spiritual exeriences and mental illness

[Old Soul]

Hello all, here is something that has bothered me for quite some time, I post it here because I believe in my case , some of my beliefs and and experiences have been totally hijacked by "phsyciatry". and then labelled "mental illness". it is like your personality is being medicated, not your symptoms, physciatry is to quick to take anything of the spiritual nature
and call it mania. /or depressive , In my case they don't even acknowledge that just maybe what they call mania, might be misunderstood.. by their own limited schooling....

I was wondering if anyone here has experienced this also?.. do you think the field of physciatry is closed minded,

[Alchemiss]

Although I have not experienced this directly, I just read Second Sight by Judith Orloff which might be helpful. In it she talks about her journey as both a psychic and psychiatrist. She also talks about how she relied on medicating patients initially (following the mind-based conventional way) but learned a more balanced and holistic approach over time.

Amazon.com: Second Sight: Books: Judith Orloff

[Old Soul]

I may pick this book up, it does sound good

thx:-)

[infinitethoughts]

Originally Posted by Old Soul

I was wondering if anyone here has experienced this also?.. do you think the field of physciatry is closed minded,

Of course it is.

Current day Psychiatry is based on a materialistic worldview.
Stay away from them.

[elwood]

I have always wondered about the amount of literature and art that would have been missed if these medications were around in the past.

I have been on medications, and there is a lot of over prescribing and not enough behavioral therapy.

When I was on meds, it was to treat depression and OCD. The meds in combo with the therapy helped a lot. The best way to describe what it did to me was to cut off a bunch of emotions from the top and a bunch from the bottom and leave me with a little in the middle.

So I was left with no depressed, horrible thoughts AND no joyous or creative thoughts. I just didn't feel too much either way.
For me, that wasn't going to do. So I worked on my "issues" and gradually came off the meds. They are addicting and that not easy. And I wasn't even on a dosage, they consider addicting and it was rough.

In retrospect, it worked for me. And my depression can get bad at times. Could therapy have worked alone? maybe.

I have only very recently decided to push my boundries and look into other realities. This comes after reading a bunch on evolution, Ken Wilbur, Einstein and things of that nature. I eventually landed, by chance, at Steve's podcast and have listened to all his podcasts. I have decided to give subjective reality a shot, what could it hurt.

I feel very peaceful after doing this. Time will tell if the depression comes back. But a single integral conscious view over an objective view seems to be helping.

[Old Soul]

I have been on medications, and there is a lot of over prescribing and not enough behavioral therapy.

I totaly agree with that statement, meds for me did not work, but getting to know me better and exploring my thought patterns ( neg and pos), working through this helped me more than any bottle of lithium ever did...

the only thing lithium did for me was put a ton of weight on me, made me feel zombie like, ( no emotions at all), and eventually made me feel defeated because of the weight gain

but a good faith good therapy with my friends and family helped the most

[jasonivers]

Drugs can be very effective at clearing enough of the mental clutter to allow you to step back and see what it is that you need to change in yourself. That being said, I think long-term use of psychoactive drugs is not a positive thing, as it does alter your mental state and your ability to grow fully.

Essentially, they can make your emotional self back off so that your mental self can step back into command where it belongs. Some people do not use them to do this, which leads them to believe that they continue to need the drugs.

Behavioral therapy is essentially for the same purpose... teaching you to take back control with your mental self, allowing your emotions to return to their natural state of being supportive instead of dominant.

[Old Soul]

Behavioral therapy is essentially for the same purpose... teaching you to take back control with your mental self,

Totally agree!!!

[swansong]

Hi Old Soul,

I would love to sit down with the lot of you and talk out this topic... In the past I've been in behavoral/cognitive therapy but am currently only on a pretty stout dose of prozac & trazodone. With that disclosure out of the way...

In my natural (unmedicated) state I am much more creative and spiritual; Strangers say I 'shine' and people find me eerily perceptive. While that is the upside, the downside is devastating/dark/isolating/hopeless moods that grip me and drag me down. Medication has indeed lopped off those "high notes" and "low notes" but I feel the trade-off for now is something I need to bear.

I do miss that magical spiritual world that enveloped me but I do not miss the black-funk that used to side-blind me and suck me dry for months at a time.

For now I'm compromising and taking the medications ("for now" meaning the past 8-10 years.) Behavorial and cognitive just wasn't enough... hopefully someday it will be. It's nice to fit in and function as I do now... but it's lonely too.

