Darkworkers and relationships

[Plato]

I wasn't sure which forum this belonged on so I started it here...

I'm experimenting with becoming a darkworker since my natural inclination is towards that polarity but I have run into a sticking point. I'm confused how being a darkworker influences how I should view other people. To put it simply, is it possible to love another person and truly be a darkworker? Or does a darkworker only derive pleasure from others in the form of validation? Any advice much appreciated.

Cheers.

[Parthon]

You are right. A darkworker's relationships tend to revolve around validation and fear of being alone. But then when you take it far enough the two paths tend to converge.

A lightworker would be in an intimate relationship so they could express love.
A darkworker would express love in order to be in an intimate relationship. Often what becomes good for the darkworker becomes good for all.

As a darkworker you can be fully true to yourself and get the relationship *you* really want, cutting away those leaches that won't help you out at all. To have that relationship you probably will have to be loving and caring to the person that gives you what you want. Win-win situations and mutual gain are still good goals for a darkworker.

As a darkworker a person will be self centred, but it doesn't mean they have to be selfish, even though many people confuse the two.

I hope this helps you out.

ps. I tend to polarise to the light side, so this is my view from the outside.

[Shindra]

Originally Posted by Plato

To put it simply, is it possible to love another person and truly be a darkworker?

Love, as the word is normally used, is love-polarized. If it makes you focus on another person beyond concern for their value to you. If it is the feeling that makes you want to do a lot for them without selfish concerns.

But a darkworker has something that's also sometimes called love. It is seeing intense value in things. I'm sure you can see how a darkworker might value gold or some other object. There are sentences such as "love of money" and "love of power". A high-level darkworker can also see intense value and importance in other people. Respect for another somewhat like their high respect for themselves, their feeling of self-importance extending to see other people as important in that manner of value, related to the same feeling with which they value themself ('egoistical/narcissistic' selflove), because they see the inherent or potential value the other person has to them. (note they'll still turn their back on another person any time it serves them to do so - not as something they'll do all the time just for the principle of it, they'll stay loyal to gain something, but when the relationship is no longer beneficial to them, they'll quit without a backwards glance)
Respecting a person, honouring a person, and drawing pleasure from having a great person in their lives.

that's only what I think, I haven't really tried darkworking much. But see if it resonates with you.

Also, think selfishly of all the ways a partner could enhance your life. Simply focus on what you desire (not in the way of longing for 'sappy' love and sharing) and would enjoy in your life. Then I also think you could see how you could value a partner very strongly, 'love' them in a manner that is more aligned with the definite fear-polarized emotion of lust (not just sexual, but 'lust' for their presence) than sweet-soft longing for love.

Caring for another person would be like caring for something that's important to you, instead of caring for another person for the other person's sake. But there can still be a great intensity and focus, dedication to caring for them, if you've decided they're of value to you.

[Plato]

Thanks guys,

So a darkworker still desires to be social for the sake of being social and they still desire intimacy with others. This makes sense to me.

It's my personal issues that are holding me back I think...I'm not a good enough darkworker yet! I'd still love to hear the opinions of somebody who is strongly polarised to 'darkworking'.

I'd particularly like to know how to remove any feelings of guilt for doing what *I* want. It all stems from a deeprooted feeling of unworthiness I think. How can I get rid of that? Will it naturally fade over time by polarising more strongly?

[Natsu]

What I am going to give is my opinion. It may be wrong.

I think polarization is wrong. You can enjoy your development and other people's as well. You can love someone, and give to that person, and enjoy what that person gives you. I don't see the reason why you should only enjoy what you get from other people. Giving is a form of joy, getting is a form of joy, and deciding to be a darkworker so you'll only be "getting" is pretty limiting, for your development and your happiness.

You can work for yourself and love others, yes. You can't love others without the joy of giving. It's as nice to prepare a good meal thinking of how much your partner will enjoy it; as being surpised by your partner with a good meal that you can enjoy. Why should you deprive yourself of one of those joys? Of course, when choosing friends and partners, you should choose people who also like giving. But when you find such a person, someone who gives and receives with equal pleasure, you are one step next to happiness.

So, if I were you, I wouldn't polarize. You say you are a darkworker. I suppose that means you want to develop yourself and your life. If you, as a darkworker are doing harm, in the end it will hurt you. If you are producing something useful, why shouldn't you be glad that what you're doing is useful? It won't be an obstacle for you to enjoy the fact that what you're doing helps you, and pays your bills.

