Are you ABLE to stop thinking?

[Ralph]

Lot's of you are already familiar with Eckhart Tolle's work. Those that do not, please read this paragraph of this post. Tolle says (and so do I) that the enlightenment lies within awareness of the present moment. This still awareness is deprived of any kind of mental activity. Disidentification with mind, mental story of me, past and future leads to joy of spiritual awakening.

I've recently had a nice long conversation with a dear friend of mine about spiritual awakening. What got me really interested is that she either pretended or wasn't able to stop thinking. Of course she believed that it was not possible, but it shouldn't disable her from succeeding at nevertheless committed attempts.

I'm wondering how many people can i find that can't stop thinking by trying to stop or by using the techniques I'll describe below. If you know any more very effective techniques for stopping the stream of thought and becoming fully aware of the present moment, please share them.


Ask yourself "what is my next thought going to be?". That's a technique suggested by Eckhart Tolle. It works great for me, I have to wait for at least 5 seconds for the next thought. My friend though claimed that the thought came immediately and there was no gap of presence involved.

Feel the energy of your body. Close your eyes, hold up your hands and ask yourself "how do I know that my hands exist?" You will feel a subtle feeling of your inner body/soul/energy field or whatever that is. Focus on that feeling without analyzing it and your thinking processes will vanish.

Spend time near nature. The plants and animal are always focused on the present moment. Spend time near them, be with them without analyzing and mentally labelling them.


Please share your thoughts

Ralph

[ilrein]

The basic concept of "not thinking" is flawed in its thinking. You cannot meditate without a goal. Because even meditating without a goal is a goal.

If you decide to NOT think, then your thinking of NOT thinking. Rather, what Tolle really meant, was a way to turn of NEGATIVE thinking patterns (by being the the Here and Now). If you second guess yourself constantly, then you NOT thinking like that is probably a good thing.

If you condition yourself to framing perception and thinking as positive, then what good does not thinking do?

[Ontowhere]

I think what he means is not to try and stop thinking, but to be aware of the present moment. Everything that happens in the present moment outside and inside of you. The suroundings, the mind and your emotions. When you are aware as the space or entity behind all of these, you don't identify with it anymore. You become the observer not the thinker.
The mind then will quiet itself down, for it has no more power over you.

[Ralph]

Originally Posted by ilrein

The basic concept of "not thinking" is flawed in its thinking. You cannot meditate without a goal. Because even meditating without a goal is a goal.

If you decide to NOT think, then your thinking of NOT thinking. Rather, what Tolle really meant, was a way to turn of NEGATIVE thinking patterns (by being the the Here and Now). If you second guess yourself constantly, then you NOT thinking like that is probably a good thing.

If you condition yourself to framing perception and thinking as positive, then what good does not thinking do?

If I'm not thinking, it's not like I'm thinking of not thinking. I'm just being. I'm perceiving the present moment with the awareness deeper than thoughts

[ilrein]

If I'm not thinking, it's not like I'm thinking of not thinking. I'm just being. I'm perceiving the present moment with the awareness deeper than thoughts

Just to clarify then, here's another lens to view this from:

The meditation analogy shows that it's impossible to not focus on a goal. When you are "being", and negative thinking patterns are off, you still HAVE to focus on SOMETHING. Rather then focusing on thoughts then, you may be focusing on a certain sight, sound or feeling, or any combination of the three. Most people in the process of meditation and/or hypnosis tend to focus on their breathing.

So really you've just changed from focusing on thinking to focusing on something else, such as breathing. I once again hold and state that Tolle's real point to being is to turn off negative thinking.

[Ralph]

Originally Posted by ilrein

So really you've just changed from focusing on thinking to focusing on something else, such as breathing. I once again hold and state that Tolle's real point to being is to turn off negative thinking.

IMO he teaches to stop all the thinking, positive as well. Sounds counter-intuitive but I found it extremely fulfilling. No more happiness on the ego-level, but much more profound happiness gained. Positive thinking is being happy for a reason. No thinking is just being happy.

[Acting Like Godot]

Originally Posted by ilrein

The meditation analogy shows that it's impossible to not focus on a goal. When you are "being", and negative thinking patterns are off, you still HAVE to focus on SOMETHING. Rather then focusing on thoughts then, you may be focusing on a certain sight, sound or feeling, or any combination of the three.

Actually there is objectless shinay. Consciousness observing consciousness itself, rather than any particular object. My preferred form of meditation.

[SuavePlaya]

I like option 2 that you wrote ralph, that's the one I use most of the time. Option two is intense especially when you are in the gym. I can't say i totally stopped thinking, but it doesnt effect me now because it's not happening right now so they just go away quickly when they do come up. I also agree with ralph when he says no thinking just makes you happy for no reason.

[frajilthunder]

I can stop thinking, but it usually takes a mixture of alcohol and one or two illicit substances. :P

[schola]

Originally Posted by Ralph

Feel the energy of your body. Close your eyes, hold up your hands and ask yourself "how do I know that my hands exist?" You will feel a subtle feeling of your inner body/soul/energy field or whatever that is. Focus on that feeling without analyzing it and your thinking processes will vanish.

