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| Spirituality, Consciousness, & Awareness Spirituality, beliefs, the nature of reality, consciousness, awareness, metaphysics, truth, philosophy, religion |
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06-06-2008, 06:34 PM
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 Friendly message to the HARDCORE Christians.
Try and See..... ....you are simply Believing in a Belief system....As is hinduism, judaism, zoroastrianism, buddhism, shinto, confucianism, jainism, taoism, muslism, islamicism, animism, secularism, agnosticism, atheist-ism, sikhism, juchesim, bahai'ism, cao dai-ism, tenrikuyoism, rastararianism, newage-ism, wicca-ism, roman catholicism, eastern orthodoxism, protestantism, protestantism, amishism, baptist-ism, lutheranism, presbyterianism, seventh-day adventists-ism, mormonism, pentecostalism, gnosticism.... ..........Well you get the idea. Am I exempt? LOL.... That would be the biggest mistake for me to think that. _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/ <<< Is this a wall or simply characters from a keyboard ? WHICH sect below has the "truth"? WHICH one do YOU belong to and you "know" has the "truth"? * African Methodist Episcopal (1) * African Methodist Episcopal Zion (2) * African Orthodox Church (1) * American Baptist Churches USA (4) * Amish (22) * Anabaptist (4) * Anglican Catholic Church@ * Anglican Church (134) * Antiochian Orthodox@ * Armenian Evangelical Church (1) * Armenian Orthodox@ * Assemblies of God (21) * Associated Gospel Churches of Canada@ * Association of Vineyard Churches (5) * Baptist (148) * Baptist Bible Fellowship (2) * Branch Davidian (3) * Brethren in Christ (1) * Bruderhof Communities (10) * Byzantine Catholic Church@ * Calvary Chapel (3) * Calvinist (5) * Catholic (1619) * Cell Church (14) * Celtic Orthodox@ * Charismatic Episcopal Church (2) * Christadelphian (14) * Christian and Missionary Alliance (4) * Christian Churches of God (1) * Christian Identity (5) * Christian Reformed Church (4) * Christian Science (9) * Church of God (Anderson) (3) * Church of God (Cleveland) (4) * Church of God (Seventh Day) (1) * Church of God in Christ (2) * Church of God of Prophecy (1) * Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (138) * Church of Scotland@ * Church of South India (1) * Church of the Brethren (8) * Church of the Lutheran Brethren of America (2) * Church of the Nazarene (16) * Church of the New Jerusalem (4) * Church of the United Brethren in Christ (2) * Church Universal and Triumphant (3) * Churches of Christ (32) * Churches of God General Conference (5) * Congregational Christian Churches (3) * Coptic Orthodox@ * Cumberland Presbyterian Church (1) * Disciples of Christ (12) * Episcopal Church@ * Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahedo Church (4) * Evangelical Congregational Church (4) * Evangelical Covenant Church (1) * Evangelical Formosan Church (1) * Evangelical Free Church (3) * Evangelical Lutheran Church (31) * Evangelical Methodist Church (1) * Evangelical Presbyterian (1) * Family, The (aka Children of God) (8) * Fellowship of Christian Assemblies (1) * Fellowship of Grace Brethren (3) * Fellowship of Independent Evangelical Churches (2) * Free Church of Scotland (4) * Free Methodist (6) * Free Presbyterian (2) * Free Will Baptist (4) * Gnostic@ * Great Commission Association of Churches (2) * Greek Orthodox@ * Hutterian Brethren (2) * Independent Fundamental Churches of America (1) * Indian Orthodox@ * International Church of the Foursquare Gospel (3) * International Churches of Christ (7) * Jehovah's Witnesses (31) * Living Church of God (7) * Local Church (7) * Lutheran (38) * Lutheran Church - Missouri Synod (17) * Mar Thoma Syrian Church (7) * Mennonite (24) * Messianic Judaism@ * Methodist (16) * Moravian Church (3) * Nation of Yahweh (2) * New Frontiers International (1) * Old Catholic Church@ * Orthodox (93) * Orthodox Church in America@ * Orthodox Presbyterian (2) * Pentecostal (25) * Plymouth Brethren (4) * Presbyterian (71) * Presbyterian Church (USA) (17) * Presbyterian Church in America (10) * Primitive Baptist (3) * Protestant Reformed Church (11) * Reformed (14) * Reformed Baptist (7) * Reformed Church in America (4) * Reformed Church in the United States (3) * Reformed Churches of Australia@ * Reformed Episcopal Church@ * Reformed Presbyterian Church (6) * Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (5) * Revival Centres International (4) * Romanian Orthodox@ * Rosicrucian@ * Russian Orthodox@ * Serbian Orthodox@ * Seventh Day Baptist (4) * Seventh-Day Adventist (49) * Shaker (10) * Society of Friends (39) * Southern Baptist Convention (14) * Spiritist (2) * Syrian Orthodox@ * True and Living Church of Jesus Christ of Saints of the Last Days (4) * Two-by-Twos (3) * Unification Church (11) * Unitarian-Universalism@ * United Church of Canada@ * United Church of Christ (14) * United Church of God (3) * United Free Church of Scotland@ * United Methodist Church (107) * United Reformed Church (1) * Uniting Church in Australia@ * Unity Church (3) * Unity Fellowship Church (2) * Universal Fellowship of Metropolitan Community Churches (2) * Virtual Churches (12) * Waldensian Church (3) * Way International, The (4) * Web Directories (6) * Wesleyan (9) * Wesleyan Methodist@ * Worldwide Church of God (5)      |
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06-06-2008, 10:48 PM
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06-06-2008, 10:52 PM
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* True and Living Church of Jesus Christ of Saints of the Last Days (4) This one has the most truth because it's the only one with the word "true" in its name. 
