Subjective vs. Objective reality

[Irisha]

Originally Posted by Arcanum

I'm more focused on the collapse of beliefs. there is a practical approach to this, but i don't think anybody is interested in that.

Oh, I AM interested. If you could be so kind as to tell more about it here, or PM me too, I'd appreciate.

[Acting Like Godot]

Originally Posted by Irisha

Wow, I even got inspired that there may be people who would be able to cope with such a problem as MrG.
Are these telekinetic abilities so wide-spread in China?
If it could be possible to use these abilities distantly over many thousands of miles... - do you know any examples?

Ehh, the links seems to have got broken on their own - they now lead to the general Youtube website. Not to the specific videos I linked. Strange, perhaps the universe is acting to defend Seeds' reality as he thinks it to be.

Now, these telekinetic abilities are quite widespread in China. But they do not call it as such. They call it "chi", and it is an energy that they use, in various forms of exercise and martial arts, mainly chi gung (also spelled qi gong) and tai-chi.

Lots of people in China practise tai-chi and qigong, not with the intention of acquiring telekinetic abilities, but because they are exercises for general good physical and mental health.

Among people who diligently practise these exercises for years, you get a couple of masters (who end up being the instructors and teachers) who develop these unusual abilities, to manipulate physical objects with their minds.

Apart from the telekinesis, some of these Chinese masters also develop pyrokinetic abilities. Here is one video (hope the link works this time)

Qigong Master Demonstrates Pyrokinesis - YouTube

Watch the full video, he also demonstrates some other stuff other than pyrokinesis.

Such as changing his body mass rapidly. So much for Seeds' assertion that the mind cannot affect the workings of physical matter.

[Luciddd]

My only question would be, how is that no one has succeeding at beating the James Randi Challenge?

[oasis]

What would remain for one in life, if they were able to channel higher consciousness, and thus change life at their will. Would life become boring, if you were able to achieve everything you wanted?

[Luciddd]

Originally Posted by oasis

What would remain for one in life, if they were able to channel higher consciousness, and thus change life at their will. Would life become boring, if you were able to achieve everything you wanted?

It depend on the person, but guess if said person doesnt become insane, they will look to go beyond life, since they have already experienced everything it can offer.

[Acting Like Godot]

So far, there doesn't seem to be anybody who is fully able to change their life at will. There are people who attain considerable general ability to consciously shape and create their lives; and then there are people who attain weird and specific mind/reality abilities such as telekinesis, pyrokinesis etc. But not the full ability to consciously change just everything and anything.

[Acting Like Godot]

Originally Posted by seeds

The speed at which quantum entities affect each other across vast stretches of the universe is “instantaneous,” making something traveling at the “speed of light” appear to be standing still in comparison.

Actually, the "faster than the speed of light" hypothesis looks like it just got refuted this month.

Scientists reject rivals' light-speed claims - Science - News - The Independent
BBC News - Doubt on faster-than-light neutrino result

I wish you would give up your attempts to be smug. It just ends up making you look ridiculous, as I prove you to be wrong and wrong and wrong again.

Furthermore your points are so pedantic and irrelevant. In the context of IM/LOA, do we really, really, REALLY care whether the process happens faster than the speed of light; or at the speed of light; or slightly slower than the speed of light?

Nope. For all practical purposes that we can think of, any of the above is fast enough.

[Beingist]

Originally Posted by Acting Like Godot

Furthermore your points are so pedantic and irrelevant. In the context of IM/LOA, do we really, really, REALLY care whether the process happens faster than the speed of light; or at the speed of light; or slightly slower than the speed of light?

Personally, I really don't care about any of that physics stuff. But, then, I'm not an LoA devotee, either.

[Luciddd]

Originally Posted by Acting Like Godot

So far, there doesn't seem to be anybody who is fully able to change their life at will. There are people who attain considerable general ability to consciously shape and create their lives; and then there are people who attain weird and specific mind/reality abilities such as telekinesis, pyrokinesis etc. But not the full ability to consciously change just everything and anything.

They MAY exist, but again, would we be able to even perceive them within our own reality?

[seeds]

Originally Posted by Acting Like Godot

So much for Seeds' assertion that the mind cannot affect the workings of physical matter.

ALG,

This whole tangent of Apopohis Reject's thread began with you stating the following:

Originally Posted by Acting Like Godot

This is going to surprise you, but I've had the experience of walking through a wall...

...My wife also walked through solid glass doors...

I then asked you to demonstrate for all of us exactly how you and your wife can do such things.

To which you unleashed a barrage of anecdotal examples of other people's accomplishments, all worthy of the Time/Life Encyclopedia of the Paranormal in what to me appears to be the equivalent of a "sleight-of-hand" effort to draw attention away from your flamboyant statement that you and your wife are capable of walking through walls and doors.

