Confused about the Light/Dark Worker Theory. And my own theory...

[ProjectX]

I'm a little confused here. And tell me if I'm on the wrong track. A lot things are contradicting, and the theory doesn't make sense.

Can darkworkers feel gratitude? Or do they only feel a sense of entitlement? I mean if they are so successful doesn't this contradict the Law of Attraction where the notion of abundance is fundamental? Why are there so many successful darkworkers?
It gets really confusing. Are there any good examples of darkworkers? For example at the top of my head I can give some examples of lightworkers; Warren Buffet, Howard Hughes, Bill Gates. I guess some examples of darkworkers can be Genghis Khan, Julius Ceasar, The Rothschild banking family, Donald Trump.

I'm just thinking the main difference between both workers is a lightworker would think
"I want to use my creativity and ideas and turn it into reality and do something great."
while the darkworker would think
"I need to be creative and do something so I can be great."

Its basically reverse psychology.
Also I'm pretty sure there are darkworkers who are helpful. I'm pretty sure there are doctors and philantropist who are darkworkers, though they don't do it to help people. They do it for the money and the women. But helping people is just part of that process. However perhaps they maybe more "dark" when it comes to relationships. Perhaps they have no problem using women or cheating on their spouse etc.
However you can also have a lightworker who is a soldier. He probably killed people but he will not harm innocent women and children, even if it means it could cause himself harm. Also he would never think of cheating on his spouse. I guess its all a matter of perspective.

One more final thing I would like to add is, maybe each "worker" philosophy is suited for different stages in life/personal development. Perhaps its better to be a darkworker when your a college student, making ends meet and trying to make good grades. You cannot spare time to look out for other people all the time. You are priority no.1. Getting yourself on your feet for life is all that matters.
On the other hand if you're 40, rich and have a family then being a lightworker can be more ideal.
I think maybe the lightworkers are so successful is they have placed boundaries. They like to help other people, but they must not sacrifice their own well-being for that.

So if I'm right this is how it goes;

Lightworkers realize they need to feel good first so they can serve other people. Darkworkers realize they need to make other people feel good so they can be served.

I hope I get a response.

[Syr]

I find the whole theory a bit limited to be honest. If I look at the definitions which are given for the two kinds, I turn out to be a twilightworker. I try to mirror how people react to me, but amplified. If one is kind to me (or people/things I care about) I'll try to give that person heaven, if one tries disrespects me, I'll give him/her hell.

I think some of the lightworkers you mentioned got at least a bit of their fortune over someone else and some of the darkworkers did something for others just to truly help those people, just like you said. Unconsciously, most of us are busy to try to achieve some sort of status in society: the way you dress, the way you work, your mannerisms, they all reflect something. I doubt there are people who are truly selfishness. To give an example: religious philanthropists are trying to secure her spot in the heaven she believed in, secular philanthropists are busy with their status here on Earth.

Inbetween black and white there are shades of gray.

[Ecce Homo]

Originally Posted by ProjectX

I'm a little confused here. And tell me if I'm on the wrong track. A lot things are contradicting, and the theory doesn't make sense.

Can darkworkers feel gratitude? Or do they only feel a sense of entitlement? I mean if they are so successful doesn't this contradict the Law of Attraction where the notion of abundance is fundamental? Why are there so many successful darkworkers?
It gets really confusing. Are there any good examples of darkworkers? For example at the top of my head I can give some examples of lightworkers; Warren Buffet, Howard Hughes, Bill Gates. I guess some examples of darkworkers can be Genghis Khan, Julius Ceasar, The Rothschild banking family, Donald Trump.

I'm just thinking the main difference between both workers is a lightworker would think
"I want to use my creativity and ideas and turn it into reality and do something great."
while the darkworker would think
"I need to be creative and do something so I can be great."

Its basically reverse psychology.
Also I'm pretty sure there are darkworkers who are helpful. I'm pretty sure there are doctors and philantropist who are darkworkers, though they don't do it to help people. They do it for the money and the women. But helping people is just part of that process. However perhaps they maybe more "dark" when it comes to relationships. Perhaps they have no problem using women or cheating on their spouse etc.
However you can also have a lightworker who is a soldier. He probably killed people but he will not harm innocent women and children, even if it means it could cause himself harm. Also he would never think of cheating on his spouse. I guess its all a matter of perspective.

