Dedicated to the victims of 9/11

[Derelle]

Today one of the greatest acts of treason of America happen 10 years ago. I know a lot of people don't want to believe the truth about what happen this most fateful day. There is too much inconsistency with the official story of what happen. That being the case, I thought that it would be a good thing to post one of the videos, that opened up the minds of those who feel that 9/11 was an inside job. This video brought legit questions to the table, that has not been fully answered by the 9/11 Commission. If you care about the people, families and lost ones on this day, I urge you to watch this video with an open mind and think about the implications. When people refuse to stand up against those who impose terror on their subjects, then how can one complain, when they take over and the same is done to them?


Loose Change - Final Cut 2007 (Full Length) - YouTube

[Sypyres]

This video is old and out-dated. There is a new Loose Change video out. I'll post the link when I find it.

The problem I see when talking about this topic or posting it is the intent is not well known. We all know planes hit this and hit that. We know many people died. This and many other videos are not trying to disprove the incident but HOW it all happenedand who is behind it.

Take this video for what you may but do your own research. Look up Operation Northwoods, The Trilateral Commission, The Federal Reserve Bank...etc. I bet most people don't even know who runs the FED Bank. Big hint, it's not Chairman Ben Bernanke nor Congress.

My answer to all this is I DON'T KNOW but the thing I do know is it isn't what the news, government, mainstream media claim it is.

[Sypyres]

This is not the video i was referring to but a valid one:
The Illusion of Choice:
George Carlin: The Illusion Of Choice - YouTube

[Derelle]

Yeah, thanks, I know there are newer versions but I posted this one because I wanted people to digest this one first. Then we can post other ones later, as a tribute. Whether if it is a few years old or not, the information is still credible, as well as valid and the questions still have not been answered. The more we study this subject, the more we realize that there are those who lurk behind the government of America, pulling the strings. I will also post other videos but this I feel is a great primer.

[Derelle]

How wrong we were to believe that Muslims committed this act, when in fact this was a Mossad Israeli plot, hashed by Dov Zakheim. "...Dov Zakheim called for "some catastrophic and catalyzing event - like a new Pearl Harbor" being necessary to foster the frame of mind needed for the American public to support a war in the Middle East that would politically and culturally reshape the region." This event was agreed upon and published in a document by The American Enterprise's "Project for a New American Century" Which had the approval of the likes of Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld etc., the usual suspects. Anyway, it was Rabbi Dov who had access to the Boeing jets, that were refitted with a device called FTS (Flight Termination System), that allowed for remote operation of the planes used on 9/11. This is why the planes were flown in such a way, that no pilot could fly, before impact.

If you look at one of the freezed frames of the air plane before it smashes into the South Tower, you will see that it is fitted with some type of device, under it, that is oblongated. This is said to be part of the remote control, that helped guide the planes into it's precise targets. The one person, who called for there to be "Pearl Harbor like attacks on America to get us to go to war, is the same guy, who had access to the actual planes and was over a company, that produced remote operational devices that can be fitted on, none other than aircrafts, like the Boeing jets that crashed on 9/11. Maybe this is where that missing $2.3 trillion went, that has helped add to this deficit, to buy and fit these planes and pay off all parties involved.

As conspiracynewsnet.com explains it, "Rabbi Zakheim had access to things like structural integrity, blueprints and any number of important facets of information about the WTC through his work with TRIDATA CORPORATION in the investgation of the bombing of the WTC in 1993. That he had access to REMOTE CONTROL Technology through his work at System Planning Corporation (SPC). That he had access to BOEING AIRCRAFT through a lease deal HE BROKERED while working at the Pentagon. And finally that he was part of a group of politically radical Straussian Neo-Conservatives, who, through their association with PNAC, called for restructuring of the Middle East, noting that a Pearl Harbor type of event MAY BE NEEDED to foster the frame of mind required for the American public to accept such a radical foreign policy agenda." conspiracynewsnet.com - government conspiracy websites Resources and Information. This website is for sale!

This shows that Americans have been duped and we should not just sit by and let these guys appear on tv gaining adoration of the public, when they got blood still dripping from their claws. These are evil people and it doesn't sit well with me, that they are getting paid by our tax money and they use it to kill innocent people. I ask will people remain asleep or will they awaken to fight back, before it's too late? As George Bush senior said on 9/11 1990, 11 years exactly to day of the 9/11 trajedy, "Now, we can see a new world coming into view. A world in which there is the very real prospect of a new world order... Even the new world order cannot guarantee an era of perpetual peace."