Interesting topic!
Swansong

[Maguru]

After many years of traditional medications, two hospitalizations and various therapies for my pitiful state, I gave up. I hadn't a clue what was wrong with me and apparently, neither did anyone else. I was so confused and in the depths of despair and could do nothing to change it. The emotional and physical pain was unbearable.

The only way I was able to bear it was that, 'I reasoned if my mind got me into this mess, then it could bloody well get me out of it'. I faced my fears and all the terrible feelings associated with it. During these horrific periods of blackness I cultivated what I term as 'home-grown wisdom'. Knowledge and insights that I believe I would not have gained otherwise.

I was wondering if anyone else has experienced this?

[Old Soul]

During these horrific periods of blackness I cultivated what I term as 'home-grown wisdom'. Knowledge and insights that I believe I would not have gained otherwise.

Yes!! I can idenitfy..

Meloncholy Blue's

Somedays are filled with golden sunshine
and somedays are a meloncholy blue
Those are the days when you can't find your smile
in anything you might say or do
Yet you carry one with life's journey
carrying all your joys and pains
perhaps learning a few of lifes lesson
and wisdom is what you gain
Maybe without the storms of life
that attribute to the meloncholy blues
I would never have found my strength
and courage to make it through!

[Billy]

Hmmm, I dont want to sound pessimistic but to reply to your thread I have to say go to any mental health proffesional and tell them that you hear positive guidance in your head{clairaudience} and listen to their reply. I dont think you'll be impressed. I don't reply much anymore on this site because I feel its being bogged down by the same old crap over and over again, but as a fellow "old soul" I feel your questions deserve straightforward answers. I know what I know and theres no use bashing people over the head with it. Swansong I went through what you'r going through now and found that I had to find the star within myself that was the true me, without meds. Once found and recognized there is more than enough love and life inside ourselves, and even a bit for everyone else. Peace u guys

[Megan]

A real can o' worms here, Old Soul!

I see the "mentally ill" as the canaries in the coal mine. If the sitcheashun ain't good for the canaries, it ain't good for the miners neither.

Lots of canaries keeling over these days.

We might want to think more deeply about all this.

A pity that the Scientologists highjacked the issue--makes it harder to look at objectively.

[infinitethoughts]

Originally Posted by swansong

While that is the upside, the downside is devastating/dark/isolating/hopeless moods that grip me and drag me down.

If you 1) accept these moods and then 2) explore these 'moods', your progress will soar.

Here's a hint. These moods are not you, but rather your reactions to societies strange "truths".

[Megan]

Ah yes...society's strange truths.

At some point, is a well-adjusted person really...insane?

[infinitethoughts]

Originally Posted by Megan

As yes...societies strange truths.

At some point, is a well-adjusted person really...insane?

Well since society is insane.....I'd say yup.

[Maguru]

I was fighting 'mental illness' for several years to no avail. It came down to a choice of becoming a conforming zombie or a non-conformist screaming painfilled 'nutter'. I chose the latter and it came at a huge cost.
However, once I took responsibilty for my agony a new picture began to emerge. A spiritual picture. An aspect of life I was previously unaware of. Eventually I realized I was in spiritual crisis. The truth for me was that I was undergoing many internal changes and the pain was the pathway.
There are many perspectives on 'mental illness' and I believe each is as unique as a fingerprint. No one knows you as well as you know yourself. You have to draw your own conclusions.

[Shamou]

Originally Posted by infinitethoughts

Well since society is insane.....I'd say yup.

A definition of sanity is sharing a common reality... therefore, anyone not sharing a common reality has some soul searching to do...

.

[KLmasina]

Great topic, and one very close to my heart/mind.

I had an experience which the doctors called bi-polar and psychotic.

I KNEW it was spiritual.

Turns out it was Kundalini rising.

In the three years since, I have experienced a spiritual rebirth. During this time, I experienced depression, and confronted my great fear that I WAS crazy.

My take on mental illness is that it is our SOUL crying out for help. Our brain stops functioning well and we feel AWFUL because we are completely out of alignment with our internal truth.

It's a huge wake-up call to make some pretty big changes in one's life.

Medication and therapy can help support these changes, but ultimately, they only treat the symptoms of mental illness and not the cause.

