Jealousy (Blog)

[Savage]

Use this thread to discuss the following entry from Steve Pavlina's blog:

Jealousy

[Holistic Star]

Do your conversations really sound like that?



but I'm stumped too - don't really get jealousy either. Although I'm disappointed you only tried it for a day rather than a full 30-day trial.

[AlwaysLearning]

Jealousy is something I'm learning about myself. It's like the latest step in my path of learning about relationships. For the first time in my life, I'm in a really loving relationship. So if I lost that relationship, it would affect me in a way which previous relationships never would have. What's more, my girlfriend is a genuine good catch, and so she is CONSTANTLY being hit on by multiple other guys. (Notice in the idiom "good catch" we have jealous, possessive notions built into our very language) From my time in the seduction community, I know that the only power those guys have over the relationship is the power I give them: the only thing they could do to make her stop loving me, would be to get me to behave all clingy and jealous and possessive. I know that intellectually, but emotionally I'm still getting it fully installed.

[jawillie]

The whole time I was reading this blog I was frustratedingly saying to myself, "I can't do that... I can't do that.... I can't do that"... Until I got to the part of the fluffy cat.

That made me think of Spanky, my dog. I unconditionally love him. He loves EVERYONE and I still love him and get enough love from him.

hmmm............

[curiousjessica]

Hi Steve,

Well, you asked for it... the perspective of a jealous person, that is.

On a good day I'm not prone to jealousy. I feel loved and happy and centred.
But some days, I feel intense jealousy. My partner (of 7 years) is never the source of these feelings. I do feel our love is unconditional and that while we love each other immensely, we could also survive without this love, because we have so much love to experience from every human being.

However, I get so jealous of other people who are in my life situation, it can be utterly draining. People who have new cars, more money (or just some money), a better career, etc etc. This is a definite blockage in my mentality and I'm trying to heal and change this destructive pattern of thinking. Living hand-to-mouth doesn't help. I'm 24 years old and bought my first house a year ago. Sometimes I feel that I've over-extended, and that the mortgage is just too big for us to handle without getting depressed, but there's that thing called indecision (that post was excellent by the way) that is so far stopping us.

The things that make me jealous:
-friends buying a brand new car while i try to start my own bomb each morning.
- people my age who seem to have enough surplus cash to go out, enjoy themselves, buy a few nice things and have some buffer money in the bank.
- people who try to compete with me. I can't handle it.
- people who are just so darn happy all the time. how do they do it?


I wanted to delete this as soon as i read it back to myself, but I need to evolve past these feelings. They do so much harm and not one ounce of good. I'm posting this reply to expand on my "honesty" and "openness" and hopefully gain some perspective.

I think it all has to do with a sense of entitlement - ie "she has that, and I deserve that, too. why don't i have it?"

it's funny how only certain people have this effect on me - for example, a couple of friends who have new everything, heaps of money etc, I am nothing but happy for them. i think it is wonderful they are doing so well. and then other people i know, i hate that they have stuff that i want/am working towards.

I'm sorry if i have come across as shallow and negative. I think I am doing really well in most other aspects of life, and being positive, now it is time to tackle the green-eyed monster (and cut off its head!)

[gingerbaker]

Originally Posted by AlwaysLearning

(Notice in the idiom "good catch" we have jealous, possessive notions built into our very language)

There is a fascinating book I have (but did not finish reading) that examined the role of hunting in men's life, and particularly both the place of the mythos of hunter in the male psyche, and the use of hunting terms embedded in our language. The examples I remember most clearly are those relating to women, e.g. "she's a good catch" or a "fox", there were lots others and naturally I can't remember them now LOL!

[Savage]

@curiousjessica: You might find this article helpful since it speaks to your situation: Overcoming Jealousy.

[Erin Pavlina]

CuriousJessica: I think you're describing envy, not jealousy. here is what wikipedia says are the differences:

"Envy" and "jealousy" are often used interchangeably, but in correct usage, both words stand for two different distinct emotions. In proper usage, jealousy is the fear of losing something that one possesses to another person (a loved one in the prototypical form), while envy is the pain or frustration caused by another person having something that one does not have oneself. Envy typically involves two people, and jealousy typically involves three people. Envy and jealousy result from different situations and are distinct emotional experiences.

[ericabiz]

My cat saw that photo of the OTHER fluffy cat and boy, was she jealous! She was all "Why does that OTHER cat get all the attention on Steve's blog?" And then she said, "Hey, I bet I can do a better pose than that other cat. Besides, I look hot."

And she showed me!

Alexis being jealous of that other cat on Flickr - Photo Sharing!

Jealousy, explained CAT STYLE.

