What happens if someone takes their own life?

[Gelfling]

Hello all,

I was just reading the thread about ouija boards and the posts near the end talked about spirits who had commited suicide or died unexpectedly being stuck between this life and the afterlife. I always assumed (or perhaps liked to think) that these people were helped and counselled on the 'other side' and given extra support. Perhaps being met by loving spirits or their guides when they died. I was just wondering what other peoples' opinions are? I'm afraid that I don't know anything about this subject at all but am interested to hear from other people,

Many thanks

[Mato Kinze]

That's a tough question. It's like asking, "What happens to people when they get on a subway train?"

Any number of things can happen depending on what the individual's purpose or Intent was in getting on the train in the first place.

The thing about people who commit suicide is that the usually do it from a place of emotional desparation, grief, anger, loss, or other similar energetic state.

This low-energy state continues after the spirit separates from the body and makes it more difficult for that spirit to recognize its new relationship to The Universe and continue into the next experience. Until they can resolve the issues which led them to end their lives, they can not make the transition. They are like a record with a scratch: they just keep focusing on the problems and can never seem to let go of the pain or negativity that brought them to that state.

It has been my experience that there are a number of "helpers" (Guides, Allies, Ancestors, Angels...call them what you will) who help these spirits regain their perspective. Certain individuals who are still in this experience may also interact with these spirits to assist them. The living who act in this capacity are known as "Psychopomps" and they work with spirits in order to help them continue their journey.

I have done this 32 times. Over 1/2 (17 to be precise) of the spirits I have worked with were suicides. Of those 17, I was able to help none to continue on directly. It is my hope that the work I did with them made it possible for them to be helped further by others.

[mikej]

michael newton's books "journey of souls" and "destiny of souls" are very good at explaining what happens in the spirit world. suicide is one of the many topics he discusses in them.

[Queen of Wands]

Originally Posted by mikej

michael newton's books "journey of souls" and "destiny of souls" are very good at explaining what happens in the spirit world. suicide is one of the many topics he discusses in them.

I was going to suggest the same thing! Those books are awesome. I learn so much.

[Reverend Keith]

I strongly believe that ultimately, we all find our way back home.

But of course there can be a few detours.

Objectively, suicide is usually a negative act, leaving sorrow and unresolved feelings with those living.

But it seems to me that most of the people who commit suicide are quite clearly in the grip of circumstances and mental states that drastically reduce their ability to make free and reasonable choices. So I would expect some kind of healing experience to be appropriate.

[Captainkirk1987]

I want to share something personal to help give a little insight on this subject. Around April or May I started abusing substances because I was depressed, I was hurting since my mom past away. I was having dreams of her I was missing her daily. I started using dissociatives because I heard of the capabilities that they had to induce NDEs and OOBEs (Near Death Experiences And Out Of Body Experiences). I got even more depressed because I thought that no one was there, that no one was listening, I was missing my mom more and more, I saw everyone moving on around me and I was still stuck in this loop. So one day I loaded my body with grapefruit juice while saying tonights the night that I do it. I was intensionally planning on risking my own life to learn the truth, as depressed as I would I was sure god would understand but I was afraid of judgement to.

I took enough of a certain dissociative to put me into an anesthetic state, the grapefruit juice potentiated this substance and made the situation worse, I ended up blacking out, next thing I know I'm outside my body, everything was a brilliant white and I could see myself clearly. I heard someone say "Do you know whats happened?" and as the scene was unfolding everything was still white but blurry aswell... I felt myself descening back into my body and as I was descending I heard someone say "Lets put him back in his body, he doesn't want to be dead yet." After that I woke up breathing really fast. The point of the story is, I was terribly afraid of death at the time, I didn't want to die and I still don't, I was afraid of god not being there, not being able to see my mother again. I know this for one thing, I will see my mom again, I know there is something there. The static, the white light, the beautiful CEVs. I would not trade any of this because its opened my eyes even more. Death is the whole reason I got into meditation, death is the whole reason I started this whole ordeal. God does not judge for judgement wouldn't be fair, but god also wants people to learn from there mistakes, god wants people to love as he loves, eveyrone always has a second chance, everyone always has the opportunity to be reborn, doesn't that seem fair? Hell doesn't exist as it was made up by the church to scare members and keep them in line. Learn from your mistakes, you kill yourself the only ones your hurting are your family and your friends.

