I came in here for an argument

[Mondrian]

Originally Posted by RonSouther

Where in your life are you repressing yourself so much that you have to argue to let out this violence?

Everywhere. Particularly where other people are.

[Angela]

Originally Posted by Mondrian

I suppose I have my frustrations like anyone and want to voice those without being rejected. Do you know what I mean? I think there is a large uncivil side to us that is part of who we are. Speak for myself at least.

Perhaps I just want to know that I can be uncivil without and not be rejected.

Yes, I think I know what you mean: you want to be able to express this authentic part of you that isn't necessarily civil, and to feel like that's ok and you won't be rejected. Right?

You guys are effectively telling me I will be rejected for expressing part of who I am.

I get that you see it that way, and the way I see incivility is that it's not our identity (who we are), but rather, a behavior (a thing we do). I don't have any problem protecting a boundary that keeps out behaviors that don't work well for me, do you? If you have a party at your home and someone comes in and pulls your dog's tail and dumps out your aquarium on the living room floor and it seems clear that he's ok with that behavior, will you invite him back? It's not Who He Is that you'd be rejecting; it's what he does. He can be who he is and enjoy your party; he's just not free to trash your place without there being consequences that he might not enjoy so much.

I want to be honest and I will say something honest. I find the control of this forum quite cult-like (I don't care if this has been said before) and a lot of the posting quite cult-like too. I also find this forum a good place to explore and discuss different ideas and points of view and there are conversations I want to be part of. The whole human society and sub-societies are all quite cult-like in their own way, in my view, and this is probably necessary for them to run eficiently and achieve their function. But I don't want to be in a cult. I tend to get pleasure from challenging or rejecting cult-like activities.

Ok. Which is it going to be -- are you going to challenge the cult-like activities you see here, or are you going to reject them? I've seen lots of lots of people making this same assertion over the years I've been posting here, and so far, it hasn't made even a tiny bit of difference to the amount of qualities that are seen as cult-like, but who knows? You might. It seems a little unlikely to me, considering the recent conversations that make it look, to me, like the qualities you see as being cult-like are only going to be increasing around here.

Do you think you may be thinking about rejecting (making us wrong) to protect yourself from being rejected (being made wrong)?

[RonSouther]

Originally Posted by Mondrian

Everywhere. Particularly where other people are.

Exactly....but what you don't realize is that on this forum, you can be yourself.

Your hostility is better vented on a punching bag....then free of that energy, come here and make some real friends?

Sincerely try it. Yell, scream, punch, but in private.

[Mondrian]

Originally Posted by RonSouther

Exactly....but what you don't realize is that on this forum, you can be yourself.

Your hostility is better vented on a punching bag....then free of that energy, come here and make some real friends?

Sincerely try it. Yell, scream, punch, but in private.

I don't think that quite speaks to what I'm saying, and is rather glib advice.

[RonSouther]

Originally Posted by Mondrian

I don't think that quite speaks to what I'm saying, and is rather glib advice.

It's not speaking to what you're saying, it's speaking to your need to vent. You've chosen to use this message board as a punching bag. Except this forum punches back, feeding your ego...ok, they asked for a fight and you're happy to escalate it.

All you're doing is purging your uncounscious mind that is packed full of repressed emotions and thoughts. I'm reading through your recent messages and you're clearly looking for a fight.

And in total sincerity you're missing a huge opportunity.

[Mondrian]

Originally Posted by RonSouther

It's not speaking to what you're saying, it's speaking to your need to vent. You've chosen to use this message board as a punching bag. Except this forum punches back, feeding your ego...ok, they asked for a fight and you're happy to escalate it.

All you're doing is purging your uncounscious mind that is packed full of repressed emotions and thoughts. I'm reading through your recent messages and you're clearly looking for a fight.

And in total sincerity you're missing a huge opportunity.

I'm happy for the forum to punch back.

I'm not sure what you mean by feeding my ego.

I don't see that I'm missing an opportunity, but, rether, siezing the opportunity to have a fight and purge my unconscious, as you put it.

What opportunity am I missing? The friends one? I'm not looking to make friends here.

[RonSouther]

Originally Posted by Mondrian

I'm happy for the forum to punch back.

I'm not sure what you mean by feeding my ego.

I don't see that I'm missing an opportunity, but, rether, siezing the opportunity to have a fight and purge my unconscious, as you put it.

What op. am I missing?

Does love pick a fight, hoping to get punched back, or is it ego that does that?

If you can pick a fight and dominate the fight, you got fresh meat to feel superior with.

The opportunity lost is that most people won't care about you. And when you're fighting you're still not being yourself. You're being your false self that you use to feel good about you, but it takes work and effort and it's a comparison game.

Do you resonate with this quote, "'Stupid' judges 'Intelligence' to be 'Retarded'"?

[Mondrian]

Originally Posted by Angela

Yes, I think I know what you mean: you want to be able to express this authentic part of you that isn't necessarily civil, and to feel like that's ok and you won't be rejected. Right?