So, my suggestion would be: do not polarize. Love requires two givers without doormat ambitions. And if you choose NOT to give, love is something you won't have. And I wouldn't trust friends who don't give either.

[Chet]

I think of choosing light or dark as being lazy. Its easy to pick a course of action if you have decided in advance if you are doing first for yourself or first for others.
The middle road, choosing each time, depending on circumstances is harder but leads to balance and harmony in the end.

[Natsu]

Totally agree, Chet. Sometimes you must switch. Though, as a general rule, I don't like "either or", I much prefer "both"

[Shindra]

Originally Posted by Natsu

I think polarization is wrong. You can enjoy your development and other people's as well. You can love someone, and give to that person, and enjoy what that person gives you. I don't see the reason why you should only enjoy what you get from other people. Giving is a form of joy, getting is a form of joy,

A lightworker can enjoy giving with love, and enjoy getting with a deep sense of gratitude. A darkworker enjoys getting with selfish desire, and enjoys giving to others because, post-syndrome, darkworkers see the great value others have to them. They enjoy nurturing what's important to them - directly, simply because they see their importance. They enjoy giving to, improving (the state of) others like they enjoy improving the environment they live in.


I think a lot of people have problems with the idea because before polarization, they use different polarities for respective parts of their lives - anger towards and revenge on the bad guys, forgiveness and compassion for the good guys. Dark for getting a fancy new car, light for driving your kids to school in it.
But either side have mechanisms for any situation. It's not compartmentalized getting/giving like that - polarizing doesn't remove half your life, or make it irrelevant or unenjoyable. The thing is, when darkworkers give, they do it as an act of getting, seeing how it improves their reality, their situation, people important to them , with a lust for all pleasing things in life fueling them. When lightworkers get, they enjoy it with love, enjoying that the giver gives as an act of love (if it is so), and with gratitude.

Some culturally well-known examples: Lightworkers can enjoy stopping to smell the flowers. Darkworkers can enjoy polishing their collection of rare and valuable items.

[Natsu]

Originally Posted by Shindra

Some culturally well-known examples: Lightworkers can enjoy stopping to smell the flowers. Darkworkers can enjoy polishing their collection of rare and valuable items.

My point is still valid: it's either/or, and "both" sounds much better. I want to stop smell the flowers I watered, AND polish my collection of rare and valuable items. I don't know why I should be stronger by focusing on one thing, when I can just as logically and easily choose both. That's why I have a problem with the concept: it's really, really limiting.

[Shindra]

Originally Posted by Natsu

My point is still valid: it's either/or, and "both" sounds much better. I want to stop smell the flowers I watered, AND polish my collection of rare and valuable items. I don't know why I should be stronger by focusing on one thing, when I can just as logically and easily choose both. That's why I have a problem with the concept: it's really, really limiting.

A darkworker can admire the power and efficiency of nature. A lightworker can enjoy all those items as beautiful.

But right - what is the point of choosing one? Actually, it's a very big one. If you don't polarize, you'll be holding yourself down from higher levels of consciousness. As Steve wrote, you can experience/use the energies -3/+3 before polarization, when afterwards you can reach 10 - on a logarithmic scale. Higher levels of consciousness make for an intensely rich and positive experience, with less and less negative emotion bogging you down. If you can reach the level of joy, "a pervasive feeling of natural euphoria" - http://www.stevepavlina.com/blog/200...consciousness/ that is always in the back of your mind, and have it as both loving joy and being high on power, I'd be more than impressed.

Truth is, you can only have very little of both. You can have many, many times more of one. By not choosing, you are actually giving up on a lot, an enormous lot. You're giving up a glory that is unlike anything at the lower levels, before polarization.
For example loving all in existence (lightworker), or feeling unstoppably powerful and having a thirst for all of life.

The reason for polarizing is that you can reach higher levels of consciousness, become a better, grander person, have a consistently wonderful experience - and you'll evolve much faster, go through the levels faster, after polarization.

So not polarizing is really, really limiting.

Suffering, lack of higher states of being, comes from mixing polarizations. Guilt is the most obvious example. But notice that to reach higher levels, to be better people, lightworkers have to transcend fear, see fear, the energy which fuels darkworkers at the root, as an illusion. They also become humble (not neccesarily acting humble, but feeling safe leads them to feel less self-important, except as a being to express love) - a darkworker does the opposite, seeing themself as all-important. And a darkworker has to discard compassion, which drags them towards guilt and makes internal conflicts that become anger.
When one holds thoughts from both polarities at once, or shift between them a lot, this drags their energy down. Your problem might be that you have never seen the potential beyond this muddled state - and that is no fault of yours, since we have so few examples. Very few people polarize. But when you see the betters states of being, when you start to glimpse higher levels of consciousness, you'll see they're imcompatible. The feeling of complete love is as different from the feeling of complete importance as black is from white. Light's love for all of life. Dark's thirst for all of life. You see, it's that. If you look at this set of data, you probably already know it. How for example your drive and ambition are not as high as they could be if you centered your life around service to self or service to others. How there's a ceiling to your most positive emotions. Something holding you back from going all-out in what you know to be a good thing.

