The War on Ego (Blog)

[BVB]

I really like your blog Steve, but was dismayed by this article. It seemed defensive and insincere. While I am not an avid fan of Tolle, I find his work interesting, and reading your post made me think that something about Tolle threatens YOUR ego.

This was confirmed even more when you "name-dropped" the Oprah situation, as well as put down his demeanor.
There is something about him that must have hit a nerve, no?

I think I understand why. While your works evoke the sense of a "journey" towards contentment and personal development, his focuses on the LACK of journey, but instead only a journey into nearness, into immediacy. While your blog focuses on goals or ideas that are "out there," he writes there is nothing "out there" needed, because already within this moment, everything is whole and complete.
I find both techniques equally interesting, they are just different. Yet no need to make up things ("war on ego"? ) nor resort to passive aggressive behavior...

[wolfgang]

Originally Posted by dhg

But myself I can't, at the time being at least, avoid the fact that there is this great world this vehicle allows me to experience. I guess one result of this belief of us being something else, something more pure, is that it might make you want to detach from this physical world, since it is not real anyway. But I think that is a mistake. To further the analogy: I want to take my vehicle for a great ride - not let it sit and rust away in obscurity!

I for one do not see transcendence to make you want to detach from the 3d world. The glipses I have have the physical world more interesting and liveable. I know people often think (not you it seems, dhg) - oh no I don't want to be enlightened because I'll not care about the world. It's so much the opposite of that. The enlightened ones of the past were all about not harming life after all. They didn't trash the world or ignore it either.

[Alex]

This is a very interesting concept Steve. I think you've just hit on one of the differences between Judaism and Christianity.

(This is all from my understand, I haven't had years of study of both religions)

Both religions believe that God put a mask between himself and us. God did this because if we saw him, there would not be any free will. If we saw God we would be so drawn to his power, we would just go straight into it. With the mask, we have the choice. Maybe God is there, maybe not. It's for us to discover and believe on our own.

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The Christian way is to abstain from sex, live in a monastery, give up all material belongings, eat simple meals, and detach from the ego by minimizing the mask that God put between himself and us.

This approach will work to some degree. That mask will get smaller as we remove the level of materialism.
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The Jewish view says that God created this mask. God created this world for us to enjoy, filled with identities and egos and material pleasures. We should USE what God has given us. Hook on to it, and let it take us to oneness with God.
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But hey, that's whatever you believe.

This is why I wouldn't compare the words 'War on Ego' 'War on Drugs' and 'War on Terror' together. Drugs and Terror are absolutely no good. No good comes from them. Ego on the other hand has helped us to build bigger buildings, discover new medicines, and bring up society from living like cavemen. Ego is what drives self-improvement in many ways.
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I love the idea of steering your ego in a good direction. That's the way to go.

===
In my mind there is contradiction in what you are saying. You say that acting for the good of absolutely everyone is better than acting for the good of the people directly next to you.

I view this differently. I think if we concentrate on the greater good of the people next to us. Much like a cell concentrating it's resources on uplifting the cells directly adjacent to it, rather than spreading it's resources thin (trying to reach the neck from the knee) than we can reach that tipping point faster.

There is always an adjacent cell. All cells have a unique batch of adjacent cells like no other. If we consciously use our energy to reach only those cells that are adjacent and making a REAL breakthrough with them and in return they do the same, and the ones they touch do the same, etc, etc, etc. We will reach the entire world.

To me this seems like a more practical approach. Some people can do more and they should. If you are a hormone secreting cell (or a billionaire) than you have the power to secrete hormones (give out massive economic resources) and affect cells far away (help people all over the world).

Even with this analogy, the hormone secreting cell must concentrate on the cells around him first, because if those cells go bad, the hormone secreting cell alone will die. To say that if the billionaire does not concentrate on the wellness of his dear family first, than the people that give him joy and life energy will not be there to support him.

[24evita]

Originally Posted by BVB

I really like your blog Steve, but was dismayed by this article. It seemed defensive and insincere. While I am not an avid fan of Tolle, I find his work interesting, and reading your post made me think that something about Tolle threatens YOUR ego.

This was confirmed even more when you "name-dropped" the Oprah situation, as well as put down his demeanor.
There is something about him that must have hit a nerve, no?

