Ladies this one is for you

[Gregooooo]

Ladies, this one is for you. Your mother always told you “Don’t give away the farm.” Yet men have been saying, “Why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free?” It’s a paradox; women think they need to put out, or they’ll lose their man. Men don’t want a woman who puts out; at least not long term they don’t. Are you the type of woman who men take home to bed; or the type who men take home to meet Mom?

One man described it this way, “When I’m talking to a woman, either on-line, on the phone, or in person, who do you think is the first person to bring up sex? Almost always it’s the woman. I don’t. I can tell almost instantly if the woman is classy or cheap. I want a woman who is confident, not insecure and thinks she needs to attract me by offering up free sex. What healthy, heterosexual man doesn’t want or enjoy sex with a woman? But I don’t want someone that everyone else has enjoyed. A classy woman is intriguing, mysterious and alluring. Her appearance and the way she carries herself can be very appealing. There’s a huge difference between sexy and sleazy; and unfortunately many woman don’t know the difference.”

Ladies wise up! If you don’t understand why you keep attracting the wrong men, it’s because your standards are too low. Set the bar higher. Do not engage in innuendos or blatant conversation that is sexual in nature. Just don’t do it. You may think you are flirting; but what you are doing is sending a signal to the man that you’re easy. You may hook him for a time. You may both be filled with infatuation, but it won’t last. Men will look at you as the good time gal; not as a keeper.

What are you wearing? Low rise jeans and tummy shirts are in. They’re not in if you don’t have the body to wear that style of clothing and they’re not in if you’re trying to convince the men that you’re a classy lady. That is not to say you need to haul out the turtle neck sweaters and long skirts which cover up your ankles.

You will not be able to change your belief system overnight; your views on what men want. But what you can change almost instantly is how you dress and how you talk. Decide today that you will not openly discuss sex or make comments of a sexual nature with men. There are ways you can let someone know you’re interested without sounding like a hootchie mamma. And lastly, take inventory of your wardrobe. Leave a little to the imagination, don’t show it all.

Men want a classy woman.

[Curtis2011]

Originally Posted by Gregooooo

Men want a classy woman.

Well, classy men want a classy woman.

Unclassy men just want whores.

[Lioness]

We were discussing feminism on another thread, and I think this represents one of the intended consequence of it.

With the invention of the pill and women asserting their rights, there became this idea in the air that women could and should be as sexually assertive as men. They no longer had to play a game of being coy and prudish.

But I suppose your post illustrates the old adage, the more things change, the more they stay the same. Mens attitudes about the whole Madonna/whore thing haven't really changed, in general.

What are you wearing? Low rise jeans and tummy shirts are in...they’re not in if you’re trying to convince the men that you’re a classy lady... And lastly, take inventory of your wardrobe. Leave a little to the imagination, don’t show it all.

I think our media has a lot to do with how women dress. You hear men extolling the desirability of a woman based on breasts, legs, sexy clothing etc. They drool at Britney and Beyonce videos, so young women buy into that. And why shouldn't they, they're hearing it from guys. Is it really guys who are playing a game?

Dressing too modestly will get you unnoticed, or even rejected by a lot of men. I suppose being stylish without showing too much is the way to go. But you know, women enjoy dressing sexily for their man. What do you think if you're already in a relationship with a "classy" woman and she wants to wear high stillettos and a slinky litle dress when you go out - just for you? Do you think differently of her?

Originally Posted by Gregooooo

It’s a paradox; women think they need to put out, or they’ll lose their man.

I've seen cases where a man won't wait and moves on, so this fear is based in reality.

If you don’t understand why you keep attracting the wrong men, it’s because your standards are too low. Set the bar higher. Do not engage in innuendos or blatant conversation that is sexual in nature. Just don’t do it. You may think you are flirting; but what you are doing is sending a signal to the man that you’re easy. You may hook him for a time. You may both be filled with infatuation, but it won’t last. Men will look at you as the good time gal; not as a keeper.

I agree with this. I think a part of a woman leading with sexy-bait is impatience. Today, women want an instant realationship when they meet a guy they are really attracted to at the right time. It doesn't happen all that often. Doesn't mean they're a whore for every guy who's interested in them. And if the sex is great, they think that it's going to be a great, lasting relationship. So I think what you're saying here is important for women to understand.

