Obama caught giving favoritism to his campaign financers

[Still Growing]

I'm not a Republican nor a Democrat so therefore I'm free to criticize both...

Check out the article
White House-Backed Solar Solyndra Company Collapses - ABC News

Was it just me or did I mistakenly think that Obama was different. Guess not.

[SnerpGoodWord]

No real surprise here - the Obama administration has been all about kickbacks since day one when his buddy Rod Blagovitch sold Obama's old Senate seat to Roland Burris.

[Brutha]

US politics is simply rotten.

[scorpio1980]

It's Obama so this should come as no surprise. I can't wait until he is kicked out next year.

[Mariana Trench]

Originally Posted by scorpio1980

It's Obama so this should come as no surprise. I can't wait until he is kicked out next year.

It should come as no surprise because:

Originally Posted by Brutha

US politics is simply rotten.

Come on, you can't honestly think those that claim to agree with you aren't subject to the corruption of the system? Any more than I could claim that Obama wasn't corrupt (because they clearly all are), just because his campaign promises seemed more to my inclination (though it's clear now he didn't mean a word of it.).

[cacheborn]

I am coming to the conclusion that no politician, no matter which country, can be completely honest. Politics and honesty are like fish and bicycle. The difference is in the degrees of dishonesty. Perhaps, that is the reason why we no longer consider politicians as heros.

[ChrisGinsburg]

Originally Posted by cacheborn

I am coming to the conclusion that no politician, no matter which country, can be completely honest. Politics and honesty are like fish and bicycle. The difference is in the degrees of dishonesty. Perhaps, that is the reason why we no longer consider politicians as heros.

Politicians are simply highly paid actors. It's a never ending play to keep everyone distracted so they can carry out what they wish during intermission.

[Orecle]

Originally Posted by cacheborn

I am coming to the conclusion that no politician, no matter which country, can be completely honest. Politics and honesty are like fish and bicycle. The difference is in the degrees of dishonesty. Perhaps, that is the reason why we no longer consider politicians as heros.

Originally Posted by ChrisGinsburg

Politicians are simply highly paid actors. It's a never ending play to keep everyone distracted so they can carry out what they wish during intermission.

Truth right here

To be a politician a number of skills are needed
1. Double talk. To be able to talk out of both sides of your mouth. To be able to passionately champion two contradictory viewpoints depending on what your audience wants to hear
2. Convincing denial and bold face lying. To be able to deny something you have said or promised. The skill is having charisma, a big enough vocabulary, absolute composure
3. Enough rich and powerful friends to pull chains behind the scenes.


New Libyan government are deceiving themselves if they think they are not going to pay for the help for the British and the west has given them to get rid of gaddafi.

2 yrs ago the British press hailed gaddafi as a reformed hero. No longer a terrorist. I watched with my own eyes our ex-prime minister Tony Blair shook his hand. Both ex pm gordan brown and the Scottish government let the libyan bomber go. 2 yrs on gaddafi is a monster and the same British public who supported the pm gordan brown in letting the bomber go are now saying we should bring him back. now all the British politicians are silent. Brown has been behind the scenes trying to get rid of any documentation that links him to the release.

[heroinqueen]

Originally Posted by Orecle

Truth right here

To be a politician a number of skills are needed
1. Double talk. To be able to talk out of both sides of your mouth. To be able to passionately champion two contradictory viewpoints depending on what your audience wants to hear
2. Convincing denial and bold face lying. To be able to deny something you have said or promised. The skill is having charisma, a big enough vocabulary, absolute composure
3. Enough rich and powerful friends to pull chains behind the scenes.


New Libyan government are deceiving themselves if they think they are not going to pay for the help for the British and the west has given them to get rid of gaddafi.

2 yrs ago the British press hailed gaddafi as a reformed hero. No longer a terrorist. I watched with my own eyes our ex-prime minister Tony Blair shook his hand. Both ex pm gordan brown and the Scottish government let the libyan bomber go. 2 yrs on gaddafi is a monster and the same British public who supported the pm gordan brown in letting the bomber go are now saying we should bring him back. now all the British politicians are silent. Brown has been behind the scenes trying to get rid of any documentation that links him to the release.

hmmmm......

[Orecle]

.??..?

Originally Posted by heroinqueen

hmmmm......

[Gabo]

Who says politicians have to be scumbag liars to get into office? The voters. We are the ones who elect our politicians, so we give that quality our validation every time we elect someone who is dishonest.