If anyone knows about occult numerology and Kabbalah, this massacre was a ritual, to Molech also known as Baal. The number 11 and 9 were used for a specific reason. Notice that it was 9/11 in 1990 (New World Order speech) and 9/11 in 2001, 11 years later. In Genesis 11:1-9 the tower of Babel was brought down. If you turn that around, you get 9/11 1. If people can't see what's going on, then this is why things like this will continue to happen. We either come together now or forever look back and wonder what we could have done, to make a change for a better future.

[Derelle]

Here is part 2 of Loose Change, posing questions that have yet to be answered and probably never will, at least officially. After watching this, anybody with a rational mind, can see the truth for themselves.There is too much evidence showing how the official story is fabricated and illogical.

"Loose Change: 2nd Edition" Full Length HQ Film - YouTube

Share this with all of your friends and family. Everyone should know this.

[lycan]

I can't believe it has been 10 years. It was a sad day.

[garentee]

Here is Noam Chomskys take on it.... I am posting this just to put some perspective on it..Noam Chomsky on 911 conspiracy part 2 - YouTube

[Sypyres]

Originally Posted by garentee

Here is Noam Chomskys take on it.... I am posting this just to put some perspective on it..Noam Chomsky on 911 conspiracy part 2 - YouTube

I can respect the man for what he has contributed but do not agree with some of his views. He states "who cares"? If it did happen, who cares? Really, that's not someone I would use to back a viewpoint whether I believe or don't believe.

"The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist" Keyser Söze
Please don't hash this quote for some religious summon. It's a great quote.

Put it this way, they can (and have) put it out (Truth) right in front of ppls faces and it still remains unkown. They dish out distractions (celeb news) and that's what most focus on.

[garentee]

Originally Posted by Sypyres

I can respect the man for what he has contributed but do not agree with some of his views. He states "who cares"? If it did happen, who cares? Really, that's not someone I would use to back a viewpoint whether I believe or don't believe.

"The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist" Keyser Söze
Please don't hash this quote for some religious summon. It's a great quote.

Put it this way, they can (and have) put it out (Truth) right in front of ppls faces and it still remains unkown. They dish out distractions (celeb news) and that's what most focus on.

Just for the record I posted that as perspective and not necessarily as my opinion...the who cares in this is pretty inconsequential as he basically said that the governments of the world were the real winners...Frankly though I do agree that the Bush Admin would have to be insane to try pulling something like this off.. Do I think that they knew about it and let it happen? That seems far more likely as there was definitely something to gain .....

[Brutha]

There is too much evidence showing how the official story is fabricated and illogical.

If you have a complex story and simplify it enough to print it in a newspaper some parts will be inexact.

He states "who cares"? If it did happen, who cares? Really, that's not someone I would use to back a viewpoint whether I believe or don't believe.

Even if you believe the conspiracy theory all the effort of the 911 "truth" movement still produced no meaningful political effect.
Focusing political energy on projects that actually have the potential to create political effects make sense.

[James Fletcher]

First of all, I'm more than a little hesitant to buy into something that Borat would believe.

Secondly, I am extremely hesitant to find any credibility in something that Iranian president Mahmoud Ahmadinejad spreads as gospel.

Islamic terrorist groups have been planting false and subversive Zionist conspiracy theories for nearly half a century, notably with their old allies the Soviets.

[HumanityChangePlease]

Since we are all sharing videos, here's one I just found.
9/11: The Luckiest Man Alive! - YouTube

This video provides a chronology of World Trade Center owner, Larry Silverstein's day on September 11th, 2001. The only question that remains unanswered about Larry's day, is why he was so lucky.

Firstly, he managed to avoid being killed in the attacks due to a fortunate appointment with a dermatologist. Silverstein gained a multi-billion dollar payout from an insurance policy he took out just 6 weeks before 9/11. Considering all of these fortunate coincidences, it is strange that Silverstein has not even been questioned by the police.

Doesn't it make you wonder...maybe..just a little? Maybe? The "conspiracy theory" is the story the press, media, government all want you to hear. So why can't we just be obedient and do as we're told? Why do we have to go out of our way and try to seek the truth? Just sit back, relax and the government will take care of everything. You have nothing to worry about.

