Weekly Religion: Hinduism - The worlds oldest belief

[hindweb]

Hinduism / Sanatana dharma is the oldest of the world's faiths and its origins is dated between 10,000 - 7,000 BCE. It is a dharma or way of life evolved by the great sages and seers of ancient India. Its traditions extend back before recorded history. Despite of the oldness, Hinduism is still a living and growing religion.

The meaning of the word Sanatana is that which has no beginning or end and that which is there always. Dharma refers to the underlying order in Nature and thus signifies 'the way things are'. Ethically, it means 'right way of living' and 'proper conduct' in a religious sense. With respect to spirituality, dharma might be considered the way of the higher truths.

More information can be found here...

Sanatana dharma

[Adam]

Promoting this thread to the weekly religion spot.

[RandomGuy101]

I've been getting into Hinduism lately. It seems pretty similar to Buddhism to me. Are there any practicing Hindus in here?

[babuji]

Originally Posted by RandomGuy101

I've been getting into Hinduism lately. It seems pretty similar to Buddhism to me. Are there any practicing Hindus in here?

You got one right here..

Actually the reason why Buddhism seems similar to Hinduism is that Buddhism branched off from Hinduism.

The reason for the branching off is that Siddhartha Gautama or "Buddha" was born into a Hindu family. He found that society at the time was misinterpreting the scriptures, so he wanted to restore the word of the Upanishads, and hence Buddhism came about.

Check out the following link for more clarification:Buddhism and Hinduism

[Michael Chui]

Question: what is the relationship between Hinduism and Jainism?

[Antarananda]

The fundamental and philosophic truth common to all religions which were given birth to in India, including Sanatana Dharma (Hinduism), Buddhism, Jainism and Sikhism is the doctrine of moksha, or nirvana, or liberation from the cycle of births and deaths for the individual soul or jiva, by realizing its oneness with the Source, which is known as Brahman in Sanatana Dharma.

Jains pay particular importance to the law of Karma, and are especially careful to avoid violence to all living creatures, and so adopt very strict diets, to the extent of avoiding even roots of plants, since they are considered to be the life of the plant. Jainism was founded by the Tirthankaras, or succession of enlightened Masters, who laid down the tenets as they realized them to be the foundation of a lifestyle to be adopted so as to enable all humans to realize the nature of Reality.

Meditation is a common element to Sanatana Dharma, Buddhism and Jainism. Transcending the mind and its fluctuations is a recommended means of realizing the pure truth which is never born and never dies.

[Antarananda]

From "Masterkey of All Ills", an eloquent and lyrical presentation of the essence of Sanatana Dharma, God-realization, as spoken by Mahavatar Babaji, a deathless Master who lives in the Himalayas.

This is the realization available to every single human being. We are not sinners, we are Gods

"I am Existence-Knowledge-Bliss Absolute. I am That by very nature. I cannot be anything else but That, as I am That alone without a beginning and an end. It is My real innate nature. I am the Absolute and Supreme Self, both within and without the finitude. I am Truth, eternal and everlasting. I am the only One, all in Myself. None exists save I, in and through all that exist. I am ever All Existence itself. I am the changeless One in the midst of all changes. I am the Formless in all forms. Change is linked up with form, and form is labeled with change. But I am beyond the two. I am not susceptible to all the ills of the flesh that exist crawling under the feet of form and change. I am the monistic unity, here, there and everywhere and at all times-nay for all times. Where is happiness, except in perfect realization of the One without a second? I feel I am all happiness itself. All Bliss I am. All joy I am.

"I am, indeed, Brahman, without difference, without change and of the nature of Reality. Knowledge and Bliss. I am the living ocean of Ecstasy that rages wild and surges and storms and levels down the earth and heavens. I send such continuous wave after wave of inarticulate Ecstasy into the world drowning deep and scattering all its thoughts and cares. I beat in every breast, see in every eye, throb in every pulse, smile in every flower, shine in the lightning and roar in the thunder. I flutter in the leaves, I hiss in the winds, and I roll in the surging seas. I am the wisdom of the wise, the Strength of the strong, and the Heroism of the heroic. I am the very life of Infinity, both within and without. I am the One in all and the All in one. I am the Impersonal Personality of the whole universe."