You later gave a more watered-down (honest) explanation of what "really happened" where it was more of a remote viewing type of exercise that you learned through the Silva Method school of thought.

If you would have initially presented your "walking through walls" adventure with a little more truthfulness and humility, I probably wouldn't have said anything.

That said, I still insist that none of the examples that you have put-forth even remotely diminish the veracity of what I stated in a prior post:

Originally Posted by seeds

The quantum fabric composing the objects of the universe does not belong to you in such a way that would allow you to wield and restructure it like you can with the fabric of your own mind.

I believe that you could have a billion humans, all focusing their attention on a single toothpick lying on a table, and no matter how hard they tried, I'll bet you anything that they could not change that toothpick into a butterfly just by willing it to be so.

That is the crux of what I am trying to say to you.


seeds

[Acting Like Godot]

Originally Posted by seeds

I believe that you could have a billion humans, all focusing their attention on a single toothpick lying on a table, and no matter how hard they tried, I'll bet you anything that they could not change that toothpick into a butterfly just by willing it to be so.

That is the crux of what I am trying to say to you.

Errrr, thanks for your crux then. A point to ponder - is changing a toothpick into a butterfly really very much different from, say:

-- converting a dead, rotting piece of meat into a walking, talking human?

-- converting water to wine?

-- spontaneously manifesting statues, watches, holy ash, jewels etc out of thin air?

-- transforming part of a sea, into a relatively dry stretch of land, to walk over?

Or even the mundane miracle of a few specks of carbon, hydrogen and oxygen molecules from a man's body combining with a few specks from a woman's body, to lead to the conception and the eventual birth and growth of another 70-kg human being?

[Reefs]

Originally Posted by Acting Like Godot

I wish you would give up your attempts to be smug. It just ends up making you look ridiculous, as I prove you to be wrong and wrong and wrong again.

Hehe, seems he can't hear that. Totally lost in details.

Furthermore your points are so pedantic and irrelevant. In the context of IM/LOA, do we really, really, REALLY care whether the process happens faster than the speed of light; or at the speed of light; or slightly slower than the speed of light?

If it can prove that seeds ultimate seeds theology is right, yes!

[Acting Like Godot]

Originally Posted by seeds

To which you unleashed a barrage of anecdotal examples of other people's accomplishments, all worthy of the Time/Life Encyclopedia of the Paranormal in what to me appears to be the equivalent of a "sleight-of-hand" effort to draw attention away from your flamboyant statement that you and your wife are capable of walking through walls and doors.

My wife has even bilocated.

That is, she has been in two places at the same time.

It happens. Some famous people to whom this phenomenon (known as bilocation) has occured include:

St. Alphonsus Liguori; St. Anthony of Padua; Ursula Micaela Morata; St. Gerard Majella; Charles of Mount Argus; St. Pio of Pietrelcina; Pope Cyril VI of Alexandria; Osho; Sai Baba; Aleister Crowley.

Errr, before you accuse me of exaggeration, I suggest you use the search engine and look for my old posts on my wife's stuff, and read them for yourself. Perhaps they are not as remarkable or unusual as you would like them to be, I don't wish to disappoint you.

The phenomenon may be related to that of doppelgangers.

Bilocation is one of the more universal sorts of paranormal phenomena, it happens across very different cultures and countries. There are reports of it in:

- Greek philosophy,
- shamanism
- occultism and magic
- Hinduism (as one of the siddhis)
- Buddhism
- Theosophy
- Christian mysticism
- Jewish mysticism.

I suspect that in many cases, it's just a more extreme version of remote viewing. Eg from your sofa, you project yourself to your uncle's home. Some people, at your uncle's home, may actually be able to see you and hear you there, at your uncle's home - like an apparition.

[Acting Like Godot]

Originally Posted by seeds

I'll bet you anything that they could not change that toothpick into a butterfly just by willing it to be so.

And really, this is just so impractical and useless - converting a toothpick into a butterfly.

There are easier ways to get rid of a toothpick, or to get a butterfly. And what would one do with a butterfly, anyway.

[Reefs]

Originally Posted by Acting Like Godot

And really, this is just so impractical and useless - converting a toothpick into a butterfly.

There are easier ways to get rid of a toothpick, or to get a butterfly. And what would one do with a butterfly, anyway.

The question is not if they can change the toothpick into a butterfly or not, the questions is if seeds will see or not. And I would say, problably not.

[Acting Like Godot]

Oh yeah, and you don't have to hear it all from me. Concerning this:

Originally Posted by seeds

just as you cannot reach into my mind or Apopohis Reject's mind to grasp and wield the substance that comprises our personal thoughts and dreams

... you can ask Irisha to tell you about her long-term relationship with someone now faraway who still regularly reaches into her mind to communicate with her.

