Poker skills

[Niki]

I started playing poker 2 weeks ago, and I'm really enjoying myself with it. Also, I discovered Online Poker, and It's going verry well(I'm playing with playing money btw, no real money yet). I was wondering if there where some good poker players online here, and if they got some good advice for me. Maybe a good guide or book about the math in poker would do me good.

[Freelancer]

Some quick advice (if you've got any other questions feel free to ask);
- Play money is a different game than real money, its like the kids playground compared to the fortune 500 company.
- If you start with money, make sure that you have atleast 20 buy ins (For no limit) bankroll. My standard bankroll limits are; 15 buy ins current level=move down 1 level. 40 buy ins current level=move up. Follow this and its unlikely you'll go broke. Don't kid yourself, for most players sticking to a bankroll will get you halfway there.
- If you start prepare to lose the ~200 bucks you put in depending on the limits you play and the study time you put in.
- Learn to be able to cope with swings and start seeying money you lose win as points removing any emotional attachments to it (very difficult).
- Study the game (reading/thinking/reviewing database/etc.) atleast half the time.
- Focus on learning the game and improving your skills, the results will follow.

Excellent resource;
Two Plus Two Publishing

Thats all I ever used, haven't read any books.



Ps. These are the basics if you want to play competetively at a decent limit (100nl+)...

[UHF]

Hello,

I've played online with just play money and with actual real people for £10 ($20) for a seat. Playing with play money is completely different from real, your opponents will just call and wait to get lucky in play money games. So the experience isn't realistic. Read books and try and get into very low stake, real money friendly games. But play for fun.

With real money you need to know how and when to bet. Also don't try bluffing as a strategy when your a beginner. Experience here counts a lot.

A lot of people who think they're great players seem to forget that half the game is about luck. You'll probably lose what you win in time, these things tend to balance out. The only people who make money from poker are pros who are payed to play.

[Freelancer]

Originally Posted by UHF

Hello,

I've played online with just play money and with actual real people for £10 ($20) for a seat. Playing with play money is completely different from real, your opponents will just call and wait to get lucky in play money games. So the experience isn't realistic. Read books and try and get into very low stake, real money friendly games. But play for fun.

With real money you need to know how and when to bet. Also don't try bluffing as a strategy when your a beginner. Experience here counts a lot.

A lot of people who think they're great players seem to forget that half the game is about luck. You'll probably lose what you win in time, these things tend to balance out. The only people who make money from poker are pros who are payed to play.

My experience;
Started with 50 bucks worked it up to approximately 7k when I walked away (over the course of ~4 months) so I know a thing or two about it, this is all online btw.

At the low limits (nl5 and nl10) all you need to do is;
Take the top 20% of all holdings, fold the rest preflop. Do not bluff postflop and know when to fold. That alone will make you money and you don't have to be a pro to do it lol.

I'd say that about 80% of the game is skill and 20% is luck, these numbers are made up on the spot though. My experience is that the general trend over a long period is purely skill based (up/down/sideways) but in the short term (up to 10k hands or so) is more luck based.
Your right that they tend to balance out eventually BASED ON YOUR SKILL LEVEL...

[Erock]

Okay I don't want to be that guy that takes over a thread with his pathetic story that has nothing to do with the main topic but I swear that some higher deity just does not want me to play poker.

I only play little 5 dollar games with my friends, but I honestly have the worst luck of all time, and I'm not talking about bad beats on the river where your winning the hand and you played your cards right and it was just bad luck. I honestly have nights where I play for 3 or 4 hours-we play really slow though cause mostly we're just talking and joking around-where I will not see one face card in the two pocket cards dealt to me the entire time.

Because of poker I now believe in the law of attraction, because it is eerie how this has happened for so long. I have left the last 4 or 5 poker games losing a dollar in antes and having seen maybe 1 or 2 hands to the flop, and I don't consider myself an overly-conservative player by any means.

