Karma is Bunk

[cdavis]

Has anyone here actually experienced karma in the way so many spirtualists claim the system works, as in the good are rewarded by the universe and the bad are punished?

I see good people punished everyday while it seems like bad people thrive.

Any thoughts on this?

[royster]

Hi cd. I have a lot of appreciation for your various postings.

I don't subscribe to "punishment"; the idea stems from the hijacking of humanity by those who wish to rule certain energy streams.

There is no question in my mind that we feel the consequences of our actions, that we are accountable for all we do with our consciousness. But a Divine mind knows that punishment only breeds resentment. Punishment is man's concept, and a crappy one, at that.

Karma is a balancing agent. It is a good thing to learn, but not fear.

[cdavis]

Originally Posted by royster

Hi cd. I have a lot of appreciation for your various postings.

I don't subscribe to "punishment"; the idea stems from the hijacking of humanity by those who wish to rule certain energy streams.

There is no question in my mind that we feel the consequences of our actions, that we are accountable for all we do with our consciousnes. But a Divine mind knows that punishment only breeds resentment. Punishment is man's concept, and a crappy one, at that.

Hey Royster

thanks for the compliment by the way

I don't get it then, what accounts for the huge amount of, well, unfairness in the world?

Theoretically, I guess it would make sense - act very good in this life and you get rewarded in the next, act bad and you will be punished. But what good is a reward if you don't even know what it is for and what good is a punishment if you have no idea what it is for either? No one remembers past lives.

So that's primarily the reason I don't believe in it, other than the fact that it does seem that good people get punished and bad people thrive.

What do you think accounts for certain people being born into more favorable circumstances?

[Merrick1]

Originally Posted by cdavis

Has anyone here actually experienced karma in the way so many spirtualists claim the system works, as in the good are rewarded by the universe and the bad are punished??

Karma is not about reward and punishment. It's about learning. And when you look at it that way, it does work. I see it almost every day in my work of a spiritual healer and constantly in my own life.

Originally Posted by cdavis

I see good people punished everyday while it seems like bad people thrive.?

Oh yes, it looks that way if we take the human life from only one life-time perspective. A very good book to read (apart from personal experience) is the Aquarian Gospel of Jesus the Christ, where Jesus talks about this. If you don't mind that it was channeled, then it's worth reading it.

Merrick

[Merrick1]

Before I finished my post, there was this other conversation. I like what royster has said about it.

So, I'll leave it for now.

Merrick

[royster]

Most assuredly it's important to take on a multiple-lifetimes view. That's where we really see Karma in action. I have witnessed the process of people in abusive situations, and they eventually discover they were the abuser in another life. Is this punishment? No, not at all; it is letting that person know the consequences of their previous actions.

Like all ideas in the mainstream, Karma has been taken and modified in ways it souldn't be. Well...uh...that's Karma, I guess.

And as one grows in knowing, yes; good contributions come back to us. I no longer see it as a "reward" system, but rather a reassurance that contributing to the abundance begets abundance.

[royster]

Theoretically, I guess it would make sense - act very good in this life and you get rewarded in the next, act bad and you will be punished. But what good is a reward if you don't even know what it is for and what good is a punishment if you have no idea what it is for either? No one remembers past live

Oh, NOW you've got me started!

Who told you this, and why do you believe tham?

The good Karma comes back to us with a similar signature...an energy signature...that let's us know we've contributed to a specific stream in a specific way. Mainstreamers are oblivious to this due to the clutter of their minds...that's not a judgement call, that's personal observation. So we CAn know what we've contributed to in positive ways.

BTW, check your "Reputation points" on your cp...it often says WHY you get those points. In fact, this type of forum CALLS it a "Karma system" (vBulletin forums).

Yes, people DO remember past lives. the energy group that wants to control everything has used their media to debunk reincarnation. Yet they, themselves, use it to reappear in advantageous places. So...why listen to them, when in fact they're energy vampires?

As Merrick1 has said...and I have tremendous respect for his insights...what you are seeing is a soul having a human experience. Not all of them are brought on by bad Karma. In some cases, it's the need to know, which sometimes can only be taught experiencially.

[cdavis]

Originally Posted by royster

Oh, NOW you've got me started!

Who told you this, and why do you believe tham?

The good Karma comes back to us with a similar signature...an energy signature...that let's us know we've contributed to a specific stream in a specific way. Mainstreamers are oblivious to this due to the clutter of their minds...that's not a judgement call, that's personal observation. So we CAn know what we've contributed to in positive ways.

BTW, check your "Reputation points" on your cp...it often says WHY you get those points. In fact, this type of forum CALLS it a "Karma system" (vBulletin forums).

Yes, people DO remember past lives. the energy group that wants to control everything has used their media to debunk reincarnation. Yet they, themselves, use it to reappear in advantageous places. So...why listen to them, when in fact they're energy vampires?

