Life Sucks, Then You Die (Blog)

[Savage]

Use this thread to discuss the following entry from Steve Pavlina's blog:

Life Sucks, Then You Die

[Lyman]

Great post, Steve... maybe we *can* compare notes on who's life was worse later.

Naw, never mind... don't have time for that anymore...

I loved the analogy of not blaming the car because it won't go through the tree. I'd just add that it's also useless to "blame" the driver. Why even waste time with that? Just change the approach.

So much time and energy is wasted looking for someone to blame - even if we are wasting that time and energy on blaming ourselves and sitting in that self-pity, just like you said. It's good to know that there's a better way.

[Shamou]

I can see it now... there will be the... "Yea, but, Steve, you don't understand... I've got a real problem... and it's not my fault..." cases where only a stick of dynamite will do the job...

But there will also be the, "Yup, Steve is right... I've been a sloppy driver... time to change..." and, those are the cats who will make it...

Great blog... very inspiring... and very true...
.

[cela]

Thanks Steve – this is just what I needed to hear today. A big kick-in-the-butt reminder!

I especially like this idea:

Your human emotions serve as your feedback mechanism on your life’s journey. They’re like the dashboard display on your car. When your dashboard indicates a problem, it means you need to fix something with the car. It doesn’t mean the dashboard is broken.

[caseyd]

I've been reading this site for a long time and I could not have explained how I feel and have been feeling for awhile now any better.
I am twenty-five years old, entering my third year in college working towards my B.S. in Computer Science. I have been married for about a year now although we have been together going on about five years. I also have a fifteen month old son who I love very much.
The problem is I spend most of my time waiting for the day to end. I don't look forward to starting a new day, most of the time I can't stand to be home. It seems like no matter how hard I try I can't keep my place straightened out.
My office is okay as it is the room I spend most of my time in, but I feel like I have to pull teeth to get my wife to do anything. Her biggest accomplishment as far as house cleaning goes is doing the dishes and sweeping the floor. I do these things everyday and I almost always mop the floors as well ( possibly every two days). Let me clarify, my apartment is not dirty just cluttered. It can be expected to have toys and what not around and I'm fine with that, and I have gone through a lot of my own stuff and have gotten rid of quite a bit and organized most everything else. I just can't seem to get my wife to care. I am also really stressed out about school as well. I am in school full time this summer and don't know when I last had a break. I just want to get through the rest of it and be done with it.
I have thought about divorce over and over for a long time now. I feel like the traditional family life just isn't for me. I am not abdicating myself of responsibility, I just don't want to drag a bad situation on longer.
The problem with all of this is, I just don't know how to handle any of it. Neither of us makes enough money to live on our own and if I did get a divorce, most likely she will be forced to move back home to her parents across the country and I really don't want to be away from my son.
It is easy to say to leave a situation if you don't like it, and I've been trying to change things, but I am still not growing to like it, but when there are kids involved what do you do?
I am starting to ramble a lot now and even if no one reads all this, it felt good to get it out. I hope that I didn't come off as whiny, it wasn't my intention. I know everybody has their problems and I know mine probably aren't the biggest problems out there, but they are problems that are affecting me greatly.

Thanks.

[mattmcc]

Casey, what is the lesson you think life is trying to teach you?

[Shamou]

Originally Posted by caseyd

I am starting to ramble a lot now and even if no one reads all this, it felt good to get it out. I hope that I didn't come off as whiny, it wasn't my intention. I know everybody has their problems and I know mine probably aren't the biggest problems out there, but they are problems that are affecting me greatly.

Thanks.

Glad that posting this has made you feel better... still, you must face the fact that a cluttered home is no big deal... and you have to make some decision regarding your wife... either, she's OK and you live with her and be happy about it... or she has to go... and you live with the consequences...

If you cannot go over these relatively small hurdles... your life will be a very long and painful affair...

You have a future, you have food and shelter... you have your health... there is nothing more than you can ask for...

I wish you the very best... and hope that you will take the right decisions... but you... and you alone can do that...
.

