If it's fun does it still count as "Hard Work"?

[cylon]

I think think the concept of "hard work" as we use it in our western culture today, is unhealthy.

On one extreme, embracing it can turn you into a stressed out workaholic, who has stress related illness, and dies young.

On the other extreme, many people who may actually enjoy taking some deliberate, focused action will avoid it unnecessarily because they have associated any action whatsoever as being "hard" or "difficult" (basically, no pleasure involved).

When we are told "to be successful, it takes lots of hard work" what we hear is that it takes lots of pain and misery to be happy. That makes no sense to me. The personal journey in our culture is basically totally ignored, and the end result is all we care about. We are raised to believe that if it's worth having, and if we're worth having it, there has to be some major sacrifice, struggle, and stress involved in attaining it.

Yet, we also are raised with the conflicting message (in my view) that we should do what we are most passionate about in life, to live each day as if it was the last, etc. Basically, to enjoy ourselves. But to me, if you're enjoying life, it is not "hard work".

And in the middle, we have people who are "lucky" or who do what they truly love in life, and are successful at it, and people look at them with envy, scorn, jealousy, you name it. Probably by the same people who wish they could live their life's passion.

How is it possible to hold both these beliefs at the same time? That on one hand, you have to be miserable and not enjoy yourself "work hard" but on the other, you have to work with passion and live life to the fullest?

[Andrew Brunelle]

Well, you don't ever have to work hard. Never. If you don't enjoy it, don't do it. You don't have to play by society's rules. You can focus yoruself to work on what you enjoy, and even though the work is challenging, you wouldn't call it hard work or even work. You would call it play. I remember hearing an audio program about this somewhere. Someone wrote some book about lazy way to success or something. Not Marc Allen, but someone else, and he was talking about how he views his "work" as play because he enjoys it so much.

[Daffy Duck]

Getting up, dressed, and going into work every day is harder work than laying around at home. But I enjoy my job, so in a sense, it would be "harder" work to stay home and be lazy.

Working hard does not have to be miserable. To me, it just means you do a lot of things. Not just sitting at home goofing off.

[supertom]

For me hard work is work makes you go to the next level, dont the repetitive tasks people seem to think hardwork is. just make it our ally so we dont have to think about it

[cylon]

I saw a great documentary yesterday called "Blindsight". It's about a group of blind kids in Tibet (who are all considered lowlife outcasts because of their blindness) who attempted to climb a mountain right next to Mount Everest, led by a blind man who had done it himself. They also had several experienced mountain climbing guides with them.

At one of their camps, where the elevation was starting to affect everyone, they all huddled together and tried to decide how much further they were willing to guide the kids up the mountain, with some of the kids showing health concerns. One of the American guides, a doctor, made a point which I think reflects what I said in the OP.

He was saying how different it is in the East than the West. He said before the westerners came, the people in Tibet never even considered climbing those mountains, but there is something in the western mindset that makes us want to climb that peak, just to get there. We forget about the journey, and what it felt like, and think of it as a lesser part of the goal.

His point being, that the kids had come so far that it was already a successful climb, and that reaching the final destination was totally beside the point.

Which was my point with the OP. I don't think we allow ourselves to enjoy the journey. And what's worse, is we think anything of value is to NOT be enjoyed, and if it IS enjoyed, there is no value to it.

I believe that many people who otherwise WOULD take focused action, don't. Probably because they would feel a lot of guilt for enjoying something that was supposed to be so "hard". They may think they are doing it wrong.

[Manomanman]

Originally Posted by cylon

How is it possible to hold both these beliefs at the same time? That on one hand, you have to be miserable and not enjoy yourself "work hard" but on the other, you have to work with passion and live life to the fullest?

Steve's got a good depiction in one of his blogs, where he talks about walking around in a quasi-meditative state, just happily doing his work all day long. There's no struggle, no questioning, no emotional blockage, just purpose-driven work.

I think the problem is just the connotation of "work" with pain. The Christian notion of salvation through self-sacrifice and suffering.

I have had to distance the term "work" in my mind from "progress." When I do certain activities, I'm just growing, evolving, and laying the foundation for future successes. It takes me hours and hours and hours...but as Steve says, the time is going to pass either way, I can either do it with action or with indecision and inaction and consciousness-dulling activities.

