Can ANY christians answers these questions ????

[infinitethoughts]

1. How do you give your soul to something that is Infinite (Definition of god from a book called the bible.)?

2. What are the exact reasons for this eternal banishment to Hell?

[{aspiring_to_clarity}]

Originally Posted by infinitethoughts

1. How do you give your soul to something that is Infinite (Definition of god from a book called the bible.)?

I've seen this question in the other thread and I still don't even understand what you are trying to say.

Originally Posted by infinitethoughts

2. What are the exact reasons for this eternal banishment to Hell?

Separation from God as punishment for sin.

[Akashic_Librarian]

1. The question is a paradox, you see to give your self to something infinite is to also give yourself to something that is nothing, because the two are the same see...

2. Because early christians needed to a way to scare the idiot sheep into doing what they told them, a' wallah HELL FIRE

[infinitethoughts]

Originally Posted by {aspiring_to_clarity}

I've seen this question in the other thread and I still don't even understand what you are trying to say.

Basically that there's a book called the bible. In that book it states that "God", is infinite.
That there is something that is infinite.

What does infinite mean in your definiton?

Originally Posted by {aspiring_to_clarity}

Separation from God as punishment for sin.

And what exactly is this "sin"?

[{aspiring_to_clarity}]

Originally Posted by infinitethoughts

Basically that there's a book called the bible. In that book it states that "God", is infinite.
That there is something that is infinite.

What does infinite mean in your definiton?

Neverending.

Originally Posted by infinitethoughts

And what exactly is this "sin"?

Do you want me to list them all? LOL

[infinitethoughts]

Originally Posted by {aspiring_to_clarity}

Neverending.

Thats the definition for Eternal. I'm asking about infinity.

Originally Posted by {aspiring_to_clarity}

Do you want me to list them all? LOL

That many huh?
How do you get up in the morning?

[{aspiring_to_clarity}]

Originally Posted by infinitethoughts

Thats the definition for Eternal. I'm asking about infinity.

Well, you asked for my definition and that's about as much understanding I have of infinity...that it never ends. Probably misguided grade school knowledge, but it's all I've got .

Originally Posted by infinitethoughts

That many huh?
How do you get up in the morning?

Very carefully. Just kidding. I'm a former "Christian." But, I do still believe the Bible and Jesus have a lot of wisdom. There are some verses that Tolle talks about in The Power of Now. I think that Jesus had a deeper meaning to his teachings than what is generally accepted by "The Church."

[wolfgang]

Originally Posted by infinitethoughts

1. How do you give your soul to something that is Infinite (Definition of god from a book called the bible.)?

2. What are the exact reasons for this eternal banishment to Hell?

I'm not a Christian, per say but like the questions.

1) I give my soul to something that is Infinite by realizing I am Infinite.

2) Banishment to Hell is really our separation from God (sin). Sin is separation from God. Redemption is realizing we are not separate from God.

[wolfgang]

Originally Posted by {aspiring_to_clarity}

I think that Jesus had a deeper meaning to his teachings than what is generally accepted by "The Church."

ditto...

[Liminal Chris]

I think we can only define Infinity interms of the Domains that we know we exist: Time and Space.

I would think the religious person would appeal to the Soul as some sort of proof for a third domain that is beyond our senses, something like a domain of Consciousness in which we are already infinite with God. I remember reading something to that effect when studying Hinduism or Buddhism.

That's not my personal beliefs, I don't believe in dualism.

[MrNotebook]

Originally Posted by {aspiring_to_clarity}

I think that Jesus had a deeper meaning to his teachings than what is generally accepted by "The Church."

Oh yes, very true.

[Christian223]

Originally Posted by infinitethoughts

1. How do you give your soul to something that is Infinite (Definition of god from a book called the bible.)?

2. What are the exact reasons for this eternal banishment to Hell?

1. What makes you think we "give" our souls to "something"?.

2. To understand that you need to understand what God is, our nature, and what hell is, its kind of complex, have you ever tried findind this on the internet? maybe a Christian article on some Christian site?.

[mlc82]

Originally Posted by MrNotebook

...or how about the Holy Bible? Why is it that man is always searching elsewhere for answers concerning God? What are we running from?

4th century Roman political spin.