Yes

Originally Posted by Angela

I get that you see it that way, and the way I see incivility is that it's not our identity (who we are), but rather, a behavior (a thing we do). I don't have any problem protecting a boundary that keeps out behaviors that don't work well for me, do you? If you have a party at your home and someone comes in and pulls your dog's tail and dumps out your aquarium on the living room floor and it seems clear that he's ok with that behavior, will you invite him back? It's not Who He Is that you'd be rejecting; it's what he does. He can be who he is and enjoy your party; he's just not free to trash your place without there being consequences that he might not enjoy so much.

I don't really want to get imto philosophical nitpicking, but for me, I think this distinction between identity and behaviour is somewhat artificial. I am not anything without action. To be is to act. At least, in the physical world, for there is no existence that isn't also behaviour.

I'm all for civilisation where it suits me. I want all the usual benefits of society and civilisation but I also want somewhere substantial that I am free from the constrainst of civilisation.

Originally Posted by Angela

Ok. Which is it going to be -- are you going to challenge the cult-like activities you see here, or are you going to reject them? I've seen lots of lots of people making this same assertion over the years I've been posting here, and so far, it hasn't made even a tiny bit of difference to the amount of qualities that are seen as cult-like, but who knows? You might. It seems a little unlikely to me, considering the recent conversations that make it look, to me, like the qualities you see as being cult-like are only going to be increasing around here.

I'm happy to have a different perspective from you on the cult-like qualities of this place as well as any other social order.

Originally Posted by Angela

Do you think you may be thinking about rejecting (making us wrong) to protect yourself from being rejected (being made wrong)?

I already do reject you. I have rejected you in the past and I will probably reject you again, that is, I will disagree with you and not come here to talk.

There's a bit of that going on, yes. I do want to make you wrong. But it's not just a question of right or wrong, rather, one of whether you're conversation is what I am interested in at the moment. If it is not, thn I will reject you.

Similarly, you rejecting me doesn't make me wrong, but rather, probably suits you better if you're not interested in what I'm saying.

[RonSouther]

My guess is that you are intelligent and tired of being treated like you're retarded....this is my story of waking up to my frustration....ADHD Self Help - A Story of Healing - Profound-Self-Help.com

I used to get these thoughts of truly wanting to pummel someone, anyone.

I used to fight with people in my head, taking on both sides of the argument. I didn't have the courage to actually confront the person so I vented in my head and it cost me dearly in physical stress as I wasn't actually venting.

[Mondrian]

Originally Posted by RonSouther

Does love pick a fight, hoping to get punched back, or is it ego that does that?

If you can pick a fight and dominate the fight, you got fresh meat to feel superior with.

The opportunity lost is that most people won't care about you. And when you're fighting you're still not being yourself. You're being your false self that you use to feel good about you, but it takes work and effort and it's a comparison game.

Do you resonate with this quote, "'Stupid' judges 'Intelligence' to be 'Retarded'"?

I don't recognise your terms 'ego' and 'love'. What are you talking about?

I don't think people care about me anyway so I've nothing lost.

Who are you to tell me I'm not being myself when fighting. Where do you get this insider knowledge of me?

[RonSouther]

Originally Posted by Mondrian

I don't recognise your terms 'ego' and 'love'. What are you talking about?

I don't think people care about me anyway so I've nothing lost.

Who are you to tell me I'm not being myself when fighting. Where do you get this insider knowledge of me?

You're a human being...I'm a human being. It takes one to know one?

[Criseyde]

This thread could also be titled "How to get the mods to watch you like my cat turning her laser eye-beams on a tiny, tiny mouse"... I'm just sayin'.

I also think it's disingenuous to announce that you came here for an argument, then get upset when people tell you that this forum isn't strictly speaking FOR that. It's a personal development forum, not a debating forum. Arguments do happen, and they are completely allowed, so long as everyone behaves in a mutually respectful fashion -- but that's not the purpose here.

Are you interested in personal growth, or are you interested in picking fights?

[Mondrian]

Originally Posted by RonSouther

My guess is that you are intelligent and tired of being treated like you're retarded....this is my story of waking up to my frustration....ADHD Self Help - A Story of Healing - Profound-Self-Help.com

I used to get these thoughts of truly wanting to pummel someone, anyone.

I used to fight with people in my head, taking on both sides of the argument. I didn't have the courage to actually confront the person so I vented in my head and it cost me dearly in physical stress as I wasn't actually venting.

You're guess isn't completely off the mark but doesn't really hit the spot either.

I do find physical activity to be a good outlet for enrgy, frustration, aggression, violence. Lots of things actually, and 'positive' creative ones too. I would like to do more of it and in new forms.

It sounds like an interesting story you've got there.

[RonSouther]

Originally Posted by Mondrian

You're guess isn't completely off the mark but doesn't really hit the spot either.