[KaleidoskopicVision]

Originally Posted by Brutha

Even if you believe the conspiracy theory all the effort of the 911 "truth" movement still produced no meaningful political effect.
Focusing political energy on projects that actually have the potential to create political effects make sense.

If discovering truths is not a 'political effect' in your definition, Emperor Palpatine has a job opening for you

Just because we haven't seen any significant political changes from the 9/11 truth movement yet doesn't mean they won't happen. The convictions that led the movement are starting to churn up more questions than answers, yet those questions are challenging the official explanation. If the official explanation is a lie, that is going to have political ramifications. Proving that the official explanation is a lie is going to have massive political ramifications. How can you say the 9/11 truth movement won't have political effects, regardless of whether or not you support it?

Abstract example: Did finding out that Bush lying about WMDs in Iraq have political ramifications by your definition?

[KaleidoskopicVision]

Originally Posted by James Fletcher

First of all, I'm more than a little hesitant to buy into something that Borat would believe.

Secondly, I am extremely hesitant to find any credibility in something that Iranian president Mahmoud Ahmadinejad spreads as gospel.

Islamic terrorist groups have been planting false and subversive Zionist conspiracy theories for nearly half a century, notably with their old allies the Soviets.

One should not judge information based upon who supports it, instead one should judge the information based upon the logic of the information. It is illogical to believe something because someone very smart believes it without first rationally evaluating that belief, just as it is illogical to disbelieve something a humorous and fictional character believes without first rationally evaluating that belief.

I could also say the reverse of that second statement, that Zionist terrorist groups have been planting false and subversive Islamic conspiracy theories for nearly half a century (since Israel was formed after the Ottoman Empire collapsed and Britain made a partition for Israel, Israel has been imperialistically seeking expansion and total domination of the Middle East ever since).

And you clearly are very ignorant of Cold War history to assert that 'Islamic terrorists' (such a broad label that one) were aligned with the USSR. The U.S. government sponsored some very notable fundamentalist organizations during the cold war in order to combat the USSR and the spread of Communism to Middle Eastern regions. One of the groups the U.S. gave aid to was the Taliban.

The USSR likewise attempted to make pawns out of various Islamic fundamentalist groups. However there was never a clear racial/religious alignment with either world superpower during the Cold War.

[James Fletcher]

Originally Posted by KaleidoskopicVision

One should not judge information based upon who supports it, instead one should judge the information based upon the logic of the information.

The broad-sweeping/generalization debate. Again. Fine.

The theory that Israelis orchestrated 9/11 and forewarned Jews in Manhattan about the events is illogical, no matter who supports or spreads it.

There.

Originally Posted by KaleidoskopicVision

It is illogical to believe something because someone very smart believes it without first rationally evaluating that belief...

I am not certain what you mean by this. Are you paying Mahmoud Ahmadinejad a compliment?

Originally Posted by KaleidoskopicVision

I could also say the reverse of that second statement, that Zionist terrorist groups have been planting false and subversive Islamic conspiracy theories for nearly half a century (since Israel was formed after the Ottoman Empire collapsed and Britain made a partition for Israel, Israel has been imperialistically seeking expansion and total domination of the Middle East ever since).

The Protocols of the Elders of Zion. A satirical text that was exploited and promoted by the wrong parties.

Originally Posted by KaleidoskopicVision

And you clearly are very ignorant of Cold War history to assert that 'Islamic terrorists' (such a broad label that one)

I was referring to terrorist organizations who commit graphic mass murders in the name of Islam. How is that incorrect?

Originally Posted by KaleidoskopicVision

were aligned with the USSR. The U.S. government sponsored some very notable fundamentalist organizations during the cold war in order to combat the USSR and the spread of Communism to Middle Eastern regions. One of the groups the U.S. gave aid to was the Taliban.

The USSR likewise attempted to make pawns out of various Islamic fundamentalist groups. However there was never a clear racial/religious alignment with either world superpower during the Cold War.

Socialists and Islamic extremists are bound by their shared values of suppression, brutality and also by their opposition to Western values of liberty, freedom and equality.

[KaleidoskopicVision]

Originally Posted by James Fletcher

The broad-sweeping/generalization debate. Again. Fine.

The theory that Israelis orchestrated 9/11 and forewarned Jews in Manhattan about the events is illogical, no matter who supports or spreads it.

There.