I'll choose the purpose-driven time passing.

[Manomanman]

Originally Posted by cylon

Which was my point with the OP. I don't think we allow ourselves to enjoy the journey. And what's worse, is we think anything of value is to NOT be enjoyed, and if it IS enjoyed, there is no value to it.

I believe that many people who otherwise WOULD take focused action, don't. Probably because they would feel a lot of guilt for enjoying something that was supposed to be so "hard". They may think they are doing it wrong.

EXCELLENT way of putting it. "Fun" = "not working" = "guilt". That about sums it up.

You've got to radically change the way you think about things in order to obtain that which you desire. The mindset that cylon is describing is a VERY disempowering mindset to have towards financial abundance, time, goal setting...basically any facet of your personal success.

[cylon]

Originally Posted by Manomanman

I think the problem is just the connotation of "work" with pain. The Christian notion of salvation through self-sacrifice and suffering.

Right. And it probably doesn't help that I was raised by wacko-christians for the most part.

We all like to think we're evolved and think for ourselves now, but I'm afraid our cultural heritage casts a large shadow we aren't aware of. Where else could one possibly get the notion that their lives should be one of suffering? That's really what our 'creator' intended? To feel like crap all the time?

Originally Posted by Manomanman

I have had to distance the term "work" in my mind from "progress." When I do certain activities, I'm just growing, evolving, and laying the foundation for future successes. It takes me hours and hours and hours...but as Steve says, the time is going to pass either way, I can either do it with action or with indecision and inaction and consciousness-dulling activities.

I'll choose the purpose-driven time passing.

I can use that, I also have been using the terms "focused action" "right action".... have to get away from this concept of work/suffering which seem to be inseparable.

It's like if you say "God", I'm going to instantly think of the Bible, and maybe see a picture of Jesus. Not because they are necessarily God (I highly doubt they are), but because I have associated those words with those images zillions of times over the years.

I'm afraid it's the same with "work" and "suffering".

[Trezker]

My theory. There should only be joy in your life.
There is two ways to achieve this. Either you eliminate that which does not give you joy, or you choose to enjoy it.

I think you can learn to find joy in anything. Liking something is a choice.

[MindsetApprentice]

Cyclon: Hey Cyclon, I totally hear what you're saying.

In my opinion the concept of 'hard work' is a negative one to maintain in ones life. As you mentioned, the phrase has a negative connotation to it and immediately puts weight into the factor of taking the enjoyoment out of what you're doing. Even if it's something you're passionate about, attaching the perspective of 'hard work,' onto it can make it sincerely unenjoyable.

All that you discuss comes down to a sense of perception really.

The only reason 'hard work' has a negative association to it is because the way it has been portrayed is in a way with a negative perception.

Thus, our perception of 'hard work,' is negative. In reality, anyone of us can change our negative association with the concept to one that's positive.

Any associations we have in life, positive or negative, can be changed immediately simply by choosing to. This can be done simply by 'linking,' the concept with something positive.

For example, the words 'hard work' can in some people bring about in their mind exhaustion, feeling tired, unmotivated, sweat, etc. If instead they purposely thought of positive associations with the words 'hard work' such as the end result...the feeling of incredible success...the joy at the 'attainment' of whatever it is you're working hard for...Doing all that would GREATLY pay off.

Regarding the point about living each day as if it's our last and living passionately. You are so completely on.

There are a lot of nonsensical contradictions in our society that just don't go hand in hand.

It's interesting considering in the eastern culture and philosophies there are dichotomy's and contradictions left and right...but if you understand them, they actually go together...the contradictions that is...

In our Western culture however, we have many contradictions that just do not go together -- one of them being the concept of working hard (with that negative perception), but also living passionately. Those two wouldn't be contrary factors if the 'working hard' had the positive association attached to it as I mentioned earlier.

As for Lucky: oh my! Don't get me started I have people tell me so often...

"Sean you're so lucky to have the mentorship of the top leaders in the personal growth/transformational industry."

I say 'NO! What are you saying?! Don't say that! Do you realize what you are doing when you're calling me Lucky? You are giving your power away and acting 'as if' the things I've manifested in my life only 'happen' to certain people.'

