If reality is truly subjective, then why are Steve and Erin changing their diets?

[magi13]

everyone is entitled to his own opinion. ^^, that's all there is to it.

[SuavePlaya]

What part don't you understand when they say subjective reality is a belief system they choose to live. It's not like they are saying this belief system is the truth and that's it follow it or you are wrong or die a horrible death. I do not see why you are bashing their beliefs. If you are against it then live according to your beliefs and it's a win win situation for everybody. It's never a bad thing to try something out and if it works great and if it doesn't find out what does.

[bluedragon]

Originally Posted by The Animus

This issue was brought up in order to help them see the faults in their reasoning, and to instruct others more accurately and according to the truth.

Animus, I'm sorry but you're proving over and over that you don't understand what they mean by subjective reality. Don't you understand that if reality is subjective, than Steve and Erin don't even exist, and neither does their changing of diets? It's all only a projection of your thoughts.
If, and i repeat, if reality is the way Steve described it, then it is absurd to ask "Why are Steve and Erin changing their diets?" because the moment you ask this question, you create them and you create the truth that "they are changing their diets.". They are not doing so. You perceive them as doing so. But "you" does not mean your physical body and mind. When I say "you", I mean Consciousness, and there is only ONE consciousness. Your body, the bodies of everybody else on this forum, as well as this forum, all the computers in the world, and the whole world, are only a projection of Consciousness. Again, IF reality is subjective. But you can't prove it isn't, because "if it is", than you wanting to prove that it isn't would ALWAYS result in you succeeding in proving it. Because the moment you would believe it is subjective, it would become subjective. Does that make sense? How would you like this explained so that you would accept it, as a possibility, as a plausible model of reality, not as truth?

[Aleksander Krstic]

Originally Posted by bluedragon

If, and i repeat, if reality is the way Steve described it, then it is absurd to ask "Why are Steve and Erin changing their diets?" because the moment you ask this question, you create them and you create the truth that "they are changing their diets.". They are not doing so. You perceive them as doing so. But "you" does not mean your physical body and mind. When I say "you", I mean Consciousness, and there is only ONE consciousness. Your body, the bodies of everybody else on this forum, as well as this forum, all the computers in the world, and the whole world, are only a projection of Consciousness. Again, IF reality is subjective. But you can't prove it isn't, because "if it is", than you wanting to prove that it isn't would ALWAYS result in you succeeding in proving it. Because the moment you would believe it is subjective, it would become subjective. Does that make sense? How would you like this explained so that you would accept it, as a possibility, as a plausible model of reality, not as truth?

What I don't agree with is the way everyone says that even Steve and Erin or them changing diet doesn't exist. It's like saying that changing the belief that gravity works would somehow turn it off. I believe it's essential to keep subjective and objective perspectives parallel.

[drama07]

Originally Posted by Aleksander Krstic

What I don't agree with is the way everyone says that even Steve and Erin or them changing diet doesn't exist. It's like saying that changing the belief that gravity works would somehow turn it off. I believe it's essential to keep subjective and objective perspectives parallel.

Actually, you can turn gravity off. Although, the fact there is gravity is a strong fundamental core belief in you. Your belief of gravity is so strong that any intention 'of not having it' wouldn't eliminate it. Hence you still have gravity. Once you change the core belief, then youll see what happens.

[bluedragon]

Originally Posted by Aleksander Krstic

What I don't agree with is the way everyone says that even Steve and Erin or them changing diet doesn't exist. It's like saying that changing the belief that gravity works would somehow turn it off. I believe it's essential to keep subjective and objective perspectives parallel.

It's not that their physical bodies don't exist. It's just that, they are not a separate consciousness from your own. And you are not your body either, in this model of reality. All humans and everything else in the Universe supposedly has only one consciousness, and exists only within that consciousness.
So observing any fact about reality is in fact the act of creating that reality. So asking "why is reality like this?" is absurd, since the moment you ask this question, reality will become like this, thus answering your question. It's like this, because you asked why Or simply, "because"
What would mean, in your opinion, to keep subjective and objective perspectives parallel ?

[moonrambler]

Originally Posted by bluedragon

Animus, I'm sorry but you're proving over and over that you don't understand what they mean by subjective reality. Don't you understand that if reality is subjective, than Steve and Erin don't even exist, and neither does their changing of diets? It's all only a projection of your thoughts.

I see what the person on the previous page meant about how this argument can't be won, and not only that, we can't even have a reasonable discussion about the subject. We tried this in a different thread, where I was asking why Steve would choose such a restrictive diet if he truly believed in subjective reality. All I get back is that I don't understand what they mean by subjective reality. Of course I do, and so does Animus. What I was saying is, I don't believe in subjective reality to the degree that everything is my consciousness and Steve and Erin don't exist.

Let's say subjective reality is a false belief system. Nevertheless, some people believe in it. Or they say they do. Despite this supposed belief that nothing exists outside of consciousness, there's all this talk about how only one very restrictive type of diet is healthy, and it creates all these stupendous effects, and everything else is poison. How in the world does that fit with the same person believing in subjective reality?

Please don't come back and tell me I don't understand the concept. If I did believe in the concept of subjective reality, then I'd eat meat all day long because I'd know that it didn't really come from animals.

I think Steve explained his motivation quite well, actually. And Erin said flat-out that she/they don't actually believe in subjective reality but that it's a useful lens. So there you go.

[cylon]

Originally Posted by moonrambler

Despite this supposed belief that nothing exists outside of consciousness, there's all this talk about how only one very restrictive type of diet is healthy, and it creates all these stupendous effects, and everything else is poison. How in the world does that fit with the same person believing in subjective reality?

