Thinking of the Big "M"

[Carl Carlson IV]

So I've been flirting with the idea of popping the question to my girlfriend of 4.5 years lately. I know eventually we will be married, have a home, and raise a family. We are both 21 years old and I would like to think that we are thinking about the long term more than the average person our age. We are both reading, constantly thinking of different ideas, don't drink or do drugs, and are both fairly intelligent. We get along very well, hardly ever argue, and love each other very much. But what's stopping me?

Well, I'm not by any means financially secure (actually quite the opposite) and I think that is creating some stress when thinking of being married. We have already discussed the idea a bit, and she is completely comfortable living in an apartment or something while we are both still young. She told me that she isn't expecting anything miraculous when we are married, but does not want to live together until it is "official." She keeps leaving hints about how she is excited and ready, and is basically waiting for me. I also keep thinking that we are too young, then I think I am foolish for thinking that. (My brain has a lot of vicious cycles like that ). I really think age has little to do with marriage, maybe I'm just afraid of "growing up" too fast? Eh, I'm not sure.

Married people, why did you get married?
Single people, why aren't you married?

I don't know, I am probably over thinking everything and making it into a bigger deal than it is. (I tend to do that ) However, it is a pretty important part of my life. It's like the next step, the next big thing. I know I have found the right person, so what am I waiting for?

Any advice, discussion, or anything is appreciated.

[Shamou]

Originally Posted by Carl Carlson IV

Any advice, discussion, or anything is appreciated.

I have been living in sin with my beautiful and intelligent better half for twenty four years... and loving every minutes of it... especially the sin part...

I cannot see why anyone should have to get married to be united with the one you love... but, that's just my take on that... different strokes for different folks...

.

[Carl Carlson IV]

We already consider ourselves married. We don't need a piece of paper to declare it for us. However, I know a ceremony with a wedding and reception would mean a lot to her, and I want to please her. I wouldn't mind living with her without being "married" but she thinks more traditional about it. I always have wanted to get married as well, but she doesn't want to move in until it is official.

[Shamou]

Originally Posted by Carl Carlson IV

We already consider ourselves married.

That is the essential... everything else is optional...

.

[JohnPlace]

Instead of sharing my opinion on marriage, which I've already done in this thread, I just want to say that waiting until you're financially secure to get married is not a bad move at all.

My girlfriend and I dated for nearly 7 years before I popped the question, mostly because I was still in college when we met and could not afford to live on my own at the time.

If she's your soul mate (and she should be if you plan to marry her), she will wait until you're ready.

Another point: You mentioned that you have some vicious cycles of second-guessing with regard to the marriage, and I don't think you want any of that going on when you pop the question. Marriage is a lifelong commitment. You've got to be sure.

So when is the right time to pop the question? When you and she are absolutely, positively 100% sure. In my case, marriage was the inevitable destination of an unstoppable momentum -- there was absolutely zero doubt when I popped the question.

[Asmoday]

Great advice here.

I just want to add that it is important to realise that the feelings of doubt are perfectly natural, and an inherent part of the process that people usually don't like to talk about at parties.

In fact, if you had no doubts -- I'd predict failure.

The reason its important to be fully accepting of the doubt is so that you don't:

1) Take the doubt as a sign that this shouldn't move forward, inherently (I made that mistake once, cost me more than I could have ever imagined).
2) Get angry or frustrated with yourself and tune out the feeling, thus failing to honor yourself (this is why people actually marry when they shouldn't, most of the time).
3) Fail to reap the intimacy benefits that actually overcoming the doubt provides (very important for the long-run).

Otherwise, I'd encourage you to nod at the doubt enthusiastically, like a welcomed sparring partner, and test its limits -- give it hell, and see what remains after that.

[ZHereford]

Originally Posted by Carl Carlson IV

Well, I'm not by any means financially secure (actually quite the opposite) and I think that is creating some stress when thinking of being married.

Carl, what's the rush?
The biggest reason marriages fail is money problems. You are both what I would consider too young. No matter how great you get along, there is far too much living and experience to be had for both of you. If you get married too soon you may find it confining and it may hurt rather than help the relationship.

