Why be spiritual?

[Brian E]

Why should one attempt to live a more spiritual life(not necessarily religious)? Why should I go out of my way to seek "enlightenment"/ be "in the now"/ "awakened"/ whatever you call it?

I personally enjoy reading about, meditation, buddhism, Eckhart Tolle, I Am That, Esther Hicks, etc. But what would I say to an atheist if he were to ask, "why are you spiritual, you can't prove God exists?"

Is it just that we naturally desire knowledge?

[Jarrod]

First up, reading is different to practice. Not the point of the thread but I just wanted to get that out there.

Personally I delve into 'spiritual' practices because I have seen them help make me a better person, both in ability to interact with people and just being way happier.

That is what I would say to the atheist.

I don't really want to 'prove' anything to anyone, I just want to see how far these 'spiritual' practices can improve my life.

I think atleast for myself, there was a question of 'Is this all there is to life?, doesn't make sense, everything seems pointless in the end' so I wanted to search for answers.

[Mewwy]

During my most unhealthy and depressed times I sought a lot of help and counseling - doctors, nutritionist, psychiatrists, counselors, and it didn't help me as much to walk out of diagnosed depression.

Personally I believe human, somehow, possesses something more than the physical body and the mind, because the help I sought only focused on improving these aspects, which weren't the best improvement I could get. Therefore, I also tried to "fix my spirits." Through work I simply became more joyful and energized. That's when spiritually became helpful. Spirituality isn't everything, but it can help anyone.

[Anna Conlan]

I see myself as a spiritual being having a human experience. Spiritual practice is about nurturing my spirit.

[fellowtraveler]

Originally Posted by Brian E

Why should one attempt to live a more spiritual life(not necessarily religious)? Why should I go out of my way to seek "enlightenment"/ be "in the now"/ "awakened"/ whatever you call it?

I personally enjoy reading about, meditation, buddhism, Eckhart Tolle, I Am That, Esther Hicks, etc. But what would I say to an atheist if he were to ask, "why are you spiritual, you can't prove God exists?"

Is it just that we naturally desire knowledge?

Personally I would tell an atheist he's right, there is nothing outside the phyical universe, thank him for setting me straight, and then forget about him. Or maybe tell him to ♥♥♥♥♥ off, depending on how I felt that day. Trying to prove anything is folly.

If such concepts make an improvement in your life, that's reason enough. Bare bones, I figure that I'm going to die either way, so why not use a belief system that gives me comfort? If I'm being a fool and there's only oblivion, I'll never know it. But if I'm right, I'll have led a better life because of the belief system and maybe be a few steps ahead on the path of my spirit.

Just by reading the books, your subconscious is absorbing information, processing it and eventually it will probably float to the surface when you need it. That's how it's working for me. I've been reading and cogitating and just trying to be open to what rings true - and it's working. I haven't even seriously tried meditation yet (and that seems to be the cod liver oil of the spiritual movement...good for what ails you. ) Some character traits that have deviled me for years are healing, sometimes literally overnight. It's the first time I've been amazed at anything in years.

Your mileage will vary. I think certain events need to take place to make one ready. You might spend years treading water and then one day you find yourself making headway. In any endeavor, you just don't give up.

And yes, most of us simply desire knowledge and that can be enough of a reason itself, but I think there's always a reason why we choose our topics of study.

[jfrancis]

Originally Posted by Brian E

Why should one attempt to live a more spiritual life(not necessarily religious)? Why should I go out of my way to seek "enlightenment"/ be "in the now"/ "awakened"/ whatever you call it?

I personally enjoy reading about, meditation, buddhism, Eckhart Tolle, I Am That, Esther Hicks, etc. But what would I say to an atheist if he were to ask, "why are you spiritual, you can't prove God exists?"

Is it just that we naturally desire knowledge?

I think there is a reason why most cultures have some sort of spiritual practice. I think it is part of our human nature to be "spiritual." Just like a Labrador Retreiver needs to swim and fetch sticks to really be her true Lab self- I think spiritual practice (prayer, meditation, etc.) gets us in touch with our higher Consciousness (soul, enlightenment, etc.) That's where I am now. I don't know where a diving "being" belongs in all of this. All I can do is start where I am. Hope this helps.