[Gelfling]

Originally Posted by Mato Kinze

It has been my experience that there are a number of "helpers" (Guides, Allies, Ancestors, Angels...call them what you will) who help these spirits regain their perspective. Certain individuals who are still in this experience may also interact with these spirits to assist them. The living who act in this capacity are known as "Psychopomps" and they work with spirits in order to help them continue their journey.

This is interesting MK, I have never heard the term psychopomps before.

Midnite showers I haven't looked at those articles yet but will get to it soon. Thanks everyone. One of the reasons I ask this question is because I work with people with mental health difficulties and it it has happened on a few occasions that some have spoken to me about wanting to commit suicide. Some are in quite dark places and I wonder if they will find peace when they pass on - whether it happens naturally or they take their own life. I mean what if they never find peace within themselves here? Even if they live to a ripe old age and die in their sleep for example? And what about people who despite coming to terms with things that have happened to them still have a deep sadness in their eyes, will they get the answers they want when they pass or will it not matter to them then? Will they get the love they deserved to have here?

Sorry all, I don't expect anyone to have a definitive answer for me I am just bouncing off people and enjoying the chance to hear opinions

[seeds]

Originally Posted by Gelfling

One of the reasons I ask this question is because I work with people with mental health difficulties and it it has happened on a few occasions that some have spoken to me about wanting to commit suicide. Some are in quite dark places and I wonder if they will find peace when they pass on - whether it happens naturally or they take their own life. I mean what if they never find peace within themselves here? Even if they live to a ripe old age and die in their sleep for example? And what about people who despite coming to terms with things that have happened to them still have a deep sadness in their eyes, will they get the answers they want when they pass or will it not matter to them then? Will they get the love they deserved to have here?

Sorry all, I don't expect anyone to have a definitive answer for me I am just bouncing off people and enjoying the chance to hear opinions

Hi Gelfling,

I truly believe that they will awaken into their ultimate form and be welcomed into the open and loving arms of their infinite and eternal spirit family – no ifs, ands, buts, or judgment.

Anything other than that is “old paradigm” thinking.


seeds

____________

[taylor]

Originally Posted by seeds

Hi Gelfling,

I truly believe that they will awaken into their ultimate form and be welcomed into the open and loving arms of their infinite and eternal spirit family – no ifs, ands, buts, or judgment.

Anything other than that is “old paradigm” thinking.

If only.

I wouldn't call Buddha, Jesus, Krishna, and astral travelers old paradigm.

I'm sure it's like any other action and depends a lot of motivation and that person's vibration. One example I can think of is the suicide by fasting that Jain monks can perform when they can no longer physically keep their vows. A rigid type of thinking perhaps, but I can't really fault it given that these vows are sacred to them.

There's another example of Buddha in a past life recalled killing himself in order to stop another being from inheriting bad karma. And this was an example of a noble action.

But if your vibration is low in this world, when you kill yourself I would doubt it gets higher. You're probably initially in a pretty bad spot. The last thing you want to do when you're full of fear or grief is leave your body because the environment you attract will be horrid.

Just my 2 cents from reading astral projection books among others.

[seeds]

Originally Posted by taylor

If only.

I wouldn't call Buddha, Jesus, Krishna, and astral travelers old paradigm.

taylor,

I have absolutely no problem whatsoever calling Buddha, Jesus, and Krishna, old paradigmers .

Indeed, they are literal "poster children" for the old paradigm.


seeds

___________

[MiBeloved]

One thing which happens for sure is that the person does not really take his or her own life. That act only deprives the person of their social influence in this physical plane of existence. Whatever else that person was, continues. All psychological energy of the person is retained in tact.

[Midniteshowers]

My friend recently killed herself, and I wonder just that. Here is what Erin Plavina has to say about it: How do you know if a spirit is at rest? And: The Life Review

[theuprising]

Originally Posted by MiBeloved

One thing which happens for sure is that the person does not really take his or her own life. That act only deprives the person of their social influence in this physical plane of existence. Whatever else that person was, continues. All psychological energy of the person is retained in tact.

how is this possible, if we lack the physical parts of us that contribute to our mind? Our mind, if it is nonmaterial, isn't completely nonmaterial, as it is completely reliant on the brain, and putting stimulants and what not in your brain directly affects the mind.

Maybe there's just consciousness after the mind is gone. It would just be looking, though there is nothing to look at and there is nothing you telling you so since your mind is gone... so it would be kind of like sleeping except with no dreaming. Annihilation basically, returning to the void.