I think the idea is that everything in awareness is of your creation. We are not the people we think we are, we are in fact all of existence, in a way tricking ourselves into thinking that we are one little part of a larger whole as an individual, when in fact, we are everything. And stuff.

So assuming for the moment that's true, the entire concept of diet is something that you are creating. Maybe even the very fact that food is required for survival, I'm not sure. It's not so much about the ins and outs of which diet you should be eating, it's the premise that eating in itself has any effect whatsoever. Or that food is even real. Or that our bodies are real.

So the bottom line is, this entire discussion is actually, a projection of your understanding of your abilities as a creator, right now, and for whatever reason, this thread was created by you to explore your own creative ability as 'god'.

Or I could say it's all my creation since there is only one consciousness.

I was at the gym the other day and thinking about the same thing "can I just think my body into good shape?" I don't know. I know that I ENJOY the feeling of going to the gym, and in order to do that, I have to accept certain truths about the physical universe, like, my body has muscles and it feels good to exercise.

It's easier to think about if you don't see yourself as separate from anything or anyone. If you can believe that you are literally creating your reality, not just attracting stuff, but literally creating the very planet you're on, then you'd see these threads as conversations you're having with yourself. Then at some point, the nasty ego (da-da-duuum) comes along, and makes us think we are separate, and then all of the sudden things start getting all difficult again.

Know what I'm sayin'?

[Savage]

FYI the accounts The Animus, Byron, and several others were fake accounts created by a previously banned user. The fake accounts were caught by a moderator today and have since been banned (having multiple fake accounts has always been against the forum rules).

This was a previous user who was banned for trolling and creating multiple fake accounts in the past.

I'm happy to keep this thread open, but if you wish to continue the discussion, just be aware of the source and that the fake accounts will no longer be participating.

Carry on...

[bluedragon]

Originally Posted by moonrambler

Please don't come back and tell me I don't understand the concept. If I did believe in the concept of subjective reality, then I'd eat meat all day long because I'd know that it didn't really come from animals.

Then I don't understand it, because from where I stand, your view is different enough from what I understand, that the difference is important enough to lead you to completely different opinions and conclusions. If I understood it the way you do, I would totally agree with your conclusions, and I would contradict those who use this model of reality. But if you would try to look at it the way I look at it, your questions would be possible to answer. Because you still talk about other people as being separate entities having a separate consciousness and "doing actions" that you can comment on or ask questions about, while in a subjective reality, other consciousness simply don't exist. The fact that your body can type a question about what somebody else's body is doing does not prove that both your bodies are not animated by a single consciousness.

[cylon]

I have a phrase that is helping me not get too confused or carried away with SR.

"It's all one thing."

Seems to stop my mind from going down endless avenues.

[bluedragon]

One more minute and I would have hit 11:11 again

Originally Posted by Steve Pavlina

I'm happy to keep this thread open, but if you wish to continue the discussion, just be aware of the source and that the fake accounts will no longer be participating.
Carry on...

I think you are very amused by our struggle to debate this concept you! brought up

In my opinion, discussing this is like fighting with a panda

[moonrambler]

Originally Posted by cylon

Know what I'm sayin'?

Yeah, I do. It's basically a twist on how I tend to look at things by asking, "Why is this happening now?" Instead, the SR question is, "Why am I creating this now?"

[moonrambler]

Originally Posted by Steve Pavlina

FYI the accounts The Animus, Byron, and several others were fake accounts created by a previously banned user. The fake accounts were caught by a moderator today and have since been banned (having multiple fake accounts has always been against the forum rules).

This was a previous user who was banned for trolling and creating multiple fake accounts in the past.

I'm happy to keep this thread open, but if you wish to continue the discussion, just be aware of the source and that the fake accounts will no longer be participating.

Carry on...

Hee. Somebody'd had enough and subjective-realitied them right outta here

[cylon]

It's a shame. It's always so much fun when someone goes out of their way to tell you that they disagree with you, unasked.

[bluedragon]

It's even more a shame when somebody goes out of their way to say the same thing as you say, while at the same time stating that they disagree with you. Or when they say they contradict YOU while they actually argue with a point of view that is in fact totally opposite to yours.

[eternomi]

Originally Posted by Erin Pavlina

No one is claiming reality is subjective. Steve is presenting subjective reality as a useful lens with which to perceive reality.

As a lense, subjectivity is a great tool, but just a tool nonetheless. One of many.. You can't rely just on it and take it as the ultimate truth because it is not. There are areas where it works great and others where it doesn't apply.

Incidentally, another name for subjective reality is psychology. It is the perception of the outer from the inside. I know, I know, when you call it that it becomes blend, dry, boring, overdone, uninteresting, common, etc.. It loses its sparkle, magic, mystical essence, but still it is what it is. Kudos to Steve and others though for coming up with a better packaging for an existing product and make it appealing again to the masses!

Originally Posted by Erin Pavlina

As for diet... I struggle with diet and health because I have conflicting beliefs in this area that have precluded me from achieving what I deem to be good health. I can't be a vibrational match for a healthy, slim and trim body if I have limiting beliefs which don't serve me.

Fortunately, not everything is due to what you have done at an emotional, conscious, psychological level. If you have a physical ailment, it may or may not be because of an emotional trauma or your belief system in general. The subjective reality lense looks at these realms for answers and it may very well find them there, but you may be looking for ghosts. Don't discount other realms and other tools!

The human mind strives to simplify, turn things into little, sequential lists, into 12-step programs, which it can easily take in, follow and reap rewards (instantly of course). Sometimes it works, but often these simplifications mask the full complexity of the truth. A smart student of personal development has to face the fact that things are much more complex under the hood and any attempt to simplify is noble, yet comes with much fineprint.