[hindweb]

Thank the mod for the promotion!

Antarananda - the below wordings from you surely does show your scholarly knowledge.

''The fundamental and philosophic truth common to all religions which were given birth to in India, including Sanatana Dharma (Hinduism), Buddhism, Jainism and Sikhism is the doctrine of moksha, or nirvana, or liberation from the cycle of births and deaths for the individual soul or jiva, by realizing its oneness with the Source, which is known as Brahman in Sanatana Dharma.'

Meditation is a common element to Sanatana Dharma, Buddhism and Jainism. Transcending the mind and its fluctuations is a recommended means of realizing the pure truth which is never born and never dies.''

[maverickstruth]

Great thread. Another site that might be of interest to y'all is http://www.hindunet.org/ With the exception of the occasionally annoying banner ad, it's a pretty good site on Hinduism.

Bit of trivia, actually, on that note. The term "Hinduism" is actually pretty much a scholarly construct. Literally, it refers to the people who live in "India" (ie. originally the region of the Indus River). Even to a non-linguist, the connection between the words should be apparent. Lots of scholars actually prefer to talk of "Hinduisms," since there are so many different forms of religion which all fall under the broad umbrella of Hinduism. Some have numbered these different forms in the thousands. Most of them share many of the the same basic ideas, and in many cases, the only difference is which deity is venerated as being "more supreme". That being said, this is mostly something you can bring up at your next office party, since the distinction is mostly semantics, not and not one of practicalities.

[hindweb]

maverickstruth

The river indus in Indian languages is Sindhu. This may be the reason and this term Hindu is coined by the persian invaders from my limited knowledge.

There is another trivia here, have you heard of the Hindukush mountain ranges? do you know what that means?

[maverickstruth]

The river indus in Indian languages is Sindhu. This may be the reason and this term Hindu is coined by the persian invaders from my limited knowledge.

There is another trivia here, have you heard of the Hindukush mountain ranges? do you know what that means?

I'm not a linguist by any stretch (though I do like to play pretend sometimes), but as I recall, you are correct in your etymology of Indus >< Sindhu.

Aha! Wikipedia to the rescue: "The name Indus is a Latinization of Hindu, in turn the Iranian variant of Sindhu, the name of the Indus in the Rigveda." (it's Wikipedia, so take it for what it's worth ) Then again, I've been told that the basic structure of languages like Persian, Sanskrit, Greek and Latin are all very similar, so it's not a surprise that this would be the case (I've only ever worked in the latter two, so I can't speak to their relation to Sanskrit or Persian... if I think of it, I'll have to ask a friend of mine who is a Hindu scholar and also works in Classical Sanskrit if she knows anything further).

From what I know, you're also correct in that the terms "Indian" and "Hindu" were coined by foreigners coming into the region. According to my limited knowledge (which I must admit is *very* limited) the term came into use in the Persian period after the Sassanian incursions, which you noted in your post.

As for Hindukush... I know that there's a ton of theories, but I think the prevalent one is that it means something like "Hindu killer"... but I could be wrong, since I would have heard that a looooong time ago. I'm always up for a history lesson, though!

[babuji]

Another great reference website for people who are interested in Hinduism is the following:
Hindu Wisdom

The sections pertaining to 'Basics', 'Science', 'History' and 'Social' have alot of depth and information is derived from many credible sources.

[fourthdan]

@babuji - the hinduwisdom site link doesn't work.

I'm a practicing hindu myself, but was away on vacation the last 10 days and that's why I'm just posting now.

I find it interesting that nobody's posted on the Gita or the Vedas, the ramayana or the Mahabharata, the yogas or the gunas, vaishnavas or shaivas... among many other things.