It's not always that clearcut, though. I was reading where this woman had done everything wild thing her man wanted sexually for years, thinking this would keep him satisfied. He left her and married a virginal type. But plenty of men leave the classy "I-don't-do-that-" woman for someone more adventurous. It can be very confusing.

[ZephyrusX]

Greego has been banned, Lioness. I'm not sure if that influences your desire to participate in this thread or not. Personally, I found the original post incredibly condescending and it reeks of double standards and objectification.

I think it is wise for young women to become assertive enough where they will negotiate their sexuality with their partners as opposed to just doing whatever that will please young men (as it is now, many young women in the U.S do not wear a condom because young men think it some how diminishes their pleasure, which there is no proof of that I am aware of), but I think they ought to do that in order to protect their own interests, health and self-esteem. It shouldn't have anything to do with satisfying the gaze of the objectifier or satisfying some archaic gender norm concerning sexuality.

Originally Posted by Lioness

Dressing too modestly will get you unnoticed, or even rejected by a lot of men. I suppose being stylish without showing too much is the way to go. But you know, women enjoy dressing sexily for their man. What do you think if you're already in a relationship with a "classy" woman and she wants to wear high stillettos and a slinky litle dress when you go out - just for you? Do you think differently of her?

[Mariana Trench]

Lioness, and the anyone who's thoughts reflect the OP, though the actual text was just stock pasted from something going around, the fundamental mindset that requires all this "strategizing" is screwed up. I am seriously baffled at anyone who thinks a fulfilling relationship can be built on the basis of trying to mind read what the other wants in an attempt to covertly bargain for their wants. 'Blech' to all the ridiculous, unnecessary deception, and the misogyny and misandry it ends up reinforcing by discouraging people from ever actually approaching potential partners as, first and foremost, individual people. (Not to mention how many people end up hating the opposite sex because their idiotic dating games failed.) So many screwed up things in this thread, so little time...

Edit: For general information, Greego was banned because this was a cross post.

[Ubershift]

I really think relationships and dating is quite simple; let sex happen naturally, and let the relationship grow at it's own pace. If you like the girl, she likes you, and you're willing to work on it there's no problem.

That being said, i know of a husband and wife (friends parents) that had sex the first day they met each other and have been happily married for 10 years (no affairs or anything of the sort).

[Mariana Trench]

And, might I add, someone comfortable with you bringing up your sexuality in an honest way, and willing to openly discuss those matters for the benefit of you both, is generally a sign of someone who will respect you. The real respect where talking to you is not considered a chore, and is fundamentally built on the understand of shared humanity and admiration of character traits--not the "respect" that consists of shallow gestures and considers basic human decency a privileged that can be taken away.

[ainsleigh]

Originally Posted by Mariana Trench

Lioness, and the anyone who's thoughts reflect the OP, though the actual text was just stock pasted from something going around, the fundamental mindset that requires all this "strategizing" is screwed up. I am seriously baffled at anyone who thinks a fulfilling relationship can be built on the basis of trying to mind read what the other wants in an attempt to covertly bargain for their wants. 'Blech' to all the ridiculous, unnecessary deception, and the misogyny and misandry it ends up reinforcing by discouraging people from ever actually approaching potential partners as, first and foremost, individual people. (Not to mention how many people end up hating the opposite sex because their idiotic dating games failed.) So many screwed up things in this thread, so little time...

Edit: For general information, Greego was banned because this was a cross post.

I agree....

[Lioness]

Originally Posted by Mariana Trench

the fundamental mindset that requires all this "strategizing" is screwed up. I am seriously baffled at anyone who thinks a fulfilling relationship can be built on the basis of trying to mind read what the other wants in an attempt to covertly bargain for their wants. 'Blech' to all the ridiculous, unnecessary deception...

Thanks for the edit, I thought - agree or disagree, it was worth discussing. because obviously, we all don't understand the thinking of the opposite sex. I think a lot of men still have these attitudes, even if they don't show it outwardly. Knowledge is power.