[Liminal Chris]

Originally Posted by Christian223

1. What makes you think we "give" our souls to "something"?.

2. To understand that you need to understand what God is, our nature, and what hell is, its kind of complex, have you ever tried findind this on the internet? maybe a Christian article on some Christian site?.

1. I think the confusion is generated from the poorly worded, yet common idea of "giving one's Self" to God. The giving of one's Self is quite vague and is open to vast amounts of interpretation. Submission tends to be a fairly common theme in the Bible.


Can you explain number 2 a bit more please?



I think there are two ways to look at Hell, Historically and Metaphysically.

Historically, Hell was used as part of the overarching threat of damnation. Extra incentive to be a good person. If people don't necessarily buy into the "kindness of your own heart" routine of Jesus, then they could be feared into the same actions through the threat of eternal damnation.


Metaphysically, I have problems with the ideas of both Heaven and Hell, I find it overly simplistic. A God that judges people or does anything is Anthropomorphized, and Antropomorphic Gods have severe problems metaphyiscally!

[Who am I]

How do you give your soul to something that is Infinite?

NOTHING beyond yourself can make you fearful or loving, because nothing IS beyond you. Time and eternity are both in your minds, and WILL conflict, until you perceive time SOLELY as a means to REGAIN eternity. You cannot do this, as long as you believe that ANYTHING that happens to you is caused by factors OUTSIDE yourself. You must learn that time is solely at YOUR disposal, and that nothing in the world can take this responsibility FROM you. You can VIOLATE God's laws in your imagination, but you cannot escape from them. They were established for your protection, and are as inviolate as your safety.

God created nothing beside you, and nothing beside you exists, for you are part of Him. What except Him CAN exist? Nothing BEYOND Him can happen, because nothing EXCEPT Him is real. YOUR creations add to Him, as YOU do. But nothing is added that is different, because everything has always BEEN. What can upset you except the ephemeral, and how can the ephemeral be real, if you are God's ONLY creation, and He created you eternal?

Your holy will establishes EVERYTHING that happens to you. Every response you make, to everything you perceive, is up to you, because your will DETERMINES your perception of it. God does not change His Mind about YOU, for He is not uncertain of HIMSELF. And what He knows CAN be known, because He does not know only for Himself. He CREATED you for Himself, but He gave you the power to create for YOUR self, so you would be LIKE Him. That is why your will is holy.

Can anything EXCEED the love of God? Can anything, then, exceed YOUR will? Nothing can reach you from BEYOND it, because being in God, YOU encompass everything. Believe this, and you will realize how much IS up to you. When ANYTHING threatens your peace of mind, ask yourself "Has God changed His Mind about me?" Then ACCEPT His decision, for it is indeed changeless, and refuse to change your mind about YOURSELF. God will never decide AGAINST you, or He would be deciding against Himself.

The reason you do not know YOUR creations is simply that you would decide against them, as long as your minds are split, and to attack what you have created is impossible. But remember that IT IS AS IMPOSSIBLE FOR GOD. The law of Creation is that you love your creations as yourself, BECAUSE THEY ARE PART OF YOU. Everything that was created is therefore PERFECTLY safe, because the laws of God protect it by His love. Any part of your mind that does not know this, has banished itself from knowledge, because it has NOT MET ITS CONDITIONS.

Who could have done this but you? Recognize this gladly, for in this recognition lies the realization that your banishment is not of God, and therefore does not exist. You are at home in God, dreaming of exile, but perfectly capable of awakening to Reality. Is it your will to do so? You know, from your own experience, that what you see in dreams you think is real, as long as you are asleep. But the instant you waken, you KNOW that everything that SEEMED to happen DID NOT HAPPEN AT ALL. You do not think this mysterious, even though ALL the laws of what you awake to WERE violated while you slept.

Is it not possible that you merely shifted from one dream to another without really wakening? Would you bother to reconcile what happened in conflicting DREAMS, or would you dismiss BOTH TOGETHER, if you discovered that REALITY is in accord with neither? You do not remember being awake. When you hear the Holy Spirit, you merely feel BETTER, because loving seems POSSIBLE to you. But you do NOT remember yet that it once was so, and it is in this remembering that you will know it can be so again.