One more final thing I would like to add is, maybe each "worker" philosophy is suited for different stages in life/personal development. Perhaps its better to be a darkworker when your a college student, making ends meet and trying to make good grades. You cannot spare time to look out for other people all the time. You are priority no.1. Getting yourself on your feet for life is all that matters.
On the other hand if you're 40, rich and have a family then being a lightworker can be more ideal.
I think maybe the lightworkers are so successful is they have placed boundaries. They like to help other people, but they must not sacrifice their own well-being for that.

So if I'm right this is how it goes;

Lightworkers realize they need to feel good first so they can serve other people. Darkworkers realize they need to make other people feel good so they can be served.

I hope I get a response.

My sense is that the theory has to be kept simple in order to remain operable. If we keep the focus on fundamental intentions, such as largely serving yourself as opposed to largely serving others, I think the theory works, as your bolded sentences suggest. (I italicized largely because I don’t think anyone truly serves one polarity or the other with complete, 100% exclusivity in so called real life.) When it gets beyond that into specifics and details, the polarity theory seems to break down.

I had some of the same questions about gratitude and its connection to LOA, etc. Thanks for bringing this up!

[ProjectX]

Originally Posted by Ecce Homo

My sense is that the theory has to be kept simple in order to remain operable. If we keep the focus on fundamental intentions, such as largely serving yourself as opposed to largely serving others, I think the theory works, as your bolded sentences suggest. (I italicized largely because I don’t think anyone truly serves one polarity or the other with complete, 100% exclusivity in so called real life.) When it gets beyond that into specifics and details, the polarity theory seems to break down.

I had some of the same questions about gratitude and its connection to LOA, etc. Thanks for bringing this up!

That is a good point. I think it follows that major rule 80/20.

[Sam988]

Why people complicate it so much!



It's as simple as this: Darkworkers do thing ultimately for their own benefit, while Lightworkers do things ultimately for the benefit of the whole/world.


It's a really simple mindset. Just tell me here what doubts may arise from it. I can't see reasons for confusion.


By the way, DWs and LWs can act in exactly the same ways, the difference between them is their mindsets and what they ultimately want, to serve themselves or the whole. So the question of "can DWs/LWs do this or that" doesn't apply, what applies is the question of "what mindset should i have when doing this or that", of course the answer depends on whether you choose DWing or LWing!

[ProjectX]

Originally Posted by Sam988

Why people complicate it so much!



It's as simple as this: Darkworkers do thing ultimately for their own benefit, while Lightworkers do things ultimately for the benefit of the whole/world.


It's a really simple mindset. Just tell me here what doubts may arise from it. I can't see reasons for confusion.


By the way, DWs and LWs can act in exactly the same ways, the difference between them is their mindsets and what they ultimately want, to serve themselves or the whole. So the question of "can DWs/LWs do this or that" doesn't apply, what applies is the question of "what mindset should i have when doing this or that", of course the answer depends on whether you choose DWing or LWing!

So what about people who do it to benefit both themselves and others?
And again I don't think one needs to be polarized to one side their entire life. One can change in their midlife.

[MasterD]

It has been discussed a lot and I see it the same way as you do ProjectX, it is reverse psychology but it ultimately leads to the same path.

However, that is not the difference that Steve states; he states a lightworker and a darkworker have different strategies (love for the lightworker, fear for the darkworker). I don't see how this works out in practise all the time, e.g. you can go entirely for your own personal gain, that would mean you are a darkworker, but you may find love to be the most effective strategy, making you a lightworker.

[amkumar00]

Originally Posted by MasterD

It has been discussed a lot and I see it the same way as you do ProjectX, it is reverse psychology but it ultimately leads to the same path.