Yes, polarizing loses you one. But the gain is really indescribable. It's like putting down a penny to pick up a briefcase with a million bucks.

http://www.stevepavlina.com/blog/2007/02/polarization/

Originally Posted by http://www.stevepavlina.com/blog/2007/02/polarization/

At their fullest intensities, both polarities are extremely powerful. But until you polarize, you don’t have access to the full range on either side. On a scale of -10 to 10, you maybe get to operate in the -3 to +3 range before you polarize, and that’s a logarithmic scale. After you polarize you gradually get access to the rest of the range… but only on one side or the other.

[...]

After you polarize and learn to use your dominant energy with greater intensity, there will be major consequences. These include clearer thinking, stronger and more accurate intuition, increased psychic development, and a greater ability to manifest your desires. Overall life will become much easier for you because you’ll have a greater capacity to use intentional energy. It’s like being 10x stronger — everything you pick up feels lighter.

[Chet]

Anybody besides Steve (and his me too's) saying all that about polarizing?

[Natsu]

Originally Posted by Shindra

A darkworker can admire the power and efficiency of nature. A lightworker can enjoy all those items as beautiful.

And a non-polarizer can do both things. It's still two to one.

Originally Posted by Shindra

But right - what is the point of choosing one? Actually, it's a very big one. If you don't polarize, you'll be holding yourself down from higher levels of consciousness.

Who says? That sounds illogical, specially considering that in Hawking's book, the highest level of consciousness were filled with "lightworkers" ONLY. The very definition of the levels of consciousness stop the development of the darkworker at pride and courage. How do you know that if you don't polarize you hold yourself down? I don't think being ONLY a darkworker can take you higher than reason, and that's too high for what I normally see of darkworkers. I totally disagree with that: polarization may drag you down in levels of consciousness. Apply selfishness and don't recognize the genius and potential in others, and that's going to lead you to joy? Wrong. It is illogical even in writing.

Most "darkworkers" I've known never get higher than pride. They lose the joy of love and giving. It's a great loss. "Lightworkers" are supposed to lose the joy of the knowledge of their own potential and divinity. Another great loss. No sense in any of it.

As Steve wrote, you can experience/use the energies -3/+3 before polarization, when afterwards you can reach 10 - on a logarithmic scale.

That only depends on how hard you are going to work to raise your level of consciousness. It is ridiculous to say that you have to choose either -3/+3 or +10. I am saying I want 10/+10, and I'll go for -100/+100, because I would lose if I had to sacrifice any of the two.

Higher levels of consciousness make for an intensely rich and positive experience,

Sure, but what has that to do with polarity? Of course higher levels of consciousness are better than low ones. What I don't see is the reason why polarizing will lift me up, and not polarizing will drag me down. Only because Steve says? I disagree with Steve: I intend to go up with my levels of consciousness without polarizing, how do you know that's limiting? I believe I can achieve the state of joy without polarizing.

Truth is, you can only have very little of both. You can have many, many times more of one.

Who says? Only because Steve and you say, that must be true? I disagree... I can have many times more of both, because two is more than one, because giving is joy and getting is joy, and I don't know how on Earth you should get to joy sooner and better by cutting your sources of joy in half. It's preposterous.

By not choosing, you are actually giving up on a lot, an enormous lot. You're giving up a glory that is unlike anything at the lower levels, before polarization.

Huh? Do you realize that you are giving no reason to your statements? What you just wrote could be a believer telling me that only with his religion I'd go to paradise, and all others are wrong. I'm asking... Why?

For example loving all in existence (lightworker), or feeling unstoppably powerful and having a thirst for all of life.

For the hundredth time... Why cannot I do both things? I love all in existance, and have thirst for all life can give me, because my life is just as sacred and loveworthy as all the rest of existance.

The reason for polarizing is that you can reach higher levels of consciousness, become a better, grander person, have a consistently wonderful experience - and you'll evolve much faster, go through the levels faster, after polarization.