Maybe I was just meant for greater things? (I'll keep telling myself that)

Erock

[Freelancer]

Originally Posted by Erock

Okay I don't want to be that guy that takes over a thread with his pathetic story that has nothing to do with the main topic but I swear that some higher deity just does not want me to play poker.

I only play little 5 dollar games with my friends, but I honestly have the worst luck of all time, and I'm not talking about bad beats on the river where your winning the hand and you played your cards right and it was just bad luck. I honestly have nights where I play for 3 or 4 hours-we play really slow though cause mostly we're just talking and joking around-where I will not see one face card in the two pocket cards dealt to me the entire time.

Because of poker I now believe in the law of attraction, because it is eerie how this has happened for so long. I have left the last 4 or 5 poker games losing a dollar in antes and having seen maybe 1 or 2 hands to the flop, and I don't consider myself an overly-conservative player by any means.

Maybe I was just meant for greater things? (I'll keep telling myself that)

Erock

Variance, pure and simple.

Simple math;
5 games of about 4 hours (keeping it high) thats 20 hours playing time live.
Lets say about 30 hands/hour (which is about average, although its probably lower for you) so 20*30=600 hands which isn't that much at all.

Online I've had stretches of up to 3k hands where I saw the flop with about 13% of my hands (yeah I actually remember the percentages lol) at 6-max while my usual number is around 25% basically losing to the blinds during that time. I've also had stretches of 3k hands where I played 35% of my hands (or so) and made a HUGE profit.

All I can say is that variance a ♥♥♥♥♥.


Ps. Online=/=offline but it serves to show a point.

[Trustme]

I hope it's ok to take over this thread and ask a question regarding poker. I have to admit I started playing / learning it some weeks ago so my knowledge is very limited.

Some days ago I stumpled across this report where some poker pros were able to beat a computer. Afterwards the pros said that although they were able to win against the computer they were sure that within some years artifical intelligence would get even and we would end up with a similar situation like in chess.

Most people play online for money. Not necessarilly to win huge amounts but money plays a certain important role that motivates people to play. What happens to this industry when everyone plays with the help of these kind of programmes?

I did some research and found out that even now there are lots of progs available to increase your performance on the table (like Poker Tracker etc.) and it looks like the sites that offer online playing don't mind these programmes or even support them.

What's your opinion?
TM

[Freelancer]

Originally Posted by Trustme

I hope it's ok to take over this thread and ask a question regarding poker. I have to admit I started playing / learning it some weeks ago so my knowledge is very limited.

Some days ago I stumpled across this report where some poker pros were able to beat a computer. Afterwards the pros said that although they were able to win against the computer they were sure that within some years artifical intelligence would get even and we would end up with a similar situation like in chess.

Most people play online for money. Not necessarilly to win huge amounts but money plays a certain important role that motivates people to play. What happens to this industry when everyone plays with the help of these kind of programmes?

I did some research and found out that even now there are lots of progs available to increase your performance on the table (like Poker Tracker etc.) and it looks like the sites that offer online playing don't mind these programmes or even support them.

What's your opinion?
TM

The poker sites actually have tracking software to find bots and its illegal to use them. Right now (as far as I know) these bots are really really basic and easy to beat so for now you don't have to worry.

Most people play online not to win money but for the excitement of the POSSIBILITY of winning money, no matter how good the bot there's always a decent shot that the newby wins some money in the short term so they'll always carry more money into the game. The higher stakes are all fueled by these people that carry large amounts of money to the online tables (they slowly filter upwards as the skill rises).

Pokertracker is a basically a math program that calculates all kind of playing related stats to assist in sharpening your own skills, it doesn't give you direct advice on how to play.

In short; don't worry about this...


Ps. Most people are outright stupid on the poker table and can't see the right move even if its staring them in the face, its a factor that won't disappear even with the best programs lol.

[Spacey Chris]

My biggest advice if you are just starting out and learning is do not play the play money games. They are nothing like a real cash game. In fact they may even encourage poor poker playing habits.

If you are serious about wanting to learn how to play poker deposit the minimum, and play the cheapest cash games, and or sit n gos that wherever you are playing has to offer.

Then take it from there.