I think I understand why. While your works evoke the sense of a "journey" towards contentment and personal development, his focuses on the LACK of journey, but instead only a journey into nearness, into immediacy. While your blog focuses on goals or ideas that are "out there," he writes there is nothing "out there" needed, because already within this moment, everything is whole and complete.
I find both techniques equally interesting, they are just different. Yet no need to make up things ("war on ego"? ) nor resort to passive aggressive behavior...

I love your point of view BVB as that is exactly the feeling I got when I read this article. I tried to think positive as I love Steve's articles - but I could not help getting the feeling you speak of out of my mind.

And Alex - excellent comments too!!!

Besides that I was shocked that Steve was using the title of "war against ego" as I had no idea it was seen this way and have not heard it referred to as such. I know that is definitely not what Eckhart means. Perhaps people who are getting the messages about the ego all wrong would refer to it as that but not others who truly understand what this is all about.

I myself felt like I really understood the ego well and everything that surrounds it until I read this article from Steve. I do look at the bright side of this though, and that is that it gave me a greater expansion of this topic to think about before I got too comfortable with my current viewpoints.

[thoughtfull]

I can agree with becoming conscious of the ego , the opposite is a state of unconsciousness that is where the front lines of the war are . The war is the egos battle with itself , a rather global schizophrenic freeforall . I wonder if the collective consciousness can become aware and integrate its ego .lol

[tekomino]

This article is, I feel, rooted in misunderstanding and ignorance. There is no "War on Ego". The war is inside you. You alone can't sort it out and feel threatened by this attention to ego.

Tolle's teaching is very simple. Become aware of the space between your thoughts, the silence between the words spoken by the voice in your head. I think Steve does not really understands the basic premise behind Tolle's teaching.

Global Awareness idea is misguided at best and contradicts human nature. We are not bee-hive. We are individualist. We don't have to become more aware of global good, we have to be more aware of what is truly good for us. Communism failed for that reason, becouse it expected people to all do what is best for commune. Individualism is in our DNA.

The alignment with greater good also does not have any merit on success of your actions. What was Hitler aligned with to have such power? Success of your actions is based purely on demand. If what you are doing is needed by people it will succeed. Whether its aligned with "greater good" or not is irrelevant.

You can't/shouldn't get rid of your ego, the same way you should not cut your arm off. It is natural part of you. You are not using your arm 24x7, so your thinking mind shouldn't be chattering 24x7 either. Once we learn to use it, as a tool, and let it rest when you don't need it anymore the things will get much better.

[Bruce Achterberg]

Originally Posted by Steve Pavlina

I think they were looking to recruit additional trainers to help teach Tolle's material. Teaching someone else's material is the wrong path for me though. They'll surely find someone else who can do a good job as a Tolle trainer. That isn't the best way for me to help people.

I believe Eckhart is looking to retire soon (at least, for now). He mentioned it in a seminar he gave this year.

Worry not, though. He's still going to be working now that A New Earth got into Oprah's book club, or so he said.

Originally Posted by ZeeZoy

I find this post rather interesting because Eckhart Tolle has cautioned people against discussing his work.

Is this because the work is rather useless and once people discuss this they will figure this out?

Or is it because everyone will interpret his work according to his or her own need and that interpretation may be different than the next person's interpretation?

There is spirituality, and there's spirituality. The difference between the two lies in those who don't compartmentalise their spiritual practices.

Eckhart understands that for most newcomers to his work, speaking about it will only perpetuate thought. That doesn't mean his work has no value, but when you're starting out, it's hard to be present and think at the same time.

I'd actually find it difficult not to be present when speaking with people now. I'm not present all the time, but presence is becoming more and more consistent in my life. Even as I write this I have an awareness of the moment. I'm right here; I'm not focusing on or thinking about the various things I could be worried about if I wanted to. To the degree that something does slip into my mind, I just let it be, even if that involves thinking, or even suffering.

This is the non-compartmentalised awareness I speak about. I can't be certain, but I believe Steve has reached this level. Eckhart obviously has as well. It's not so much a "level" to reach though; more of a state of being that deepens within you until eventually it's with you all the time.

[Bruce Achterberg]

Originally Posted by BVB

I really like your blog Steve, but was dismayed by this article. It seemed defensive and insincere. While I am not an avid fan of Tolle, I find his work interesting, and reading your post made me think that something about Tolle threatens YOUR ego.

This was confirmed even more when you "name-dropped" the Oprah situation, as well as put down his demeanor.
There is something about him that must have hit a nerve, no?

Certain articles Steve writes definitely have a different energy to them. Some of them feel charged with intellectual energy; others, more spiritual-type energy.