Aren't mental images in your head still thought? If you close your eyes and dissociate all mental images from the sensations that flow in, is your body still "there"?

[SuavePlaya]

schola you just feel the hands you don't have to picture anything. If you pay attention to your hands you will feel a pulse out of them that's the energy he is talking about.

[schola]

Originally Posted by SuavePlaya

schola you just feel the hands you don't have to picture anything. If you pay attention to your hands you will feel a pulse out of them that's the energy he is talking about.

When I did what I described above, I realized that any senses or perceptions of my body still occur within my mind. The body is no more real than thoughts that occur within the mind.

[Dharma]

Originally Posted by Ralph

This still awareness is deprived of any kind of mental activity. Disidentification with mind, mental story of me, past and future leads to joy of spiritual awakening.

If you don't believe your thoughts, the mental stories slow down. My mental flow rarely stops on it's own. It is good to focus on the now for short periods throughout the day, but not necessary to do it all the time. It will begin to slow down on its own the less you identify with it.

Tolle's experience does not have to be your experience. Don't think "I will never reach enlightenment if I cannot be still all the time". Just take breaks from the mental chatter now and then. Be amused by your thoughts. Don't let thoughts get stuck in you. Just allow them to flow in and let them go.

[SuavePlaya]

Originally Posted by schola

When I did what I described above, I realized that any senses or perceptions of my body still occur within my mind. The body is no more real than thoughts that occur within the mind.

I'am not sure how it works, but it makes me feel better for no reason. Schola all this stuff to me is mind boggling so you asked the wrong person lol.

[Ralph]

Originally Posted by Dharma

If you don't believe your thoughts, the mental stories slow down. My mental flow rarely stops on it's own. It is good to focus on the now for short periods throughout the day, but not necessary to do it all the time. It will begin to slow down on its own the less you identify with it.

Tolle's experience does not have to be your experience. Don't think "I will never reach enlightenment if I cannot be still all the time". Just take breaks from the mental chatter now and then. Be amused by your thoughts. Don't let thoughts get stuck in you. Just allow them to flow in and let them go.

Yet, why allow myself to experience the joy of no thinking just occasionally? Why when I'm aware of how joyful it is?


@schola
Everything happens in your awareness - sense perceptions AND thinking. That's why if you focus on the sense perceptions part of your awareness, thinking subsides

[Eric Roosevelt]

The way to "stop thinking" is usually to become very aware of the thoughts themselves.

[Judge]

It's the words (again) that conceal it.

Thinking is a word to describe the mind doing something. The mind thinks.

You think you have a thought about something inside your head/mind/brain which is inside your body.

All words to allude to you being a human being having a conscious experience when in fact it's the other way around.

Consciousness (formlessness) having a formed content experience.

Thinking is for the mind. Tolle says less or no thoughts is ideal and required to access the now. But I think he's really saying is that thoughts are also content and form.

Identifying with al the content and form (thoughts are content) is the way to be lost in the world. All creation from that will always be lacking, even if you get everything you want.

Some people get it all and sare still not happy, because they haven't found what they're truly looking for.

Thoughts are tools, like emotion and ego. Consciousness (you) uses them for specific reasons. You pick them up and put them down. Observing isn't thinking, look at something, just look at it, then form an opinion.

That is thinking.

You can observe reality without thinking, because thinking is the labeling part.

When you simply observe, soon enough you can see that everything is the same, made of the same stuff. Like a blank canvas and all the color and shape is added.

You are the blank canvas

Judge

[Dharma]

Originally Posted by Ralph

Yet, why allow myself to experience the joy of no thinking just occasionally? Why when I'm aware of how joyful it is?

I guess I'm cautioning against making up strict rules.
Ex. "If I am to be enlightened, it has to look like this and my mind has to be this way..."

That's a bunch of baloney. Just because it works one way for someone like Tolle, it doesn't have to look that way for me. That's all I'm saying.

[schola]

Some sages, like Ramana Maharshi, said that it isn't stopping thought that is important, but figuring out who is observing the thoughts.

"You" say "you" are stopping thought in the mind. My question is, who is "you?"

[Judge]

Originally Posted by Dharma

That's a bunch of baloney. Just because it works one way for someone like Tolle, it doesn't have to look that way for me. That's all I'm saying.

Exactly. How can you trust anyone and what 'they' say?

You can't.

It's a puzzle, you have to figure out for you

I have never found anyone who I totally agree with. When I truly seek, I find pieces, but never the whole thing.

Tolle is great, right until he talks about collective consciousness, then the wheels fall off. Steve is great right up until consciousness is present everywhere. Chopra's great right up unitl he says, we are all cells in the one supreme being.

No one can tell you what is true, they can only ever show you the doorway, you alone have to walk through it. I wouldn't trust much of what anyone says........including me

Judge

[Lauxa]

Hadn't tried #1 before, got a brief break from the "voice"...

When thoughts would start to arise, then I would think again "what's my next thought going to be?" until I figured out that the next thought was going to be "what's my next thought going to be?" and then I got kind of distracted by some circular thinking. But a fun little exercise.