Where the hell is the Devil?

[Neblasian]

I have conflicting views about who he is or if he actually exist. Could he be just part of man's egoistic mind? For instance, the Bible states that the devil is the enemy of your soul. Since the Bible is highly symbolic and our greatest enemy is ourselves it makes sense that he is created by man's ego. On the other had, those who visited the astral plane have reported dark entities and light entities. Is is possible that he is one of these dark entities? Or is that he is the representation of these dark collective consciousness somewhat like how "God" is a representation of the light collective consciousness. Maybe he is really the master demon and like a mob boss his workers are not suppose to even mention his name. Personally I don't know, since I have never contacted spirit guides, higher self, visited the astral realm etc. So any of you who experience such can you shed some light?

[Erin Pavlina]

I wrote a blog entry about this subject that you may find interesting.

[Clarity]

The way I see it, hell and the devil are Christian concepts. If you don't believe in Christianity or the Bible then I guess for you there is no devil or hell, should not even be thoughts of what it is, as for you it doesn't exist. If you aren't in agreement with Christianity or the Bible you should not steal the concepts and try to manipulate them into your interpretation.

I don't understand this taking parts of the Bible that suit you and not believing its entirety. Either you are going to believe it or not.

[Angela]

Originally Posted by Clarity

If you aren't in agreement with Christianity or the Bible you should not steal the concepts and try to manipulate them into your interpretation.

The devil you say! There goes that christian tendency to try and hog up all the best stuff for christianity!

Clarity, christianity is not the only religion that claims there's a devil. Islam, baha'i, and many others warn of the dangers of this impish fellow. Even buddhism has a devil figure, and buddha has been around way longer than christ! And let's not forget that christianity stole the whole idea of the devil from the Greeks vision of Pan, whom christians transformed from a horny shepherd into god's fallen angel. They sort of shmooshed him together with Hades, and voila! The devil you know and love in modern times.

C'mon, if we pagans must have Jesus around, at least let us have my favorite halloween costume!

[The David]

You called?

[The David]

Originally Posted by Clarity

The way I see it, hell and the devil are Christian concepts. If you don't believe in Christianity or the Bible then I guess for you there is no devil or hell, should not even be thoughts of what it is, as for you it doesn't exist. If you aren't in agreement with Christianity or the Bible you should not steal the concepts and try to manipulate them into your interpretation.

I don't understand this taking parts of the Bible that suit you and not believing its entirety. Either you are going to believe it or not.

Maybe you'll understand it when you realize that the Bible is not a unified book that descended from heaven already compiled, but rather a series of documents subject to a wide variety of interpretations and uses.

[Johnny5]

Hi there,

Hell is the realm of suffering existence:

Those people who kill other people will go to hell; Those who disturb other people peace of mind all the time, they will to hell. Those who kill their parents, they will go to hell. Those people who detroy the life of wholesome people, they will go to hell. However, it is not an eternal hell.

Check the explanation of 31 planes of existence... you may find out what hell mean.

http://www.buddhanet.net/filelib/pdf/allexistence.zip

You will see the meaning of hell, it may not be a place that god punish someone; but a place those people who live the life full of hatred and unwholesome actions (destroy life, disturb other, killing, robbing, and etc..) will descend into it by the weight of their unwholesome deeds.

Best Regards;

Johnny

[dorothy hanna]

Devil, is a shortened form of De' meaning a diety, or god, of something. Evil is an action of destruction, hatred, ill-intent etc...thus we have De' Evil. The god of evil. Satan is translated as "The Father of the lie". Now, we might want to take into account some cultural things in ancient history. Satan may have been a person that some did not like, (he had enemies). And as enemies have a tendancy to do, they use your name in disparaging ways, as in calling you a liar, and a man slayer. He may have been exactly that, and no spirit being at all, just a very bad man, and gained over time much power in a very pre-historic world. He may have wared, and caused complete distruction in his time.

In some very ancient folklore, the really big bad hauncho was named Calligra, and his first leutinent was Satan.

There's also a very secretive religion in the middle east whose symbol is the snake, and the religion is called SHATAN. I'd say that name resembles Satan very closely, and it comes from the same area that was once known as the garden of Eden, now known as Iraq. HMMMM Very little is known about this religion, due to it's extreme secrecy. Interesting.

[Sam988]

Originally Posted by The David

You called?

In the Name of Jesus Christ, stay away!

[Liara Covert]

I agree with some of the earlier posts. In my mind, any idea that triggers fear is just another human invention created to exert power and control over others. Ideas that trigger fear can be seen as independent of religion.