The War on Ego article seemed much more about logic than a particular state of being. Interestingly, I didn't really bother to read it; I skimmed it and was largely "meh, unnecessary." I'm not sure if Steve is writing this way consciously, or if he's shifted to seeing his blog as being more a means to an end while he's busy with his book. That's a very real possibility by the way—especially with Steve writing and editing his book recently.

Steve may be experienced with personal development, but he's just like the rest of us, and he too can stray from his purpose path, or at least, intellectualise it so that he's in service to a conceptualisation of his purpose instead of his purpose itself. I do this—often!—so I'm not terribly worried. If Steve self-destructs (unlikely, but possible), I'll silently thank him for what he's helped me with carry on with my own personal growth.

Try to focus on Steve the person, not Steve as you perceive him through his articles. His articles tend to shift around a lot, and it's hard to pin him down. Since you probably don't know Steve the person, unless you're interested in changing that, focus on more constructive things and accept Steve's work for what is it; don't worry about what it isn't.

[supertom]

steve means ego as in "point of focus" try telling a athiest to transend his ego, its not gonna work, but when we view the world as "cells" and the "human body". than everyone can get in the act.

One thing i hate about tolle is that he makes my love of the "stock market" sound like its evil

[tomstine]

A comment or two on Eckhart Tolle and Steve's post:

Eckhart never went to war with his ego. He was suffering horribly, and woke up one morning and his ego "had died" meaning he no longer identified with his ego. He still had a persona, an "Eckhart" that presented itself to the world, but "he" knew that "he" wasn't that persona, that ego, that mind. He sounds in his description just like Ramana Maharshi and Nisargadatta Maharaj and some of the great Zen masters.

If I read Steve correctly, or maybe I'm reading between the lines, it isn't the Eckharts and Ramanas that "go to war with the ego" it is the people who read them and think "I've got to get rid of this ego." It is the unconscious spiritual seeker who spends hours and hours trying to destroy his ego.

But as the gurus have said, it is the belief that you are the ego that is the problem. You aren't. Letting go of identification is the key. As another poster said, putting your attention on that which you truly are, awareness itself, will do the trick. Just pay attention to what you truly are.

[24evita]

Originally Posted by supertom

One thing i hate about tolle is that he makes my love of the "stock market" sound like its evil

I could not resist and had to just put a quick comment in regards to your above comment. I am not sure in what essence you said it, but deep down nobody else can make anything in our lives "be" or make us "feel" anything unless we let them. And I love that I learned that from Dr. W. Dyer because it sure made life much easier. People can judge us, or say whatever, but it is in us as to how we choose to let that affect us or not

Please don't think I am picking on you but I have to ask do you think that maybe deep down, you know it(the stock market) isn't the right thing for you?

[pyrogen]

Interesting article about ego.

It's why I consider myself a darkworker.

For me, the left-hand path of the shadow *is* a path of enlightenment and not merely of personal power, though it's not what most people in this community would tend to accept.

All attempts at following the right hand path for me, resulted in the contents of my shadow coming around and smacking me. My ego became an even bigger obstacle. I became even more self-centered.

But to admit that I have certain desires (to be powerful, the center of attention, et cetera) has lead to greater serenity and my ego being LESS of a problem. I can only become a more honest person by coming out and saying from the start that I am a liar, and only become more connected with others by starting from a place of acknowledging my self-centeredness.

For me, it's a much more powerful place to work from, though it seems to be misunderstood by much of the New Age/New Thought community.

[Judge]

Tolle addresses the ego in much detail, therefore, many people think he and other's like him, are trying to get us to kill off our ego's and/or at least subdue or repress them.

They are not saying this at all, but that we must realise they are not us, like knowing your dreaming while in the dream.

Our ego's are essentially our validating mechanism. We can't experience most stuff without it. The trick is to know it's not us, it's a tool just like thought and emotion.

Wonderful, wonderful tools, but tools none the same

Judge

[ellie]

Originally Posted by Judge

Tolle addresses the ego in much detail, therefore, many people think he and other's like him, are trying to get us to kill off our ego's and/or at least subdue or repress them.

They are not saying this at all, but that we must realise they are not us, like knowing your dreaming while in the dream.

Our ego's are essentially our validating mechanism. We can't experience most stuff without it. The trick is to know it's not us, it's a tool just like thought and emotion.

Wonderful, wonderful tools, but tools none the same

Judge

Judge I really like all your posts, do you have a blog or something?