[Mark Lapierre]

I'm with Steve on all the points he made except for the definition of true surrender. He described it as a deepening of responsibility without giving up control. He also mentioned letting go of your resistance to life. Both of these issues are fine and agree with the Buddhist concept of surrender. I think he confuses the point by mentioning cooperation with a greater good. While it's something that's also beneficial, it isn't required for true surrender.

So they are really two separate points, surrender to the reality of whatever situation you find yourself in, and acceptance of your responsibility towards the greater good. One doesn't require the other, though they can be combined.

A minor distinction, but an important one I think. But it doesn't detract from another great article.

Oh, one more thing. The suggestion to make changes if things aren't working is a good one, even if they're radical changes. But when doing so be prepared for things to go radically wrong... But if it does, as Steve said, never give up. Sort it out then try something else.

Casey, you say you've been thinking about divorce, and yet the only problem you've mentioned is a cluttered house, and your wife's reluctance to help with housework. For your sake I'll assume either there's a lot more to it or you've got some ingrained issue with tidiness. If it's the former we'll need more info before being able to give anything more than very general advice (I'd suggest starting a new thread in the Relationships forum). If it's the latter then perhaps you could work on accepting clutter and seeing that it's not such a bad thing (again, start a thread if you'd like advice on that).

[Max Power]

When you align with a higher power (god/consciousness/whatever) you don't give up control, you actually take control. People are victims when they work from ego, from all the human senses and emotions.

While they are necessary to sense and feel the joy of creation, they tend to go off on a powwer trip and stuff the creation up.

When we back off from ego, don't asign or align oursleves with it, the creative flow just flows better. It's never about taking a back seat to creation, it's about taking a front seat to enjoy the show.

Max

[Bitsy]

Originally Posted by Lyman

I loved the analogy of not blaming the car because it won't go through the tree. I'd just add that it's also useless to "blame" the driver.

But I don't even know how to drive...

While it's not a common point of view seen on this website, I guess since the worst-off people never get to this website, and the people who are where I've been (and could be) emotionally are not very articulate on their experiences, the truth is that there are a lot of people who don't go through mere periods of suicide or boredom, but are born into those negative emotions and never get out, have no idea how to get out and no one has ever, nor ever will tell them, about LoA. I lived my whole life like that, until last January when, by no impressive means, I stumbled upon the notion of intention-manifestation--and I'm still thinking it may have been too little too late for me.

Nobody tells you you are in control of your life. Nobody. And your life experiences point to the contrary, especially when you are at the emotional mercy of people who mentally abuse you 24/7 throughout your entire life from birth.

I have wallowed my fair share in self-pity and more than average in plans for killing myself over the past 20 years. I've even done research on how I want to kill myself, so as not to fail if and when I do it. I have unsuccessfully spent my life trying to change this--nobody wants that kind of existence.

Steve, you left one key point out of your "take action" solution. I have in fact taken action in attempts to change my situation to get out of the suicidal inclinations (not a fleeting period, but a 20-year (and counting) state--it's always a viable option in my mind, but it's not my first choice), to get to a state where I can enjoy life. My whole adult life consists of actions I have taken in attempts to change my situation. The problem is, when you are born into ♥♥♥♥♥, you live your life in it, you ... I sit in my life, miserable, I take action, I move to this country, that country, I change scenes, I change cultures, I find new people the world over--yet, because I don't even know how to drive in the first place, I keep crashing. I have taken action. I have done more things in my 39 years than lots of people do by the time they're old and gray, and crazy things, at least I'll admit to this most recent one being crazy, things people will tell me are impossible and I can't do or I am stupid for doing, or I will die or get hurt doing (hasn't happened yet). No matter what new thing I set out on, a relationship, friendship or a new country, society, culture, whatever, the results always ended up catastrophic. Taking action=more catastrophe.