[MiBeloved]

Originally Posted by theuprising

how is this possible, if we lack the physical parts of us that contribute to our mind? Our mind, if it is nonmaterial, isn't completely nonmaterial, as it is completely reliant on the brain, and putting stimulants and what not in your brain directly affects the mind.

Maybe there's just consciousness after the mind is gone. It would just be looking, though there is nothing to look at and there is nothing you telling you so since your mind is gone... so it would be kind of like sleeping except with no dreaming. Annihilation basically, returning to the void.

It is possible because the transmission of a car can be operated if it is taken out of the car and provided with another motion-source (engine). The psychology appears to be the same as the biology when the two are operating in a living body, but the psychology can exist without that body. Look at computers, they have a certain artificial intelligence in them and due to that we are taking help from them. But if all the computers in all the world shut down suddenly how would it be possible for us to continue existing sensibly. We would still go on but without the technology.
The person will still continue after the death of the body, though he or she would be deprived of the advantages which the body afforded.

[Anagogy]

Originally Posted by Gelfling

Hello all,

I was just reading the thread about ouija boards and the posts near the end talked about spirits who had commited suicide or died unexpectedly being stuck between this life and the afterlife. I always assumed (or perhaps liked to think) that these people were helped and counselled on the 'other side' and given extra support. Perhaps being met by loving spirits or their guides when they died. I was just wondering what other peoples' opinions are? I'm afraid that I don't know anything about this subject at all but am interested to hear from other people,

Many thanks

In most cases, they are still the same person, just minus the vehicle they were traveling about in (that is to say, the physical body). However, when most people die, they tend to slough off the lower vibrating material. Think of it like non-physical dirt. Thus, they release all negativity and reemerge into pure positive energy. They feel really good, in other-words, because there is no longer anything separating them from their desires.

Occasionally, an individual is so traumatized by "unfinished business" that they willfully resist the natural impetus to reemerge back into pure positive energy. These individuals become what we would call "ghosts", though not always in the sense we would normally think of them. They aren't always "haunting" a physical location (though some do), but rather, oftentimes it is a non-physical space that they've created for themselves to reside in, till they get out of the vibrational funk they are in, and call or ask for help. Help is not forced on these souls. They have to ask for it. But when they do, there is plenty available.

I mean, consider the psychological and therapeutic knowledge we have in this world. Now, imagine a realm where access to all knowledge is available for therapeutic benefit. We can't even begin to imagine how advanced spirit-world psychology is. They have it down to an art-form, to be sure.

While there is no such thing as objectively "wrong" or "sinful" from the perspective of the spirit world, there are behaviors that are somewhat frowned upon because they involve the spirit underestimating their potential and capacity for meaningful change. Suicide, or the premature casting off of the physical shell, is one of those behaviors that is frowned upon. There is no punishment for it, but it is considered an extremely unbalanced action as it often represents a desire, on the part of the suicide, to destroy the Self.

The Self is considered to be sacred from the spiritual perspective. Self hatred, and the desire to destroy the Self is so completely in congruent with the way the Higher Self sees things that it is the most separating behavior that can be offered from the physical perspective. It throws the soul energy into disarray, in other-words, at least temporarily.

If the suicide was just to escape pain, it is not so energy disturbing, and is not regarded with as much disappointment.

[NickTunes]

my little sister commit suicide last december, i found her hanging in her closet,, i still have trouble moving on from this experience although over the past year i have grown more than i could ever have imagined,,, yet i still dont have any closure to know if she's okay,,, mike newton's books have and eckhart tolle's teachings have helped me to understand different perspectives on life, birth, and death,,, my way of seeing was completely changed after this experience...

[taylor]

I'm sorry to hear that Nick. I know that many people let something like that stop them in their tracks for a long time, especially the person who found the loved one. I can't even imagine. But I'm really glad to hear you're growing and moving forward.

[dream]

Thank you midnight showers that was a great article.

[dream]

NickTunes, I agree with Taylor. What amazing strength you have. If this brings you any peace, please know the exception to any death, is when you are young. God/Jesus say in the scriptures all children and youth go to heaven no matter what. They have a special pass straight to God when they die by others or themselves. I think she would want you to live on there is so much you can do.

[rhoeda]

I would think that when someone takes his/her own life , that the painful experiences and circumstances they suffered would be gone, that the mind and soul would be in a higher place, and that they would have compassion and understanding for the lessons that their past life has taught, and then continue to move on to their own journey towards enlightenment.I would think that they would also want those that had bonded with them in life to let them go and live their lives the best they can.