[Judge]

Originally Posted by ellie

Judge I really like all your posts, do you have a blog or something?

Sorry, I don't have anything like that.

Judge

[cylon]

Judge exists enough to have a blog?

[inverse Paranoid]

Originally Posted by Judge

Tolle addresses the ego in much detail, therefore, many people think he and other's like him, are trying to get us to kill off our ego's and/or at least subdue or repress them.

They are not saying this at all, but that we must realise they are not us, like knowing your dreaming while in the dream.

This is not quite accurate. Tolle seems to have claimed many times that he has "lost" his ego and is now ego free. He also claims that he no longer has a "pain-body" anymore either.

From Oprah's A New Earth web event transcript 5 page 49:

OPRAH WINFREY: So let me ask you this. On the night that you had that, you know, the breakthrough where you said, "I cannot live with myself any longer," did you lose your pain-body too?

ECKHART TOLLE: Yes.

OPRAH WINFREY: Well, that was just one happy day, wasn't it?

ECKHART TOLLE: That's quite rare.

OPRAH WINFREY: Oh my goodness. You lost your ego, you lost your pain-body, what a day that was.

ECKHART TOLLE: Yeah...

Anti-ego sentiment has really permeated many spiritual circles. Even A Course in Miracles is heavily anti-ego. But in truth, anyone trying to disconnect from the ego part of themselves is in fact acting through ego because the ego is the source of all separation.

As Alan Watts once said, "and the biggest ego trip of all is this idea that we can get rid of the ego!"


Steve offers a more congruent approach that actually loves and accepts your ego for what it is, rather than trying to fix it or get rid of it. That's what this article is all about.

[Rose of Cairo]

Inverse Paranoid I really like all your posts, do you have a blog or something?

[Judge]

Originally Posted by inverse Paranoid

Steve offers a more congruent approach that actually loves and accepts your ego for what it is, rather than trying to fix it or get rid of it. That's what this article is all about.

Well, that's your opinion but I think it's a little bit of Tolle with a bit of Steve mixed in. Tolle says he has lost his ego, but I don't think that's true. He still seems to thrieve on the attention under the guise of sharing the message. You can't switch off your ego completely and even if you could, why would you want to.

Steve has said that you can find value in the experience from your ego POV, but it's a limiting perspective compared to viewing everything as you, consciousness, but he also seems to contradict himself a little when many of his blog posts are very egoic in nature, which of course is fine and dandy

No one source has all the answers.

Judge

[BeyondtheWrap]

Originally Posted by inverse Paranoid

This is not quite accurate. Tolle seems to have claimed many times that he has "lost" his ego and is now ego free. He also claims that he no longer has a "pain-body" anymore either.

Perhaps he was egoless for a time and then the ego came back?

[cylon]

Bump. This thread is over a year old but I think it's unique in that Steve takes the approach that the ego is not bad in itself.

We talk about ego here a lot, but almost always in the context of it being bad. Acknowledging that you have likes and dislikes, preferences, opinions, and goals, that someone else may not have, is based on the idea that you exist at some level. And I think it's totally normal to acknowledge that you exist, even if as a cell that makes up the whole body. You're still part of the body, but you are separate, at the same time. I don't see why people think they have to choose one or the other.

I think it's harmful to deny anything that is a natural part of being human. If we weren't meant to have identities and personalities, then we wouldn't have them.

[JoeRad]

Originally Posted by cylon

I think it's harmful to deny anything that is a natural part of being human. If we weren't meant to have identities and personalities, then we wouldn't have them.

Indeed! You have echoed a revelation I recently had. We don't have to force one side or the other to dominate our life, be it the ego, or the oneness of us all.

[magic1]

I do not see it as abandoning ego either...my ego gives me pleasure at times! I think life would be boring without ego...I do not want to sit on a mountain and meditate with no experience....and be this spiritual being that's immune to life...this is not my intention to be honest, its a choice, but hey maybe in the next life, but right now NO!

but I do feel to manifest one needs to get through it to ultimately create from your essence...so this means asking for something and not letting your ego try and drive the manifestation........so no thought and analytical, doubt fear, chatter etc...but calm soul knowing....

[BeyondtheWrap]

Originally Posted by magic1

I do not see it as abandoning ego either...my ego gives me pleasure at times! I think life would be boring without ego...

Sometimes I stay something arrogant (or egoic in some way) simply because I think it's funny, even though I don't actually believe it.