Can you change the basics of how your mind works?

[RonSouther]

Originally Posted by NursingGirl

Yes, to some extent, this is true. She definitely has an entitled attitude. We were texting one day (we text even though we live in the same house, lol) and it was somewhat of a deep conversation for the two of us to be having and it was initiated by her. I forget what she was trying to "get" from me, but I was explaining that I love her (blah, blah, blah- that's what it sounds like to her) and she replied that I had to love her and take care of her because it is my job and she didn't choose to be here and I have a responsibility. I just felt so warm and cozy inside, lol. Basically, SHE does not have a responsibility to ME. Our relationship is nothing more than me being her Mom because I have to and she owes me nothing for it. I have told her before that she doesn't have to say EVERYTHING that pops into her mind. It is a good idea to examine it for harshness first. Oh well. She will be entering the school of hard knocks and experience soon because next year, she will be living on college campus and she will find out how wonderful to her I was/am.

With my kids, I realize that I brought them into the world and that they didn't ask to be here. I make sure never to treat them as my property. It was more fun when they were so eager to love before their egos got developed, but at the same time, I'm forced to find ways to stay ahead of them intelligently so that I don't have to use arm-twisting to get their cooperation. In other words, if I can use intelligent perspective to gain their support, then they want to help me or help themselves.

I don't take anything they blurt out personally. And I encourage them to speak freely. To me, the home must be a place of absolutely freedom of expression and not a boot camp of obedience. The rest of life is about obedience training and home should be a place to be exactly what the person is. That doesn't mean to put up with abusive behavior, however, my feeling is that if the child truly can relax at home, what need is there to escape or be abusive?

She won't truly love you until she can find her self and love herself. Trying to get her approval is futile. This parenting job is truly thankless for a really long time until the kid gets his own experience as a parent so just love unconditionally and seek a deeper understanding of self and life in the meantime. The benefit is to become free of the need for approval and affirmation.

[BillieAnn]

My friend, nothing can be as before. These emotions are in childhood. Today all is of interest. It is not up to you. World going craze!

[NursingGirl]

Originally Posted by The Backward OX

Good point.

No. I don't really think that is the most beneficial way to approach this situation. You started out wanting to find ways to improve and you were on the right track. I think that an expert on autistism/asperger's issues would be a good start. Another idea that I think my daughter would accept would be to suggest that (as she already knows) other people connect on an emotional level in relationships and to study this approach to connection. You may not understand it, but you could replicate it to "try it on". I wouldn't support this idea on any unsuspecting person because it would advocate being deceptive in that particular circumstance. Don't we all have to "fake it 'til we make it" regarding confidence and sales technique and other social situations? Have you ever watched the movie, A Beautiful Mind? The conditions are not comparable to yours in that Russell Crowe was actually schizophrenic but he had to learn (by logic) which voices were real and how to function in social situations and in his relationship with his wife. It seemed pretty true to life to me. One difference I noted was that his wife didn't give up on him (and he didn't give up on himself) and it seems acceptable in this society today not to invest long term in people or to claim responsibility for oneself. I've seen lots of people throughout my daughters' life who have abandoned her or didn't attempt to understand her perspective. My daughter and I are in counseling together because she formed an unhealthy internet relationship with a 40+ year old guy. In all her logic, she still does not understand that his motivations were not the same as hers and the "connection" she felt that they had was not real but based on what was motivating him. I suppose those are all the details anyone needs in this post about that topic. My point being that though you may think that logic is enough, you have emotional needs as well-no matter how small they are at this point- and it benefits you to be aware of those needs and to more fully develop them so that you are not deceived.

[Ronnie Brown]

Originally Posted by bodi

Ox,

Psycho-Cybernetics, by Maxwell Maltz.

Precisely. Transforming the self-image is key. Always has been, always will be. I would also recommend Steve's book, Personal Development for Smart People, especially the chapters on truth, love, power, and oneness.

The combination of the two books would be an excellent starting point for anyone...