We are spiritual beings, and our mind is just a tool, like our hands or our arms. Just like too much pressure on a leg the wrong way can break it... so can too much pressure on the mind the wrong way "break" it.

It was really tough to dig out my true self, because this self perceived the world so differently from the 'norm'. It brought up a lot of fear about being an outsider, not fitting it... etc.

But now that I am here, I am SO glad I have had the courage to walk this path.

That blackness we experience is there for a reason. It's a motivating force calling us to confront our truths and LIVE those truths.

That so many of us are experiencing mental illness speaks to me of the collective calling our of our Souls... it is time to wake up, to know the Self as Consciousness.

When it comes to dealing with mental illness and seeing it as an opportunity to awaken the True Self, behavioural and cognitive is not always going to be enough. This approach doesn't work with the consciousness - that part of you that IS the divine, is God, is All.

I found yoga and meditation absolutely invaluable in my rebirthing experience - both taught me that I am not my mind, nor my emotions, nor my body. I am the eternal all that is, as are You.

I have written extensively about this on my site if anyone's interested.

Much joy,
KL

[Megan]

Our "shared reality" is destroying the ecosystem.

So maybe people who opt out of the corporate insanity have already done some soul searching, but just haven't had much support for it and feel pretty lost and alone.

If you seek help from others who haven’t yet been through this expansion of consciousness, they won’t be able to help you. They will only make things worse for you. They may even want to drug your problem to help you try to forget.

http://www.stevepavlina.com/blog/200...-conditioning/

Good post, KLmasina!

[Liara Covert]

Years ago, I conducted a research project that examined the evolution of perceptions and understanding of the psychiatric illness MPD over a period of 60 years. I based this research on North America and drew from professional interviews, popular culture films, texts and case studies. Although the extensive project referred to many sources, its still only one perspective. Results revealed that social stigmas highly-influenced public and health professional perceptions of mental illness and treatment. Many biochemical, environmental, socio-cultural and holistic approaches psychiatry still exist.

Another thought-provoking view of the perception of psychiatry and the question of over-medication of Ritalin in children can be seen here: Justification of restriction - Dream Builders - Dream Builders direct you to find Financial Freedom through Motivation and Goal Setting

[Old Soul]

Turns out it was Kundalini rising.

what exactly is that? I've never heard of this before sounds interesting

That blackness we experience is there for a reason. It's a motivating force calling us to confront our truths and LIVE those truths

totally agree!!

[Maguru]

I really would like an insight as to the effect of spiritual rebirthing. I am most interested in the new you. Has anything changed besides feelings?

Originally Posted by KLmasina

Great topic, and one very close to my heart/mind.

I had an experience which the doctors called bi-polar and psychotic.

I KNEW it was spiritual.

Turns out it was Kundalini rising.

In the three years since, I have experienced a spiritual rebirth. During this time, I experienced depression, and confronted my great fear that I WAS crazy.

My take on mental illness is that it is our SOUL crying out for help. Our brain stops functioning well and we feel AWFUL because we are completely out of alignment with our internal truth.

It's a huge wake-up call to make some pretty big changes in one's life.

Medication and therapy can help support these changes, but ultimately, they only treat the symptoms of mental illness and not the cause.

We are spiritual beings, and our mind is just a tool, like our hands or our arms. Just like too much pressure on a leg the wrong way can break it... so can too much pressure on the mind the wrong way "break" it.

It was really tough to dig out my true self, because this self perceived the world so differently from the 'norm'. It brought up a lot of fear about being an outsider, not fitting it... etc.

But now that I am here, I am SO glad I have had the courage to walk this path.

That blackness we experience is there for a reason. It's a motivating force calling us to confront our truths and LIVE those truths.

That so many of us are experiencing mental illness speaks to me of the collective calling our of our Souls... it is time to wake up, to know the Self as Consciousness.

When it comes to dealing with mental illness and seeing it as an opportunity to awaken the True Self, behavioural and cognitive is not always going to be enough. This approach doesn't work with the consciousness - that part of you that IS the divine, is God, is All.

I found yoga and meditation absolutely invaluable in my rebirthing experience - both taught me that I am not my mind, nor my emotions, nor my body. I am the eternal all that is, as are You.

I have written extensively about this on my site if anyone's interested.