Taking action to get out of your misery is not the only element of the solution to your suicidal, bored etc. state. (Maybe it would work for boredom, but it doesn't work for suicide/severe depression.) If the other element is learning how to drive (if life must be a car) my problem is I don't even know how or where to learn to drive.

[winyourmind]

Bitsy - thank you for having the courage to come here and share so openly.

I understand exactly how you feel. I have struggled with depression my entire life, fantasized about and attempted suicide, and physically hurt myself. I have dealt with the self-loathing, the apathy, and the anxiety. I have woken up mornings terrified to face myself and the world, barely able to function and wondering why I even bothered.

I can tell you unequivocally - IT IS NOT TOO LATE. First, don't be afraid to try medication. After a lifetime of drowning in emotional overload, it is no shame to need a little help getting started. If you are seriously considering harming yourself, please talk to someone. I guarantee the feeling will pass and you won't regret sticking around. Second, it takes time -probably years - to move beyond the emotional and mental ruts that have been created by the depression you struggled with. You will have to persevere through more dark days as you train your mind and emotions in a new way of being. This kind of growth comes in stages.

I wish I could tell you that there was some "Easy Button" to push, but there isn't. I can only offer you my own story as hope. I have survived, and am in the midst of my own recovery. Life is incredible and filled with joy and opportunity. Trust me; if you keep pushing forward, you will find the life, love and joy you are looking for.

[AmyM]

I'm well aware of the fact that I am in control of where I am going, but currently there are 2 issues: I don't really know where else I want to go right now, and life isn't really BAD right now, just blah. I'm in a maintain phase at the moment, a gestation period if you will. For example, I think I might need to move to another city, but I like my current job pretty well - frankly better than any job I've ever had. I've been there for 3 years, and next year they will be going public and it could really help me financially if I hang on here for 1 more year. I was in a long, exhausting, dysfunctional marriage - I moved out over 2 years ago, and got divorced a year and a half ago. I have been trying to cope with that major change; it feels akin to swimming up from the bottom of the ocean, trying to surface. I dated for a while, but now I'm sick of the meaninglessness of that, fed up with the men I was meeting, and not really ready to handle the "something significant" that I desire anyway.

So right now, there is almost no movement. At least not on a significant level. I am making a real effort for the first time in my life to control what I eat and drink, to improve my health, but frankly I find this boring and tedious so there's not really any particular joy emanating from that feeling of control.

How do you deal with these periods of stasis? Where your life is gestating and you feel swollen and cranky and immobile, but don't want to abort the baby?

[Bitsy]

Winyourmind, thank you for your kind and understanding reply.

Don't worry, I'm not technically suicidal right now. I've been 20 years like that, to lesser and greater extents, but I haven't done it.

I said it was too late, because I don't know if I have the will anymore to do what at this point would be required. We'll see. I don't care too much anymore one way or the other.

I'm better off than lots of people in some way, especially among those who are suicidal, for what that's worth.

20 years, because, as I said, I don't know how. Many times I have thought I don't know how to live in this world. I mean it literally. And I only found that out when I left the family at age 20. And no one to teach me how to survive here--no one to teach me how to "drive." I tried by myself all that I possibly knew to try. (Shrinks didn't help a bit.) And I'm still trying, to the extent that my will (referred to above) goes. As you sustain injury upon injury from all the repeated crashes, your will to live and make efforts wanes accordingly.

Don't worry, though, I'm ok at the moment . Although I feel like I found this site and LoA way too late, it has helped a lot. Time will tell what happens.

For the record, in my first post, I also speak for other people with similar life experiences, and worse, and who I don't think would make it to this website.

[dalang]

I think one should also consider the possibility that the dashboard display is indeed broken. This blog entry focusses on physical action, but it may also be necessary to review your thinking and the emotions that follow. Is it really necessary to feel bad? (cognitive therapy comes to mind)

Action isn't the only way to change your life. The other part is challenging and changing your perception and attitude towards it. I think both should go together to create the best results.

[Asmoday]

My absolute favorite development blog quote ever:

"It's not spiritual. It's not divine. It's just dumb."

BWAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

I'm seriously crying over here...

Oh man, come to the dark side Steve.

You know it would be a HOOOT

[dalang]

Originally Posted by Shamou

I can see it now... there will be the... "Yea, but, Steve, you don't understand... I've got a real problem... and it's not my fault..." cases where only a stick of dynamite will do the job...

When you are really depressed, such a reaction is to be expected. It doesn't necessarily mean you are a lazy whino. Depression can be very convincing despite all logic. It won't go away just because you once present arguments that it should. It takes a lot of endurance to get out of it. I wonder why you are picking on people who have a hard time at changing...I'm sure nobody stays miserable just to annoy you. Not to say I don't understand the frustration of people who are trying to help and don't see any improvement, but "the stick of dynamite" certainly won't help at all...

[Holistic Star]

Casey it occured to me that your wifes not caring about your living environment is an external manifestation of you not caring about your internal environment.

Start caring about your life on the inside, and by that I mean showing up, being fully present in the moment and experiencing joy rather than just waiting for each day to end and dreading the next day. I would be willing to bet money that when you made that internal change your wife's messiness would no longer be an issue.

I'm sure Steve blogged about this very issue about how erin's untidiness reflected something inside him that was messy and as soon as he sorted it out internally, erin tidied the house! (I'm paraphrasing here!)

Good luck.

[caseyd]

Thanks for all the replies, I am afraid I am just not going to be able to keep up with them. In rereading what I wrote I can see where everyone is coming from. There are deeper issues with myself and in my relationship with my wife that I just didn't have the space to touch upon. I came off as overly fixated on this tidiness aspect which I realize is a small part.

I will think through everyone's suggestions as I am not sure if I will be posting too much more on this subject.

Thanks!

[Bitsy]

Originally Posted by dalang

Not to say I don't understand the frustration of people who are trying to help and don't see any improvement, but "the stick of dynamite" certainly won't help at all...

Hmmm...well, I don't know...if you want to die, but don't have the nerve to do it yourself, or are wavering for years in indecision, it would get the job done and you wouldn't even have had to do it yourself.

FYI - being really depressed or suicidal does not mean shunning the responsibility for your situation, as Shamou indicated. I don't ever remember thinking "and it's not my fault". On the contrary, one is more often laden with self-blame and guilt, which contributes greatly to the depression and self-loathing. So blaming the suicidal person even further is really nasty and puts them even farther down.

P.S. Casey - the blog entry Holistic Star is referring to is this one:

http://www.stevepavlina.com/blog/200...relationships/

You could read it and try it out.

[phoenixmama]

"No one is coming to rescue you. It’s all you. If your life currently sucks, it’s entirely up to you to change it."


Wow, did I need to read this today. I have been pretty depressed about my life, I trying to get over the belief that I am a born loser. It seems that every decision I have ever made has been a bad one. Finding about PD has completely opened a new world for me, that I actually have control over my life. Its kind of overwhelming. Here is my but, what do you do about marriage and kids. I mean, now that I am seeing things more clearly there are things about my marriage that are not ok with me and that I can't believe I accepted. But I have small children so every decision I make affects them, I can't just do what I want because it can have severe repercussions on their life.

I do realize that does not give me the excuse of doing nothing. My top three areas of change are changing my diet and starting to exercise, getting my life on a schedule and figuring out how to increase my income. No more excuses for not getting started.

[carenkh]

Steve! Wow! Very inspiring!! Thanks for this article. The biggest moment so far for me in my own development is when I realized... really, really, realized... that *I* am responsible for this life. As you say, "No one is coming to rescue you. It’s all you." AND what I've found is that when I do take small steps forward, all types of things happen and forces come together to support that decision.

If anyone's feeling overwhelmed at the amount of change suggested, remember it can start with baby-steps. For me, it was showering and brushing my teeth every day, no matter what. (I know, I know... I was in a *very* dark place!) If you want to change your diet, start by adding in one fresh vegetable every Tuesday. You can do more if you want, but *commit* to that vegetable on Tuesday. No matter what.

