| |||||||
| Register | FAQ | Members List | Calendar | Search | Today's Posts | Mark Forums Read |
| Spirituality, Consciousness, & Awareness Spirituality, beliefs, the nature of reality, consciousness, awareness, metaphysics, truth, philosophy, religion |
|
Welcome to the Personal Development for Smart People Forums, the place for lively, intelligent discussion of all personal growth issues -- physical, mental, financial, social, emotional, spiritual, and more. You're currently viewing as a guest, which gives you limited read-only access. By joining our free community, you'll be able to post your own messages, access many members-only features, see the new messages posted since your last visit, and of course remove this header message. Registration is fast, simple, and free, so please join today. If you arrived here from a search engine, you may want to explore the main site first, which includes hundreds of deep and insightful articles on a variety of personal development topics. |
 |
| | Thread Tools | Display Modes |
08-04-2007, 10:46 PM
| |||
| |||
 I concede, Max - you're right. You are God!! Max, you are right. In your subjective reality, you are God, and in my subjective reality, I am God. Just to validate what you've been saying, and to add a little extra spin, here's what I make of it all. In the beginning, now and forever, is All-Knowingness, the great "I Am". "I Am" wished to experience (I don't know why) as other "I Am"s, other versions of itself, which are us. In order to maintain a sense of individuality and separateness amongst us "I Am"s, the world of mind, time and space came into being. So, to use an analogy, the big "I Am" is like the sun, from which sprout other "I Am"s, i.e. us, created in it's image and likeness. Some great mystics and saints of the past have sussed out this problem of ego/mind/space and time and have merged again with big momma "I Am". Some are very close, so close that you could hardly get a cigarette paper between them. However, most of us are drifting further away from the source of "I Am", having become embroiled in the traps of ego/mind/space and time, etc. Some of us blame our pain and suffering on "I Am", while others have totally forgotten that they originate from "I Am". Some have experimented with the no-no rules, like killing, stealing, lying,etc. and have drifted even further from "I Am". I appear to be a little "I Am", but actually, I am the great "I Am" as well. If I can clear out the clogged up conduit between myself and the great "I Am", an incredible two way flow of love and power takes place: the great "I Am" becoming more fulfilled and self-realized in experiencing itself as the little "I Am" and the little "I Am" becoming more fulfilled and self-realized in experiencing itself as the great "I Am". In fact, the little "I Am" is the great "I Am" and vice versa. It's a bit like the mystery of the Christian doctrine of the Trinity: there are three persons in one God. Each person is separate and distinct, but each person is God. So it is with us. So, when you say you are God (as long as you are not saying it from the ego self), you are God. The Jews originally had it right, when they sensed the "I Am" was present. They said the name could not be spoken and referred to it as three letters : JWH. Then they started calling it Jahweh. Soon they had scaled it down to accommodate their human whims and gave "I Am" a masculine, misogynistic personality, prone to fits of jealousy, anger and revenge, which reflected the time and culture in which they lived. That's where traditional religion went wrong. However, there is a danger - trying to get too much of "I Am" too quickly. It would be like pumping 1 million volts of electricity into a device capable of handling only 220 volts. There are recorded case of people, whilst meditating deeply on their chakras, have opened them up too quickly and allowed such a great influx of energy that they have had heart attacks and died. As we exist withing a mind/body/ego framework we need to bring this into ourselves calmly and gradually. We are all connected with same "I Am" stuff, so the more united we are and the closer we get to the source of "I Am", the happier amd more fulfilled we will be.      |
|
08-04-2007, 11:53 PM
| |||
| |||
| Quote:
In SR (the way it's describe that I understand) there aren't mulitple subjective realities, that's like saying there are mulitple consciousness's and niether of those are SR or at least not the version I understand. Quote:
The real challenge or trick if you like is to see that consciousness, true self is not human and to understand it from the limited human POV just doesn't work, because as long as we're human beans understandinig consciousness, we can never see what we are. You, me, I, we, are not human and as long as we think we are, we will suffer all the human traits, problems, trouble and hindrance. Your goal, the only one that matters is to align yourself with consciousness as much as possible without tipping the scales to the point of instantly going back to perfection which is the true state of consciousness. Max Last edited by Max Power : 08-04-2007 at 11:59 PM. |
|
08-05-2007, 12:11 AM
| |||
| |||
| I understand SR as there being only ONE consciousness which is all there truly is - but, there is more than just one individual ego identity (which is consciousness also yes, but that part of itself forgets that). Each ego identity is separate (to the ego mind anyhow), consciousness is the vine, from which each one grows. So all is one, I am consciousness, everyone else is my creation - but you can say the same and be correct also. |
|
08-05-2007, 12:23 AM
| |||
| |||
 Not human? Max, I understand most of your observations but not this one. What do you mean we are not human? We are in human form. We live, drink eat, and die. Thinking otherwise can be dangerous. Quote:
|
|
08-05-2007, 01:14 AM
| |||
| |||
| Quote:
__________________ My blog which I haven't updated in a long time.  Thoughts do not create. Get used to it. |
|
08-05-2007, 01:24 AM