Much joy,
KL

[Old Soul]

There are many perspectives on 'mental illness'

you might find this interesting, :



Mis-Diagnosis and Dual Diagnosis of Gifted Children:
Gifted and LD, ADHD, OCD, Oppositional Defiant Disorder

By James T. Webb, Ph.D.


Many gifted and talented children (and adults) are being mis-diagnosed by psychologists, psychiatrists, pediatricians, and other health care professionals.


The most common mis-diagnoses are: Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder (ADHD), Oppositional Defiant Disorder (OD), Obsessive Compulsive Disorder (OCD), and Mood Disorders such as Cyclothymic Disorder, Dysthyinic Disorder, Depression, and Bi-Polar Disorder.


These common mis-diagnoses stem from an ignorance among professionals about specific social and emotional characteristics of gifted children which are then mistakenly assumed by these professionals to be signs of pathology.

Mis-Diagnosis and Dual Diagnosis of Gifted Children

[Megan]

Old Soul, thank you for that excellent article!

It helped me personally, actually, because I am one of those people who have giftedness in some areas and learning disabilities in others, and have never seen this addressed.

I hope parents will be extremely cautious about allowing their children to be put on psyche meds. These medications can make some people worse in the long term, sometimes drastically, dangerously worse.

I realize that that is a controversial statement at present, but I think we will be hearing a lot more about this issue in coming years. I'll post some links about that later.

Edit: I realize just how controversial Peter Breggin is also, but here is a link to his HuffPo blog:

Dr. Peter Breggin - Politics on The Huffington Post

The spiritual dynamic in giftedness and mental illness is simply not factored in by modern psychiatry, nor can it be, given a materialist worldview.

[infinitethoughts]

Originally Posted by Shamou

A definition of sanity is sharing a common reality... therefore, anyone not sharing a common reality has some soul searching to do...

The idea that you share a common reality is insanity.

The idea that your awareness is only inside your physical body sharing a common reality, is insanity.

Sanity is seeing the truth.

Sanity is seeing you are expanded awareness, you are your physical body plus everything your senses show you.

Sanity is seeing you are continually choosing any version of the Sea of Infinity that you are immersed in.

[Shamou]

Originally Posted by infinitethoughts

Sanity is seeing the truth.

That is exactly what "they" all say... those flying mice are real...

.

[wolfgang]

Me and my brother were both diagnosts as manic depressives. I took lithium for about one summer and rejected it on my own and stopped going to the pill pushing pyscologist. Any depression was just that I couldn't stay in the manic state and function, sort of like being normal wasn't as fun as being manic. After stoppping lithium I ramped up my meditation, did rebirthing, tai chi, behavioural consoluing, started the coarse in maricles, listened to binorial CDs/tapes, guided relaxations, wrote poems/music, went into nature (camping,hinking) more often, etc, and I'm not having trouble like that manic thing. I don't think people knew how to help me. It was an awakening in my retrospective thinking. But it was too much to operate with, I did need help. Maybe if there were shamen I could have been with in the deep jungle, it would have been normal and be an initiation of some kind. Instead there was no way to tell anyone what the lifted veil feeling/sensing was like. And probably in the jungle the shamen know a plant to take if the awakening is too much. Actually, they take Ayahuasca in the jungles to get into some state that lifts the veil.

My brother took lithium for years and then became a born again Christian and stopped lithium and he's ok now. Although he wants to save everybody(he, he). He's saved by Jesus, he says. He said when he had his conversion, when Jesus came into his heart, it was similar to the manic state, without the ungroundedness of it, w/o delussions of granduer, like a humble balanced version of being mainc.

I wonder, though, if lithium wasn't around, like during the 1800s - society would have put me away as a lunitic who was very excited that I thought I knew something that coulnd't be communicated but would keep trying and have people look at me like I have two heads. Although, friends who visited me during my mania would listen to me and I'd think, I can't make any sense out of what I'm saying. But then friends would say, you know what? you are making some sense. You aren't really "mad".

[infinitethoughts]

Originally Posted by Shamou

That is exactly what "they" all say... those flying mice are real...

.

Lol...............!

Shamou, leave your guru (robbins) and follow me, my son.

Lol.

[infinitethoughts]

Originally Posted by wolfgang

But then friends would say, you know what? you are making some sense. You aren't really "mad".

It's cool you made the jump out of societies frying pan.

Shhhh. Don't tell Shamou.
~Joke~