But I suppose these items are all explained on any of the sites mentioned on this thread - and I know for a fact that they're up on wikipedia too.

Anyways, I'm a devotee of Krishna and I'm a member of the organisation called ISKCON, but i'm not a full-time devotee who wears saffaron and lives a life of renunciation.

[pi11]

I find it interesting that nobody's posted on the Gita or the Vedas, the ramayana or the Mahabharata, the yogas or the gunas, vaishnavas or shaivas... among many other things.

I am pleasantly surprised that no one posted on those texts, but rather on the Upanishads instead! I applaud this because it is important to focus on the origins of such an old religion and not on the later iterations and instantiations. I personally am not happy with some of these later iterations because they are in essence pollutants of the original word and message.

Sorry, I may sound like a bigot, but I can back my claims. And I am certainly not attacking someone else's religion. I would dare not attack something that I don't understand. I grew up in India in an Hindu family. I am well aware of these texts.

I study world religions and philosophies and have rediscovered the original Hindu religion. It is a thing of beauty! Although I do not practice any particular religion, I do respect everyone of them and attribute credit where its due.

[fourthdan]

what's interesting is that i've just bought myself a copy of the upnishads, but have yet to read it! I bet it's going to be quite interesting.

[hindweb]

You can read the 18 chapters of the Bhagavad-Gita in a simple English translation in the site I mentioned...

[hindweb]

fourth dan, did you get to read your upanishads, There are 18 upanishads, which one did you get?

[Uplift]

Indigenous Australian religion is minimum 40,000 years old, probably at least 60,000 years old, and plenty of evidence suggests quite likely more than 100,000 years old. The world's oldest continual cultures, and religions, by miles, and miles and miles. Something the 'true blue, fair dinkim, good ol aussie battler' has done their best to hide for the last 200 years, since invading and stealing their land. I mean, who wants to be famous for trying their best at obliterating such an incredible thing?

[hindweb]

I do agree that many of the ancient customs, rituals and indigeneous religions followed by aborginals, mawaris and red indians before the on-slaught of organized religions can be traced back to the specified dates.

In that respect, even the dates in this thread about Hinduism is inappropriate and can be traced to much before this. The indian concept of yugas (a vedic or ancient year calculation) dates the religion back to millions of years!

[dor]

Originally Posted by hindweb

I do agree that many of the ancient customs, rituals and indigeneous religions followed by aborginals, mawaris and red indians before the on-slaught of organized religions can be traced back to the specified dates.

In that respect, even the dates in this thread about Hinduism is inappropriate and can be traced to much before this. The indian concept of yugas (a vedic or ancient year calculation) dates the religion back to millions of years!

aryan invasion which the vedic texts clearly allude to , was something of an onslaugh

Unless of course you belive reverse ayran invasion theory

[babuji]

Originally Posted by dor

aryan invasion which the vedic texts clearly allude to , was something of an onslaugh

Unless of course you belive reverse ayran invasion theory

There is no such thing as the Aryan Invasion.. and it's been consistently disproved by scientific research. Please take a look at this clip:

Scientific Verification of Vedic Knowledge - Google Video

The only reason people believe in the Aryan Invasion Theory today is that it's been said to be true over many generations.. and we all know that if a lie is said many times over.. it is eventually thought to be the truth. Ignorance does not equal bliss in this case. :-)

[dor]

Originally Posted by babuji

There is no such thing as the Aryan Invasion.. and it's been consistently disproved by scientific research. Please take a look at this clip:

Scientific Verification of Vedic Knowledge - Google Video

The only reason people believe in the Aryan Invasion Theory today is that it's been said to be true over many generations.. and we all know that if a lie is said many times over.. it is eventually thought to be the truth. Ignorance does not equal bliss in this case. :-)

you think i am ignorant...i think the video is nonsense. this little bit from wiki sums it up:
Political debate