Dishonesty is not some natural state of people in politics, it exists because we continue to elect people who are dishonest. When voting for a candidate, look at their track record, look at who finances them, and compare that to what they say.

A candidate like Obama, who energized millions with his talk about hope and change, was obviously just like all the other dishonest politicians. All we had to do was see where he got his campaign contributions from and look at his track record as a senator.

[Mariana Trench]

Originally Posted by Gabo

Who says politicians have to be scumbag liars to get into office? The voters. We are the ones who elect our politicians, so we give that quality our validation every time we elect someone who is dishonest.

Before voting is even on the table politicians need funding, media backing, and connections. That's where the corruption happens--that's where our choices are narrowed before they even begin.

[Brutha]

I am coming to the conclusion that no politician, no matter which country, can be completely honest.

The fact that you need to have large donor to be elected into a political office in the US makes a difference.

Additionally the kind of favoritism that gets criticized in the linked article isn't really possible in any EURO-country (I'm not exactly sure in what extend non-EURO-EU country are also included).
There are contracts that prevent a country from engaging in that kind of favoritism of a single company.
The EU commision would simply step in and prevent the German government from given a single company a 500 million loan guarantee in the absence of an open process that makes it clear how the company was selected.

[Orecle]

Originally Posted by Brutha

The fact that you need to have large donor to be elected into a political office in the US makes a difference.

Additionally the kind of favoritism that gets criticized in the linked article isn't really possible in any EURO-country (I'm not exactly sure in what extend non-EURO-EU country are also included).
There are contracts that prevent a country from engaging in that kind of favoritism of a single company.
The EU commision would simply step in and prevent the German government from given a single company a 500 million loan guarantee in the absence of an open process that makes it clear how the company was selected.

Not true brutha

Remember the uk cash for questions scandal or the recent debacle with rupert Murdoch and the uk politicians. Rupert got Tony Blair to remove the restrictions preventing him from going for bskyb in exchange for his papers (by far the most influential) in the uk, backing Blair in the elections. The Brits are discovering how powerful rupert Murdoch is in uk politics

[russianrocket]

Originally Posted by Brutha

The fact that you need to have large donor to be elected into a political office in the US makes a difference.

Additionally the kind of favoritism that gets criticized in the linked article isn't really possible in any EURO-country (I'm not exactly sure in what extend non-EURO-EU country are also included).
There are contracts that prevent a country from engaging in that kind of favoritism of a single company.
The EU commision would simply step in and prevent the German government from given a single company a 500 million loan guarantee in the absence of an open process that makes it clear how the company was selected.

you don't honestly think that America is the only corrupt country. Maybe in Euro countries, they don't have THIS issue, but that sure as hell doesn't make you guys squeaky clean. We all got our own **** to deal with.

[Gabo]

Originally Posted by Mariana Trench

Before voting is even on the table politicians need funding, media backing, and connections. That's where the corruption happens--that's where our choices are narrowed before they even begin.

Funding can come from individuals that support the candidate's cause. It doesn't have to come from special interests and corporations.

And you don't need corporate media support to succeed. It certainly helps, but look at someone like Ron Paul, who has become a top tier candidate for the Republican primary while being constantly ignored and ridiculed by the corporate media.

If we don't think for ourselves and vote for candidates that are honest and trustworthy, then corporate media will surely tell us to vote for whomever they like best. The question is whether we will let them choose for us.

[SnerpGoodWord]

Originally Posted by Gabo

Funding can come from individuals that support the candidate's cause. It doesn't have to come from special interests and corporations.

A "special interest" is just a group of people. A corporation is just a legal entity that acts on behalf of its owners. When special interest and corporations speak, it's really people speaking.

Thankfully, we have freedom of speech in the US and those types of speech are protected.

[Jonathan Browne]

I don't see what the big deal is here.

Obviously there's GOT to be favoritism.

They can't invest in every single company that exists. Just like any other investor if the government is looking to invest they choose a company they think well do well, many times because of personal connections etc. and then invest in that.

You win some you lose some.

The whole favoritism argument is absurd.

What, is the government just supposed to give 500 mill to every single solar company out there?

[Jonathan Browne]

Not to mention, it looks to me like they might just be restructuring. They filed for a restructuring bankruptcy. They are probably going to have to go back to the drawing board and change their business model and so theirs no point in having all those employees working to implement the current one.

[SnerpGoodWord]

Originally Posted by Jonathan Browne

What, is the government just supposed to give 500 mill to every single solar company out there?