What is possible has not yet been accomplished. But what has once been is so now, if it is eternal. When you remember, you will know what you remember IS eternal, and therefore is NOW. You will remember everything the instant you DESIRE IT WHOLLY, for if to desire wholly is to create, you will have willed away the separation, returning your mind simultaneously to your Creator and your creations. Knowing them, you will have no wish to sleep, but only the will to waken and be glad. Dreams will be impossible, because you will WANT only truth, and being at last your will, it will be yours

[joco]

I don't really get question 1,

As for question 2, you don't get banished to hell. Hell = She'ol = Hades = pit ie. it means a grave. I think fiery hell is a misunderstanding. Fire is a symbol of destruction, not torment. Just by the way the lake of fire is what is called the second death (destruction), as opposed to dead and buried (hell).

[m0vingon]

This all feels like a game of semantics to me. I was raised Catholic, so I have Cristian teachings as a part of my internal scaffolding. I don't consider myself Catholic now because I can't stand up and recite the creed with faith- that's when the priest tells you you're not a Catholic any more Oh, and then there's that whole divorce thing... that's a problem for the church too

Anyway, the way I reconcile my New Age faith and my Old Age (Catholic) teaching is by seeing through the semantics to the true meaning of a lot of this stuff. I really, really have come to believe that all that stuff about "giving your soul" blah, blah, is meant to say that we are to find, connect to, and accept our own divinity and connection to the great power of a unified cosmic consciousness. I also believe that hell and suffering are terms used to describe the state of being that we live in when we do not accept that we are all intrinsically connected and that we as a whole comprise that which religion calls God. If one examines the root of most world religions, these truths exist, they are just presented in semantically different terms. Perhaps the prophets of the time had no better means of wording their teachings?

[hombre]

Originally Posted by infinitethoughts

1. How do you give your soul to something that is Infinite (Definition of god from a book called the bible.)?

2. What are the exact reasons for this eternal banishment to Hell?

I do not know if these are sincere questions but I will briefly respond to them.

1. The concept of God as the Master Designer, Creator of all things, includes human beings. In the book of Genesis, it says that God breathed into man and be became a living soul. Man is created for His Glory. Since He is the Creator (Omnipotent, Omnipresent, Omniscient), He gets to call the rules (He is Sovereign). You can find His rules and the truth in the Bible (If you don't believe in the concept of the Creator, then only God can help you; if you don't believe and have faith that the Bible is God's Word to us, then only God can help you). One of them is that every man has sinned and come short of God's glory (Romans 3). God's remedy for man's sinfulness and rebellion is Jesus Christ and his atoning death on the cross for the sins of the world (that includes you). But God's requirement for eternal life is for you to repent of your sins, to believe all the Bible says about Jesus Christ and to confess Him Lord of your life. Submit to His Lordship and follow Him. (John 3:16, Roman 10, Eph 2:8-10). Those who reject Jesus Christ have God's wrath on them right now (John 3:36). Your soul will live forever; it is God's - you can either submit to Jesus Christ's Lordship and follow him in obedience and inherit eternal life or continue your godless, rebellious path (along with your guru Steve P.) and receive God's wrath in the eternal lake of fire. “God resists the proud, but gives grace unto the humble”

2. Hell (Gehena, Lake of Fire, Eternal Torment, etc.) - Whatever this place is, it is for those (Satan, the fallen angels, and those who reject Jesus Christ) to spend eternity. As your soul continues in hell throughout eternity, you will be in torment (read Luke 16). The purpose of Hell is to Glorify God - God is Holy and the horrors of Hell reveal His Holiness. Salvation is being saved from God Himself - His Wrath upon sinning humans and those who reject His gift of Salvation which is Jesus Christ. After a billion years in hell and as it continues throughout eternity, as compared to your 100 years of life that you spent on planet earth, these "few" years will eventually approach zero, and your torment will have just begun. You will be able to contemplate the foolishness of believing in God as espoused by the religious teachings of Steve P. – the “omniscient” leader of the “smart people.”
Steve confuses his experiences (Catholicism) and the foolishness of modern religions and now rejects God (Creator) Himself. The Bible also condemns these as well (along with what most of us know as modern day “Christianity”). But there is a Creator and Jesus Christ is the Savior and the Bible calls all men to repent and turn to Christ. “For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.” (I Cor 1:18).