As Merrick1 has said...and I have tremendous respect for his insights...what you are seeing is a soul having a human experience. Not all of them are brought on by bad Karma. In some cases, it's the need to know, which sometimes can only be taught experiencially.

Why wouldn't karma, if it is real, make people aware of why they are experiencing what they are experiencing? If you were abusive to one person in one life, and now are being abused, why wouldn't the system make the person aware that they are having to experience this now because they had already caused another to experience the same thing in a past life?

Without the awareness, it almost makes it pointless, because people have no clue why they are suffering, get more angry, do bad stuff, and incur even more bad karma. It seems like a neverending cycle.

[cdavis]

and also, how would someone who has done an extreme amount of bad things to people *ever* be able to fully experience it all?

they would have to file for karmic bankruptcy! it would be too much.

[BillyTheAdult]

A lot of people might jump in here and say NOOOO!!! because he is a controversial figure, but you might benefit from reading what David Hawkins has to say about karma.

In a nutshell he says, karma is not a punishment or punishment/reward system.

No one escapes it, just because because you don't know about it, doesn't mean it didn't happen but there is no such thing as getting off scott free.

Karma is a natural consequence for your actions, such as getting an STD is a consequence of having unprotected sex, not a consequence of making fun of STD's. There are internal consequences consequences as well such as if you kill someone and don't get caught, that is not escaping karma, because there will still be the enormous guilt. Even if that person is not aware enough to experience guilt directly, there will still be the consequence of having to live life wondering when they are going to come for you. They being police or anyone who might want vengeance. Then there is the consequence as mentioned previously of how it might affect your future lives (karmic inheritance.)

[royster]

There is no "Karma bankruptcy", though i got a good laugh from that.

I know from my own experience that you cannot ignore or amass bad karma indefinitely. What happens is, when you begin to honestly address it, you experience Grace. This is dismissing some of the stuff because you're on the way to take responsibility for what you did. Continuing this path may get you Divine Forgetfulness. In other words, should you be brought back into Allignment, these things are quietly set aside. Relapse, if you will, brings them back to the fore.

Those experiencing abuse and not seeing its origins...I know of a couple people doing this...are so overloaded by the packages of over-the-counter Spiritual-fix-all and fragments of spiritual insight that they will flop-and-stumble on down the sidewalk until all this load simply falls around them, and they feel they have to pick it up. It is then, if they're smart, they see the oppertunity to look at it all. And around. And FEEL.

Karma is Bunk

"You made your bed, now lay in it!"

[curiouslyrandom]

You might give the Bhagavad Gita a read. It touches on the subject of karma and dharma quite nicely.

[cdavis]

ok, so say it is my karma to be abused, who does the abusing?

and what gives them a license to do so?

wouldn't they be incurring bad karma as a result?

and if so wouldn't that defeat the whole purpose of karma unless they had some karmic license that gave them a karma shield that would allow them to dispense it with no reprecussions from a universal law?

I don't know why the topic of a license is coming up so frequently in my threads lol

[BillyTheAdult]

Wow another banning. I am curious as to why specifically but I won't say I'm surprised.

[royster]

Originally Posted by BillyTheAdult

Wow another banning. I am curious as to why specifically but I won't say I'm surprised.

Ya gotta admit, this messes with one's sense of humor, yet what a profound example of karma!

[Showtime]

Yea karma exists, but not in a "what goes around comes around" kinda way

The Buddha said "You will not be punished for your anger, you will be punished by your anger"

[BillyTheAdult]

Originally Posted by royster

Ya gotta admit, this messes with one's sense of humor, yet what a profound example of karma!

Yes this is a perfect example of what I was talking about. Apparently the OP was being abusive towards others, so he got banned. It's not a punishment per se,(although in this case maybe intended as so) just a consequence of actions. Now if he is off somewhere feeling wounded and wondering what happened or being in denial (not fun either) it's not punishment it is just a result that one gets for actions.

[BillyTheAdult]

BTW showtime I like that quote you included. I also like your signature quote, funny stuff.

[rei]

Originally Posted by cdavis

Any thoughts on this?

Oops too late, he's banned already.

[allis1]

firstly, karma is not doled out. it is basically an accumulation of energy, like the ego, fear and all other illusions we adopt in our incarnations, except that karma follows the soul through all incarnations until it is finally overcome. it is magnetized to the soul mostly through belief. certain tendencies are repeated until one sees, through a higher consciousness, that it just doesn't work, that it never worked, that it was never anyone's fault. it was just given power through energy. yes, back to energy. anything we give our attention to accumualtes energy. so, pay attention to the kingdom within, the one Jesus told us about.

[theuprising]

Originally Posted by Showtime

Yea karma exists, but not in a "what goes around comes around" kinda way

The Buddha said "You will not be punished for your anger, you will be punished by your anger"

I saw it as almost a guilt system where your soul is punishing itself. Or something like that.

Makes a horrible learning tool in anycase b/c you don't know why you are incurring the bad karma when it is happening, kind of like hitting a dog 30 minutes after it dug a hole, completely f'in pointless.