I do find physical activity to be a good outlet for enrgy, frustration, aggression, violence. Lots of things actually, and 'positive' creative ones too. I would like to do more of it and in new forms.

It sounds like an interesting story you've got there.

Check it out....I see the real you behind the angry "you". I'm very sincere....thanks for allowing me to share with you....

You remind me of my old "self". And I know you can find the happiness you need.

[Angela]

Ok, Mondrian. Goodbye!

[RonSouther]

Originally Posted by Angela

Ok, Mondrian. Goodbye!

Mondrian...that's a missed opportunity to share with a potential new friend....oops...

[Mondrian]

Originally Posted by Criseyde

This thread could also be titled "How to get the mods to watch you like my cat turning her laser eye-beams on a tiny, tiny mouse"... I'm just sayin'.

I also think it's disingenuous to announce that you came here for an argument, then get upset when people tell you that this forum isn't strictly speaking FOR that. It's a personal development forum, not a debating forum. Arguments do happen, and they are completely allowed, so long as everyone behaves in a mutually respectful fashion -- but that's not the purpose here.

Are you interested in personal growth, or are you interested in picking fights?

Are you interested in PG or are you just interested in making bland comments?

I can get upset at whatever I want. I don't see what's disingenuous about it either. If I get upset, I say about how I am upset = genuous.

A PD forum but not a debating forum? How do you know what form my PD takes? maybe I have a different style from you.

[Wombels]

Originally Posted by nistacular

I feel like too many people think arguments are so negative, and also so many people are scared shitless of negative emotions, or at least with disagreeing with people.... I absolutely think discussions should be as open and honest as possible at all costs. What'd ya want to argue about? lol

At the same time, deliberately provoking people or saying things you know to be offensive might have consequences in some settings.... lol

It's normal, most individuals hide or linger behind a wall, mostly a low self-esteem is responsible for this to be a reality, while hurt is the main factor they have started to build one in the first place.

The root of this wall building is to be found in poor familial education, most parents assume to know what is best for their offspring, mostly they are wrong but not aware of being as such, still they act out of a protection mode believing they are doing the right thing, this causes confusion and in many way's at a later age rebellion from their kids, they turn away from the parental nonsense while as young as they can be sometimes become or get entangled in what seems to be the biggest nightmare of all parents.
Character is another factor which influences the degree of separation all along, most kids these day's lack in (receiving) love.

[Mondrian]

Originally Posted by Angela

Ok, Mondrian. Goodbye!

Bye.

[Mondrian]

Originally Posted by RonSouther

Mondrian...that's a missed opportunity to share with a potential new friend....oops...

When one door closes another opens, or something.

[ZephyrusX]

Lets rumble!

What are we arguing about?

[RonSouther]

Originally Posted by Mondrian

When one door closes another opens, or something.

The door is always open so long as you don't kick it shut....Open minds welcome you, closed minds run away from you.

Nearly everyone can be closed up by words. Few will see you for who you are inspite of your confusion.

And you're confused, right? Are you happy? No... Who can be confused and happy? Impossible.

[Criseyde]

Originally Posted by Mondrian

Are you interested in PG or are you just interested in making bland comments?

I can get upset at whatever I want. I don't see what's disingenuous about it either. If I get upset, I say about how I am upset = genuous.

A PD forum but not a debating forum? How do you know what form my PD takes? maybe I have a different style from you.

I'm not going to give you an argument. What do you think about the forum rules?

[RonSouther]

Anger Management Self Help - Arguments - Profound-Self-Help.com

Self Help Anger Management - Profound-Self-Help.com

[RonSouther]

Originally Posted by ZephyrusX

Lets rumble!

What are we arguing about?

dang...nearly jumped out of my skin!

[Mondrian]

Originally Posted by ZephyrusX

Lets rumble!

What are we arguing about?

I'm not sure I can summarise it effectively.

[RonSouther]

Originally Posted by Mondrian

I'm not sure I can summarise it effectively.

Right, because you're releasing emotions, not making a statement. It just feels good to dump this venom, right?

You're not fighting for a cause, you're fighting for your sanity....

[Mondrian]

Originally Posted by Criseyde

I'm not going to give you an argument. What do you think about the forum rules?

I don't want to give you an argument. You came on here accusing me of picking fights.

I have checked the rules and I am as fine as anyone else in this thread.

[Mondrian]

Originally Posted by RonSouther

Right, because you're releasing emotions, not making a statement. It just feels good to dump this venom, right?

You're not fighting for a cause, you're fighting for your sanity....

Why do you insist on telling me what I'm doing? I'm here, it's okay, I've got a brain too. It's starting to be make me laugh (in partially affectionate kind of way).

[ZephyrusX]

I'm not sure if I can argue with that.

Why are you frustrated? You mentioned that debating can be good to vent and let off steam, but then, that implies you are venting about something.

Originally Posted by Mondrian

I'm not sure I can summarise it effectively.