[mlc82]

Originally Posted by Liara Covert

I agree with some of the earlier posts. In my mind, any idea that triggers fear is just another human invention created to exert power and control over others. Ideas that trigger fear can be seen as independent of religion.

Funny thing is, in the Bible, Satan is a lot less horrific than God, and certainly hasn't managed to achieve the kind of chaos and destruction that the organized church has over the last 1700 yrs or so.

Edit: I agree with you 100%

[Cantando]

Originally Posted by mlc82

Funny thing is, in the Bible, Satan is a lot less horrific than God, and certainly hasn't managed to achieve the kind of chaos and destruction that the organized church has over the last 1700 yrs or so.

Edit: I agree with you 100%

Maybe he has, by infiltrating the organized church!

[Cantando]

Originally Posted by dorothy hanna

Devil, is a shortened form of De' meaning a diety, or god, of something.

That's an interesting explanation, but I thought the word 'devil' came from the Greek word 'diabolos' (via the Anglo-Saxon word 'deofol'), which means 'the one who throws across' or 'who opposes' God.

If God is the source of love and truth, then, I suppose, it could be said that we are all the devil at times, as we seem to have a habit of throwing up obstacles to block the flow of source energy.

[The David]

Originally Posted by Sam988

In the Name of Jesus Christ, stay away!

Nah, I'm just an impersonator.

Although whenever I see this thread, I always see 'Where the hell is David?' for some reason...

[Amandaaa]

i have no idea... i don't believe in the Devil.




i pretty much agree with everything that Erin said in her blog...
especially this part:

I do know that being afraid of Satan, demons, and evil men does me no good. ...
As with all things, I try not to adopt a belief in something unless it empowers me and/or I have experienced it personally.

[mlc82]

Originally Posted by Cantando

Maybe he has, by infiltrating the organized church!

If I believed in any of it, I would believe this 100%.

[dorothy hanna]

dioblos...that is what we call anyone, who opposes t God/goodness, so it is another way of saying a "bad person".

[Clarity]

The devil is roaming the earth seeking those whom he choses to devour.


Hell si the "lowest pit" (Deuteronomy 32:22; Psalms 86:13) (Psalms 55:15)
"Sheol" is translated "grave" in A. V. in (Genesis 37:35;42:38;44:29,31; 1 Samuel 2:6; 1 Kings 2:6;; J)
Hell is THE FUTURE HOME OF THE WICKED (Psalms 9:17; Proverbs 5:5;9:13,15-18;15:24;23:13,14; Isaiah)

Revelation 20:14 (NIV) 14Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.

Revelation 19-20 thus says that the beast,[1] the false prophet,[2] the devil, Death, Hades, and all those whose names are not found written in the book of life are thrown into the lake of fire.

We battle not with flesh and blood but with principalities and powers. Everything is a spiritual warfare.

Question for you, is your name written in the book of life?

[dorothy hanna]

"Is your name written in the book of Life"?
answer: "YUP".

[adderrall]

the devil spoke to me in jail, he said praying is hanging your head in shame.

[infinitethoughts]

Originally Posted by Clarity

The devil is roaming the earth seeking those whom he choses to devour.


Hell si the "lowest pit" (Deuteronomy 32:22; Psalms 86:13) (Psalms 55:15)
"Sheol" is translated "grave" in A. V. in (Genesis 37:35;42:38;44:29,31; 1 Samuel 2:6; 1 Kings 2:6;; J)
Hell is THE FUTURE HOME OF THE WICKED (Psalms 9:17; Proverbs 5:5;9:13,15-18;15:24;23:13,14; Isaiah)

Revelation 20:14 (NIV) 14Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.

Revelation 19-20 thus says that the beast,[1] the false prophet,[2] the devil, Death, Hades, and all those whose names are not found written in the book of life are thrown into the lake of fire.

We battle not with flesh and blood but with principalities and powers. Everything is a spiritual warfare.

Question for you, is your name written in the book of life?

WOW....!

(Just checking this thread out of curiosity.)

My apologies Clarity, but I'd totally forgotten how this type of muddled thinking still exists.

(Blows my mind the number of people who still think this way !)

[Jamie]

In the carlos casteneda books; they talk about various degrees of "tyrants" (and I know there are guys on here who know a lot more about this than I do); anyhoo..

They range from, small-fry petty tyrant, who is like another person, who has some power over you to make your life hell; going up through petty tyrants, regular tyrants, up to the tyrant. Calling someone (your egomaniac evil boss?) a small-fry petty tyrant, is kinda putting them in to perspective, laughing at them almost, at how insignificant they are in contrast to other maelovent (spiritual) forces in the cosmos.

