Eating Raw - Update (Blog)

[Savage]

Use this thread to discuss the following entry from Steve Pavlina's blog:

Eating Raw - Update

[Angela]

"Erin isn't raw"?!? I know she's hot, but I didn't know she was cooked.

[Calculusaurus]

I suppose the next step up from eating raw is to grow your own food (or at least eat locally grown food), and after that you probably have to start fasting or become a breatharian if you want to reduce your environmental footprint.

Reminds me of this quote from the simpsons:

Lisa: Oh, the earth is the best! That's why I'm a vegetarian.
Jesse: Heh. Well, that's a start.
Lisa: Uh, well, I was thinking of going vegan.
Jesse: I'm a level 5 vegan -- I won't eat anything that casts a shadow.

[Dan.Linehan]

Do you worry about getting organic foods when you eat out? I buy all organic food, partly to support the industry, and also because I don't want bizarro pesticides in my food - but most restaurants don't seem to have much of a commitment to buying organic. It keeps me from eating out as much.

If anyone is looking for a juicer that isn't quite so expensive, I'd recommend the Breville Ikon 900. I've had it about 6 weeks now -- it's pretty awesome. The variable speeds are nice.

Some things I've learned about juicing:

• Carrot-orange juice is delicious.
  
• Carrot-apple juice is also delicious.
  
• Basically any combination of berries, grapes, oranges, apples, pineapple and carrots is really great. Hard to go wrong.
  
• Buying all organic doesn't cost that much more, and is definitely the way to go if you are juicing a lot of fruit. Non-organic fruit can have dozens of pesticides sprayed on it.
  
• Carrot-orange juice, besides being my favorite, is also the least expensive. Five pounds of organic juicer oranges are only $4, and two pounds of organic carrots are $2.
  
• You can juice garlic if you are trying to make a V-8 style veggie juice. Veggie juices will still generally use carrots for the base. It is much harder to make good veggie juices than it is to make good fruit juices.
  
• Don't juice bananas or mangos - they won't juice well and you'll basically just waste the fruits trying. Watermelons will juice well but it's better to just blend watermelon up for smoothies. Watermelon makes an excellent smoothie base.
  
• My favorite smoothie so far is a bunch of watermelon, a couple bananas and a bunch of strawberries with ice in the blender.
  
• People get randomly really jealous when you are drinking fresh juice around them at work or sports events.
  

To find some raw food people in Vegas you might want to start a meetup group.

[Jake Birkett]

Thanks for the update Steve, very interesting! And good for you!

Dan: Yeah when I find I can't eat something organic I have to console myself with the fact that at least it's still a vegetable or fruit and that's better than a burger or whatever! Another thing is you can't be sure how well restaurants wash their food. I'm pretty thorough (without being OCD about it) but some people either a) don't wash the food or b) just wave it near a tap thinking the water is "magic" instead of giving it a proper rub and rinse. I guess though if you only occasionally eat a pesticide covered food item it's not too bad.

[anderssonj]

"I just scoop some watermelon into the Vitamix, seeds and all, and in about 20 seconds on high, I’ve got one liter of delicious juice."

Does this mean that the seeds are liquified in the blender? Very interesting, as I love watermelons, but I rarely eat them because the seeds annoy me. ;-)

If so, how do the seeds affect taste?

[Keith]

Initially I didn’t experience any discernable adverse effects, but I didn’t find the cooked food as satisfying as I once did. It felt more like I was drugging myself or feeding an addiction instead of nourishing my body.[...]
Once I started including a little bit of cooked food, I seemed to crave more of it until a few weeks later, I was down to 30% raw. I noticed I kept craving cooked items, and raw foods were becoming less attractive for me.

So if you eat cooked foods you find cooked foods more appealing and if you eat raw foods you find raw foods more appealing?

Once you had a bit more cooked into your system, did raw foods feel "like drugging yourself or feeding an addiction"?

Just interested.