A helpful book in this regard is One Small Step Can Change Your Life, which describes why sometimes large, sweeping changes trigger our defense mechanisms, but teeny-tiny changes get in "under the radar" so to speak. Just for today, what one thing can I do in the direction of change?

Gassho ~

[dalang]

Originally Posted by Bitsy

FYI - being really depressed or suicidal does not mean shunning the responsibility for your situation, as Shamou indicated. I don't ever remember thinking "and it's not my fault". On the contrary, one is more often laden with self-blame and guilt, which contributes greatly to the depression and self-loathing. So blaming the suicidal person even further is really nasty and puts them even farther down.

I think there is a big difference between accepting responsibility and self-blame. Although no depression is like another, I believe that most depressed do plenty of the latter but are afraid of the former.

All I wanted to express with my post is, that this fear shouldn't be mistaken for unwillingness.

I'm curious why I picked up this hint of sarcasm in your reply.

[ZHereford]

Originally Posted by dalang

Action isn't the only way to change your life. The other part is challenging and changing your perception and attitude towards it. I think both should go together to create the best results.

Very true dalang! You can take all the action you want, yet if your mindset is lagging behind the action will not be as effective. You have to change your perception and attitude first. Also easier said than done.

@Bitsy, I think you are courageous and very articulate. I don't think it's ever too late to enjoy life to the fullest and be the best that you can be! Perhaps working on your mindset a bit more might help.

[Lyman]

Originally Posted by dalang

I think there is a big difference between accepting responsibility and self-blame. Although no depression is like another, I believe that most depressed do plenty of the latter but are afraid of the former.

As a person who has suffered from severe clinical depression and went the attempted suicide route a few times myself, I'll have to agree with you, dalang... I don't think I've ever heard it put so well.

I used to get so pissed off (which was at least better than the depression!) when people would say that I needed to take responsibility for my life... didn't they know what I was doing to myself on the inside??? My days were filled with bashing myself in the brain with a baseball bat (you suck you suck you suck!) - how could they say that I didn't think I was responsible???

But to stop the self-blame and really take some responsibility... now that was tough. The biggest part of it for me was to accept 100% responsibility for my life, and to 100% accept myself as a human being who was worth saving. Part of this was to get on an antidepressant.

No, I didn't know "how to drive", but I learned. And I keep learning, and keep on crashing into trees.

[Bitsy]

Originally Posted by dalang

I think there is a big difference between accepting responsibility and self-blame. Although no depression is like another, I believe that most depressed do plenty of the latter but are afraid of the former.

You are totally right. I apologize, I contradicted myself. I refer back to my first post here, that one reason for such depression is a feeling that you are helpless to affect anything in your life, that your experiences are what confirm that for you and that nobody comes and explains LoA to you, or that you can control and change your life by consciously using your mind and your thoughts.

Originally Posted by dalang

I'm curious why I picked up this hint of sarcasm in your reply.

It was directed at what Shamou said about sending them a stick of dynomite. It's like kicking someone when their down instead of giving them the information they need to help themselves. In January when I read about I-M and LoA on Steve's site, it made so much sense when I reflected on my life and others' lives and I felt empowered, for the first time ever, I had something to work with to help myself and I set about trying to apply it. It was that information I needed and never had before.

Time to update: I'm in a transitional phase and am forgetting what it was like to be in that depression, so I am writing mistakes I think. I used to know better.

Also, I don't feel it's healthy for me to be writing about depression at this point, because it seems to be hindering me from what I am presently working on. I have lost touch a bit with this depressive thinking.

P.S. ZHereford--thank you I know it's not too late--hence, I'm still here. But I'd like to trade in my mind for a new one instead - a well-functioning logical one

[Savage]

Originally Posted by AmyM

How do you deal with these periods of stasis? Where your life is gestating and you feel swollen and cranky and immobile, but don't want to abort the baby?