And your justification for that assertion is what? I consider it a possibility based on Israel's heavy demand for U.S. support in their imperialistic conquest of Middle Eastern lands. Israel certainly has a motive.

Originally Posted by James Fletcher

I am not certain what you mean by this. Are you paying Mahmoud Ahmadinejad a compliment?

I was referring to an abstract, theoretical situation wherein someone considered to be very smart makes a statement that someone believes based on the statement maker's reputation as a very smart person. The reference was not meant to be to Ahmadinejad.

Originally Posted by James Fletcher

The Protocols of the Elders of Zion. A satirical text that was exploited and promoted by the wrong parties.

I was not referring to the Protocols, which were never intended to be satirical but an outright forgery. One need not refer to a forged document explaining a Zionist agenda to see the imperialistic drives inherent in Israel's militaristic aggression. I was referring to the British Mandate for Palestine British Mandate for Palestine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Originally Posted by James Fletcher

I was referring to terrorist organizations who commit graphic mass murders in the name of Islam. How is that incorrect?

First of all you are begging the question and making a subtle appeal to emotion by referencing 'graphic mass murders in the name of Islam'. Second of all you are already forgetting that you stated "notably with their old allies the Soviets."

I reiterate, when the Cold War reached the Middle East the Mujahideen were fighting against the Soviets and were backed by the U.S. The Mujahideen later formed Islamic fundamentalist groups, notably the Taliban. The U.S. indirectly funded the Taliban, I should have been clearer as to what I meant by that as the Taliban didn't actually exist during the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan.

Originally Posted by James Fletcher

Socialists and Islamic extremists are bound by their shared values of suppression, brutality and also by their opposition to Western values of liberty, freedom and equality.

Okay James, it appears you're not actually reading or directly responding to anything I am saying and are just parroting your favorite talk show host, disregarding how irrelevant your responses are. Good day sir.

[James Fletcher]

Originally Posted by KaleidoskopicVision

And your justification for that assertion is what? I consider it a possibility based on Israel's heavy demand for U.S. support in their imperialistic conquest of Middle Eastern lands. Israel certainly has a motive.

All "evidence" on the matter is completely circumstantial. It proves nothing.

Originally Posted by KaleidoskopicVision

I was not referring to the Protocols, which were never intended to be satirical but an outright forgery. One need not refer to a forged document explaining a Zionist agenda to see the imperialistic drives inherent in Israel's militaristic aggression.

Or a deliberate and unjust persecution of a small nation, surrounded by aggressors, defending it's very right to exist.

Originally Posted by KaleidoskopicVision

First of all you are begging the question and making a subtle appeal to emotion by referencing 'graphic mass murders in the name of Islam'.

I am basing my assertion on known facts. An Islamic terrorist organization took responsibility for the events of 9/11, as they have for many numerous brutalities committed throughout the ages. It is well known that such organizations freely identify themselves as killers. Do I have to provide a link to prove this?

Originally Posted by KaleidoskopicVision

Okay James, it appears you're not actually reading or directly responding to anything I am saying and are just parroting your favorite talk show host, disregarding how irrelevant your responses are. Good day sir.

All you have done is provide abstract inversions of the roles of the aforementioned parties in order to voice your own opinion. You have provided no solid evidence that the Israeli's orchestrated 9/11, nor by stating that another power aided an early Islamic organization in Afghanistan have you invalidated my assertion that Socialists and Islamic terrorists share a common ideology, that survives to this very day. You have brought nothing new to the discussion and I quite fairly believe that you lack any credential to criticize my comprehension skills.

[KaleidoskopicVision]

Originally Posted by James Fletcher

All "evidence" on the matter is completely circumstantial. It proves nothing.

Not true but I'm not about to derail this thread further by making it about 9/11 conspiracies. That's one of the things that pushes my buttons online. I'm not about to let you do that as it was not the original intention of this thread, nor of my first post.

Originally Posted by James Fletcher

Or a deliberate and unjust persecution of a small nation, surrounded by aggressors, defending it's very right to exist.

The exact inverse of this statement could be said of Palestine. All appeals to defense of national sovereignty from foreign aggression is political rhetoric serving to do nothing but bolster the egos of either side.

Originally Posted by James Fletcher

I am basing my assertion on known facts. An Islamic terrorist organization took responsibility for the events of 9/11, as they have for many numerous brutalities committed throughout the ages. It is well known that such organizations freely identify themselves as killers. Do I have to provide a link to prove this?

