How many enlightened people are there?

[Calisto]

Erock,

By 'realized' I think you mean 'awakened'. Adding this is rather crass, I came across it on the net, but it is a very good description of what it is like to be 'Awakened'. And I believe this is closer to what we are than being enlightened.

The Awakening

A time comes in your life when you finally get it - when, in the midst of all your fears and insanity, you stop dead in your tracks and somewhere the voice inside your head cries out Enough!

Enough fighting and crying or struggling to hold on. And, like a child quieting down after a blind tantrum, your sobs begin to subside, you shudder once or twice, you blink back your tears and begin to look at the world through new eyes.

This is your awakening!

You realize it's time to stop hoping and waiting for something to change...or for happiness, safety and security to come galloping over the next horizon.

You come to terms with the fact that neither of you is Prince Charming or Cinderella and that in the real world there aren't always fairytale endings (or beginnings for that matter), and that any guarantee of "happily ever after" must begin with you. In the process, a sense of serenity is born of acceptance.

You awaken to the fact that you are not perfect and that not everyone will always love, appreciate or approve of who or what you are... and that's okay. They are entitled to their own views and opinions. And you learn the importance of loving and championing yourself. In the process, a sense of new found self confidence is born of self-approval.

You stop complaining and blaming other people for the things they did to you (or didn't do for you), and you learn that the only thing you can really count on is the unexpected.

You learn that people don't always say what they mean or mean what they say, and not everyone will always be there for you and it's not always about you.

So, you learn to stand on your own and to take care of yourself. In the process, a sense of safety and security is born of self-reliance. You stop judging and pointing fingers and you begin to accept people as they are and overlook their shortcomings and human frailties. In the process, a sense of peace and contentment is born of forgiveness.

You realize that much of the way you view yourself, and the world around you, is as a result of all the messages and opinions that have been ingrained into your psyche. You begin to sift through all of the junk you've been fed about how you should behave, how you should look, how much you should weigh, what you should wear, what you should do for a living, how much money you should make, what you should drive, how and where you should live, who you should marry, the importance of having and raising children, and what you owe your parents, family, and friends.

You learn to open up to new worlds and different points of view. And you begin reassessing and redefining who you are and what you really stand for.

You learn the difference between wanting and needing and you begin to discard the doctrines and values you've outgrown, or should have never bought into to begin with. In the process, you learn to go with and trust your instincts.

You learn that it is truly in giving that we receive. There is power and glory in creating and contributing, and you stop manoeuvring through life merely as a "consumer" looking for your next fix.

You learn that principles such as honesty and integrity are not the outdated ideals of a bygone era but the mortar that holds together the foundation upon which you must build a life.

You learn that you don't know everything, it's not your job to save the world and you can't teach a pig to sing.

You learn to distinguish between guilt and responsibility and the importance of setting boundaries and learning to say NO.

You learn that the only cross to bear is the one you choose to carry, and martyrs get burned at the stake.

Then you learn about love. How to love, how much to give in love, when to stop giving and when to walk away.

You learn to look at relationships as they really are and not as you would have them be; to stop trying to control people, situations and outcomes; and that 'alone' does not mean lonely.

You also stop working so hard at putting your feelings aside, smoothing things over and ignoring your needs.

You learn that feelings of entitlement are perfectly okay, and it is your right to want things and to ask for the things you want... and that sometimes it is necessary to make demands.

You come to the realization that you deserve to be treated with love, kindness, sensitivity and respect and you won't settle for less.

You learn that your body really is your temple, and you begin to care for it and treat it with respect. You begin to eat a balanced diet, drink more water, and take more time to exercise.

You learn being tired fuels doubt, fear, and uncertainty. So, you take more time to rest. And, just as food fuels the body, laughter fuels our soul. So you take more time to laugh and to play.

You learn, for the most part in life, you get what you believe you deserve, and much of life truly is a self-fulfilling prophecy. You learn that anything worth achieving is worth working for, and wishing for something to happen is different than working toward making it happen. More importantly, you learn that in order to achieve success you need direction, discipline and perseverance.

You also learn that no one can do it all alone... and it's okay to risk asking for help.

You learn the only thing you must truly fear is, the greatest robber baron of all, FEAR itself. You learn to step right into and through your fears because, you know that whatever happens, you can handle it and to give in to fear is to give away the right to live life on your own terms. And you learn to fight for your life and not squander it living under a cloud of impending doom.

You learn life isn't always fair, you don't always get what you think you deserve and sometimes bad things happen to unsuspecting, good people. On these occasions, you learn not to personalize things. You learn that God isn't punishing you or failing to answer your prayers. It's just life happening. And you learn to deal with evil in its most primal state - the ego.

You learn that negative feelings such as anger, envy and resentment must be understood and redirected or they will suffocate the life out of you and poison the universe that surrounds you. You learn to admit when you are wrong and to build bridges instead of walls.

You learn to be thankful, to take comfort in many of the simple things we take for granted, things that millions of people on the earth can only dream about: a full refrigerator, clean running water, a soft warm bed, a long hot shower.