I suppose the next step up from eating raw is to grow your own food (or at least eat locally grown food), and after that you probably have to start fasting or become a breatharian if you want to reduce your environmental footprint.

Is breatharian really a significant improvement over growing your own food? That seems like it'd be pretty much zero footprint anyway.

But yeh, growing your own food would definitely be the natural next step...

[Adelina]

Yay! I can't wait for the breatharian update!!

[Amanda Norris]

Thanks for the update. I've been wondering how it was going.
I still have some questions though:
What do you eat in a typical day?
How many calories do you get?
What percentage of your calories are carbs, protein, and fat?

I tried eating mostly raw for a little while, but I had a hard time eating enough calories. For the last week or so I've been eating cooked food and dairy and I noticed that my brain feels pretty foggy and my fitness level seems impaired. I would like to go back to raw, but it seems too hard to be able to eat enough, especially to get enough protein.

Thanks,
Amanda

[carenkh]

Amanda, Steve goes into lots of detail about calories and his menus in the archives about his 30-day raw trial. Click here, then it's every day after that for 30 days!

Steve, I thought when I read your response to someone about eating raw at the I Can Do It! conference, that I picked up on some cooked food stuff going on. I thought I was wrong when I read the first part of this entry, then I saw... nope! That was there! Glad to see my radar's not off. Not to make your entry about me or anything...

I so appreciate your sharing all this, especially the stuff about superfoods. I know you'll share your true experience. You just helped me realize I can do a 30-day trial of some tea I've read about. For some reason, that didn't occur to me 'til now, and I was experiencing the same thing, that all the good feedback came from folks who stood to benefit by people buying it. Thanks again for that.

[Savage]

Originally Posted by Dan.Linehan

My favorite smoothie so far is a bunch of watermelon, a couple bananas and a bunch of strawberries with ice in the blender.

Mmmm... that sounds good. I have those ingredients on hand, so I'll try that for breakfast this morning.

I favor organic produce, but its availability in Las Vegas is more limited than what you'll find in California.

[Savage]

Originally Posted by anderssonj

"I just scoop some watermelon into the Vitamix, seeds and all, and in about 20 seconds on high, I’ve got one liter of delicious juice."

Does this mean that the seeds are liquified in the blender? Very interesting, as I love watermelons, but I rarely eat them because the seeds annoy me. ;-)

If so, how do the seeds affect taste?

The Vitamix will turn a block of wood into sawdust. Seeds are no match for it.

The seeds will be liquified. They can make the juice taste a bit earthier, but I actually like that.

[ctutt]

What about the environmental impact of transporting all those exotic foods thousands of miles from all around the planet? How fresh and wholesome can they be after traveling all that distance?

How much money would such a diet cost?

How much time in shopping and preparation?

Are you using force of will, forcing yourself to ignore what your body tells you it wants and imposing your "I know what's best intellect"? How do you REALLY KNOW? The measure of result seems to me VERY SUBJECTIVE.

Personally, I'm for growing your own in your back yard. However, ensuring a steady balanced supply is a real challenge.

[Savage]

Originally Posted by Keith

So if you eat cooked foods you find cooked foods more appealing and if you eat raw foods you find raw foods more appealing?

Once you had a bit more cooked into your system, did raw foods feel "like drugging yourself or feeding an addiction"?

No, it's a totally different sensation. Many raw food books mention the shift in how you experience hunger... from cooked food cravings to the return of true hunger. It's hard to describe, but it's sort of like the difference between craving a cup of coffee (due to caffeine addiction) vs. being genuinely thirsty. You may feel the urge to drink coffee even when you aren't thirsty. Similarly, you may feel the urge to eat cooked food even when you aren't hungry. The urge to eat has more of an addictive quality to it.

[Savage]

Originally Posted by ctutt

What about the environmental impact of transporting all those exotic foods thousands of miles from all around the planet? How fresh and wholesome can they be after traveling all that distance?

I wonder about that myself. Vegas doesn't have much in the way of local produce aside from cactus. Most of our produce comes from California, Mexico, or South America.