| |||
| |||
| The way I view SR is similar to how torilink views it. I think the great danger of SR is to claim "I am God" while the ego is still alive and kicking. In fact, I don't think it's possible for an ego to claim "I am God" at all -- only God can be God, the ego's reality is just illusion and doesn't exist. First get enlightened and relinquish the ego, THEN claim that you are God all that you want I differ from Steve in that I don't think enlightenment is so easy as changing a few belief systems, i.e. switching to SR. Enlightenment is to completely relinquish all beliefs and all attachments, including everything that you think you are. The only positive aspect (I believe) of using the thought "I am God" to try to sense the ultimate reality beyond the personal ego, such as what Hindus do with "I am Brahman". But to use it as how certain people on this forum use it...I have my doubts  Regarding Cantando's remark about the dangers of spiritual work...Yes, Kundalini Yoga and other methods that focus on manipulating energies or chakras CAN be dangerous, without an advanced teacher to help. That is why it is better to avoid intensive energy/chakra work, and to focus on traditional spiritual pathways (knowledge, devotion, service, meditation, etc.) -- that will automatically and naturally bring up the energies as you progress. The Kundalini energy is very smart -- it seems to know exactly what to do, without us having to direct it |
|
08-05-2007, 03:04 AM
| |||
| |||
| Quote:
No. A human body is a collection of physical stuff, blood, bone, tissue, hair, atoms. What is thought? Where is thought? What is thought made of? Most people agree that when the body dies the spirit/whatever lives on, so if the body dies and the thing that make's you.........you, then that must live on. So while you may think you are a human body having a human experience, you are actually a spirit/something having a human experience through a human body. Where do you think creative power/thought/choice comes from? You physical mind/body/brain? It can never be dangerous to understand who and what you are unless you believe you're god and from a human bean POV, that is an egotistical, potentially harmful way to view reality, because you envoke your believed power to control others and to suspend beliefs that are in place to protect you. Personal development (this forum) is about developing your person and that includes your whole person, not just the physical stuff. Max |
|
08-05-2007, 03:57 AM
| |||
| |||
| Quote:
|
|
08-05-2007, 06:06 AM
| |||
| |||
| I am human Ah, I think you are referring to the 'essence' of a human which is different to a human being in the here and now. We cannot be other than a human being whilst still in the body. I think ignoring the fact of our humanity can be dangerous, not 'not knowing' who we are. We do need to know who we are and being human is a part of that. I'm not too interested in the after life, where my soul or spirit goes. It's out of my hands but life as we know it now is in all our hands (or imaginations as you may wish to see it). I truly believe the human being has far more potential than we can imagine, but that is our job to grow, flourish and create. We cannot do for humanity if there is no humanity. Quote:
|
|
08-05-2007, 06:24 AM
| |||
| |||
| Quote:
It's terminology that I may have referenced incorrectly. Your creative source isn't human, how can it be when everything begins as thought. Max |
|
08-05-2007, 06:39 AM
| |||
| |||
| Subjective Reality Quote:
The way I see it, there is Oneness. This Oneness is synonymous with consciousness. We seemingly live in a reality with parts. The truth is, the separation never occurred, but we believe it did, and because of that, the Oneness took on the behaviour of a separated reality with parts and distinctions. But it's all a matter of perspective. It is like looking at a shattered mirror. Your reflection is in each of the pieces -- you yourself, never shattered, but your image appeared to, but then, it wasn't real anyhow. And by moving the pieces of the mirror about, you can see that you are still whole. It is simply your ability to see it all at once that has been hampered. So one way of looking at it is there is only one reality, and it is subject to consciousness. Another perspective allows us to see that because Oneness has took on the behaviour of separation, a pseudo objective reality can exist because the seemingly separated "parts" can "agree" on certain properties of reality. The more peace you attain in this life, and the more conflicts you resolve in yourself, the more illusory the separation will seem. When you resolve all conflictual thoughts within yourself (which currently can appear to be outside yourself), this world will no longer appear to have parts. The ego is the part of your mind that believes in separation. It insists that is "in here", therefore, there must be a world "out there" or vice versa. |
|
08-05-2007, 02:10 PM
| |||
| |||
| I see the light Absolutely, I'm totally with you now. Ta very much Max next question, "how do we harness this creative source'? Quote:
|
|
08-05-2007, 05:27 PM
| |||
| |||
| Quote:
Ego says: I want everything now. We live in a world of 5 second attention spans and immediate results. Everything has to be delivered on our doorstep immediately. Whatever happened to the virtue of patience? I believe experiencing + learning from it = growth. I would not ctiticize anyone who desires to create, to have things and experience things, but if they are not growing as a result, then they must be stagnating or becoming less as a person. By growing, I mean becoming more self-realized as "I Am". When we have played out our games of creation in this mind/universe, surely there comes a time when when it's time to pack up our toys and go home. When I talk about "I Am", you can experience this in meditation: listen for the whisper from deep within your being. When we are kids we are taught things like: I am a boy; I am a girl; I am American: I am Jewish: I am strong, or whatever. But we are never taught, just "I Am". If you stripped yourself completely of all bodily sensations, thoughts and memories, what are you left with? Being aware, being "I Am". It is always there. It can never be obliterated. It is the "I Am" which springs from the eternal "I Am". They are one and the same. If you don't believe that, then you are letting ego or mind or time or limiting beliefs get in the way. To grow in "I Am", look at the other guy's reality. If you help those less fortunate than yourself and show a bit of compassion, you can rest assured that those further ahead on the spiritual road will be helping you. We grow and ascend together. |