However, that is not the difference that Steve states; he states a lightworker and a darkworker have different strategies (love for the lightworker, fear for the darkworker). I don't see how this works out in practice all the time, e.g. you can go entirely for your own personal gain, that would mean you are a darkworker, but you may find love to be the most effective strategy, making you a lightworker.

Fear of failure leads to being insecure and thats a quality that Steve mentioned in his post of the DW. If personal gain includes love as a strategy then you can see it from 2 perspectives i guess
1)LW: I can help myself and others thats very good
2)DW:I dont care about others as long as the other person benefited is not my rival i dont care what happens to them good or bad

Further Steve also said that a dark worker realizes that (after many years) that seeing others happy around him also makes him happy so for his own sake he later makes others happy so that he can also be happy

The way i see it i feel its a balance
A LW first becomes abundant and then helps others(Best example Steve)
A DW thinks about himself and later for his happiness makes others happy
Unfortunately i can say that there are not many DW who have lived long enough to experience the state and the need to make others happy as most of them are still in a constant battle with their rivals

Well thats my say on it hope u guys reply on what you think about this

[Ecce Homo]

Originally Posted by amkumar00

hope u guys reply on what you think about this

Let’s use a concrete historical example to flesh this out. I think most people who have read, understood, and accepted this polarization theory would agree that Napoleon Bonaparte falls under the category of darkworker, so I’ll use him as my example. Napoleon was arguably one of the most successful darkworkers in history.

Project started this thread by asking if darkworkers felt gratitude. Well, is it likely that Bonaparte felt gratitude? I’m going to go with yes; to and for himself. And perhaps gratitude isn’t the best word either. Maybe it might be more accurate to describe it as a kind of self congratulatory appreciation. Napoleon might have been appreciative of all he was capable of and all he accomplished. I can’t imagine he spent a lot of time thanking god or the universe for his crown. If I had to guess, I’d say Napoleon spent more time appreciating his own talents, his ambition, his drive, his being able to seize and make the most of any moment, and maybe even the audaciousness with which he crowned himself emperor. This would also go along with the idea that guys like this were certain of their inherent specialness, their manifest destiny, and their divine right to rule all they surveyed.

Is the notion of gratitude fundamental to manifesting one’s intentions then? I don’t know for sure, but judging by Napoleon's story and others, I’d say no. From what I understand, the LOA is operating at all times, regardless of how one feels. We always have been and always will be manifesting our true intentions, consciously or unconsciously. “Your focus determines your reality”. Maybe the darkworker focuses on abundance for himself and simply doesn’t concern himself with anyone else's welfare.

How does a darkworker use the LOA? The way Steve describes it in the original debut polarization article, that’s how. For the darkworker, the primary intention is on bringing power to himself as opposed to the lightworker's primary intention being about serving others. Napoleon's career beautifully illustrates this. He was supremely focused on the “in breath”, bringing power and achievement to himself and the universe (aka Bob the Builder) obliged. Napoleon was obviously a man of great talent and intelligence, but Bob gave him opportunities which he consistently and sometimes ruthlessly made the most of. And as Steve’s articles also suggest, as he ascended up the ladder of dominance, Bob exacted his price in the form of competition and warfare. Fortunately, Napoleon was one of the supreme men of war and gladly paid that price.

Can a darkworker experience nondual truth? With regard to spirituality, Napoleon is obviously not instructive. So I’ll just speculate that yes, it’s possible. How? The darkworker could come to see that all is indeed one in some sort of enlightenment experience, but instead of proclaiming “GOD IS EVERYTHING, GOD IS ONE”, they’d focus on the identity part of that equation, “I AM EVERYTHING, I AM ALL!” In a way, it could almost be like divine validation. Darkworker dude would be like, “See, I told you I was God!”

[ProjectX]

Originally Posted by Ecce Homo

Let’s use a concrete historical example to flesh this out. I think most people who have read, understood, and accepted this polarization theory would agree that Napoleon Bonaparte falls under the category of darkworker, so I’ll use him as my example. Napoleon was arguably one of the most successful darkworkers in history.