The debate over such a migration, and the accompanying influx of elements of Vedic religion from Central Asia is still politically charged and hotly debated in India. Hindutva (Hindu nationalist) organizations, especially, remain opposed to the concept, for political, religious, and scientific reasons, while many Indian Marxists and a fraction of the Dalit Movement support the theory in opposition to the Hindu nationalists, mostly for political reasons. Outside India, the perceived political overtones of the theory are not as pronounced, and it is discussed in the larger framework of Indo-Iranian and Indo-European expansion.

it's policized 'science' from insecure nationalists. do you seriously believe and 'out of india theory'
Indo-Aryan migration - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[babuji]

Yes it's been turned into a political debate, which unfortunately overshadows the heart of the matter.. which is that when people talk about this issue, they generally imply that the Indo-Aryan Migration THEORY is the sole truth... however, I have no problem if both sides are represented when giving introduction to this topic.

Like I mentioned before, if something which is not 100% truth (lie), is repeated over and over again, people start to believe it to be the truth. Which is the case now.. However, if you present both sides, at least it implies that there's research being done on both sides to eventually come to a final conclusion...

[dor]

Originally Posted by babuji

Like I mentioned before, if something which is not 100% truth (lie), is repeated over and over again, people start to believe it to be the truth. Which is the case now..

that is not why I, or anyone who's studied it, believe it. I haven't made it my life's purpose but I have read two lengthy volumes on the history of India, and that, common sense leads me to believe Aryan invasion. Like the fact that they had no word for elephant, but one for horse - kind of odd for people in south asia, don't you think, but common from a horse riding people from the stepps of asia??

To me, denying it or constructing elaborate theories is as much a waste of time as denying the Normans invaded and conquered the Saxons.

no one is saying that there weren't sophisticated cultures in India prior....and I am not saying I am authority on the subject - i have read enough to know the extent of my ignorance - I could even ask, what do we mean by india? The geogrpahic boundries of the current country? Which means part of punjab isn't India? The Raj? Asok's empire?

[munish]

Originally Posted by Michael Chui

Question: what is the relationship between Hinduism and Jainism?

Hinduism is a Religion,Jainism is a Cult Like Sikhism.But they have come out of Hinduism.There are many such cults in India.

[munish]

Originally Posted by pi11

it is important to focus on the origins of such an old religion and not on the later iterations and instantiations. I personally am not happy with some of these later iterations because they are in essence pollutants of the original word and message.

I study world religions and philosophies and have rediscovered the original Hindu religion. It is a thing of beauty! Although I do not practice any particular religion, I do respect everyone of them and attribute credit where its due.

The follower is the greatest curse.”-annonymous.

[hindweb]

Can anyone please tell me if the Theory of Aryan invasion has been heard before the colonial invasion? Is this one made up by the colonisers or came in to practice afterwards?

[Simmiah]

I didn't read the entire thread but I am shamelessly promoting the Bhagavad Gita! It is absolutely compelling.

[autumn]

Hinduism/Hindu isn't really a good word to describe the many branches of faith found in India ("India" is also a more modern word), but I see you guys have also touched on that. So just to add to it:

What is hinduism?

A Christian, visiting India from the West, would surely think it strange if he or she was told by an Indian, "You are a follower of Jordanism."

Christianity, along with Judaism and Islam, hails from the region of the Jordan river. But it is unlikely that Christians, Jews and Muslims would like their faiths being lumped together under such an artificial, unscriptural category as "Jordanism."

Yet just this sort of thing was done to the followers of the indigenous religions of India. The word "Hinduism" is derived from the name of a river in present-day Pakistan, the Sindhu (also known as the Indus). Beginning around 1000 AD, invading armies from the Middle East called the place beyond the Sindhu "Hindustan" and the people who lived there the "Hindus" - due to the invaders' language, the "s" was changed to "h". Soley used by the invading Muslims, in the centuries that followed, the term "Hindu" became acceptable even to the Indians themselves as a general designation for their different religious traditions. But since the word Hindu is not found in the scriptures upon which these traditions are based, it is quite inappropriate. The proper term is "Vedic dharma" or "sanatana dharma".