You may find this article helpful:
http://www.stevepavlina.com/blog/200...m-a-7-to-a-10/

[Shamou]

Originally Posted by dalang

When you are really depressed, such a reaction is to be expected.

Originally Posted by Shamou
I can see it now... there will be the... "Yea, but, Steve, you don't understand... I've got a real problem... and it's not my fault..." cases where only a stick of dynamite will do the job...

When I wrote my quote seen above I did not have the "clinically depressed" in mind... but the multitude who always hide behind excuses...

I have no statistics... but I would be willing to bet that for every "clinically depressed" person there are one thousand who hide behind excuses... and giving compassion to these people is like giving alcohol to an alcoholic...
.

[kgiuliani]

What a great blog post! I did really need to read that today!

I just want to say a few things...

First off - to the people suffering from depression - please investigate taking magnesium supplements! Very cheap to take with no side effects from the psycho drugs a doctor would give you. Many, many, many people who suffer from psychiatric disorders such as depression and anxiety are magnesium deficient - you can google it and find all sorts of research. The reason so many people are deficient in this mineral is the way that food is produced these days.

One website to start with is:

Rapid Recovery From Depression Using Magnesium Treatment

Try taking magnesium supplements for 30 days and see if you feel any better! I take 400 mg a day.

Secondly - if someone is making you unhappy - it's not them - it's your perception and story about them in your mind that is making you feel unhappy. If you just get rid of all the "shoulds" you have about the other person - question them and see if they're really true - you will change your perception of things. A lot of people I know decide they are unhappy in a relationship, they leave, then they're unhappy without a relationship so they find another which is great at first until all the "shoulds" creep back into their minds and they're again unhappy.

Anyway, try investigating your thoughts before you decide to just quit a relationship.

However, there are some relationships that really are just dead and are worth quitting - neither person has any interest in continuing yet they stay together because of money or kids or ???. Those kinds of relationships can really hold a person back.

Just my $.02 - really should get back to work!

[{aspiring_to_clarity}]

This is a great reminder for me as I was sinking a little into the old 'it sucks and I can't do anything about it' mindset...just a little.

Some days it's harder to keep your mind in the right focus and this post has jolted me back into place.

Thanks!

[Zaulche]

As with many people who posted already I can say that this was a good post that reached me when I needed this reminder. In fact, many things you write about happen to reach me at just the right time. I suppose if you go with the subjective reality theory then you wrote about just the right thing I needed to read because I wanted to read it.

kgiuliani - I have not heard of magnesium deficiency but I will check that out. My girlfriend has trouble with anxiety (panic attacks and such), and since depression and anxiety are tied together in many ways I will give this some research. Maybe it will help her out. She did used to eat a lot of junk food when she was growing up so the food preparation idea makes sense.

In respect to the discussion on depression, I'll also throw in my two cents. I had a bout with depression for several years, as do many in this world, but where therapy and medication failed a change in my subconscious thought succeeded. I believe now that the problem then was that even though I wanted to get better, deep down I never actually believed I could. I got wrapped up in reinforcing everyone else's thoughts about me (that I needed help, or that I was not normal, etc.). What helped me eventually overcome it was realizing that it truly doesn't matter what other people think (which was a lot harder than it sounds), and that just because most people are normal doe snot mean it is the best thing to be. Once I realized I was in control of my life it really made a difference (similar to Bitsy's intent manifestation experience I think. Would that be a correct correlation Bitsy or am I off here?). It has been a long road, and sometimes I still fight with depression, but as I slowly replace all those negative thoughts with positive thoughts (and there are a lot to go through ) I am slowly becoming happier in my life. Not because I took some medication to make me happy, or because someone else thinks I should be happy, but because I truly deep down want to be happy. I know this is much easier to say than it is to actually accomplish, and it took time to move from thought to action, but I think it is probably one of the better things I have been able to accomplish as I travel down the road of personal growth.

Now I just need to get out of my car and ride a bike for a while. I suppose I could also use the exercise, as well as getting a chance to enjoy more of the scenery.