Project started this thread by asking if darkworkers felt gratitude. Well, is it likely that Bonaparte felt gratitude? I’m going to go with yes; to and for himself. And perhaps gratitude isn’t the best word either. Maybe it might be more accurate to describe it as a kind of self congratulatory appreciation. Napoleon might have been appreciative of all he was capable of and all he accomplished. I can’t imagine he spent a lot of time thanking god or the universe for his crown. If I had to guess, I’d say Napoleon spent more time appreciating his own talents, his ambition, his drive, his being able to seize and make the most of any moment, and maybe even the audaciousness with which he crowned himself emperor. This would also go along with the idea that guys like this were certain of their inherent specialness, their manifest destiny, and their divine right to rule all they surveyed.

Is the notion of gratitude fundamental to manifesting one’s intentions then? I don’t know for sure, but judging by Napoleon's story and others, I’d say no. From what I understand, the LOA is operating at all times, regardless of how one feels. We always have been and always will be manifesting our true intentions, consciously or unconsciously. “Your focus determines your reality”. Maybe the darkworker focuses on abundance for himself and simply doesn’t concern himself with anyone else's welfare.

How does a darkworker use the LOA? The way Steve describes it in the original debut polarization article, that’s how. For the darkworker, the primary intention is on bringing power to himself as opposed to the lightworker's primary intention being about serving others. Napoleon's career beautifully illustrates this. He was supremely focused on the “in breath”, bringing power and achievement to himself and the universe (aka Bob the Builder) obliged. Napoleon was obviously a man of great talent and intelligence, but Bob gave him opportunities which he consistently and sometimes ruthlessly made the most of. And as Steve’s articles also suggest, as he ascended up the ladder of dominance, Bob exacted his price in the form of competition and warfare. Fortunately, Napoleon was one of the supreme men of war and gladly paid that price.

Can a darkworker experience nondual truth? With regard to spirituality, Napoleon is obviously not instructive. So I’ll just speculate that yes, it’s possible. How? The darkworker could come to see that all is indeed one in some sort of enlightenment experience, but instead of proclaiming “GOD IS EVERYTHING, GOD IS ONE”, they’d focus on the identity part of that equation, “I AM EVERYTHING, I AM ALL!” In a way, it could almost be like divine validation. Darkworker dude would be like, “See, I told you I was God!”

Interesting theory. Napolean was a dark worker indeed, and good one at that. But look where he ended up.

I first and foremost prioritize my own wellbeing before anyone else's. However I will not impede other people's wellbeing for my own. But also I will not sacrifice my own wellbeing to help other people. So really what does that make me?
A darkworker with a conscious? A selfish lightworker?
Or a tactful darkworker who follows the rules of LOA, knowing that being good isn't the most easy way but the most logical and thereby safest way because being completely selfish can have serious repercussions.

Just like to add also, maybe being 100% darkworker isn't so bad, if ultimately the goal is to achieve being a lightworker. Basically one must build up his power in order to give.
It all balances out, like Yin and Yang.

[Ecce Homo]

Originally Posted by ProjectX

Interesting theory. Napolean was a dark worker indeed, and good one at that. But look where he ended up.

Napoleon ended up the same place we all end up on this side of life: dead. At least he lived fully and gloriously while alive. If given the choice between a long but safe and mediocre life versus a shorter but spectacular life, I would choose the latter. That's just my preference though. It's neither right or wrong.

Originally Posted by ProjectX

I first and foremost prioritize my own wellbeing before anyone else's. However I will not impede other people's wellbeing for my own. But also I will not sacrifice my own wellbeing to help other people. So really what does that make me?

A darkworker with a conscious? A selfish lightworker?

None of the above. It makes you uncommitted. Which is cool. Who says you have to polarize?

Originally Posted by ProjectX

knowing that being good isn't the most easy way but the most logical and thereby safest way because being completely selfish can have serious repercussions.

The most logical and safest way to what? The destination determines the path. It’s been my observation that “being good” is so often code for adherence to socially acceptable but largely unexamined and inconsistently applied moral principles. (It’s the best way to avoid self inflicted emotional pain, which is more famously known as guilt.) Even lightworkers often rebel against society’s understanding of “being good” in order to show them a better way. "Being good" is not necessarily a better or safer way in general.