[Ecce Homo]

Originally Posted by Brian E

But what would I say to an atheist if he were to ask, "why are you spiritual, you can't prove God exists?"

If she were asking me this question, I'd ask her why she was asking me. Her question would be more about her and less about me. (Unless you bring the LOA, but that's another story...)

Why be spiritual? Well, I say why not be?

[Angela]

It's hard for me to imagine an atheist asking anyone, "Why are you spiritual?"

She might ask you, "Why do you believe there is a god?" in which case you might choose to either take the question at face value and answer sincerely or (perhaps sensing hostility) refrain from answering and pass the spinach dip.

But "why are you spiritual?" is not a question that makes much sense to an atheist. He would be more likely to ask you, "what does it mean to you to be spiritual?" And that is a great question!

As to the question:

Why should one attempt to live a more spiritual life(not necessarily religious)? Why should I go out of my way to seek "enlightenment"/ be "in the now"/ "awakened"/ whatever you call it?

...I don't think you *should.*

If certain practices work well for you, though, take them up, and don't worry about what you *should* do.

[Jamie]

Originally Posted by Brian E

Why should one attempt to live a more spiritual life(not necessarily religious)? Why should I go out of my way to seek "enlightenment"/ be "in the now"/ "awakened"/ whatever you call it?

I personally enjoy reading about, meditation, buddhism, Eckhart Tolle, I Am That, Esther Hicks, etc. But what would I say to an atheist if he were to ask, "why are you spiritual, you can't prove God exists?"

Is it just that we naturally desire knowledge?

My first response to an 'Athiest' telling me I can't prove god bla bla bla ... is "Please define God for me".

I don't think being spiritual, having an interest in spiritual matters, your own self awareness etc, has anything to do with this notion of 'God'.

In-fact, I think the word can be mis-leading and un-helpful. I also think, on the whole, religions inhibit natural spiritual development, because they're so hung-up on their own dogma etc.

[jfrancis]

Originally Posted by Mewwy

During my most unhealthy and depressed times I sought a lot of help and counseling - doctors, nutritionist, psychiatrists, counselors, and it didn't help me as much to walk out of diagnosed depression.

Personally I believe human, somehow, possesses something more than the physical body and the mind, because the help I sought only focused on improving these aspects, which weren't the best improvement I could get. Therefore, I also tried to "fix my spirits." Through work I simply became more joyful and energized. That's when spiritually became helpful. Spirituality isn't everything, but it can help anyone.

I knew my current therapist was going to work out when one of the first things she said to me was, "it sounds like you have lived soul-less-ly for some time..." I definitely think that spirituality is a piece of the puzzle. Your story gives me a lot of encouragement.

[amixa]

aha there are some great points here.
most atheists i know don't know the difference between the 'idea' of god and spirituality.
it all depends on what their definition of god is first off. and yours.
secondly they don't tend to understand spirituality necessarily. an atheist *can* be spiritual but chances are they don't refer to it as being spiritual because usually they think that means they believe in god and that god is usually a man looking down on everyone judging and punishing the wicked hearted.
also your definition of being spiritual can vary from other individuals so you can never assume they know what your definition is.

i know what you mean though. its very tough to deal with people who are atheists who demand you to prove god exists in order to prove something.
science tends to be the study of the absolute physical world. if the 'spiritual realm' is not of this world but can enter in it and use it at their will, then how is it possible to proove something that is not tangible? they are not made of physical matter....

[Michael Chui]

I suggest starting with this question:

Why do you need to defend the path you chose?

[fellowtraveler]

Originally Posted by jfrancis

I knew my current therapist was going to work out when one of the first things she said to me was, "it sounds like you have lived soul-less-ly for some time..." I definitely think that spirituality is a piece of the puzzle

It's probably the whole puzzle, actually.

Your current therapist shows great promise. It's too bad it takes so much trying to find the right person to talk to, but it sounds as though you've hit a good one.