How about, given that 500 mill is crapload of money, that they give it to NO solar companies and let the taxpayers keep it.

If solar was a viable energy technology, there would be a line around the block to fund it with private money. That hasn't happened because the economics aren't there.

[Brutha]

Not true brutha
Remember the uk cash for questions scandal or the recent debacle with rupert Murdoch and the uk politicians.

Firstly UK is no country that uses the Euro. No UK example would prove the point I made wrong.
Secondly the fact that a government has the ability to reduce restrictions that a company faces doesn't mean that the government also has the ability to pay subventions to a company.

The whole favoritism argument is absurd.

What, is the government just supposed to give 500 mill to every single solar company out there?

No, the government is supposed to say:
"We want to give a credit to some company. We'll give the credit to the company that best fulfills criteria A, B and C."
Then companies submit their proposals and the governments gives the contract to the company that best fulfills criteria A, B and C.

[Criseyde]

Originally Posted by Brutha

US politics is simply rotten.

I agree with you so much.

[cacheborn]

Originally Posted by Brutha

The fact that you need to have large donor to be elected into a political office in the US makes a difference.

Additionally the kind of favoritism that gets criticized in the linked article isn't really possible in any EURO-country (I'm not exactly sure in what extend non-EURO-EU country are also included).
There are contracts that prevent a country from engaging in that kind of favoritism of a single company.
The EU commision would simply step in and prevent the German government from given a single company a 500 million loan guarantee in the absence of an open process that makes it clear how the company was selected.

I must confess that I don't know much about government of Germany, but judging from the high standards of German people in many of the areas, I would not be surprised to see high standards in governing as well.

Speaking of EURO-countries, the Italian government has broken all records for corruption. I wonder if the process that you described of EU stepping in also applies to Berlusconi?

[Gabo]

Originally Posted by SnerpGoodWord

A "special interest" is just a group of people. A corporation is just a legal entity that acts on behalf of its owners. When special interest and corporations speak, it's really people speaking.

Thankfully, we have freedom of speech in the US and those types of speech are protected.

Yes, they are people, and yes they have the right to support their own self-interests, which is what they do when they give to candidates. I have no problem with how that works.

I'm simply suggesting that for the people who disagree with what special interest groups and corporations want, they should vote for candidates who aren't funded by special interest groups and corporations.

[Brutha]

Speaking of EURO-countries, the Italian government has broken all records for corruption. I wonder if the process that you described of EU stepping in also applies to Berlusconi?

If you read the list of Berlusconi's wrongdoings on Wikipedia you find stuff like:
"Berlusconi's governments has passed some laws that have shortened statutory terms for tax fraud. Berlusconi responded to critics by saying that he would not take advantage of these himself, but later did. Romano Prodi, who defeated Berlusconi in 2006, claimed that these were ad personam laws, meant to solve Berlusconi's problems and defend his interests."

Passing laws for personal gain is a form of corruption it however something that's difficult to prevent when the electorate doesn't have a problem with it. As long as the law is the same for everyone you don't trigger rules that prevent favoritism.

[WarrenG]

On the main page the title of this thread is shortened to "Obama caught giving..."

I was like, "Please be head! Please be head!"

But no.

[cacheborn]

Originally Posted by Brutha

Passing laws for personal gain is a form of corruption it however something that's difficult to prevent when the electorate doesn't have a problem with it. As long as the law is the same for everyone you don't trigger rules that prevent favoritism.

True. And that is essentially the point I was making earlier. The methods may vary, the degrees of dishonesty would be different but in general politicians are not to be trusted. The kind of compromises they make to gain and retain power has no place for values like honesty and integrity.

[Brutha]

The methods may vary, the degrees of dishonesty would be different but in general politicians are not to be trusted.

Nobody is to completely trusted whether he's a politician or isn't. It also makes sense to look into the context in which someone is speaking.

[NoJobRob]

Originally Posted by ChrisGinsburg

Politicians are simply highly paid actors. It's a never ending play to keep everyone distracted so they can carry out what they wish during intermission.

Like Gerald Celente says, politics is show business for ugly people.

[Pokerface]

World politics is rotten to be more precisce on an earlier point. . however, the governments may change but the undercurrent is the same, the talking heads are the ones on display while under the surface of the deep the bottom feeders do all the work, make all the choices, and play the tunes. . watch Yes Minister or Yes Prime Minister an old BBC comedy, still very relevent even today.