__________________ Steve Pavlina www.StevePavlina.com (Twitter page, Facebook page) Get my book Personal Development for Smart People I'm a human alarm clock. I awaken people who are sleeping through life. Then I duck.  |
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06-06-2008, 11:10 PM
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__________________ Pax et bonum, Brandon Creator Spiritus Blog and forum discussing living a Christ-centered life |
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06-06-2008, 11:19 PM
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__________________ Pax et bonum, Brandon Creator Spiritus Blog and forum discussing living a Christ-centered life |
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06-07-2008, 01:31 AM
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Do you really have a message to hardcore Christians or do you just want to make fun of them?
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06-07-2008, 05:30 PM
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Well I guess it's my turn to pick... Free Will Baptist (4) A complete oxymoron. How do you have "free will" believing in a belief system? Quote:
And whenever there are misunderstandings, then communications fails completely. And BTW- In the above, I'm sure you will agree, I've just made fun of a Church. |
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06-07-2008, 05:46 PM
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A "christian" church, but a church nevertheless. And this friendly ribbing, is simply pointing out a very strong point: Namely....... take a good hard look at the sheer number of Churches in the list above, and consider that all of them believe they have the "truth" and no one else. So Nightspirit, my point is simply -- Question beliefs. Because beliefs are the traps. |
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06-08-2008, 12:51 AM
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I will take you at your word and accept that you sincerely want to understand the Christian perspective and believe you can help enlighten the hardcore ones. Sorry, I felt a little duped by the title of the thread by the jokes within and LOL's and wanted to be sure of your intent before I responded. Hardcore Christians such as myself feel that the “church” is the entire group of believers in Christ and is comparable to the body of Christ The divisions or sects within that church serve as different parts of that body. It is not necessary or required that any part of that body have the whole and complete truth or serve the same function. Of course one would feel that the sect they are part of is correct and maybe even that the differences might be critical to entering heaven or one wouldn’t be part of it to start with. Most of these separations were formed from a person or group's sincere desire to tweak or fine tune their worship of God to the best of their understanding. Rather than stay with the first group and try to persuade them of what they feel is the best way to honor God, they leave and form a new gathering much in the same way that a new thread is started when the conversation gets off topic or more reverently, the way cells divide to form a baby. As long as they are still worshipping God as revealed through Jesus they are still part of his body. These divisions, I believe, do not dismay God but please Him and some may even be caused by Him because faith grows and differing sects accommodate those who are at various stages of revelation and growth. Because of my beliefs, that the attempt of someone to worship God in sincerity the best they know how at the time by the creation of a new denomination, I consider that process to be reverent and holy and not really something to made light of. By the way, respect for the sincerity of the beliefs of any person should extent to all people of any faith, even if it is felt they have placed their faith in the wrong concept of God. There is a truth about God and He is more than any of us know and we can only offer an explanation of what proved what we believe to us. If someone led you to believe that if you didn’t accept their version of the truth then you would be lost from God, it was probably because they sincerely believe it and don’t want you to be lost and was not to condemn you because they know don’t have that power. It's between you and God whether you accept or reject what anyone says about the ultimate fate of your soul. We don’t have an argument that your having faith in my faith or a belief in a belief system is not the same thing as faith in God. The account of our experiences with God are meant to encourage those who haven’t had or don’t know to seek an experience with God of their own. |
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06-08-2008, 06:33 AM
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I'm sorry, I just realized that I didn’t answer the question of your original post. I find truth in Christ and in the Bible but am not currently a member of any denomination although I most often have attended those with a Pentecostal leaning of which there are several on your list. I most closely associate my beliefs which what they teach which is why I go there to worship. I have studied several of the other belief systems that you listed and have found some truth in most of them but I believe the Christian church is where I most experience the love of God and the more complete truth. Where have you found the truth or are you still seeking it? You seem to be rather certain that the whole truth in not in the Bible as you read it or did something else bring you to that belief? And since you brought it up as moronic I will try to explain the name as I understand it. A Free Will Baptist church was named such to let others know that might come there to worship that they believe that we are all born with a free will of whether to accept or reject Christ as Lord and to distinguish themselves from Primitive Baptists. Primitive Baptists believe that God already knows who will come to Him as He calls them and who will not, that all your life was known to God before you were born. Their church was established as more of just a place to worship God as those pre-known people are drawn in by a Spiritual revelation from God after they have heard Jesus. Most churches believe that on some level, that you can’t really believe or can’t be expected to believe unless you receive that revelation. The sin would be in not being open to a revelation from God because of pride or arrogance or in rejecting Christ once God has made Him known to you. To my earlier point, Free Will Baptist is not a blind belief in an dictated belief system but an honest establishment of a place where people who believe as they do can worship in peace and unity. I don’t believe it is necessary for Christians to sort our way through every organized set of beliefs other than our own to be sure that we have found the truth any more than you, infinitethoughts, need to go to every Christian church on your list to make sure you haven’t missed out on some truth We all, as you know, believe in our own beliefs including you or we would change our beliefs which all of us, including Christians, are free to do. |
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06-08-2008, 02:15 PM
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I don't think I've quite hammered home what they meant, though, so please, jump in and correct me if needs be.