Slowly, you begin to take responsibility for yourself by yourself and you make yourself a promise to never betray yourself and to never, ever settle for less than your heart's desire. You hang a wind chime outside your window so you can listen to the wind. You make it a point to keep smiling, to keep trusting, and to stay open to every wonderful possibility.

Finally take a deep breath and begin to create the life you want for yourself.


Sonny Carroll
1999

[blazer1]

enlightened, the word that distinguishes one from others as being more awake to reality is just a word that is used in everyday context. in reality reaching this 'enlightened state' is just another shade of perception on the pallete of infinite colours, or combinations. sure you might soon understand how the Ego, the Self, or the concept of seperation is merely a delusion - but what you must also note is there is no true/false states.

our five senses are limited - five senses are just enough to be prolific (sexually) in this expression of existence. if it was not, then we MAY have an extra sense, or perhaps one of the senses strengthed more, which will totally put our perception of reality on a trip. consider a person on LSD, his reality for several hours is distorted, but he is still observing and experiencing reality. Therefore our understanding of this Universe is limited by our five or six senses and the technological instruments we have that extend our senses.

if we started off understanding reality with deluded perceptions then we continually inherit the wrong mindset, or type of thinking.

we have great people like Buddha, Krishna, Jesus, Spinoza, Einstein, Newton, etc who make great discoveries ... they all seem unrelated but really they are ever so connected. for instance, Newton observes if some object is travelling in some direction xyz it will continue that way unless an external force acts upon it, such as friction. this to me is related to the observation of the effects of repetitive thought (habits, dominant thought (even through auto-suggestion)), or social dynamics (some kid gets picked on all the time, continues until he steps up), relationships, interest rates, ... Karma in other words. There are some correlations between Einsteins theories and Hinduism/Buddhism. There are correlations in life everywhere, there probably is a very simple pattern or algorithm to all this that we have not seen because we are so deluded. Or maybe there is'nt.

Enlightenment is just another shade of an opinion ... my greatest enlightenment is realising we are recursive infinitely. I don't ask, what is the Universe, or what is our purpose, or how did it all happen or come from .... I just accept the Universe is an extension of me, is me, or I am it, or we are the same thing ... no Seperation. What is me, is the Universe. But then that is MY Shade of enlightenment don't forget... it is 1 peep hole perhaps.

[boundlesslove]

Hello there friends,

I wanted to post on this thread to mention the Oneness University in Chennai, India.

You may want to take a look. It's fascinating stuff!

They are giving a Diksha or Oneness Blessing which is said to cause enlightenment in the receiver. Currently a worldwide phenomenon. I shall be off to India soon I think.

[veranadine]

I would simply say that there is only ONE enlightened person, because we are all ONE, and that one is the ALL.

[bellemeadows]

Originally Posted by veranadine

I would simply say that there is only ONE enlightened person, because we are all ONE, and that one is the ALL.

Ohhhhh my; that is a perfect response. Count me in, and thank you for saying this. Very, very well done!

Blessings from Belle,

[infinitethoughts]

Originally Posted by MagnusTapping

Doesn't it rather depend on what you think 'Enlightened' means?

Good one, Magnus.

[infinitethoughts]

Originally Posted by blazer1

... my greatest enlightenment is realising we are recursive infinitely.

Good one, blazer.

[infinitethoughts]

Enlightenment is seeing on a practical level that you are continually rebooting yourself, continually pulling your self up by your own bootstraps.

Non-enlightenment is seeing on a practical level that time is continually rebooting you, continually pulling your self up by it's bootstraps.

But don't quote me on that one.
Lol.

[Groundless]

Originally Posted by Angela

All of us. We just don't all realize it yet.

Requoted for truth and my whole-hearted agreement.

Awakening is really more an unblocking (IMO).

[Buttercat Apocalypse]

Originally Posted by Calisto

[indent] "People are too serious. All the time, too serious."

They are

[stellasky]

Originally Posted by Erock

Agh. I hate you guys but I love you guys. I definitely see the error in my question. For those that are curious, this is where it originated from:

Page 115, I Am That:

Questioner: Still there must be some way of making out who has realized and who has not. If one is indistinguishable from the other, of what use is he?

Maharj: He who knows himself has no doubts about it. Nor does he care whether others recognize his state or not. Rare is the realized man who discloses his realization and fortunate are those who have met him, for he does it for their abiding welfare.

I got from this that there are a lot realized men who don't disclose their state or haven't met anybody who cared. This is why I got to wondering how many there are.

Erock

If we all are one, I guess my answer is 1, but I've met two enlightened people in my life. Both at the same Buddhist temple.
One is the grandmaster monk, the other that made a stronger impression on me, isn't a monk, but a master teacher of a Zen Martial Art taught at the temple.
HE definitely didn't disclose his enlighetenment and feigned a response with humor when asked directly.
I as well as many others there feel fortunate to have met him and I suppose the way he handled the enlightenment question was truly for our abiding welfare, as inspiration for our continuing spiritual practice.
He made it seem like nothing, but oh, was it something..The energy that emanates from this teacher is glowingly apparent and quite beautiful.