I think when you come up against maelovent beings, people, spiritual beings, devils, whatever; the principles of dealing with such beings are the same. To not give your power away, to not be touched by them, to retain your own power and integrity, and wholeness; focussed within your own being.

I always feel hesitant to talk about this, because I know it's behond the scope of most peoples' experience, and they'll automatically think I'm a nutter or something; I'm not. I personally have had direct exposure to several maelovent spiritual entities (who cares what you call them?). Not fun. People generally don't seem to like me saying that; I guess it's just behond the scope of their experience, and also it's nothing I can prove. I just say, there is a lot lot more to the cosmos, than what we perceive through out minds and senses. I also believe, very much, that we're out here on our own; and just like no-one will save us from natural catastrophy, or evil men; no-one (but ourselves) will save us from maelovent spiritual entities.

[Jamie]

Originally Posted by Clarity

Question for you, is your name written in the book of life?

I hope not; such a notion (that some of us will be 'saved' and others not) is to me; completely repugnant.

Power resides in me; not some list in any book. I *AM* life.

[Christian223]

The Bible says that there are many devils, not just one, and their primary characteristics is that they are liars, and they come to us to believe those lies, that should worry you more. So, all humans are contacted by this spirits, those that sincerely follow the God of the bible, fight against the lies of these devils, others just believe their lies.

2Co 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
2Co 11:15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

May Jesus bless us all. Nice post by Clarity, by the way.

Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

[joco]

Well, the way I see it ...

The devil is an angel (spirit being). I believe that angels are created in God's image too, even more so than we are. They were created with self-awareness. Satan was the first of the angels to rebel against sub-ordination to his creator - he later lead other angels that way. I do not believe he is "evil" but the indirect source of "evil". This can only make sense if one believes in absolutes and the labels of "good" and "evil". Sin in Satan's sense was rebellion.

In the book of genesis you will read about the tree of knowledge of good and evil. I have come to the conclusion that this is a symbol for the instructions of Satan and his angels. Through these teachings man became self-aware and learned the capacity for judgement (the fruit).
Now man can judge for himself what is right and wrong.

An action such as murder is generally considered to be wrong, but some may be able to justify this action to themselves and so may be able to murder without consequence. This then leads the majority to judge that individual (or his actions) as evil. So evil is from the devil in the sense that he taught man to think for himself.

[supertom]

Originally Posted by Christian223

The Bible says that there are many devils, not just one, and their primary characteristics is that they are liars, and they come to us to believe those lies, that should worry you more. So, all humans are contacted by this spirits, those that sincerely follow the God of the bible, fight against the lies of these devils, others just believe their lies.

2Co 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
2Co 11:15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

You know the funny thing is that it sounds like the church

[Jamie]

Too right tom; sounds just like regurgitation of stuff he's been told. While I think there are mulitple devils, I also think the notion that only such-n-such will be "saved"; is simply a dynamic to keep the believes tied to their particular religious organisation.

Save yourself.

[Christian223]

Originally Posted by supertom

You know the funny thing is that it sounds like the church

Yes, the church. The church or any organization doesnt save, Jesus does.

[Ninja]

Originally Posted by Christian223

Yes, the church. The church or any organization doesnt save, Jesus does.

No, no, everyone knows that visiting a man-made building and donating lots of money to the people inside is the way to eternal bliss!

Jesus, son of God/old soul < brick, mortar and some dude in a robe

[fwellers]

Originally Posted by Clarity

The devil is roaming the earth seeking those whom he choses to devour.


Hell si the "lowest pit" (Deuteronomy 32:22; Psalms 86:13) (Psalms 55:15)
"Sheol" is translated "grave" in A. V. in (Genesis 37:35;42:38;44:29,31; 1 Samuel 2:6; 1 Kings 2:6;; J)
Hell is THE FUTURE HOME OF THE WICKED (Psalms 9:17; Proverbs 5:5;9:13,15-18;15:24;23:13,14; Isaiah)

Revelation 20:14 (NIV) 14Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.

Revelation 19-20 thus says that the beast,[1] the false prophet,[2] the devil, Death, Hades, and all those whose names are not found written in the book of life are thrown into the lake of fire.

We battle not with flesh and blood but with principalities and powers. Everything is a spiritual warfare.

Question for you, is your name written in the book of life?

LOL. Don't make me laugh. So sure of this are you ?
Funny thing, but all mention of 'hell' in the OT is translational error, as the original hebrew did not have a word for hell. Sheol, means 'the pit', or even more literally 'the unseen'. It's where they said people go to when they die, 'the unseen realm'.
Funny how a few errant translators with an agenda took translational liberties to create a doctrine of hell that never existed in the early manuscripts.