I wouldn’t be surprise of this is censored and does not get posted since it goes against the religious teachings of the “smart people.” I do not come out here very often at all, but I am surprised on the anti-God blogs and postings.

Hombre

[fwellers]

Originally Posted by hombre

The purpose of Hell is to Glorify God - God is Holy and the horrors of Hell reveal His Holiness. Salvation is being saved from God Himself - His Wrath upon sinning humans and those who reject His gift of Salvation which is Jesus Christ. After a billion years in hell and as it continues throughout eternity, as compared to your 100 years of life that you spent on planet earth, these "few" years will eventually approach zero, and your torment will have just begun. You will be able to contemplate the foolishness of believing in God as espoused by the religious teachings of Steve P. – the “omniscient” leader of the “smart people.”

Hombre

If eternal torture is your god's idea of glorifying himself, I feel sorry for you.
that is one twisted god you got there.

[Christian223]

Originally Posted by hombre

I do not know if these are sincere questions but I will briefly respond to them.

1. The concept of God as the Master Designer, Creator of all things, includes human beings. In the book of Genesis, it says that God breathed into man and be became a living soul. Man is created for His Glory. Since He is the Creator (Omnipotent, Omnipresent, Omniscient), He gets to call the rules (He is Sovereign). You can find His rules and the truth in the Bible (If you don't believe in the concept of the Creator, then only God can help you; if you don't believe and have faith that the Bible is God's Word to us, then only God can help you). One of them is that every man has sinned and come short of God's glory (Romans 3). God's remedy for man's sinfulness and rebellion is Jesus Christ and his atoning death on the cross for the sins of the world (that includes you). But God's requirement for eternal life is for you to repent of your sins, to believe all the Bible says about Jesus Christ and to confess Him Lord of your life. Submit to His Lordship and follow Him. (John 3:16, Roman 10, Eph 2:8-10). Those who reject Jesus Christ have God's wrath on them right now (John 3:36). Your soul will live forever; it is God's - you can either submit to Jesus Christ's Lordship and follow him in obedience and inherit eternal life or continue your godless, rebellious path (along with your guru Steve P.) and receive God's wrath in the eternal lake of fire. “God resists the proud, but gives grace unto the humble”

2. Hell (Gehena, Lake of Fire, Eternal Torment, etc.) - Whatever this place is, it is for those (Satan, the fallen angels, and those who reject Jesus Christ) to spend eternity. As your soul continues in hell throughout eternity, you will be in torment (read Luke 16). The purpose of Hell is to Glorify God - God is Holy and the horrors of Hell reveal His Holiness. Salvation is being saved from God Himself - His Wrath upon sinning humans and those who reject His gift of Salvation which is Jesus Christ. After a billion years in hell and as it continues throughout eternity, as compared to your 100 years of life that you spent on planet earth, these "few" years will eventually approach zero, and your torment will have just begun.

Steve confuses his experiences (Catholicism) and the foolishness of modern religions and now rejects God (Creator) Himself. The Bible also condemns these as well (along with what most of us know as modern day “Christianity”). But there is a Creator and Jesus Christ is the Savior and the Bible calls all men to repent and turn to Christ. “For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.” (I Cor 1:18).

Hombre

Amen, i agree, the word of the bible is truth.
I have remarked the most important parts, we have sinned against a holy and perfect God, and we are violators of his laws and have dishonored him, and just as if we break the law we deserve payment to justice, likewise we deserve payment from God, his wrath is upon us because of our deeds and thoughts. Justice needs to be made, but we are saved from this Justice/wrath thanks to the sacrifice of God himself, Jesus Christ paid for our sins. There is hope if we turn to him and repent:

Ecc 9:4 For to him that is joined to all the living there is hope: for a living dog is better than a dead lion.

Tit 3:3 For we ourselves also were sometimes foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving divers lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another.
Tit 3:4 But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared,
Tit 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
Tit 3:6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;
Tit 3:7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

Jesus bless you all.

[yossarian]

Originally Posted by infinitethoughts

1. How do you give your soul to something that is Infinite (Definition of god from a book called the bible.)?

You don't give your soul to God because it is already God Himself. You are already God and always have been.

Salvation is to realize the God within.