__________________ dishing out tough love. |
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06-08-2008, 04:35 PM
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Taoism very much encourages you to discover the truth of your own nature, and the universal nature, for yourself; it states very clearly, that words, concepts, ideas etc; are not it (check out first few lines in the DDJ). While Taoism is a descriptor to the nature of reality; it makes this clear, and that one should let go of the descriptor. It also describes the interplay and change within the natural world. One analogy I like to use, is that of a finger pointing at the moon. Religions do that; they point at something, but then there is a tendency with people to mistake the finger for the moon; no no no! The fingers' only value is in it's ability to direct people to the moon; to their true, unforced natures, behond all description and words. |
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06-08-2008, 05:25 PM
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What I'm trying to do is get you to the point to see that... could it not be that that statement is based on a belief? Thats all. Quote:
Am I still seeking it? Well I have to admit the minute I say I have the "truth", I am deluding myself. I've fallen in the trap of not continually striving to be aware of any further mental Filters inside myself. Quote:
Thanks for adding that. |
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06-08-2008, 07:47 PM
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06-08-2008, 08:10 PM
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Not every religious person thinks that everyone else is wrong. Today you have a lot of Christian who accept that different people as other ways to reach God and think that it doesn't matter whether you say source, God, god, Allah or a variety of other terms.
__________________ I am always open for feedback on my posts. If your feedback would go offtopic feel free to send me a Personal Message. My posts generally don't contain medical or legal advice, if you have a problem seek the opinion of an expert Talking about this in terms of “bad news” or “bad judgment by business leaders” seems archaic. It’s like describing World War One as “a serious diplomatic concern.” Bruce Sterling about the financial crisis. |
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06-08-2008, 09:30 PM
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Buddhism isn't a belief system: it's a way of life. Buddha (the first one) pressed that we should not just blindly believe everything he said, but use his teachings in a way we see fit so we can find our own truth.  P.S: How could you leave out the coolest religion of them all: Pastafarianism? All hail the Flying Spagettimonster and his Noodly Appendage! Last edited by Ninja; 06-08-2008 at 09:35 PM. |
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06-08-2008, 09:57 PM
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06-08-2008, 11:29 PM
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Why identify yourself with a label if you realize this? Last edited by Liminal Chris; 06-08-2008 at 11:32 PM. |
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06-09-2008, 12:55 AM
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06-09-2008, 12:57 AM
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06-09-2008, 01:25 AM
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Not going to argue communication with you (very much out of the scope), but suffice it to say, I think if people really believed that it was "many paths to the same summit" there would be a whole lot more action within these religions to come together, and there simply hasn't been. |
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06-09-2008, 02:41 AM
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However, some of those churches are insular and feel either that they are the sold repositories of truth, or feel their version is superior (in the sense of being smug about it). As I've said elsewhere, I don't have much use for Christianity's core value proposition anymore but I do think it's important to not set up straw men. The only thing a long list of denominations proves is that Christianity is huge and pervasive and diverse. It is not as fragmented ideologically as you assume it to be. --Bob |
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06-09-2008, 04:59 AM
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06-09-2008, 08:40 AM
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In your attempt to become belief system free, you have been trapped by the belief system that belief systems are traps. But keep trying. |
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06-09-2008, 08:42 AM
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My point would be in mentioning the spiritual revelation would be that Jesus taught that His church would not be built on what man or flesh and blood said about Him but in a spiritual way from God Himself. Because there is a condition that you be open to a revelation or that one must ask and allow to receive it, in respect of the sovereignty over one's own mind, that requirement of openness, in and of itself, does not make the belief system false. It seems to me that the belief system that God should reveal Himself to all people in the same way with or without their permission and willingness or that the condition of a true belief system is that there be no conditions or allowing involved could also be false. |
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06-09-2008, 04:48 PM
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06-09-2008, 06:02 PM
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To the christians answering my points....Respectully....You guys missed the ENTIRE point of my post. Give up religion, it's a trap. Pure and simple. Now whether you see this remains to be seen. |
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06-09-2008, 06:03 PM
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ANY religion.
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