[The Backward OX]

Originally Posted by NursingGirl

No. I don't really think that is the most beneficial way to approach this situation. You started out wanting to find ways to improve and you were on the right track. I think that an expert on autistism/asperger's issues would be a good start. Another idea that I think my daughter would accept would be to suggest that (as she already knows) other people connect on an emotional level in relationships and to study this approach to connection. You may not understand it, but you could replicate it to "try it on". I wouldn't support this idea on any unsuspecting person because it would advocate being deceptive in that particular circumstance. Don't we all have to "fake it 'til we make it" regarding confidence and sales technique and other social situations? Have you ever watched the movie, A Beautiful Mind? The conditions are not comparable to yours in that Russell Crowe was actually schizophrenic but he had to learn (by logic) which voices were real and how to function in social situations and in his relationship with his wife. It seemed pretty true to life to me. One difference I noted was that his wife didn't give up on him (and he didn't give up on himself) and it seems acceptable in this society today not to invest long term in people or to claim responsibility for oneself. I've seen lots of people throughout my daughters' life who have abandoned her or didn't attempt to understand her perspective. My daughter and I are in counseling together because she formed an unhealthy internet relationship with a 40+ year old guy. In all her logic, she still does not understand that his motivations were not the same as hers and the "connection" she felt that they had was not real but based on what was motivating him. I suppose those are all the details anyone needs in this post about that topic. My point being that though you may think that logic is enough, you have emotional needs as well-no matter how small they are at this point- and it benefits you to be aware of those needs and to more fully develop them so that you are not deceived.

You raise more interesting points than I could even begin to address in a month of Sundays. My original post was somewhat tongue-in-cheek as I also neglected to mention my age. At 75, it may all be a bit late in the day.

Tell me this: why should two people in a relationship need to have identical motivation for the relationship, for it to be successful? If the needs of both are being met, isn’t that enough? I buy bread from the corner store because I’m hungry; the store owner sells it because she wants to make money. That seems to be a successful relationship.

On the subject of emotional needs, every day of my life I see and hear the way people become churned up inside because of the way their emotions rule them. They’re the ones who risk deception, in my opinion. The corollary of this reasoning is that if I need fully-developed emotions to be able to function in society the way the majority do, then all I can say is that I’m glad I have Asperger’s.

[RonSouther]

Originally Posted by The Backward OX

You raise more interesting points than I could even begin to address in a month of Sundays. My original post was somewhat tongue-in-cheek as I also neglected to mention my age. At 75, it may all be a bit late in the day.

Tell me this: why should two people in a relationship need to have identical motivation for the relationship, for it to be successful? If the needs of both are being met, isn’t that enough? I buy bread from the corner store because I’m hungry; the store owner sells it because she wants to make money. That seems to be a successful relationship.

On the subject of emotional needs, every day of my life I see and hear the way people become churned up inside because of the way their emotions rule them. They’re the ones who risk deception, in my opinion. The corollary of this reasoning is that if I need fully-developed emotions to be able to function in society the way the majority do, then all I can say is that I’m glad I have Asperger’s.

Life isn't logical Ox. If it was, you would not be on this board trying to sort it out. Your logic makes sense, but life doesn't seem to agree with logic.

Your logic is your idea, not the truth. It's a partial truth. Your example of exchanging needs is a good one but not encompassing of every type of relating. If you treat your logic as an idea to be tested and stop insisting that life must follow your logic, you'll be on your way to "changing the basics of how your mind works". It will be helping you instead of running your life blindly.

Aspergers is a gift of an incredible capability for intelligence and creativity. Logic, however, is neither of these. Logic is your mind guessing at what it doesn't know.

[NursingGirl]

Originally Posted by The Backward OX

You raise more interesting points than I could even begin to address in a month of Sundays.

Sorry about that!

Originally Posted by The Backward OX

My original post was somewhat tongue-in-cheek as I also neglected to mention my age. At 75, it may all be a bit late in the day.

Naaa, never too late to continue to live in a living body! And of course it's never too late to work toward self-actualization!