[Andrew Brunelle]

Steve, it looks like you are one step closer to breatharianism. I would like to see you take on a 30 day trial of that. Day 1: I'm so hungry. Day 10: Steve Pavlina was hospitalized today with dehydration and starvation symptoms. AT least your footprint will be closer to zero.

IT's good to hear about your raw diet. Try out raw cacao often. It's really good stuff. Just make sure you mix it with a little sweetener. Otherwise, it's bitter. You can even make raw "hot" chocolate.

[Rose of Cairo]

Originally Posted by Steve Pavlina

No, it's a totally different sensation. Many raw food books mention the shift in how you experience hunger... from cooked food cravings to the return of true hunger. It's hard to describe, but it's sort of like the difference between craving a cup of coffee (due to caffeine addiction) vs. being genuinely thirsty. You may feel the urge to drink coffee even when you aren't thirsty. Similarly, you may feel the urge to eat cooked food even when you aren't hungry. The urge to eat has more of an addictive quality to it.

I totally agree with this and I can relate very well. I had a cheat day last month and ate one piece of cooked food. As a result I got so strong cravings that I kept eating small amounts of cooked food for about 8-10 days. It was a big struggle. Now I'm back to 100% raw and enjoy my independence.

When you're raw, you don't have such a urge to eat, even if you haven't eaten anything for a while. You can stay for hours without eating and still have the very same energy. You don't get nervous or aggressive or weak when you're hungry. You just know that you need food, and if there's no food in sight, no biggie.

However, at least for me personally, it works only on 100% raw. As soon as I eat something cooked, I suddenly feel like eating more often even when I don't feel true hunger. For me too it's too difficult to stay 95% raw. Cooked food definitely is addictive.

I'm lucky that I once was a smoker. Because now, I can compare the feeling I have when I want to eat cooked food with the feeling I had back then when I wanted to smoke a cigarette: it's the same. When I feel like eating an apple, it's NOT the same feeling. That's how I know the difference.

[Holistic Star]

Hi Steve,

i was really interested in what you had to say about 100% being easier than 95% as I've heard that from others too. I haven't made the leap yet to 100% but it looks like I will at some point.

Are there any other meals you have made as your staple ones? I remember you asking for ideas in a previous post?

[firefly]

Wow, I'd never thought of cooked food being addictive, in and of itself.

Steve (or any other raw foodists out there), what would you recommend as the first step in moving away from a standard American diet?

Cutting out sugar/processed foods feels like a good place to start but I wonder if it might be easier over the long run to jump straight to raw or at least minimally processed vegan.

[martin]

Steve I'm so proud of you.

[Savage]

Originally Posted by Rose of Cairo

When you're raw, you don't have such a urge to eat, even if you haven't eaten anything for a while. You can stay for hours without eating and still have the very same energy. You don't get nervous or aggressive or weak when you're hungry. You just know that you need food, and if there's no food in sight, no biggie.

That's what I've been experiencing. I'm reaching the point where I can go several hours without eating and not crash like I used to. Even when I'm hungry, it's a sensation I can practically ignore if I want to stay with certain activities for a while. I can even skip a meal now and then. My blood sugar seems to remain a lot more stable even when I haven't eaten.

I'm gradually getting by on less food too. I'm not eating as much as I did during my January raw trial. I averaged 2300 calories per day back then. This week I'm doing around 1500-2000 calories per day. Eating more green veggies like cucumbers and spinach seems to reduce my appetite a lot. When I eat mostly fruit with few greens (like I did in January), I get hungry more often.

[Rose of Cairo]

Originally Posted by Steve Pavlina

That's what I've been experiencing. I'm reaching the point where I can go several hours without eating and not crash like I used to. Even when I'm hungry, it's a sensation I can practically ignore if I want to stay with certain activities for a while. I can even skip a meal now and then. My blood sugar seems to remain a lot more stable even when I haven't eaten.

Yes absolutely, you're saying it better than I did. It's truly amazing, isn't it? I love it. I'm feeling so free!