2. What are the exact reasons for this eternal banishment to Hell?

It is only eternal if you choose for it to be eternal.

We are in Hell already because we suffer from the delusion of separation from God. Since we are God, how can we ever be separate from Him? It is only the willful delusion on our part that gives us a sense of separation, and this separation is Hell itself. The further we separate, the deeper in Hell we reside. Hell is not something that is to come. Hell is right now, in every moment that we spend with the sense of a separation from God. But this is only a sense of separation, not true separation, for how can God be separate from Itself?

To see this delusion and then to let this delusion go, to rest in the peace of the One Infinite Creator which is us, is salvation.

[Liminal Chris]

Can someone explain to me the need to speak about God in an anthropomorphic manner?


Also, why is there such a need to buy into the mythology of the Bible? Why are people so attached to it? Why are so many people Apologists, when they could simply drop the bible and still believe?

Originally Posted by yossarian

Salvation is to realize the God within.



It(Hell) is only eternal if you choose for it to be eternal.

These seem more like Buddhist and Hindu concepts to me. They are traditionally much more internally focused.



I realize Christianity probably gets a raw deal in this forum, many of us come in with already preconcieved notions of many Christian terms. The term God alone is a pretty loaded one. I'm thinking my problem is a linguistic one, because I have trouble seperating my own 12 years of Jesuit schooling from the very loose meaning that some people are using here. But I think that is a problem for many people here, and perhaps at large, more of a problem of the instituion teaching people inadequately or a fundamental problem of the bible itself.

Talking about Heaven and Hell and giving yourself over to god for salvation, all the anthropomorphism and loaded words, it just doesn't do the ideas behind them any justice I think.

Originally Posted by Christian223

Ecc 9:4 For to him that is joined to all the living there is hope: for a living dog is better than a dead lion.

Tit 3:3 For we ourselves also were sometimes foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving divers lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another.
Tit 3:4 But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared,
Tit 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
Tit 3:6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;
Tit 3:7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

Like to me this was a whole lot of nothing, except a lot of anthropomorphism and an extremely poor explination. I just feel like they are almost talking in tongues on purpose, in order to confuse people, when it would be so easy to clean up the language and make it more straightforward and not open to misinterpretation.

[Tina McLeman]

Excuse me please if I have missed the point. I have limited knowledge of christianity since I do not follow that (or any other) organised belief system. I always, however, attempt to understand what other people believe in and why.

One point regarding "hell" has always troubled me. During my years at school, and many trips to church against my own free will (darn brownies and guides) - I was taught that God forgives everything. Now, if this is so, why is there any need for a "hell"? Surely once we all get up to those supposed big pearly white gates, we will all be forgiven and let into "heaven". No need for hell.

I remember my brother asked a christian priest guy about this once. It was during a school assembly. The guy had no answer. He kinda panicked and moved onto the next question. He completely ignored my brother! Shows that he doesn't fully understand his belief system (but then can anyone fully understand their belief system when it's based on something that cannot be proven to be real).

So, whats your verdict? Can anyone explain this?

[NightSpirit]

1) Permission to enter through the door of your free will where He is knocking.

2) Rebellion against God or against the knowledge God.

[Matthew Shea]

Originally Posted by wolfgang

I'm not a Christian, per say but like the questions.

1) I give my soul to something that is Infinite by realizing I am Infinite.

2) Banishment to Hell is really our separation from God (sin). Sin is separation from God. Redemption is realizing we are not separate from God.

Wolfgang, I am a Christian and I think you pretty much hit it spot on. To expound on the questions a bit more:

1) Part of this is accepting that there is a power higher than yourself. You weren't responsible for the existence of the universe, were you? So how can you be sure that whatever was responsible for the universe isn't worthy of a personal relationship.

2) Hell is a conscious choice. If you separate yourself from God in this world, you get separated from him for eternity. If you cultivate a relationship with him in this world, you get to spend eternity with him. That's pretty much the long and the short of it. Sin is anything that gets in the way of that relationship. Also, contrary to what AL says, hell is still very real and still an integral part of Christian belief. It's not PC to talk about it these days, even in some Christian circles, but it is certainly still there. You CAN, however, throw out the medieval visions of hellfire and brimstone. That's someone's overactive imagination at work. (Dante's Inferno is a work of fiction, after all).