I absolutely hate the game playing and double standards too, but I do think some women lose an opportunity by coming on too strong initially. I don't like it when a guy is overtly sexual right away either, do you? I don't think it's mysogynistic for him to opine that some dress too skimpily for his taste. Frankly I'm not feeling the way some guys dress now - the sagging pants, the 50 tatoos, and some wear those huge ear-stretcher thingies, but, I digress. At least it was an opportunity to hash out these issues.

[Moriarty]

I noticed by other Gregooo posts, he seems to hold a one-eyed male view about women and the role we are supposedly meant to play. To give him some credit though, his OP does carry some weight. There is still that kind of thought floating out there, even though the female role is slowly equalising.

Over here, women are taking on male-oriented trades now, slowly infiltrating the male world. Men are accepting house-mum roles more readily. Yet there's still that desire to keep dynamic role playing tucked neatly into its box and tied up tight. I'm not so sure either, that some elements of how genders still see each other will ever change....at least, not in my time.

Personally, I don't allow social influence to rule how I wish to be. If others, including men, don't like how I present myself, then the onus is on them. What I do in my own home and family unit, is different again.

I think we need to stop allowing outside influence to rule our lives and live it genuinely. Authentic people are steady people and are soon spotted and relied upon by many.

[Lioness]

Originally Posted by Moriarty

Personally, I don't allow social influence to rule how I wish to be. If others, including men, don't like how I present myself, then the onus is on them.

This is admirable self-confidence. I think we do try to people-please too much, but on the other hand, there are times when it makes sense to consider how you are being perceived.

Women are not necessarily being themselves when they talk and dress very sexily. Many of us have bought into media images that tell us what is attractive. That's why I agreed with what some of the OP was saying. We may be behaving a certain way, thinking it will be to our advantage, when it's actually not.

[elucidate]

Originally Posted by Lioness

This is admirable self-confidence. I think we do try to people-please too much, but on the other hand, there are times when it makes sense to consider how you are being perceived.

Women are not necessarily being themselves when they talk and dress very sexily. Many of us have bought into media images that tell us what is attractive. That's why I agreed with what some of the OP was saying. We may be behaving a certain way, thinking it will be to our advantage, when it's actually not.

For me, when I'm at work, this is the only time when I think about how I am perceived and that I am representing someone elses business, so I dress appropriately, but in most other cases I tend to just dress down from habit, because I'm not really interested in pleasing anyone else.

Sometimes it's fun to dress up of course and go out, but it is rarely done with the thought of pleasing anyone else but myself. Occasionally I do catch myself falling back into thinking about what to wear that might please a man I like, but then I stop myself and just go with what feels good for me...which is usually what is attractive to the right guy anyway, when you feel at your best and comfortable.

Many men make the mistake of thinking that women dress for them. Mostly this is not the case these days. If anything, women dress for themselves or other women, for the fashion game they like to play. It doesn't have anything to do with men a lot of the time, but they think it's all about them.

[Moriarty]

Originally Posted by elucidate;1044562

[QUOTE

It doesn't have anything to do with men a lot of the time, but they think it's all about them.

[/QUOTE]

Amen to that!

[CroMagna]

Grego, you just solidified my misanthropy. You're a misogynist.

Originally Posted by Gregooooo

Ladies, this one is for you.

No it's not. It's for you. It's all about your desires without any regard for what the woman wants.

Your mother always told you “Don’t give away the farm.”

My mother never talked to me about sex. She let me decide for myself what I wanted out of life.

It’s a paradox; women think they need to put out, or they’ll lose their man.

Have you ever thought that women "put out" because they want to? Because they enjoy sex as much as the man does?

Men don’t want a woman who puts out; at least not long term they don’t.

Oh I get it. So men get to play two roles, the stud and the gentleman, at varying points in their life. They get to sow their royal oats and later fall in love. But women have to choose either casual sex or love.

Are you the type of woman who men take home to bed; or the type who men take home to meet Mom?

See? Women are put into a particular box: angel or whore. Men get to play to both sides of the fence.

I want a woman who is confident, not insecure and thinks she needs to attract me by offering up free sex.