[Acting Like Godot]

Originally Posted by Reefs

The question is not if they can change the toothpick into a butterfly or not, the questions is if seeds will see or not. And I would say, problably not.

Empty space, empty space .... First it pretends to be a toothpick, then it pretends to be a butterfly, then it pretends to be a toothpick that cannot turn into a butterfly.

What nonsense! Everyone knows that butterflies and toothpicks are all exactly the same sort of empty space, with just a couple of quarks and neutrinos popping in and out!

Anyone with a little bit of scientific knowledge should be able to understand that.

[seeds]

Originally Posted by Acting Like Godot

Actually, the "faster than the speed of light" hypothesis looks like it just got refuted this month.

Scientists reject rivals' light-speed claims - Science - News - The Independent
BBC News - Doubt on faster-than-light neutrino result

I wish you would give up your attempts to be smug. It just ends up making you look ridiculous, as I prove you to be wrong and wrong and wrong again.

I was never referring to "particles" moving through space. I am talking about concepts in physics dealing with Bell's Theorem, and the entanglement between quantum particles that have come in contact with each other (which basically refers to all particles in the entire universe).

From Wiki:

"Quantum entanglement is a form of quantum superposition. When a measurement is made and it causes one member of such a pair to take on a definite value (e.g., clockwise spin), the other member of this entangled pair will at any subsequent time[5] be found to have taken the complementary value (e.g., counterclockwise spin). Thus, there is a correlation between the results of measurements performed on entangled pairs, and this occurs even though the entangled pair may have been separated by arbitrarily large distances."

It suggests that an "instantaneous" correlation occurs between paired particles theoretically separated by the entire distance of the universe

Oh, and by the way, I think that last line of yours...

I wish you would give up your attempts to be smug. It just ends up making you look ridiculous, as I prove you to be wrong and wrong and wrong again.

...makes you the king of smugness in this thread.


seeds

[Apopohis Reject]

Acting Like Godot: So much for Seeds' assertion that the mind cannot affect the workings of physical matter. ALG,

Seeds: This whole tangent of Apopohis Reject's thread began with you stating the following:

You might be interested in some cutting edge work being carried out right now by a Norman Doidge, MD, who wrote "The mind that changes itself".

It is his claim that through a series of processes and exercises, intentionally rewiring the brain's neural pathways (as I understand it) in the process, he is able to prove not only the mind changes itself, but those changes extend into the outer body.

In one proclaimed account, he explains that his team has conclusively reached the result of helping a man, blind from birth (if memory serves) to have a kind of vision. Yet he does not use his eyes at all. Astoundingly enough, the claim is that he now effectively sees through his tongue! There is in fact, a youtube video with him in discussion about this. I might look for it in a minute and post the link shortly.

Of course, scientists seem less than inclined to accept the possibility, and are therefore reticent to afford themselves a chance of investigation into this. As such, I guess we are left a-wondering what the heck is really going on and what are our real possibilities???

Yet I'm absolutely certain, indeed I KNOW in ways I can merely allude to right now, that we haven't begun to scratch the surface as yet, and this entire thing is very shortly, exceedingly shortly; about to explode in a way that we can't even begin to dream of right now. ALG, your "walking through a wall" will seem a child's prank in hindsight, IMO.

Originally Posted by seeds

I believe that you could have a billion humans, all focusing their attention on a single toothpick lying on a table, and no matter how hard they tried, I'll bet you anything that they could not change that toothpick into a butterfly just by willing it to be so.

Whilst I accept your hypothesis as stated, what this thread is all about, is that in being born; by default we exist within a mentality set up in us prior to our conception.

As such, we live out our lives in this default mindset with precious little awareness of what it is, from whence it originates, how it functions, who is responsible for what, how we continually make choices which we know are not in our best interests, why we strangely, unhealthily enjoy (often with a great religious zest) entertaining ourselves with atrocities such as chop-em-up movies, indeed perpetrated against ourselves, why loving another is often such a painful experience etc.

So there is clearly an inherent disconnect, a dissonance of serious proportion going on within our consciousness. But amazingly we reason there is nothing that can be done about it, for in the first instance, we know not what consciousness is, and go even further by relating to it as something that 'just happens'!!!!

Did I hear that right? Did someone just say that the very commodity that makes us everything that we are; 'just happens', is a spontaneous happenstance, is nothing worth appreciating, is pointless to try and correct (provided we appreciated this) it's serious, pernicious disease? Into how moribund a condition can our mentality possibly descend, I ask?

Even though it was not really created by me, but rather by a mod spinning it off from another, nonetheless that is what this thread is all about. Looking into what constitutes consciousness, where that comes from, how it operates, how that operation/mix makes us the individual presenting, where is/are the problems/issues/disease for us in all this, what we can do about this to achieve a healthier result, what those results will be, etc.

Now what about all the above, and why this post?