You’re right about selfishness. Complete selfishness does have serious repercussions in many ways, including success, prosperity, and increased self esteem. The consequences of consistent selfishness are not necessarily bad, as you seem to imply. The outcome largely depends on the intelligence and insightfulness of the darkworker and is not a foregone conclusion.

Originally Posted by ProjectX

Just like to add also, maybe being 100% darkworker isn't so bad, if ultimately the goal is to achieve being a lightworker. Basically one must build up his power in order to give.

It all balances out, like Yin and Yang.

Balance is not the point; focus is. Balance equals non-polarization. Why commit to being a darkworker if you know your ultimate goal is to be a lightworker? Why not skip the middle man and just be a lightworker? Or better still, remain blissfully uncommitted?

[munish]

Originally Posted by ProjectX

A lot things are contradicting, and the theory doesn't make sense.

Why are there so many successful darkworkers?

It gets really confusing.

Are there any good examples of darkworkers?

On the other hand if you're 40, rich and have a family then being a lightworker can be more ideal.

I hope I get a response.

The biggest problem with concepts is, that people debate them more than applying them .

[Ecce Homo]

Originally Posted by munish

The biggest problem with concepts is, that people debate them more than applying them .

Too true. Then again that's true of all self help concepts I suspect. I also suspect that world changers like Alexander the Great, Jesus, Napoleon, Gandhi and the like didn't spend a great deal of time debating this kind of thing either; they just "did it".

[ProjectX]

Napoleon ended up the same place we all end up on this side of life: dead. At least he lived fully and gloriously while alive. If given the choice between a long but safe and mediocre life versus a shorter but spectacular life, I would choose the latter. That's just my preference though. It's neither right or wrong.

Actually Napolean ended up being exiled in an Island for the rest of his life. I see your point, quality over quantity. But the thing is how do I want it? Spectacularly good, or spectacularly bad?

The most logical and safest way to what? The destination determines the path. It’s been my observation that “being good” is so often code for adherence to socially acceptable but largely unexamined and inconsistently applied moral principles. (It’s the best way to avoid self inflicted emotional pain, which is more famously known as guilt.) Even lightworkers often rebel against society’s understanding of “being good” in order to show them a better way. "Being good" is not necessarily a better or safer way in general.

So you're saying the issue is not whether its bad or good the person is doing. The issue is whether the person has a conscience or not and his ability to feel guilt?

Balance is not the point; focus is. Balance equals non-polarization. Why commit to being a darkworker if you know your ultimate goal is to be a lightworker? Why not skip the middle man and just be a lightworker? Or better still, remain blissfully uncommitted?

I prefer to call the term twilight worker.

[Akashic_Librarian]

Being blissfully uncommited is the same as saying "I'm scared". You can live perfectly happy lives being uncommited but from what I have seen with just a tiny tiny tiny bit of dedication to the ideas of Darkworking, then its well worth it to polarize.

[Ecce Homo]

This one is all about definition:

Originally Posted by ProjectX

But the thing is how do I want it? Spectacularly good, or spectacularly bad?

In this context, the choice is really between spectacular or mediocre, and how you define those terms.

Originally Posted by ProjectX

So you're saying the issue is not whether its bad or good the person is doing. The issue is whether the person has a conscience or not and his ability to feel guilt?

No, the issue is defining what you really want and what you are willing to do to get it.

Originally Posted by ProjectX

I prefer to call the term twilight worker.

Works for me!

[Ecce Homo]

Originally Posted by Akashic_Librarian

Being blissfully uncommited is the same as saying "I'm scared". You can live perfectly happy lives being uncommited but from what I have seenwith just a tiny tiny tiny bit of dedication to the ideas of Darkworking, then its well worth it to polarize.

You said it. It's about what you have seen. Alot of people simply do not see this, hence all the indignation about labels and oversimplification and what not.

[ProjectX]

I really doubt Darkworkers are motivated by fear. Perhaps some, but I think a lot is motivated by the feeling pleasure and exhilaration. Fear is such a poor definition.

