|11-14-2011, 03:44 AM||#1 (permalink)|
Join Date: Apr 2007
Why the traditional "christian" version of Satan makes no sense to me
Well, lets get the facts straight, according to the traditional "christian" version of Satan and correct me if I am wrong the guy was highest among angels or one of the highest and basically second only to God.
Knew no suffering, had no one to tempt him. Yet he attempted to DESTROY GOD personally, and took 1/3 of his angels with him.
So basically prefal satan:
- Super high position, basically second only to God
- Has supernatural powers is not bound by some laws of physics
- Knows no suffering
- He doesnt have anyone tempting him
- A lifestyle that would put all kings of the world to shame
- No sinful urges
- Needed zero effort at anything he did
- He is sent to hell
- He rules hell
- He retains his powers and abilities
- He can go between heaven and hell freely to accuse people of their sins and take them to hell
- Until the final judgement day, he isnt punished in hell
- He cause evilness not because of sufferings or need, he does it only because he is evil, for thousands of years he has destroyed countless lifes
- IS RELEASED FROM PUNISHMENT, yes after his second defeat at the end of times he is captured for 1000 years and then released. As if God was giving him a second chance, even if not he was freaking released.
Now lets see the case with man:
- No supernatural powers, is bound to the laws of physics
- Has to make it in life
- Knows pain and suffering
- Has a limited life
- Lifespan of 150 years maximum
- Is a sinner, but one would assume it cant be compared with personally wanting to headshot God
- Usually most of the sinful acts that are commited, for example sex are either because of natural urges of the body (as we have fallen from grace) or because man becomes twisted by suffering in life
- Has to work, work is a divine punishment in the traditional intepretation of bible
- Has Satan tempting him
- No supernatural powers or anything, reduced to the lowest scum
- No ruler in hell, is a prisoner a slave that is tortured by the devil and his angels
- Is suffering ALWAYS in hell and has no chance to get out as opppossed to Satan being released after 1000 years
So am I the only one seeing the inconsistencies here with the traditional version? Satan who did way worse apparently even have second chances or at least is temproarilly released while he is allowed to be lord in hell, go between hell and heaven, etc.
While normal people who live no more than 1000 years and didnt turned to Christianity are turned into slaves in hell, with no relief or anything.
|11-14-2011, 03:57 AM||#2 (permalink)|
Join Date: Feb 2011
Yep.. some good old christian values should get you through.
Try not to confuse Satan with Lucifer. Two different entities. One is severely less powerful.
When is Judgement Day meant to be?
|11-14-2011, 06:59 AM||#4 (permalink)|
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Down the infinite rabbit hole
This is the exact "doctrine" (really, it's a strange, cobbled-together mish-mash of ideas) that made me first start to ask real questions, many years ago. It led me to a study of Christian theology and the history of the Christian church (which, by the way, has very little to do with the man known to history as Jesus Christ), then to biblical exegesis digging into the underlying languages of Greek and Hebrew (though, admittedly, I'm not very good at Hebrew; I had to rely on a dictionary and concordance for anything in that language), then to textual criticism, and now I'm studying the archeology of the ancient near east and ancient history.
And I still think the whole Satan/Lucifer thing (btw, the "Lucifer's Fall from Heaven" story, although based on earlier traditions, didn't really appear until about the 3rd century CE, and Midnight is right that Satan, or ha-satan, represents a different concept) and a "loving God" who tortures his own creation eternally and related matters to be bizarre and unexplainable. It can only be justified with circular logic, from the very centre of the orthodox-based worldview, but not from without, or even from slightly off center of it.
The more I delve into the matter, the less orthodoxy and its offshoots make sense, frankly.
|11-14-2011, 02:29 PM||#5 (permalink)|
Join Date: Feb 2011
At least in Hell you expect things to be that way. We assumed this place might have a spark of difference, many still fell for the traps.
Headshot God? Go and make people start praying to you and mentally projecting all their pure energy into you rather than God/Source and you would come pretty close.
Christianity is portraying an accurate version of Satan, they just don't know how they are doing it so well.
|11-14-2011, 03:59 PM||#7 (permalink)|
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Florida USA
Where did you get the idea that religious tenets make sense? For believers they are the word of the divine or to be taken on faith. For non-believers they are delusions, manipulations, or just nonsense.
I’m not sure what your comparison of Satan to the human condition is supposed to show. It just suggests that Satan is not a human (consistent with Christian teachings). According to Christians, animals are not humans and they don’t have to go to hell mo matter what they do.
Regarding the Christian view of Satan and other demons, these are more catch all categories for ‘evil things’ than actual beings. You probably know that ‘Satan’ has many names. Actually many of those names belong to other demons and beings. The Christian term ‘demon’ refers to any ‘evil’ being not a bad human or fallen angel. In actuality there are vast numbers of types of beings Christian would see as evil.
Seems the real issue for you is that you are struggling with deserving a second chance.
|11-14-2011, 05:47 PM||#8 (permalink)|
Join Date: Apr 2007
|11-17-2011, 08:05 AM||#9 (permalink)|
Join Date: Feb 2011
As much as the world likes to believe Lucifer is a Demon, he is not. Lucifer is an Archangel that existed with a near 100% polarity into the Light. He however chose to mimic 'God' by allowing his polarity to 'fall' down to 51/49 Light to Dark ratio. The essence of this piece of knowledge, for those who realise the implication of what I am actually saying here, would contradict just about every piece of Christian or Religious scripture that has ever hit the mainstream.
Satan is a fully-fledged Demon without a Doubt. However miniscule in relation to power, knowledge, position in heirarchy, status, etc.
As ButterflyWoman suggests, there was a convergence of the two entities in religious scripture at some point in time.
It spirals around the 3rd Dimension quite a few times before going higher.
Now imagine that spring becomes bent out of shape mid-way and instead of continuing the spiral upwards, it circles down and and around the same spot quite a few more times, before eventually leading upwards again. You essentially get a kink in the system that forces the energy to cease continual growth, and instead focuses on the same ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ issues that everybody is already fed up with. Welcome to Earth.
In the end of the day this would have a relatively minor impact (in fact practically non-existent) in the grand scheme of things, disrupting a natural process nonetheless.
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