Vedic traditions

There are four main groups or practices in Vedic tradition: Vaishnavism, Smartaism, Shaivism, Shaktism

1. Vaishnavism

Om Namo Narayanaya, Hare Krishna

Worship of Vishnu and His various avatars, especially Rama and Krishna, in a profoundly devotional form is the basis of Vaishnavism. Intense devotion to a personal Supreme God, Vishnu through bhakti yoga is the path to perfection. There are four main Vaisnava traditions - Visistadvaita, Dvaita (includes Acintya-bheda-abheda), Suddha- advaita, and Dvaitadvaita. Vaishnavism is followed by majority of people in India.

2. Smartaism

Om Namah Sivaya

Smartaism is an ancient brahminical tradition reformed by Adi Shankara. The word smarta means one who follows the smriti or dharma sastras. Smartas follow the smriti literature, particularly dharma shastra, Puranas and the Itihasas. They worship five forms of God and also revere the Vedas and the Agamas. They worship Shiva, Vishnu, Ganapati, Surya and Shakti and this system is called pancayatana (pancopasana). Kumara was further added by Shankara's reform. Today they are synonymous with Adi Shankara's monistic, meditative and philosophical theories. The five group system of smartas is there because each deity can be chosen as one's own personal and preferred deity (ishta devata). Smartas believe in attainment of salvation mainly through jnana yoga. However other yogas like bhakti yoga, karma yoga and raja yoga are recognized as leading to enlightenment. Jnana yoga involves the study of scriptures (shravana), reflection (manana) and sustained meditation (dhyana).

3. Shaiva

Om Namah Shivaya

There are six main sub-groups of Shaivism:

Shaiva siddhanta

Pasupata

Kashmir Shaiva or Trika (tantric)

Vira Shaiva or Lingayata

Siddha Shaiva

Shiva Advaita

Sometimes Lakulisa Saivisms is also added.

A system of temple mysticism and an enlightened view of man's place in the universe as well as siddha yoga form the basis of Shaivism. The final goal of Shaivism is realizing one's identity with Shiva in perfect union and non-differentiation (monism, kevaladvaita) based on advaita philosophy.

The path for Shaivites is divided into four progressive stages of belief and practice called Charya, Kriya, Yoga and Jnana. Union with Shiva comes through the grace of the satguru and culminates in the soul's maturity in the state of jnana, or wisdom. Shaivism values both bhakti and yoga sadhana.

4. Shakta

Om Chandikayai Namah

The worship of Mother Goddess in her fierce or gentle form is the basis of Shaktism. Shaktas use mantra, tantra, yantra, yoga and puja to invoke cosmic forces and awaken the kundalini power. They consider the Goddess a manifested form of the deity whose worship leads to the masculine unmanifested form or Shiva, thus attaining salvation.

There are four different expressions:

Devotional

Shamanic

Yogic

Universalist

The devotional Shaktas makes puja rites to invoke Sri Chakra Yantra to establish intimacy with the Goddess. The Shamanic Shaktas - usually with the help of a medium - use magic, tantra and trance as well as fire walking and animal sacrifice for healing, fertility and power. The Shakta yogis seek to awaken the sleeping Goddess Kundalini and unite her with Lord Shiva in the sahasrara chakra. The universalists follow the reformed Vedantic teachings and traditions.

Copied from this website.

[Michael Chui]

Originally Posted by autumn

A Christian, visiting India from the West, would surely think it strange if he or she was told by an Indian, "You are a follower of Jordanism."

Christianity, along with Judaism and Islam, hails from the region of the Jordan river. But it is unlikely that Christians, Jews and Muslims would like their faiths being lumped together under such an artificial, unscriptural category as "Jordanism."

A fair point.

However, I have to other points to make:

1) Hinduism did not conquer most of the planet.

2) Christianity, Judaism, and Islam are artificial, unscriptural categories, too. But we don't seem to have a problem using them.