A month later he announced he was leaving the temple for good, to travel to other temples across the country, to find answers to burning questions
It was hard not to be affected by his presence and hard to imagine the temple without him. And, thus a few fundamental Buddhist precepts were learned as a result..

[mtrimpe]

We are all living in a vast Universe, which to me is God: the great divine is the Universe, all that we Experience. We are parts of it and we are evolving in time.

As a Buddhist teacher once said: 'Eventually even the plants will become enlightened'. It is not Us; individual people; who become enlightened. It is God, Buddha nature, the Universe, that is slowly become enlightened.

I believe that we are part of God, the Universe, whatever you may call it, which is ever evolving. It is even our perspective of time that gives rise to the concept of enlightenment, of coming up from darkness into enlightenment. Once our mind moves beyond the concept of time, we are all simply one giant consciousness experiencing ever-changing Now's.

As to free will; do you believe the Universe has free will? As to enlightenment; do you believe the Universe is enlightened? As to good and evil; do you believe the Universe knows good and evil? As to how many enlightened people there are; you are able to answer that now.

[Buttercat Apocalypse]

Man, everyone on this thread has gone all fluffy.

I'd rather like to know the answer myself -- and I mean a straight answer. Of course the definition of enlightenment may vary but I think "total transcendence", "the end of suffering" or "broken free of the cycle of rebirth" will do.

"Prometheus rising" gives a figure of 2% of the population having activated the "universal circuit". Seems odd to me, but what if you just can't see them because you're not wise enough? Actually I have a few memories of telling people things that were way above their level of consciousness and them just getting amnesia, basically, about it, which makes me wonder if I don't do the same. What if angels are flying above my head and I'm not awake enough to see them?

Then we get into subjective reality of course

[Eric Revelin]

Originally Posted by ScottJMurray

I don't know if they would fade into the background like you said. I follow the traditional Buddhist definition of enlightenment, meaning that it is like "God flowing through a person." This person is so filled to the brim with compassion and spiritual energy, completely without a self, that all they would spend there time doing would be trying to get the message out to others. These people are noticed.

Somehow I don't think that definition really works, either. You can't exist here on earth without a self. The ego is not some abhorrent little bump upon an otherwise pristine consciousness. I don't think that's what you're advocating here but I think it is the way a lot of people think of the ego or the self. Higher energies need a strong self to channel themselves through if they're going to be of any use on this plane.

The following is an article that is very much in line with my own perspective on egolessness: Sensible Perspectives on Egolessness

[dream23]

i would say the dude that walked on water must have been enlightened. hmm i'm still yet to see Ekhart tolle turn water to wine.

[Eric Revelin]

Originally Posted by dream23

i would say the dude that walked on water must have been enlightened. hmm i'm still yet to see Ekhart tolle turn water to wine.

Which is hardly a measure of enlightenment. If someone legitimately turned water into wine or walked upon water then all I could conclude is that this person probably knows more about reality than I do. It doesn't mean he's enlightened. He could be, but how would I know? Unless I have become enlightened myself I'm in no position to make the call. Enlightenment is tricky business.

Whoever has wisdom to share will get me to listen, but I will not worship him nor will I call him enlightened. It is arrogance that favors enlightenment on this level of existence. That is to say, most of the so-called enlightened are delusional. We are simply human beings, each of us at different stages of our journey, each of us doing as best as we know how according to our current knowledge. I think it's possible that even the Buddha and the Christ didn't know everything there is to know.

[Anagogy]

Originally Posted by Eric Revelin

Which is hardly a measure of enlightenment. If someone legitimately turned water into wine or walked upon water then all I could conclude is that this person probably knows more about reality than I do. It doesn't mean he's enlightened. He could be, but how would I know? Unless I have become enlightened myself I'm in no position to make the call. Enlightenment is tricky business.

Whoever has wisdom to share will get me to listen, but I will not worship him nor will I call him enlightened. It is arrogance that favors enlightenment on this level of existence. That is to say, most of the so-called enlightened are delusional. We are simply human beings, each of us at different stages of our journey, each of us doing as best as we know how according to our current knowledge. I think it's possible that even the Buddha and the Christ didn't know everything there is to know.

Well said, Eric.

[AquariusKey]

I'm not sure how many enlightened people exist but the number should start to rise considering we are in the beginnings of the Age of Aquarius. Lay Gnosis could be the missing key in Aquarius. I recommend checking out TruebluehealerDOTcom

[4Mind4Life]

Yep, that's what I got out of it

Originally Posted by Angela

I heard that a little differently. Like: we're all in this together, we're all one consciousness. Either we're all enlightened, or none of us are.

[PerDev]

I believe 8 is the magical word and also heared that at particular time maximum 8 people can be eligntened simultaneously ..