The one I see (well he's my son's really but I need to talk to him occasionally about his condition - I have recently been paying him for appointments just so we can discuss sprituality together) is a good one too. I had known him years ago and went to him when my lad had his problem. The first time we met this trip around, he showed me photos of vortices accidentally taken by one of his patients. He then said I should look into the zero point field. He knew exacly what it would take to get me back on my path, with no pushing. He's been writing a book about the use of spirituality in psychotherapy.

Almost a year later and I'm off to the spiritual races in a big way, and my boy is getting there as well.

I wish for you the success I'm having - I'm sure your therapist will prove to be a healer and an earth angel for you. Peace.

[Ecce Homo]

Originally Posted by Michael Chui

I suggest starting with this question:

Why do you need to defend the path you chose?

Good question.

[Jamie]

Originally Posted by amixa

aha there are some great points here.
most atheists i know don't know the difference between the 'idea' of god and spirituality.
it all depends on what their definition of god is first off. and yours.
secondly they don't tend to understand spirituality necessarily. an atheist *can* be spiritual but chances are they don't refer to it as being spiritual because usually they think that means they believe in god and that god is usually a man looking down on everyone judging and punishing the wicked hearted.
also your definition of being spiritual can vary from other individuals so you can never assume they know what your definition is.

i know what you mean though. its very tough to deal with people who are atheists who demand you to prove god exists in order to prove something.
science tends to be the study of the absolute physical world. if the 'spiritual realm' is not of this world but can enter in it and use it at their will, then how is it possible to proove something that is not tangible? they are not made of physical matter....

Sure ... it's a lot to do with symantics ... and people getting confused or stuck on the level of words.

I just like to say ... spirituality ... it's nothing that is not you.

[Chris Cade]

Originally Posted by Brian E

Why should one attempt to live a more spiritual life(not necessarily religious)? Why should I go out of my way to seek "enlightenment"/ be "in the now"/ "awakened"/ whatever you call it?

I personally enjoy reading about, meditation, buddhism, Eckhart Tolle, I Am That, Esther Hicks, etc. But what would I say to an atheist if he were to ask, "why are you spiritual, you can't prove God exists?"

Is it just that we naturally desire knowledge?

Before I was spiritually inclined, my wife and I had an argument (because she was inclined). The result was that we agreed I would at least explore spirituality some.

I found a book called "Think Logically, Live Intuitively" which was very interesting to me... and ended up catapulting me into a spiritual life that was, and still is, unexpected.

If an atheist were to ask, "Why are you spiritual?" I would say simply, "Because I feel more at peace." "But you can't prove God exists?" "Whether God exists or not does not have any affect on whether or not I feel more at peace in the world because of my choice to have a spiritual life. If you believe God does not exist, and as a result you feel more genuinely at peace... then that's just as spiritual as somebody who has 'Found God.'"

[metamorph]

Did you ever try to convince a (born) blind person, there are colours?


I agree with others you should not try to convince someone who has no receptors for this. It is really a waste of time, unless you really merely see it as intellectual catching-and-pitching.

For me life got really juicy once I stopped limiting my scope to the rational mind and what is proven as facts. The bottom line is, we know nothing yet (If we had God's power and all the rational human knowledge of the world combined, we would not be able to create anything remotely similar to the the world we live in). So why reject something that we cannot prove yet? Only 100-200 years ago people rejected the existence of bacteria or virusses.... What will we think about the 21 century in 1000 years?

Spirituality really opens you to a new world. It does not have to involve God, but it involes a world beyond the one that you can perceive with your standard senses.

[Chris Cade]

Originally Posted by metamorph

Did you ever try to convince a (born) blind person, there are colours?


I agree with others you should not try to convince someone who has no receptors for this. It is really a waste of time, unless you really merely see it as intellectual catching-and-pitching.

For me life got really juicy once I stopped limiting my scope to the rational mind and what is proven as facts. The bottom line is, we know nothing yet (If we had God's power and all the rational human knowledge of the world combined, we would not be able to create anything remotely similar to the the world we live in). So why reject something that we cannot prove yet? Only 100-200 years ago people rejected the existence of bacteria or virusses.... What will we think about the 21 century in 1000 years?