I married a great guy when we were both 21 - just out of university. It was short-lived because we were way too young. We never argued or disagreed much either, we just married too soon for us. We're still on good terms but we were wrong for each other. I am now happily married for the second time and I must admit I learned a lot from not listening to my gut feelings.

Whatever decision you make, make sure it feels right and you don't do it for the wrong reasons. If your girlfriend wants it and you don't, then it's not for the right reasons.

[Carl Carlson IV]

Thanks for the replies everyone!

I guess I need to clear something up that sounded wrong in the first post. I haven't really been going through a vicious cycle about it, that was a bit exaggerated. I know we are meant for each other, and we basically have already commnitted to each other anyway. As for money, I know we could at least support ourselves with what we make currently. That should not be an issue, but I guess I just want us to be more secure financially, which seems the be the tone in the replies as well! I'm going to see how the summer goes, and if I get the feeling that we're ready, I might pop the question on a beach or something (I know she would love this).

Any more replies are appreciated!

Edit - I guess I should clarify that the reason I made this thread wasn't necessarily so I could be convinced one way or the other. I think I just want to move forward in the next step in life, and I already have the hard part done (the girl!). There are times I feel ready and some minor things hold me back. I think it would be fun to move in and start the marriage learning process and everything.

[Matthew Shea]

I'm going to chime in on the side of waiting, too. Finances can cause a big strain in a marriage, even when there aren't really any "problems" per se. My wife and I went through some stress for a while over how to handle our daily finances, despite the fact that we were earning well in excess of what we were spending and had no debt (save our mortgage). If the finances were unstable to begin with, I imagine the problems would have only been magnified.

I'd suggest that you'll want a certain degree of stability before you go through with this. You don't need to wait forever, of course, but 21 is awfully young. I may be wrong, but I want to say that statistically, younger marriages tend to fail more frequently. The maturity that will come with your increasing years will give you the ability to make much better judgements moving forward.

Best of luck, whatever you decide.

[Angela]

It sounds like you've pretty much made up your mind, or I'd advise you to wait, too.

If you do go ahead and decide to go ahead, it would be a great idea to have a really in-depth talk before you get married about finances and, especially, about sexual fidelity. A pre-marriage counselor is a must!

She's 21, she's been with you for 4.5 years, and it is a 99.9999% chance that one or both of you will be faced with hot temptation to stray in the next few years, despite how passionate about each other you are. Are you willing to talk about that possibility and how you would each handle it now? If you're not, it won't be any easier later.

Same with money. There are a lot of issues that you don't even know you don't know; better to figure out together how you'll manage money now, so you're not surprised later on.

Getting married is a business decision as well as sentimental one. Do your due diligence -- get professional advice!!

(and best wishes to you.)

[Lychee]

It's very important for both people entering into a marriage to have similar values and they both must be mature enough to understand the ups and downs of life. Questioning is natural, but if there is a gut or emotional feeling within you which has an inkling of doubt regarding this person, you must listen to it.

I don't think 21 is too young to get married. We only think that because of the college years and how people like to "have fun" before they get married. It's just the norm to get married later. But now it's becoming the norm to have babies at 40...which isn't such a great idea for many reasons. People are pushing the age further and further.

It's all about values and beliefs. If you believe that marriage and faithfulness is important and your partner doesn't, there'll be problems. If someone in the relationship feels they are missing out on "having fun" during this time then there will be a problem. Maybe you guys could get together and write your expectations and goals for the marriage. I don't think you're growing up too fast if you feel this is the sound decision to make emotionally and practically. Society plays a role in marriages, but there are answers to problems which come up from other people and society. It all depends on if the two are strong enough to withstand against the pressure of society and remain faithful to themselves and to the relationship.

Remember, hearts change as do minds. You may feel 100% in love with her one day and not the day after...these things are normal. You have to make sure to be able to see if what you are feeling is a fleeting emotion or a deep feeling.

I think it would be a wise decision for you to get an idea of what you want to do and your plans of how you intend on achieving that goal (in regards to your career). Many divorces occur over financial matters, so it would be better if you guys get married when you are secure financially and can support a family.