Originally Posted by Steve Pavlina

I'm gradually getting by on less food too. I'm not eating as much as I did during my January raw trial. I averaged 2300 calories per day back then. This week I'm doing around 1500-2000 calories per day.

Ah, very interesting. Back then in january you told me I was undereating. I'm looking forward to seeing how much you'll eat when you're stabilized.

I just got an email from someone asking me how I can get so much energy from so little food. That's not a problem though. I'm sure we don't need as many calories as they say. But I think the whole calories thing is BS anyway.

Originally Posted by Steve Pavlina

Eating more green veggies like cucumbers and spinach seems to reduce my appetite a lot. When I eat mostly fruit with few greens (like I did in January), I get hungry more often.

Yes, this is true for me too. When I eat mostly fruit I'm hungry more often. When I eat mostly greens, this doesn't happen. Greens are wonderful! I eat 4-5 plateful of them a day. They give a lot of energy. I'm considerably building muscle too.

Do you know roquette and portulaca? Just curious.

[The Wise Turtle]

Yeah, I've been on and off raw since last summer, and I really hate it when I fall off the wagon, so to speak, but I forgive myself, and just keep eating as well as I can given my circumstances.

I'll also add a little nugget of juicing wisdom, which is that you can make juice really easily and cheaply (and with about the same amount of cleanup) using a simple cotton cloth and a hand-held grater. I shred my carrots, celery, apples, etc. with my trusty little pyramid shaped grater, and use the cloth to squeeze out the yummy juice into a bowl. It's not only a lot quieter and more energy efficient than a motorized juicer but it's also a lot of fun to get your aggression out squeezing and squashing the pulp!

And I like adding a little fresh ginger to my carrot apple juice, for a bit of a kick.

Peace, Love, and Bicycles,
Turtle

[Dan.Linehan]

Originally Posted by firefly

Steve (or any other raw foodists out there), what would you recommend as the first step in moving away from a standard American diet?

Cutting out sugar/processed foods feels like a good place to start but I wonder if it might be easier over the long run to jump straight to raw or at least minimally processed vegan.

I would start by buying vegan groceries and eating vegetarian when dining out.

This makes for an easy transition. Buying vegan groceries is pretty straightforward. There are substitutes for any of the standard foods you would buy: Soy milk, earth balance butter, veganese for mayo, tofurky lunchmeat, food for life brand bread is really good. Better than cream cheese. Man, now I really want a sandwich.

Anyway, when you start buying vegan groceries you can make a smooth transition. You'll eat many more whole foods. And eating vegetarian when you eat out will ween you off fast food as well.

This is how I started. Then I got tired of "casual dining" restaurants offering nothing but greasy, cheese packed quesadillas for vegetarian fare, so I started going to different places and eating more and more vegan food even when dining out. Chipotle is great for a vegan / vegetarian burrito if you have one nearby.

I did try to jump directly into raw when I first started changing my diet. Wasn't happening. Going raw would be a difficult transition for me even today -- I've been vegan for two years and I drink half a gallon of fresh juice daily. I wouldn't try raw until you are comfortable with not eating the standard Western diet anymore. And that might take a bit of time to get used to. Do you have a whole foods or Trader Joes's in your area?

Also, you can try to stop eating anything with corn syrup in it. That will open your eyes pretty quickly as to what trash we are habitually putting in out bodies. Check out a documentary called "King Corn" for more info on that.

[Liminal Chris]

I'm not sure what Breathariamism is, I looked it up on wikipedia (i know, i know) to get a general idea. It just doesn't seem feasible.

If our bodies are biological machines, we need fuel to feed our engines. It's like asking a computer to run with no electricity (or power source of any kind).

Can anyone explain the theory behind it? Do people view it as legitimate?




The raw foods thing is fascinating, and something I actually really want to try. I just fear that with a hectic lifestyle, its near impossible to maintain. I have a hard enough time trying to fit 3 meals into a scedule. 5 or 6, forget it. Also I am a dreadfully picky eater, so somethings that Steve eats in his journel would be out of the question for me.