Who says? Never seen a darkworker up reason. And the enlightened, Jesus and Buddha admitted divine potential in themselves. They were mainly lightworkers, but they also recognized their own divine nature... So what you claim does not agree with what we know of people in high levels of consciousness.

So not polarizing is really, really limiting.

Then again... Why? Examples? Reasons? You say that polarization will make you reach higher levels of consciousness... where did you get that from? Who says?

Suffering, lack of higher states of being, comes from mixing polarizations.

NO.

Well, let's rephrase that. Not to me. Anyway, if reality is subjective and I believe I'll be stronger by non-polarizing, I'll be stronger by not polarizing, full stop. Still, I haven't seen why mutilating yourself will get you higher. You say "Polarization gets you higher, non-polarization gets you down"... I say... Why? I don't agree at all with that. I went up the levels of consciousness thanks to a higher consciousness and understanding of myself, meditation, hard work, use of the law of attraction... But, polarization? No polarization will raise your level of consciousness as the fact of getting to know that levels of consciousness exist. That alone makes you go higher.

Guilt is the most obvious example.

What does guilt have to do with polarization? Reason, logic and self-knowledge get you out of guilt, NOT polarization. Where do you get the idea that if you don't polarize you'll feel guiltier? Or, what's the reason behind that idea?

But notice that to reach higher levels, to be better people, lightworkers have to transcend fear, see fear, the energy which fuels darkworkers at the root, as an illusion. They also become humble (not neccesarily acting humble, but feeling safe leads them to feel less self-important, except as a being to express love) -

That can be done with reason, love and meditation. No need to polarize.

a darkworker does the opposite, seeing themself as all-important. And a darkworker has to discard compassion, which drags them towards guilt and makes internal conflicts that become anger.

Discarding compassion will NOT raise your level of consciousness. You can be angry and compassionate. You'll pass the state of anger when you realize that it's natural, and learn to use it to your advantage. No need to stop being compassionate in the way.

When one holds thoughts from both polarities at once, or shift between them a lot, this drags their energy down.

No.

Your problem might be that you have never seen the potential beyond this muddled state -

That's right. I don't see the potential. But my state is not muddled, and I find it pretty daring of you to say I have a problem. Polarization is still limiting. I don't see conflicts or muddled state. You act properly, you get the benefits of giving and receiving; your potential and that of others. Any less is asking too little from life.

Very few people polarize. But when you see the betters states of being, when you start to glimpse higher levels of consciousness, you'll see they're imcompatible. The feeling of complete love is as different from the feeling of complete importance as black is from white. Light's love for all of life. Dark's thirst for all of life.

No wonder very few people polarize, since it's one of the most limiting beliefs I've ever faced. Again: I want to love all life and thirst for all life. I can do both. I can enjoy both. I feel joy when serving others, and joy when being served by others.

You see, it's that. If you look at this set of data, you probably already know it. How for example your drive and ambition are not as high as they could be if you centered your life around service to self or service to others.

Au contraire. You don't get my point: my service to myself and my service to others ARE THE VERY SAME THING. Fulfilling my purpose in life is giving to others. Others fulfilling their purpose in life is giving to me. My drive and ambition cannot be affected by polarization, because then again, serving others is serving me, and serving me is serving others, both things are joyful and promising.

How there's a ceiling to your most positive emotions. Something holding you back from going all-out in what you know to be a good thing.

Hmmm... No.

Yes, polarizing loses you one. But the gain is really indescribable. It's like putting down a penny to pick up a briefcase with a million bucks.

Polarizing loses you one eye, one ear, 16 teeth, half a nose, one leg, one arm, one lung half a heart... And it doesn't give you anything worthy of that loss.

[Plato]

Originally Posted by Natsu

Most "darkworkers" I've known never get higher than pride. They lose the joy of love and giving.

How would you know? Darkworkers and lightworkers will behave in the same way. Giving has many many rewards for the giver, including material gains. The people you are talking about are not darkworkers- they are people with a very blinkered view of the world.

[Chet]

So lets see -
lightworkers love everything, its the primary motive? That I presume includes loving yourself?
And of course since you love everything equally and unconditionally that includes yourself .. so no such thing as a darkworker ... and since there is no opposite ... no such thing as a lightworker ....

[Kingston]

Well said Shindra. Nice to see you are making an effort to convince people, it doesn't seem easy to say the least!

Let me add a bit that might help. I am not going to refute your (Natsu's) objections one by one, it is like fighting a hydra. I am going to try to show what it feels like to be polarized.