|
08-05-2007, 08:04 PM
| |||
| |||
| Surely we should trust an omniscient central source and remain satisfied with the time/space/mind model that it created for us? To suggest that the ego is a negative element of a model of existence and that an omniscient consciousness brought this model into existence is surely wrong in some way. Either the ego is good or the central consciousness isn't omniscient. |
|
08-05-2007, 11:09 PM
| |||
| |||
| Quote:
Long answer................People put their humaness first, because they identify with it so strongly, it's all they see and because it's a dense version of true self, it seems very powerful, but it's not, in fact it's very powerless. Remember you spend 6-8 hours a day (a third of your life) untethered to your physical body, but you're still you, still creating a reality of sorts. People forget that when they identify strongly with humaness. When you identify with you humanity first, you create all sorts of problems. Just look at the world. Every problem in it is the result of creation from the human POV, greed, anger, hate. As humans we need those things, but they tip the scales because we become blinded by the power of emotion. When are humans at their best? When they care for others and often in crisis situations. That's because in those situations we bypass our limited human POV and work straight from consciousness, straight from source. When you identify with consciousness as your true self and where all the power is, it's a joyous thing. It allows you to see the truth, that you are a creation as is everyone. Looking at it from the consciousness POV helps you find true peace and the creative source just flows like water. There is no struggle, sure you can build some in for growth purposes, but you don't need it. You can relax and just marvel at it, in all it's glory, self sustained and self contained, there is nothing outside consciousness and everything required is inside already there waiting for you to stop putting your humaness first and get out of the way. The level of trust is honourable, for you don't give up control, but you control from the the correct source, from consciousness. Everything is perfect, your human bean will attempt to try to tip the scales, that's it's purpose to keep things interesting, but most of that subsides when you know you're working from the right source. To harness the creative source, you must identify with consciousness. You don't have to say or think "max said I'm not human, AHHHHHHHH!!!" Just realise the truth........all creative power comes from consciousness, not your human brain/mind/body. Thinking like this doesn't stop you from being human, it actually makes you a better human because you're aligned with the true creative source and that benefits everything and everyone. You create things to improve everything, including your humaness. Money, love, health all come easily because the purpose is true and correct, you create these things to improve your entire consciousness and that improves your human state and the state of humanity. You become rich to help you and others, you express love to help you and others, you get healthy to help you and others. All those others are just extensions of you, as you improve yourself, you improve your whole self. How do you create money, health and love?........... Simple.......as everything starts as thought, don't be fooled by this dense reality, for thought (choice) is the creative power and can render into physical reality anything choosen. So to choose something (observe it) is to create it, Then the how to do it will be revealed. When we try to create from our limited human bean, we actually confuse consciousness and usually get a manifestation that is a mess. Create from your consciousness.......it's where all the power is. "You are consciousness having a human experience, not a human having a conscious experience............the difference in that makes the difference to everything" Max |
|
08-06-2007, 12:29 AM
| |||
| |||
| Quote:
I'm sorry, even really wanting to, i try to not comment nor flame people's beliefs in this forum. But this is way too much gibberish for me to hear (read  ). Someone having a heart attack because they tuned in too much into their higher selves or whatever you people call it? Recorded cases of such people? Whats the font?? Don't bother, because whatever you say will probably will be something that couldnt possibly be proved, so it really doesnt matter. If people want to believe this stuff, fine, but they shouldnt take some extreme actions because they believe this or that, like they risking all their money in a new business endeavor thats highly risky but believing they will succeed because they think this is their consciousness and they're god, like some individuals here believe.
__________________ All that matters is results. |
|
08-06-2007, 01:12 AM
| |||
| |||
| Quote:
I could be wrong, but I doubt it  Max |
|
08-06-2007, 03:18 AM
| |||
| |||
| Quote:
I just wanted to give an advice to most people reading this, which i'll quote from my last post: Quote:
There's something called risk-management, and believing that one cna control everything around him, will obviously screw things over for him, and he won't be able to handle risk (possible gains vs. possible losses) effectively anymore.
__________________ All that matters is results. |