-Erica

[allen080105]

It seems like the biggest factor in jealousy is the abundance mindset vs. the scarcity mindset. I'm starting to realize intelligently that the abundance mindset is the truth, but fully crossing over and actually believing that mindset is taking some time. I know it's worth it though. I've tested the abundance mindset out in the area of money by donating to some different people when I didn't have that much money. That released the death grip I had on it and it felt really good. Plus it all came back in different ways which is so crazy to me. Money through things I sold, and ideas/ opportunities/info (a lot from this site) that could really be profitable. Now I guess I have to apply that same mindset to love. That doesn't seem to be as hard to do as with money.

I guess it's a subconscious mind thing? I would imagine it would be just as hard going back from an abundance mindset to a scarcity one. I wouldn't wanna go back though.

[Wanderer]

Erica

I hardly ever post here, preferring just to malinger and borrow advice, but I had to comment on how beautiful your cat is, it is the nicest cat I have ever seen. How do you get those awesome colors, half black half orange?

*on topic*
Steve great post as always. I feel jealousy when I see a girl I like with another guy, because I want to be the guy you want to spend your time with, it feels like I'm not adequate, not enough to make you happy. Obviously I am working on it, but still have along way to go.

But seriously Erica, did you paint it?

[Yynatago]

Originally Posted by ericabiz

Alexis being jealous of that other cat on Flickr - Photo Sharing!

Oh no.... I think you've started something here. WHAT HAVE YOU DONE!!!

[cheech]

Originally Posted by ericabiz

My cat saw that photo of the OTHER fluffy cat and boy, was she jealous! She was all "Why does that OTHER cat get all the attention on Steve's blog?" And then she said, "Hey, I bet I can do a better pose than that other cat. Besides, I look hot."

And she showed me!

Alexis being jealous of that other cat on Flickr - Photo Sharing!

Jealousy, explained CAT STYLE.

-Erica

damn! your cat IS hot

[Angela]

Originally Posted by cheech

damn! your cat IS hot

QFT. I'd do her.

[Algernon]

Steve: Dammit, Erin. I’m jealous! You need to stop doing Johnny Depp, Keanu Reeves, and David Boreanaz, so I can feel better.

Erin: Awww… are you feeling unloved?

Steve: Well, yes — and it’s all your fault!

Erin: What’s making you feel unloved, darling?

Steve: I feel unloved when you do Johnny Depp, Keanu Reeves, and David Boreanaz. It makes me think you don’t care about me.

Erin: That’s so sweet to know that you care about our relationship. I really care about you too.

Steve: Ok, that’s nice, but I still need you to stop doing Johnny Depp, Keanu Reeves, and David Boreanaz. It bothers me.

Erin: What about it bothers you?

Steve: I’m worried that you’ll leave me, and then I’ll be all alone.

Erin: So you worry that if we broke up, you’d feel unloved. And so you see my actions as a threat to your being able to feel loved and connected.

Steve: Yeah, pretty much.

[st33med]

GET OUT OF MY HEAD!

Seriously. I was just thinking of this.
My thoughts!
minnnnnneee............

[Still Growing]

very new agey. I'm not sure I can relate.

I think that moderate jealousy is perfectly normal and is a natural human emotion. Do we want to elevate ourselves to where we are left with no primal feelings?

I don't think the lack of jealousy has to do with abundance of love but with indifference. That's not a bad thing for some but a horrible thing for others.

[elainevdw]

Oh my god, you are such the geek! This post made me smile.

A How To Be Jealous tutorial sounds like a great journaling tool, actually, for any emotion you want to get past.

And I agree, both cats are freaking adorable... welcome to the new internet meme. :P

[elainevdw]

Originally Posted by Still Growing

I don't think the lack of jealousy has to do with abundance of love but with indifference. That's not a bad thing for some but a horrible thing for others.

It's interesting that you mention indifference -- who was it that said that the opposite of love is not hate, but indifference?

[HealingMaven]

Originally Posted by Steve Pavlina

Use this thread to discuss the following entry from Steve Pavlina's blog:

Jealousy

*ROFLMAO*

Oh my god, the Patrick Stewart lines had squealing with laughter! Thank god no one's asleep here yet!!

Okay, let me try to take the post seriously.

Tips on jealousy... see if you can find ways to feel threatened and insecure. Play the "what if" game backwards -- "what if erin runs off with that hot tv celeb she likes and never comes back?" Think of the worst possible scenario for open relationship possibilities and get attached to them. Imagine them real hard and in great detail. And do that for explicit things that you don't think will bother you as well. Sometimes those things will take you by surprise.

That's the best I can come up with...

[JoeRad]

Originally Posted by Holistic Star

Do your conversations really sound like that?

Steve, while the content of the post is very thoughtful, you just made my day with the allusions to ST:TNG. That is by far one of my favorite episodes. It had a good message too; that we think far more in metaphor than we care to admit. Awesome episode and great quotes.