Originally Posted by The Backward OX

Tell me this: why should two people in a relationship need to have identical motivation for the relationship, for it to be successful? If the needs of both are being met, isn’t that enough? I buy bread from the corner store because I’m hungry; the store owner sells it because she wants to make money. That seems to be a successful relationship.

People don't need identical motivations really. For instance, stereotypically, women and men primarily are motivated to be in a partnership for different reasons. But using my daughter as an example, her needs were being met in this online relationship because he appeared to care because he listened...while at 43 years old listening to a 17 year old talk about her infected belly button piercing and other teenager things was a small price to pay to meet his sexual needs. There is no one on this board that wouldn't say "ew" to that. Having a personal relationship with someone and having a healthy personal relationship with someone are two completely different animals.

Originally Posted by The Backward OX

On the subject of emotional needs, every day of my life I see and hear the way people become churned up inside because of the way their emotions rule them.

I agree with you there. People who don't learn to regulate their emotions can only be in unhealthy personal relationships. I suppose I am making sweeping generalizations but yes, I've had encounters with people who don't know how to regulate for whatever reason and I certainly don't want to be the one taking responsibility for their emotions if that is even possible. The people who do that uncontrolled emotional spewing usually seem to think that others' are to blame. They’re the ones who risk deception, in my opinion. The corollary of this reasoning is that if I need fully-developed emotions to be able to function in society the way the majority do, then all I can say is that I’m glad I have Asperger’s.[/QUOTE]

But wouldn't it be cool to explore a more middle of the road existence? What would it feel (I said feel ) like to balance emotion and logic? Or sometimes to be more emotional that logical?

Have you ever taken Myer's Briggs personality typing?Personality test based on Jung and Briggs Myers typology

I would like to know your scoring on it.

[The Backward OX]

Originally Posted by NursingGirl

Have you ever taken Myer's Briggs personality typing? I would like to know your scoring on it.

Yes, many years ago. I came out an INTJ but I think INTP may be closer.

[Acting Like Godot]

Originally Posted by The Backward OX

Yes, many years ago. I came out an INTJ but I think INTP may be closer.

Oh, hello, my fellow INTJ.

Since you are an INTJ, there's a good chance that you got misdiagnosed with Asperger's Syndrome.

INTJs have a terrible habit of getting misdiagnosed for a range of different psychological conditions, including Asperger's Syndrome and sociopath-ism.

Nonsense! Nonsense! INTJs are wonderfully idiosyncratic individuals, just because they don't think like the average Joe doesn't mean that they have a mental problem.

[Acting Like Godot]

Are you physically clumsy?

It's an Asperger symptom.

Simple rule of thumb - if you enjoy (or had enjoyed, in your younger days), sports such as tennis, swimming, badminton, rugby, soccer, basketball etc, then you are probably not physically clumsy and probably not an Asperger person.

[The Backward OX]

Originally Posted by Acting Like Godot

Oh, hello, my fellow INTJ.

Since you are an INTJ, there's a good chance that you got misdiagnosed with Asperger's Syndrome.

INTJs have a terrible habit of getting misdiagnosed for a range of different psychological conditions, including Asperger's Syndrome and sociopath-ism.

Au contraire. Imnsho, it's the MBTI that can be misinterpreted. Most of those questions are so vague, one can answer them either way. In fact, just about every test of this nature that I've seen online is as bad.

[The Backward OX]

Originally Posted by Acting Like Godot

Are you physically clumsy?

It's my middle name.

[Acting Like Godot]

Originally Posted by The Backward OX

Most of those questions are so vague, one can answer them either way.

Oh, that is such a characteristically INTJ remark!

[Acting Like Godot]

Originally Posted by The Backward OX

Imnsho

And that is very INTJ too!

[The Backward OX]

Originally Posted by Acting Like Godot

Oh, that is such a characteristically INTJ remark!

But it's true! It's only the narrow-minded who fail to see it.

[NursingGirl]

I am an INTJ.