[pianoperformer]

Originally Posted by Liminal Chris

Can someone explain to me the need to speak about God in an anthropomorphic manner?

I totally agree. Unfortunately no one seems to be answering your question. If there is a god, it doesn't make any sense to attribute it with such characteristics.

[fwellers]

Originally Posted by Matthew Shea

1) Part of this is accepting that there is a power higher than yourself. You weren't responsible for the existence of the universe, were you?

Apparently I am. Not the ego me, but since I am connected with the source, yes, there is a good chance that I make my own universe, or at least a deeper part of me is in cahoots with the rest of you all to make this universe.
In other words, yes, at my deepest level, I probably am god.

2) Hell is a conscious choice. If you separate yourself from God in this world, you get separated from him for eternity.

Eternity being now. You can be in hell now, by thinking you are separate from god, but as soon as you remember who you are, you are out of hell. There is a difference between eternity and forever and ever.

[yossarian]

Personally I think people take the Bible far too literally.

The Bible is truth but the truth is expressed in metaphor. Even the explanations of the parables that Jesus gave to his disciples are metaphor. This is because you can't express truth in language, you can only point at truth. This is what Jesus did.

Then the Church came along and decided to twist Jesus' words into a system they could use to scare and control people.

Jesus spoke of God the Father as a metaphorical Father, a Father who provides for His children. It's a metaphor, because God is in all things and does indeed provide all things. But this God is not a Man, he is All Things, he is Oneness, the Infinite Creator. None of these things can be proven to another.

I think Jesus spoke truth and I believe he performed miracles. But I still think the Church is narrow minded and basically all their interpretations were incorrect. They intentionally misunderstood Jesus to create a dominance structure.

In this thread my explanation may sound similar to Hindu or Buddhism, but I assure you I am wholly Christian oriented. It just so happens that the Hindus and Buddhists also have discovered Truth.

"The Kingdom of God is within you."

[Liminal Chris]

Originally Posted by yossarian

This is because you can't express truth in language, you can only point at truth. This is what Jesus did.


I think Jesus spoke truth and I believe he performed miracles.

I think the truth can be more accurately expressed than the Bible offers. The whole idea of pointing at the truth makes it seem external. Which is why christianity is traditionally known as an externally focused religion in contrast to buddhism and hinduism.


I mean you think people take the bible too literally, but you actually believe their was a God-man walking the earth doing fantastically impossible things like raising the dead, etc?

If he could do the impossible, why didn't he just make people understand beyond the impossibility of the way language can?

The whole idea of Jesus as the son of man seems like anthropomorphic mythology to me, which is nothing but a distraction from the real goals of Christianity or any other religions.

[Asmoday]

Originally Posted by infinitethoughts

1. How do you give your soul to something that is Infinite (Definition of god from a book called the bible.)?

2. What are the exact reasons for this eternal banishment to Hell?

While not Christian, I may be able to answer these questions from within a Christian perspective (allthough my answer will not agree with all denominations).

By Infinite, all that is meant is that God is all things, and includes all things.

Your question seems to be, if God is infinite, and includes all things, how can you give your soul to something which already has it.

The answer is the purpose of God -- the mechanism of true love. God desires true love from the created, and to get it, true love is based on free choice, or free will. When you "give" your soul to God, you're not giving it your soul, it already has it, what you are actually doing is giving it true, freely chosen, love.

Or, you've found a conundrum...good for you...

Anyway, which leads to your second question. God does not damn people to hell, people damn themselves to hell. Hell is the one place where God has set aside to not contain itself. Yes, it is infinite, and this is a conundrum, but that which is infinite can define a sector where it is not by withdrawling, and still retain its infinite nature because it could choose to reclaim this "place". Now, if you do not truly love God, then God, being all-good, does not want to force you to be with it, and thus, simply answers your request by honoring your free will and your free choice. Thus, to hell you go.

Now, here you got a *lot* of variations, but the general conscensus is that there's a being called by many names whom God cast from heaven (i.e., the place where God is to where god is not -- hell ), and this being made Hell a bad, firey, tortuous place because he hates God and the people he loves so much.

So yeah, there's one answer of many. Not my thing -- but that's the "most clever" and "soundest" response I've found in the theological literature.