It's not that your statement is true, it is that it is irrelevant. You are avoiding directly answering my statement by throwing out a strawman argument. You asserted that Islamic terrorist organizations worked with the Soviet Union during the Cold War. An assertion that is for the most part incorrect. Your attempts to avoid admitting the numerous false statements you have made by throwing out strawman arguments appealing to the violent nature of Islamic terrorist groups is not a real argument. I was simply trying to correct your false perception of Cold War history and you are making this about your political position on the events of 9/11.

Originally Posted by James Fletcher

All you have done is provide abstract inversions of the roles of the aforementioned parties in order to voice your own opinion. You have provided no solid evidence that the Israeli's orchestrated 9/11, nor by stating that another power aided an early Islamic organization in Afghanistan have you invalidated my assertion that Socialists and Islamic terrorists share a common ideology, that survives to this very day. You have brought nothing new to the discussion and I quite fairly believe that you lack any credential to criticize my comprehension skills.

Historical fact is not abstract inversion. You completely fail to admit that you made a false assertion about the Cold War even after being corrected on the facts. You're making this about a completely different issue. Do I have to refer again to the false statement you made asserting the Soviets worked with Islamic fundamentalist groups during the Cold War? James, you made a mistake and are ignorant of historical facts even after me linking you what is considered by scholars to be factual information on the Cold War. That is why I think you lack reading comprehension skills.

When I quoted you in my first post my intention was not to prove the validity of an Israeli 9/11 conspiracy. That is still not my original intention. My intention was to offer you a perspective on the absurdity of believing/not believing something based on who believes/doesn't believe it and to correct you on your false assertion that the Soviets were working with Islamic terrorist groups during the Cold War. That's it. Repeatedly you have made this about my political position on the events of 9/11, doing all you can to avoid my original statement.

I am not even going to bother explaining the vast ideological, systemic and circumstantial differences between Socialism and Islamic fundamentalism. I'll just say that the comparison is clumsy and useless in most contexts. Read these two articles on the two and understand why they are so different,

Socialism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Islamic fundamentalism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[James Fletcher]

Originally Posted by KaleidoskopicVision

Not true but I'm not about to derail this thread further by making it about 9/11 conspiracies.

But that is the original subject of this thread. All you have done is attack and nitpick my posts for my quite valid skepticism towards such assertions.

But guess what? Wasting your time and energy attacking me has achieved nothing for bolstering these completely baseless theories. You have no evidence.

[KaleidoskopicVision]

Originally Posted by James Fletcher

But that is the original subject of this thread. All you have done is attack and nitpick my posts for my quite valid skepticism towards such assertions.

But guess what? Wasting your time and energy attacking me has achieved nothing for bolstering these completely baseless theories. You have no evidence.

Oh would ya look at that, it is about 9/11 conspiracies! My bad I thought I was replying to a different thread

In that case, time to roll out the evidence train.

(Note: The following assertions are by no means meant to implicate Israel as a conspirer in the 9/11 attacks. In fact they are not meant to implicate anyone, the following is simply information I have found which calls the official story into question and raises other important questions about the events of 9/11).

The thermite:

The following is a peer reviewed paper detailing analysis of WTC rubble wherein visible particles of exothermic material was found. Upon analysis it appears the particles are bits of activated thermite
Bentham Science Publishers Ltd. Home Page

The intentional and expedient destruction of evidence:

9-11 Research: WTC Steel Removal

The armed and dangerous Flight 11:

The Incredible 9-11 Evidence We've All been Overlooking

A more detailed analysis of the anomalous Flight 11,
9/11 Anomalies

Al Qaeda and Osama Bin Laden:

White House admits Bin Laden wasn't involved in 9/11 (then who was?)
White House Admits Bin Laden Wasn't Involved in 911 - YouTube

Documentary titled "Al Qaeda Doesn't Exist" raises questions about the nature of the organization as officially presented, inconsistencies
Dailymotion - Al Qaeda Doesn't Exist (Documentary) - 1 - a News & Politics video

More to come on this,

Statements made by people with relative expertise:

Patriots Question 9/11 - Responsible Criticism of the 9/11 Commission Report

AE911Truth.org

General of all American Intelligence: 911 was a fraud! - YouTube



There are many more pieces of evidence, questionable inconsistencies and otherwise problematic events concerning the official take on 9/11 that I have not listed but will continue to do so for your convenience.