Thanks for the laugh, I needed that.

Now off to digest this latest post.

[HealingMaven]

Originally Posted by cheech

damn! your cat IS hot

Seconded! That is a seriously gorgeous feline.

[st33med]

Originally Posted by HealingMaven

Seconded! That is a seriously gorgeous feline.

I'd tap that.

[jawillie]

Just trying to think my way through this.... I know when I feel jealous it is a physical pain in my chest, so that can't be the optimal way to be. Right? But then parts of me thinks it is "indifferent" to not feel jealous, but that is actually unconditional love?

I don't know. I have been plagued with this topic all week because I know I have major issues with it all.

[HealingMaven]

Originally Posted by st33med

I'd tap that.

*blinks*

You. Just Made My Brain Hurt.

[Susie]

I think if you wanted to introduce jealousy into your relationship you'd have to find ways to lessen the sense of security it seems the two of you have together. Like you said in your recent podcast things like, "I know I'll always be in love with her, I can't imagine ever finding someone who meets my emotional needs as well as Erin..." stop saying things like that. And Erin, stop believing things like that. Toss on heaps of unresolved childhood betrayal and abandonment...well those are a few steps towards creating jealousy I'd guess.

[bbdream8]

I had a good laugh out of the conversation. I believe jealously only happens when one is facing insecurity, so by being secure and loving yourself, you can prevent yourself from getting jealous.

Cheers
Vincent
Personal Development Blogger

[laur_454]

i struggle with jealousy almost daily. Its one of the things I'd most like to fix about myself. I'm constantly preoccupied with who has more than me, who is happier than me, has more money than me (which is almost everyone I know), or what girl is getting more attention than me. It's exhausting. I'm conscious of it (finally), and I try to stop it when I feel it come on. I get insanely jealous over my boyfriend (for pretty dumb reasons). I'm not sure what the root of this is... Scarcity I suppose. How does one overcome the scarcity mindset? I guess I"ll go back and read those old blog posts...

I sometimes lack self confidence. I feel that if other areas of my life were where I'd like them to be, then maybe I'd stop being so envious of others.

Truth be told, my jealousy makes me feel like a huge a*hole. It's wrong to envy others, I'd rather just be happy for them and their achievements. In the prime of my jealousy, I've gone so far as to completely isolate myself from people because I was so green with envy. My college roommate was a sweet, charming, happy small town girl. I envied her simple life and the fact that she never felt depressed, never felt compulsive, and seemed to have great family and social relationships. She was so happy and sweet that she didn't even notice what a b*tch I was to her, due to my jealousy of her simplicity.

I'm anxious to see what Steve and Erin come up with, because I'm draining myself with all this silly jealousy business.

cute kitties by the way

[Stray]

Steve, has anyone recommended this site to you yet? If not, I highly, highly recommend it. It has a couple of really good articles about jealousy, and all the other ones are excellent too. That's the first place I send anyone who expresses curiosity about poly to me.

I have occasional problems with jealousy (as a practicing poly person for about 6 years now); I've found it only happens under very specific circumstances, which lucky for me don't occur all that often: 1) I ask the person I'm involved with/interested in for something I want from them (e.g. time, attention) 2) they deny it, then 3) they give that same thing I asked for to someone else instead of me. If any one of those three is missing, I don't get jealous--if I haven't asked for what I want, I can't very well be put out about not getting it; if I ask and am given it, hey, great, no problem; if they refuse it to me but also don't give it to anyone else, then that means they just don't have it to give--no harm, no foul. But if they deny it to me and then give it to someone else, then I feel rejected and jealous and sad and so forth. Which sucks. But like I said, these three things don't concur all that often, and I've learned to ride out the bad feelings and get over it when it does happen.

[Fullcrum]

Loved the cat.

But I loved the Flying Spaghetti Monster even more.

It reminded me of when I was 11 years old and discussing the nature of God and existence on the Relic Forums (Relic is a game-development company specializing in Real Time Strategy. Some of their games include Homeworld, Homeworld 2, Dawn of War, and Company of Heroes).

It's the only company's games I've ever played, and probably the only ones I will ever play. Though I am no longer a part of the forums, I distinctly recall being in the company of some of the most brilliant and outstanding science-philosophy-and-game nerds ever. Which was kind of cool.

There was one guy, Bnonn, who was a hardcore atheist until one year and then turned hardcore apologist. Like HARDCORE. And there was a thread about the existence of God. It was basically him vs. the rest of the forum. The discussion went on for 100 pages. ONE HUNDRED! Damnit I think there were over 1200 replies in that thread. And all of them were extremely well thought out. Go figure .

I'm sure Steve has memories of the old forums he used to frequent (from the most recent podcast). What was the general vibe of the place?