[danthony]

I've always wondered this myself, it seems like a type of purgatory between worlds where they step between two dimensions.

Originally Posted by Gelfling

Hello all,

I was just reading the thread about ouija boards and the posts near the end talked about spirits who had commited suicide or died unexpectedly being stuck between this life and the afterlife. I always assumed (or perhaps liked to think) that these people were helped and counselled on the 'other side' and given extra support. Perhaps being met by loving spirits or their guides when they died. I was just wondering what other peoples' opinions are? I'm afraid that I don't know anything about this subject at all but am interested to hear from other people,

Many thanks

[ellesbelle]

I don't post very often as i am still very much learning about these things but I feel I may have something to contribute here.

This is my experience of suicide.
I first thought of suicide at a very young age, probably seriously about 14-15 years old.
I suffered with depression for many years and had very low points in my life where suicide was often on my mind but here I am still living my life and grateful for everyday.

I have experienced a few of my past lives and in one I was a young girl with the same parents I have in this life, I have shared many lives with my parents as we must have many lessons to learn from each other and much Karma to clear. My father abandoned us in that life and I never got over it so I commited suicide. I have pretty much always had a strong fear of abandonment and my Father in this life has a very troubled mind and we have not had contact for many years. I have forgiven him in this life and for past lives and forgiven myself too.

I am trying to put this together in my own mind still so forgive me if it doesn't make complete sense.
As souls we all (or most) have karma to clear and lessons that need to be learnt in order to reach enlightenment. When we chose suicide I wonder if its cause we can no longer learn in that physical body and need to go else where, born into another part of our soul family that may help us with other lessons. It makes me wonder if our higher selves, or subconcious mind knows our contract and knows when its time for us to move on, maybe we have agreed on a higher plane that our loved ones we leave behind have lessons to learn about grief, to make them stronger and clear Karma.
I would like to believe that those that feel desparate enough to take thier own life are not eternally damned but move on to another time and place to learn their lessons and clear thier Karma.

I really do hope that this makes sense as its the very first time I have attempted to write down my thoughts on this.

Many blessings
Elle

[NexusOfCompletion]

They chose death over life and severed their connection to the organic universe. Pain and anguish outweighed any possible chance of relief in their mind. But this is where the fallacy is, death doesn't relieve pain, it only removes yourself. There is no relief in death, only death.

What kind of answer are you looking for?

[Gelfling]

Thanks ellesbelle for sharing that.

It's a tough subject to discuss in many respects. I guess that may be because suicide is not something that the higher self would have chosen before incarnation so a life has been 'cut short'? ( I am purely speculating ) Thanks everyone for sharing your thoughts.

@nexus - I don't believe anyone is looking for a particular answer; just discussing a subject on a forum

[NexusOfCompletion]

Originally Posted by Gelfling

@nexus - I don't believe anyone is looking for a particular answer; just discussing a subject on a forum

Yes, I realize this. But when it comes to questions and answers, and the questioner and the answerer, it makes the world of a difference.

The more honest with yourself you are when asking a question, the more honest an answer you will receive.

If only people on this forum realized the gross misunderstanding they have of enlightenment, karma, and soul. Understanding them as such, Concepts, only furthers your distance from enlightenment. Enlightenment is never attainable because it is not possessed, more importantly there is NOTHING that can possess it in the first place. The harder you try to understand transcending duality, the harder it tightens its chains.

People cherry-pick buddhist/zen/taoist terms and act like they understand them, when in fact further add to the confusion. Hence why zen masters explicitly discouraged discoursing of such topics and preferred a smack on the head to awaken someone out of their CONDITIONED way of THINKING (thinking itself is a conditioning, not existing in reality as in itself).

Talking of higher planes and higher beings is utter nonsense. The Buddha explicitly denied all dogmas and idols.

It is about understanding/intuiting the true nature of reality, not developing concepts or following an already beaten path!

[ellesbelle]

[QUOTE=NexusOfCompletion;726964]
Hence why zen masters explicitly discouraged discoursing of such topics and preferred a smack on the head to awaken someone out of their CONDITIONED way of THINKING (thinking itself is a conditioning, not existing in reality as in itself).
I thought the above was good and a little funny, it bought about an image hehe, although this is not your opinion is it your belief?

Talking of higher planes and higher beings is utter nonsense.
I respect your opinion

Cogito ergo sum

Elle