[Carl Carlson IV]

I really appreciate the discussion!

I really don't want to sound naive or anything but temptation is not going to be a problem. We both have amazing communication, especially for our age. Some nights we just stay up for hours and hours and talk about our future, problems, goals, desires, etc etc. In all honesty, our relationship could not be better. I am not worried about being a 21 year old kid that wants to move on or meeting someone better. We read and grow together and are very open with how we like being shown love.

Last May we went through a situation where we felt we were growing apart. It was pretty tough, especially for her. However, we worked through it, made it better and are now closer than ever. If you would have asked me one year ago if I was going to be married soon I would have told you that you were crazy! But I keep feeling like it is the next step, and I want to take it.

Also, when it comes to finances it's not like we're unemployed and dead broke. I did kind of make it sound bad, but she has a job making decent money for around here and is still in school. I am currently in the process of setting up businesses and ideas, and am working here and there when I can. I know we could make it, but I do agree with money causing most marriage problems (my parents are no different). I'm not going to sit here and say "love will conquer all so I have nothing to worry about!" Because I do want to be prepared. This is one of the reasons I am going to wait until at least August and see how business/money goes.

Lychee, I totally agree with having similar values and beliefs. I can see how that could create rocky situations. I really like your idea about writing out goals and expectations, and I am sure she will too.

Angela, we have been advised by a few other couples to take marriage counseling and I think it is great idea. We know a couple who got married and had a lot of problems for the first year and counseling really changed everything around (and reading/growing together of course). So we will look into that for sure.

[openeyes]

In the past I would have thought 21 was too young, thinking a man should be at least 30 or 40 before even considering marriage, but if you two have made it for 4.5 years together at one of the most hormonally charged periods of life, not even being phased by the early years of college life, I'd say it just might work. If possible, plan some sort of shared activity such as hiking a section of the Appalachian Trail together for at least a couple weeks, and if at the end of the hike you two still want to get married, go for it. Plenty of older people marry with far less preparation. College educated people have fairly low divorce rates anyhow, particularly if both come from intact families: The State of Our Unions 2006

Finances are indeed the #1 killer of marriages, and that's been one of my prime reasons for holding off even thinking about marriage as well. By the time I was 18 I'd seriously dated at least two women that likely would have made fine wives. In neither case was I willing to make the adjustments that might have made marriage possible because I refused to even consider it until my finances were settled. After the 2nd one I stopped serious dating altogether, and decided not to start back unless/until I was ready to consider marriage, as I don't like falling for people in relationships that are treated as temporary. If both partners are fiscally responsible, early marriage could work. If not, it likely wouldn't work at any age.

[cela]

Carl,

My husband and I were married at the ages of 25 and 24, respectively. We had been dating for about 4.5 years prior as well.

How did we know it was the right time? I think it was a combination of wanting to have the big declaration of love for family and friends - to say in front of everyone, "Hey, this is the one! This is my life partner!" Of course, WE knew that within ourselves, and have no doubt we'll grow old together, certificate or no certificate!

The other factor that others have also mentioned is that we WERE financially secure and settled in our jobs by that time, and knew that a wedding was not going to be a huge, stressful 'thing' amidst uni/college, or moving house, or changing jobs or what-have-you.

Do it when it feels right! That's all I can really say! How wonderful for you to have a partner you care for so much, so early in your life - together you'll achieve great things!

[Red Willow]

Personally, I don't think you need to be financially settled to get married. You just need to have your financial priorities set up and be willing to communicate to your partner about financial concerns. It's true that most marital problems are over finances, but I don't think that's necessarily due to a lack of finances. People with plenty of money fight over it just the same.

[cela]

Oh, Red Willow, I agree - I meant financial 'security' in the sense that we were both cool with how to manage our finances (or lack thereof!). We are 'secure' with each others' views on money.

I don't want anyone thinking we were 'all set' at 24 and 25!

[Old Soul]

My deffention of marriage is the moment you and your partner commit to one another in a shared relationship, and sex is active.... the paper and ceremony i believe is more of a celebration where you are wanting to share your comitment with your friends......