Well I can explain right now what I've experienced, am experiencing - awesome spiritual growth, wonderful new realisations, far healthier perception, for I've been on this road for the past 9 years Yet I can assure you the process is a long way from being completed.

Once this eventuates however, the results (I'm convinced) will put your toothpick/butterfly demonstration and ALG's wall apparition very much in the dark.

[Apopohis Reject]

CBC Documentaries

Talk - The brain and neuroplacity

Neurons Firing

[Reefs]

Originally Posted by Acting Like Godot

Empty space, empty space .... First it pretends to be a toothpick, then it pretends to be a butterfly, then it pretends to be a toothpick that cannot turn into a butterfly.

What nonsense! Everyone knows that butterflies and toothpicks are all exactly the same sort of empty space, with just a couple of quarks and neutrinos popping in and out!

Anyone with a little bit of scientific knowledge should be able to understand that.

Hehe, I don't think that seeds considers himself to just have "a little bit" of scientific knowledge. He might fancy himself to have supreme scientific knowledge.

Quarks and neutrinos are fantasy creatures anyway.

[Acting Like Godot]

Whatever.

Now, for those who are interested in practical applications, here's a really simple one. Far more useful than transforming toothpicks into butterflies.

Let's say you have a bad cold. Your nose is blocked, your sinuses are all stuffed up. You go to bed. In the middle of the night, you toss and turn and you wake momentarily.

This is a lovely time to use a simple mind method to fix your cold. Why? Because when you have just woken up, you are in a certain mental state (deep alpha / light theta) which is trance-like and dream-like and very conducive to IM.

Think a simple thought such as "I am recovering quickly and completely from my cold". Hold it in your mind, repeat it and allow yourself to fall gently back asleep. If you prefer, you can visualise a white warm light shining steadily somewhere between your nose, and the back of your head.

You may actually physically feel movements happening somewhere in the middle of your head. As if your sinuses were expanding and contracting, painlessly wringing themselves. Your sinuses will rapidly clear themselves up and unclog themselves. You can feel them moving. You wake up in the morning, and you are much, much better, and the cold is gone.

Works for me anyway.

[Apopohis Reject]

Unfortunately I'm unable to find the full interview which I was referencing, but here is an excerpt from it. Unfortunately it doesn't include the section about the man who now sees through his tongue.

Here

[Acting Like Godot]

Originally Posted by Apopohis Reject

ALG, your "walking through a wall" will seem a child's prank in hindsight, IMO.

It IS a child's prank. It sounds weird and fascinating, but in fact it is quite useless in practice, unless perhaps if you are a civil engineer or a CIA agent.

[Irisha]

Originally Posted by Acting Like Godot

Oh yeah, and you don't have to hear it all from me. Concerning this:



... you can ask Irisha to tell you about her long-term relationship with someone now faraway who still regularly reaches into her mind to communicate with her.

Right now MrG has punished me for disobedience. I was creating a new Google account because he damaged my e-box, as he doesn't want me to communicate with people who are trying to help me. He disliked my new ID because it sounds similar to the name of his former wife. .... ... And he immediately made my IPad malfunction in revenge, because of my new ID. Distantly. He is in Russia, I am in New York.
You can read the whole story of my long-term relationship with this psychic/sadist/telepathist in Psychic Paranormal Forum.

[Acting Like Godot]

I googled "Sight with Tongue" and it returned 37 million hits.

[Apopohis Reject]

Originally Posted by Reefs

Hehe, I don't think that seeds considers himself to just have "a little bit" of scientific knowledge. He might fancy himself to have supreme scientific knowledge.

Quarks and neutrinos are fantasy creatures anyway.

The churlish antics in the thinly veiled guise of humour, yet are surely underpinned by an negligent sense of gross superiority on this forum, are becoming exceedingly tedious.

Just saying, is all.

[Reefs]

Originally Posted by Apopohis Reject

Unfortunately I'm unable to find the full interview which I was referencing, but here is an excerpt from it. Unfortunately it doesn't include the section about the man who now sees through his tongue.

Here

Oh, I have something far more amazing, there's a guy who thinks with his butt!

Link is here: http://www.stevepavlina.com/forums/s...archid=1944577

[Apopohis Reject]

Originally Posted by Acting Like Godot

I googled "Sight with Tongue" and it returned 37 million hits.

Follow the links for starters. An link to an excerpt is posted above, and I'll give it another go at sourcing the full version.

[Beingist]

Originally Posted by Apopohis Reject

The churlish antics in the thinly veiled guise of humour, yet are surely underpinned by an negligent sense of gross superiority on this forum, are becoming exceedingly tedious.

Just saying, is all.

Ah, welcome, Reject, to the Spirituality, Consciousness, & Awareness subforums of Steve Pavlina's Personal Development for Smart People Forums.

Indeed, there are some real characters around here, but we still love 'em, nonetheless.