It's all about you isn't it? Has it ever occurred to you that the woman went online to get laid? That she's merely using you? That YOU'RE not the type she wants to bring home to mom?

What healthy, heterosexual man doesn’t want or enjoy sex with a woman?

What healthy, heterosexual woman doesn't want or enjoy sex with a man?

A classy woman is intriguing, mysterious and alluring.

Tell that to Marc Antony's wife, who was ignored for Cleopatra. Trophies are considered boring. I know because I was one in my first relationship. I was a 22 year old virgin. I was cheated on and dump for "sluts". I never resorted to slut shaming because I never liked the double standard. I merely took advice from guys like you who pressure women into repressing themselves.
I know better now. No matter what a woman does, she may get disrespected because everyone gets disrespected. The Queen of England got disrespected. Hillary Clinton got disrespected. But as long as you're being authentic, it doesn't matter.

Ladies wise up! If you don’t understand why you keep attracting the wrong men

I thought all guys were sluts. There you go sending mixed signals.

Do not engage in innuendos or blatant conversation that is sexual in nature. Just don’t do it.

So not only must we refrain from having sex, we also must refraining from even alluding to it??

Men will look at you as the good time gal; not as a keeper.

So men get to be "good time guys" and later be keepers but women don't have that luxury? That's fair.

Men want a classy woman

Tell that to my first boyfriend who dumped me for sluts. Tell that to my old roommate, a 23 year old virgin who kept getting dumped on the third date once she told the guy she was a virgin. Tell that to my lovers, who support my attitude. Stop sending mixed signals about what men want!! Men want everything. They want to have their cake and eat it too. They want to put women in categories and boxes for their own purposes. They want to send the message that they want a sexy whore who gets all the attention and goofy smiles from guys, then send the message that they only respect and want a lady, who they previously considered boring. They want to pretend the whole world revolves around them.

[st33med]

Originally Posted by CroMagna

Grego, you just solidified my misanthropy. You're a misogynist.

And he's also banned.

[Lioness]

Originally Posted by CroMagna

Men want everything. They want to have their cake and eat it too. They want to put women in categories and boxes for their own purposes. They want to send the message that they want a sexy whore who gets all the attention and goofy smiles from guys, then send the message that they only respect and want a lady, who they previously considered boring. .

I have to say bravo to this.

Who knows WTF they really want half the time? Do they even know?

That said, there are some really admirable guys on this forum. Funny they've had little to say on this so far....

[elucidate]

Originally Posted by Lioness

I have to say bravo to this.

Who knows WTF they really want half the time? Do they even know?

That said, there are some really admirable guys on this forum. Funny they've had little to say on this so far....

I can say, from being in my line of work for only a couple of weeks...many men want a good, "classy" wife who will make them look good, sit home and raise their kids for them, while they are out paying for handjobs and god knows what else from "good time girls".

Men want their cake and eat it to, but don't you dare try and do the same as a woman...or they'll ruin you.

Solution: Don't give a damn what men think. Do what you want. You'll get categorized either way, so may as well have some fun!

Eventually they will get it through their thick skulls that it's really not about them after all.

[NursingGirl]

Originally Posted by CroMagna

Men want everything. They want to have their cake and eat it too. They want to put women in categories and boxes for their own purposes. They want to send the message that they want a sexy whore who gets all the attention and goofy smiles from guys, then send the message that they only respect and want a lady, who they previously considered boring. They want to pretend the whole world revolves around them.

Wait a minute. I was with you through everything you said until this here. Aren't you doing the same thing as the OP? Why don't we change this quote to "some men"?

[aelle]

Originally Posted by Lioness

I have to say bravo to this.

Who knows WTF they really want half the time? Do they even know?

That said, there are some really admirable guys on this forum. Funny they've had little to say on this so far....

In my experience, if you stop playing games - have sex when you want, talk dirty if you feel like it, enforce your boundaries with pride, dress however it pleases you, be genuine, and become the best version of yourself, not of someone else's ideal - you will eventually attract men who have no interest in playing games either. And in the meantime, you will have lead a life according to your own codes.