In actuality, the blessings I have and incredible things in my life didn't 'happen' to me, and did not arise through luck. They occurred through intention combined with inspired action, plus many other qualities such as commitment to the outcome, persistence, patience, etc. etc.

So whenever you hear someone talking about yourself or another as lucky, I recommend reminding them that they can create the same things in their life. It may take time; especially if their mindset isn't straight...but when the right development anyone can be 'lucky,' in the way that they actually think lucky is.

So finally coming to your final question of "How is it possible to hold both these beliefs at the same time?" -- You can't.

It comes down to a matter of being congruent. Being in alignment. Those contradictory beliefs are in complete disalignment with eachother.

Everyone's core being is one in which happiness, love and joy are the foundations. Everything else that is built upon that must be 'in alignment' with it.

Therefor, if the perception of hard work has a negative association with it, then we can not be aligned.

If everything we see in the world is filtered through the eyes of positive perception, then we will always be living a life that's full of both passion and purpose.

Cyclon: Thanks for bringing up this great topic. I really enjoyed thinking about this one and sharing my thoughts on it. Any other dialog on this matter is so incredibly welcome.

[cylon]

Great points there Sean, that gave me some much welcomed perspective.

I suppose it comes down to defining your own terms, and making your reality work for you, instead of trying to fit into someone else's reality, and trying to live by their rules or notions of how you should or should not act, and how you should or should not feel.

Basically just because we have deeply ingrained beliefs in the west about these things, doesn't make them true. We have to learn to listen to our own best selves.

[MindsetApprentice]

You're Welcome Cyclon! I'm glad I was able to offer a perspective you were able to connect with.

You are ABSOLUTELY ON about listening to our best selves!

Right before I got the notification that you replied to my forum post, I was about to read a blog with the topic "Don't believe a word you read."

Now, I don't know what it's specifically about yet...but it has a great point...DONT believe a word you've read...and I'll add to it by saying DON'T believe a word you've heard, until you've evaluated it yourself! And I don't mean evaluating in the sense of going through your logic and thinking deeply about it. Just see how you feel. Does it feel right?

It's amazing the answers we can get when we just calm ourselves, get centered, and listen to what's inside.

As a community we need to encourage each other...and encourage anyone who is actively studying and learning in this world, to make up their own minds about things. The paradigms we have in the west are just that, paradigms. I believe paradigms are always meant to be broken.

[Trezker]

Realize the truth, there is no hard work.
Do not try to change the work to make it fun. Instead, change yourself to enjoy it.

I watched Matrix, again.

[MindsetApprentice]

Hey Cylon!

I was resonating with this series of discussions so much that I posted about it on my blog and referenced a couple paragraphs of what you said...

I wrote it last night and had it set to auto publish this morning...

I must have had a dream about it because I woke up thinking, "oh crap, I should probably ask you if that's cool...if you mind me sharing a couple things you said..."

Is it? Let me know if that was alright or not.

[cylon]

No problem, I don't mind.

[MindsetApprentice]

Awesome! Thanks Cylon! Again, enjoyed our discussion. Love your perspective on things.

[cylon]

My pleasure. Nice reading a blog inspired by one of my questions.

[drama07]

'Hard work' is because you are resisting the moment. 'Fun' is when you accept the moment and let life flow.

It's a matter of the end of identification with the mind because the mind will always resist what it doesn't want, and accept what it wants.

[Michaelm]

Hard work is physically hard work, period.
Everything else is just lots of work but not hard.

Executives who talk about hard work most probably mean they had a hard-on during it.

[RT Wolf]

^ Lemme guess, you do physically hard work?

cylon, are you familiar with the idea of wu-wei? Wu wei - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

One way ot think of it is to move quickly but not to hurry. I think you're already familiar with these concepts?

Srsly, though, the whole idea of god loves you more if you're in pain or sacrifice is just...odd. I grew up with it too and it's just screwy.

[Michaelm]

I don't anymore and still I feel this way.
People that don't do physically hard work are usually the ones screaming the loudest about doing hard work while they never ever do.

Like those selfmade businessman.
Yeah, sure it was hard work collecting all that interest and getting drowned in tax benefits.
But they haven't spilled a single drop of sweat while they we're working.
Only on the tennis and golf courts.

They have no trouble whatsoever abusing people so why should they have trouble abusing words ?