Is there a place where I can go to learn about the math of it? In terms of calories, fats, carbs, and protiens?

[Savage]

Originally Posted by Rose of Cairo

I just got an email from someone asking me how I can get so much energy from so little food. That's not a problem though. I'm sure we don't need as many calories as they say. But I think the whole calories thing is BS anyway.

I suspect you're right. I was going by Dr. Graham's recommendations in the 80/10/10 diet, which involves eating massive quantities of fruit every day. But I've since learned that many raw foodists don't eat nearly that much. Angela Stokes posts updates on her blog about her daily food intake, and it seems pretty low in terms of calories.

I had one day where I only ate about 1200-1500 calories, and I still felt fine. I think I'll probably see some sub-1200 days soon.

Do you know roquette and portulaca? Just curious.

Yes, I eat them regularly, but they have different names here. Roquette = arugula. Portulaca = purslane.

Do you put anything on your greens when you eat them... or just plain? I will sometimes eat a plate of greens with fruit on top -- it goes great with any melon. Other times I'll have them as part of a larger salad.

[Adelina]

Originally Posted by Steve Pavlina

I had one day where I only ate about 1200-1500 calories, and I still felt fine. I think I'll probably see some sub-1200 days soon.

This is like CRON.


Though 1200 is still pretty low for a boy. But overall is better to eat the minimum amount of calories necessary for optimal health, with stable weight, both for ease of digestion (including less blood to the stomach and more to the brain) and for lessening overall environmental impact.

[rodrigo]

Originally Posted by Dan.Linehan

• Carrot-orange juice is delicious.

That is really great. But the juices I like the most involve beet (I think that is the name in english for it - its a purple root with sweet-kinda flavor, sorry if I'm wrong about the name).

Any combination (beet-carrot, beet-carrot-orange or even beet alone) makes a delicious juice.

[firefly]

Originally Posted by Dan.Linehan

I wouldn't try raw until you are comfortable with not eating the standard Western diet anymore. And that might take a bit of time to get used to. Do you have a whole foods or Trader Joes's in your area?

No, it's fairly slim pickings around here. Actually I work at a conventional grocery store so I've sampled some of the meat/dairy substitutes and didn't care for them. It's probably an easily acquired taste, but I think I'd just as soon eat lots of fruits and vegetables. I'm just not sure how financially feasible that would be given the quantities involved, and organic is definitely out of the question.

(Brief aside: from my work experience, I wouldn't encourage folks to buy organics at a conventional grocery store unless it's a super high volume store or in a particularly organic-friendly area. Most stores simply don't have the turnover needed to maintain a good fresh stock of organic produce.)

Anyway, on the subject of finances, you don't have to convince me of the evils of corn syrup. Americans should be outraged that their tax dollars are being used to support the junk food industry via corn subsidies. In this economic downturn I'm seeing a lot of people cut down on their fruit and veggie purchases in favor of the processed foods that come at artificially low prices.

[MasterD]

There is another raw foodist 'guru', Loren Lockman, who basically recommends the same diet as Dr. Graham, however he recommends to eat much less calories. That would be a lot cheaper :-). He has quite a disputable reputation, because he has been convicted because somebody died at his fasting center and his treatment does not seem to be the most customer oriented if you read stories about people who fasted there, but at this point he could be right on.

I only think when you are working out like crazy all day long you really should work up to 3000-4000 calories. Otherwise about 1500-2000 are probably enough for most people. Maybe even less.

Btw, it is quite fun to see that 'even you' have trouble to stay raw. I guess it is normal to fall off in order to realize you shouldn't fall off. I think I mentioned it earlier, but a great article about this (not about raw foodism, but about habits in general) is Real Social Dynamics Blog: You've Gotta Fall Off... To Learn Why You Shouldn't Fall Off . It may even happen another time or two and probably even more throughout your lifetime, especially when you go through stressful stages, but probably you will have had the biggest leap. I know I have had it.