[elucidate]

Originally Posted by NursingGirl

Wait a minute. I was with you through everything you said until this here. Aren't you doing the same thing as the OP? Why don't we change this quote to "some men"?

I need to rephrase what I said as well.

While I think there are a lot of men who think this way, there are definitely some really decent, exceptional ones out there, and when they fall in love, that's it...they only want that one person and would never jeopardize what they have for something that is only a fling.

I want to meet more who are like this.

[NursingGirl]

Originally Posted by elucidate

I need to rephrase what I said as well.

While I think there are a lot of men who think this way, there are definitely some really decent, exceptional ones out there, and when they fall in love, that's it...they only want that one person and would never jeopardize what they have for something that is only a fling.

I want to meet more who are like this.

Thumbs up to that!

[Laurenaus]

i was just about to spew out a huge case against the OP's post but then realized he was banned so oh well.

Just wanted to mention that sometimes it doesn't matter if a girl comes off classy or slutty on first impression and what really matters is if the guy is ready for a relationship. You can wait till date 8 to "put out" but if he doesn't want anything more he won't continue anything even if you managed to "stay classy" until date 8. My best and longest relationship began with being intimate during our first hang out sesh so my ex would've missed out if he quickly wrote me off as a slut under those circumstances.

Op also mentions that a guy doesn't want a girl whose been enjoyed by everyone. Newsflash, unless the girl is a virgin I don't care how "classy" she appears she's been with others before him and its a fact of life everyone has to come to terms with when dating someone new.

[Moriarty]

Laurenaus;1045993]
Op also mentions that a guy doesn't want a girl whose been enjoyed by everyone. Newsflash, unless the girl is a virgin I don't care how "classy" she appears she's been with others before him and its a fact of life everyone has to come to terms with when dating someone new

That goes both ways! At least, in my books it does. I damn sure dont want some guy who has a notch belt. Yucko!

[Agota]

I think people often confuse to trends:

There's a trend when young women have sex with whoever they want to because they enjoy sex and they make conscious decisions regarding it.

There's a trend when young women have sex with random guys because they're very insecure and think that they'll get a guy by doing whatever pleases him (like girls who have sex without condoms because guys complain, as Zephyrus mentioned).

I think the first trend is healthy and the second one isn't

[Agota]

I also think that men often classify women who sleep with them early in a relationship as not classy not because of sex itself, but because they have sex from a place of insecurity and men sense that.

I mean, imagine if a woman like Angelina Jolie in "Tourist" would have sex with a guy on their first date, do you really think that a guy would lose interest? I highly doubt it.

[AllTogetherNow]

I also think that men often classify women

Agota, you coulda stopped right there!

[Agota]

[ZephyrusX]

And yet, that doesn't stop some men from taking advantage of their insecurity. It seems disingenuous to impose negative judgment, but then be willing to fully take advantage of that person.

Originally Posted by Agota

I also think that men often classify women who sleep with them early in a relationship as not classy not because of sex itself, but because they have sex from a place of insecurity and men sense that.

[Agota]

Originally Posted by ZephyrusX

And yet, that doesn't stop some men from taking advantage of their insecurity. It seems disingenuous to impose negative judgment, but then be willing to fully take advantage of that person.

..and then, feel morally superior, although you did the exactly same thing that the girl did

[Lifeisamazing]

Originally Posted by NursingGirl

Wait a minute. I was with you through everything you said until this here. Aren't you doing the same thing as the OP? Why don't we change this quote to "some men"?

Thanks for stepping in! I felt a little insulted.

I think there's no "You're supposed to." Like I heard from Nate Green, "You aren't supposed to do ♥♥♥♥." Everything is based on what you and the other person likes/wants.

I would indeed like my girlfriend to be a traditional mom in the future, but only as long as she likes it too. It seems that she imagines that as a great thing based on our conversations.

As with what women should wear, again, whatever they please. I personally don't appreciate high heels very much, because they are unhealthy. Like my good friend described how he met his girlfriend for the first time: "She came from work wearing high heels. After walking on the street for some time, she just said ♥♥♥♥ it and took them off. At that point, I knew I wanted that girl." If you don't get the message, he liked how she was being herself and not acting how she was supposed to.