Re-read the polarization articles. They all stem from the law of attraction, so view them in that light. It is about generating a strong flow. When you start using one direction of flow more and more, you polarize. Your ability to manifest depends on the strength and speed of the flow, just like you level of consciousness depends on flow. You are never going to get to higher levels (love, joy, etc.)permanently if you don't polarize (i.e. use the same kind of flow for every intention).

Let me share my own experiences, so you will not have to take Steve's or Shindra's word for it.

Since my polarization decision I have gained mental clarity. I can experience the level of love by focusing on it (it is not permanent yet, that will take some time!), and I can feel joy in meditation after about ten minutes. My decision making is almost effortless and my experiences have a 'richness' they didn't have before. I am eager to see where things will go next if I get to master energy flow even better.

Natsu, consider that if you see a person at the level of pride, you are not necessarily seeing a darkworker. You see a person functioning at a lower level. Simply think of people who have done (manifested) great things. They are the real dark- and lightworkers. You don't have to polarize today, but at least be open to the possibility that you are missing something. If you want to manifest big things, you need a strong flow. Only a specialist in one direction can make a strong flow. Just think of two questions: How big are the things you want to manifest? And: Which kind of flow are you going to use?

Take care.

[Natsu]

Well, Kingston, well said. I'll try to have an open mind about polarization. I still don't see the point of it (and that's the only topic in which I've ever disregarded Steve's articles fully). Still... I have seen other people, and frankly... I have seen happy lightworkers, but never a happy darkworker. You can suffer if you only give to others, but I suppose that for those who choose such a thing willingly, it's good enough. But, be happy with the "me, me, me" mindset? I've never ever met such a person. And logic says polarization is limiting, so I still don't grasp it.

However, as I said, I'll keep an open mind towards it. I may accept the concept some day. But it will be when I see it as an addendum to my life and development, instead of the mutilation it seems to be, at least to me, now.

[Natsu]

Originally Posted by Kingston

Natsu, consider that if you see a person at the level of pride, you are not necessarily seeing a darkworker. You see a person functioning at a lower level. Simply think of people who have done (manifested) great things. They are the real dark- and lightworkers.

An example of a darkworker in a state of consciousness higher than reason, please? As far as I can remember, almost everyone in higher levels are lightworkers. If at least I could see an example of how polarization would work, I could be more receptive to it. But so far, I haven't seen such a thing.

[Kingston]

Examples are Napoleon Bonaparte, Julius Ceasar, Alexander the Great, Gengis Kahn, Silvio Berlusconi, Vladimir Putin, Miyamoto Musashi.

I could name others, but I wouldn't be sure of their level of consciousness. These guys definitely are of (self) Love and above. Musashi even reached 'classic' enlightment, which I would call, considering he was a professional killer, "endarkment".

I have some friends who are close to the level of love, both 'light' and 'dark'. They have the so called fire behind their eyes. They manifest advanced stuff. They are not that hard to find, you will meet them by chance / synchronicity when you polarize. I met my first darkworker 7 years ago, when I was around the level of courage/neutrality, immediately after deciding that I would do "anything" to succeed in life.

My life is indeed about me, me, me. I can only develop through other people, I enjoy the company of talent, I have a need for quality conversation. I have to be wise about how and with who I spend my precious time, just like the guys I mentioned above.

[Natsu]

Originally Posted by Kingston

Examples are Napoleon Bonaparte, Julius Ceasar, Alexander the Great, Gengis Kahn, Silvio Berlusconi, Vladimir Putin, Miyamoto Musashi.

Now you really convinced me that I'll (probably, I never close doors) never, ever polarize in my whole life. ¿Putin? ¿Berlusconi? Those are guys in LOW states of consciousness. Caesar and Bonaparte are a bunch of courage and pride with a bit of reason and loads of determination, I'll grant you that. But being determined to crash yourself against the wall is NOT empowering and NOT a good idea. Alexander was good enough to create an empire, but not wise enough to choose a proper heir before he died. All those people have serious flaws, are they supposed to be good examples because they've gotten into history book? That wouldn't stop many of them from being failures in life.

Musashi IS a great one... But I don't think he's a darkworker, though not a lightworker either. I totally agree that this one got to a high level of consciousness... But Musashi did NOT polarize. He could as well kill dutifully as be tender and compassionate towards women. He is an example of what you get by not polarizing, so I don't know what he's doing on that list. Musashi was a winner in life, life a total triumph. I have serious doubts about the others, and I think Musashi's life was totally un-polarized.

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