Spirituality really opens you to a new world. It does not have to involve God, but it involes a world beyond the one that you can perceive with your standard senses.

I agree entirely. When people get into discussions with me about spirituality, I make it clear that I will answer any questions they have and share my experiences... and that's it. My intent is not to prove anything nor defend anything... only to share.

It's made conversations a lot easier and less confrontational... people don't feel their ideas/beliefs are being threatened since they know I'm not trying to "convert" them or "convince" them of my way of thinking... just "This works for me. Here's why. It's up to you to find what works for you."

[Dan.Linehan]

My most positive experiences have came from consciously attempting to be less spiritual. From really being right here, right now.

There is an amazing about of wondrous things and beautiful people on this planet. But to really appreciate them you have to really, truly be present.

[Delnov]

The reason that we have several issues raised speaks volumes about the human being. We are constantly searching (when we feel unfulfilled) because our nature is one of order and not confusion.

For this reason, I would rather choose spirituality. I find it consistent and purposeful - it builds character - basically giving one a solid personal constitution if you will. In life, I would imagine it better to appreciate that am doing something because it is the right thing to do, not so much because it is what I prefer. I find that it works more like a law that we may not be happy with, but one that brings order. For example, in my country we drive on the left side of the road, you can imagine what would happen if a number of us decided to use the other side!

Atheists believe is something. That is all that matters.

Religious rituals and activities that help to point one towards spirituality are good, e.g. a prayer meeting. But people tend to work towards busy-ness in this area and come up with activities that are not absolutely useful spiritually. If one gets caught up in the empty activities before they really understand, then it becomes dangerous to them.

I quite agree with being conscious and staying in the Now. It removes the many unnecessary things that man gets trapped in and improves sharpness of focus. I should say that time was made for man - not man for time. We should never get lost in time and space. That is spirituality. I think that this is the reason God is quoted in the bible as saying I AM.

The most important thing is to have the knowledge. Once I know then I can experiment with what is thrown at me and if it does not work, then I simply throw it out and try something else. I feel that the biggest problem with us is that we are not willing to work things out - we would prefer 'microwaved' solutions for our deepest difficulties.

________________________
Delnov
In spirituality, it is the human soul that matters most - The Soul is under serious attack

[Michael Chui]

Originally Posted by Delnov

The reason that we have several issues raised speaks volumes about the human being. We are constantly searching (when we feel unfulfilled) because our nature is one of order and not confusion.

Ahem.

HAIL ERIS.

In the year 1166 B.C., a malcontented hunchbrain by the name of Greyface, got it into his head that the universe was as humorless as he, and he began to teach that play was sinful because it contradicted the ways of Serious Order. "Look at all that order about you," he said. And from that, he deluded honest men to believe that reality was a straightjacket affair and not the happy romance as men had known it.

It is not presently understood why men were so gullible at that particular time, for absolutely no one thought to observe all the DISORDER around them and conclude just the opposite. But anyway, Greyface and his followers took the game of playing at life more seriously than they took life itself and were not unknown even to destroy other living beings whose ways of life differed from their own.

The unfortunate result of this is that mankind has since been suffering from a psychological and spiritual imbalance. Imbalance causes frustration, and frustration causes fear. And fear makes a bad trip. Man has been on a bad trip for a long time now.

Just saying.

[Erock]

Honestly I think you guys are missing the big picture. I don't think we have a choice in the matter. I think once your awareness expands to a certain point and you start to see the ego all around you, you can't help but become spiritual. Like if your awareness gets off of all the materialistic and things society trains you to focus on and starts to focus on itself you can't help but start to see through things.

Erock

[Erock]

Originally Posted by Dan.Linehan

My most positive experiences have came from consciously attempting to be less spiritual. From really being right here, right now.

There is an amazing about of wondrous things and beautiful people on this planet. But to really appreciate them you have to really, truly be present.

Haha, that is being spiritual. Truly spiritual that is.

Erock