[Akashic_Librarian]

Thanks ProjectX your right.

[Liminal Chris]

I think Darkworkers are motivated by entitlement.

Darkworkers genuinely believe they are intrinsicly better than other people. To a darkworker, people are means to ends. I found the similarities between Darkworkers and Nietzche's aristocratic elite quite entertaining.

To Nietzche, the suffering of the masses was worth the successes of one good man.

To him the, non-aristocratic elite were the "bungled and botched". I would think a darkworker would agree.

[ProjectX]

I don't know why all these reactive attributes are being given to darkworkers. Darkworkers can feel gratitude. Darkworkers can help people. Darkworkers can feel all these proactive attributes, but ultimately they know they're doing it to increase their own pleasure and feeling of success.

[supertom]

darkworkers are like Goa'uld and ori for stargate fans

[Akashic_Librarian]

What I don't like is the vertical scale given to these names.

Its goes like:

 Lightworker            (supergood / enlightenment/top of the bunch)       
       |
       |
       |
       |
 Normal Person         (Middleground, can be good, can be bad, depends  
                                                what mood your in)     
       |
       |
       |
       |
  Darkworker            (evil, Selfish, reactive)

I think this is how most people see it, but really its more like:

   (service to Self)     (service to Others)
               Darkworker        Lightworker 
                          \           /
                           \         /
                            \       / 
                             \     /
                              \   /
                               \ /               
                                |
                                |
                                |
                                |
                                |
                                | 
                                |
                        Normal Person

This, therefore is why people get confused. Darkworkers are not lower down on the scale of consciousness, Seve says this himself, he says they are both highly conscious beings. What people are mistakening is that to be cruel or selfish you have to be of a lower consciousness. What if this is wrong?

What if consciousness (as we talk about it) is not determined by the social/moral implications we give it, but rather the energy behind it.

I hope these diagrams have helped some people who wherea bit confused with the whole idea, and I hope its more clearly illustrated where Darkworkers and Lightworkers stand in comparison.

[lifeforce]

Originally Posted by Syr

I find the whole theory a bit limited to be honest. If I look at the definitions which are given for the two kinds, I turn out to be a twilightworker. I try to mirror how people react to me, but amplified. If one is kind to me (or people/things I care about) I'll try to give that person heaven, if one tries disrespects me, I'll give him/her hell.

So basicly you use both polarities?

Is twilightworker/greyworker another term for unpolarized?

[Akashic_Librarian]

Yes Lifeforece, it is.

A lot of people who don't fully understand the theory like to think they can successfully and effectively flit between the two whenever it suits them. You can't, believe me. Twilightworking is more appropriately named Notworking. Simple as that.

[shinyhappy]

Truthfully, the entire darkworker/lightworker mindset is laughably immature* from a spiritual standpoint and, frankly, apes the "if you're not with us you're against us" Either/Or dichotomy that so many supposedly enlightened people rail against.

Please, if you truly wish to divvy people up into light and dark categories, for the love of God consider you may be wrong to do so. You may, in fact, despite every heartfelt belief to the contrary, be the bad ones when you do this.

*immature indeed! The idea - and spirituality - of light/dark is covered in much more nuanced detail within the Zohar and the Karmagayasutra. And, for added fun, the latter identifies Demons as those who mislead others' children, while those who correct are serving their Dharma.

So I say to you: Do not listen to this RPG-based nonsense. Read the sources and not this Pied Piper.

[lifeforce]

I thought it was about using the law of attraction and using polarization as a way to achieve peak motivation. And by focusing on one side, it puts you on a faster track to enlightenment as with the power vs. force article.

Atleast thats what I got from reading the original articles.

[ProjectX]

Sometimes it feels like lightworkers are self-serving. By making other people feel happy, they know they're making themselves happier. So they consciously uplift other people so they can benefit from the side-effects of this conscious movement.

Also sometimes I think that highly conscious person darkworker or lightworker should realise that encouraging hate and fear is only self-destructive. It attracts these things into their own lives.