I can't appreciate men for being men

[DoggyLady]

I can't appreciate men as men.

i can't appreciate maleness.

but i'm not lesbian. i'm straight woman. I have male friends. I have had boyfriends.

just that i can't "gush" about men being men.

really, what's so great about men?

tell me.

I need to learn to appreciate men on a different level. this probably explains why i have difficulty in attracting relationships into my life.

[nistacular]

I'm a male, and sometimes I ask myself the same question...

What I think is most admiral about men that perhaps isn't as common in women is their ability to devote to an ideal through reason alone. I think it's fair to say men are less emotional ON AVERAGE than women - and because of that more time is spent being thinking without floating atop their emotional state and going with the flow. Their cogs are more often turning. Of course I'm generalizing right now, but yeah... that's something I find to be respectable and present in most manly men. Not commenting on intelligence, just time spent thinking objectively.

But I ask that question to myself too because it seems to me, our emotions are what makes us human. Is more time thinking, and less time feeling necessarily a good thing? I don't think so, but I do think because of that males are more likely to take action, place value on intellectualism, and think things through (not having to do with the psychology of people - because people aren't logical lol), and these things have their own benefits for society as a whole.

Also another obvious difference is our physical strength, which is nice , but being a straight male, I can't tell you exactly what's appealing about any of these regarding relationships and stuff.

[BillyTheAdult]

Originally Posted by DoggyLady

I can't appreciate men as men.

i can't appreciate maleness.

but i'm not lesbian. i'm straight woman. I have male friends. I have had boyfriends.

just that i can't "gush" about men being men.

really, what's so great about men?

tell me.

I need to learn to appreciate men on a different level. this probably explains why i have difficulty in attracting relationships into my life.

okay honestly I post about women here often, so I guess I have my own issue. But to be completely honest I feel like my issues (not disowning them) are fairly common for men and directly relate to common issues for women, and this is one of them.

You aren't supposed to "gush" over men. It seems like to me women are waiting for some guy to just sweep them off their feet and I mean we are after all just men, not magicians. Men are just men and women are just women. It all takes time to get to that magical seeming place. Honestly if you ever meet a man who is just all excitement....run. Chances are he spent his whole life learning how to induce the release of oxytocin in women. It's not that he's better in any way it's (well there's a lot going on there that would involve lots of generalizations so I'll just leave it for now.)

So the problem with women not appreciating men on another level is just that, that they don't appreciate them on another level.

I want to say stop looking for excitement but I don't actually know if that's your problem.

This kind of makes me want to start a thread that I probably won't

[Angelique]

You mean to tell me you can't find reasons to appreciate half of the world's population?

Seriously?

[Danisoov]

I've always love men who like to cuddle like how you can imagine a child wants his mother to hold him. A man who can show his soft side and can cry in front of a woman.

Men are said to be able to use only one side of their brain at a time while women have been found to be able to use both sides at the same time.

I think men also are able to act more like sociopaths than women...

Also men are more visual and a lot of men are very competitive and want to show off.

From an aesthetic point of view Women are more beautiful. The proportioning and curves, soft features and makeup....

those were the first things that came to my mind.

[Danisoov]

Originally Posted by BillyTheAdult

Honestly if you ever meet a man who is just all excitement....run. Chances are he spent his whole life learning how to induce the release of oxytocin in women.

I will try to learn to live off this quote. Wise words, listen to this. SO TRUE

[Prinie]

Well, what is it about men exactly that you don't like? Each one of us has a masculine and feminine side soo...

[TonyToneTone]

We have penises!!!!!!!!!!!!

And whatever you don't like about us might be some trait that you want to see more of in yourself.

[danas]

I have the opposite problem. I love men. I attract lots of men into my life but I still havent attract one to have a long term partnership with.
Ive always loved men and men have always loved me. I remember my first boyfriend in kindergarden.

Why do I like men? Because they are different. Because they are strong physically but often soft and sensitive inside. Yes, they can be violent too, but thats because they can be physically. They must learn not to be. Its about spiritual growth.
I like the challenge of getting on with them, they often have sensitive egos and as a women its a sophisticated job to learn to get what I want from them.

I dont need a man technically.
Im a lot wealthier than any man Ive ever met. But I love their presence. The manlier the better.
Maybe because one of the best relationships Ive ever had in my life has been with my father, and also my grandfather and uncles. All the men I grew up with were tough men, but softies too.
Its interesting bc Ive been hurt many times, but never have I been angry at "men" as a gender, I just continue to love them and attract them.
I especially love when they make me feel like a woman. yes, I like our differences.

[CroMagna]

Maybe you just don't think men are better than women. What's wrong with that??

Exalt yourself.

[ZephyrusX]

This is more or less my question as well. There are structural gender roles allocated towards men and women, but within those gender roles lies a tremendous amount of free thought and variability. Saying, 'I can't appreciate men for being men' suggests that you are unable to see the individuality in men and instead impose upon them your own historical and emotional associations.

What is so great about men? First and foremost, they are individual human beings with whom we share the potential for great love, joy and connection.

Originally Posted by Prinie

Well, what is it about men exactly that you don't like? Each one of us has a masculine and feminine side soo...

[DoggyLady]

Originally Posted by danas

I have the opposite problem. I love men. I attract lots of men into my life but I still havent attract one to have a long term partnership with.
Ive always loved men and men have always loved me. I remember my first boyfriend in kindergarden.

Why do I like men? Because they are different. Because they are strong physically but often soft and sensitive inside. Yes, they can be violent too, but thats because they can be physically. They must learn not to be. Its about spiritual growth.
I like the challenge of getting on with them, they often have sensitive egos and as a women its a sophisticated job to learn to get what I want from them.

I dont need a man technically.
Im a lot wealthier than any man Ive ever met. But I love their presence. The manlier the better.
Maybe because one of the best relationships Ive ever had in my life has been with my father, and also my grandfather and uncles. All the men I grew up with were tough men, but softies too.
Its interesting bc Ive been hurt many times, but never have I been angry at "men" as a gender, I just continue to love them and attract them.
I especially love when they make me feel like a woman. yes, I like our differences.

Interesting... so u love men cos u have a grt relationship with ur father and grandfather and uncles.

i don't have a close relationship with my dad. he is emotionally very distant. my grandfathers were both already dead when i was born.

i'm not angry at men. i feel like men are a mystery to me. i feel like i don't know them. the more manly a man is, the stranger he is to me, cos he would be talking abt investments, sports etc, which i totally don't dig. i can't relate to them.

i get along with men who ahve a lot of feminine energy. but i'm not attracted to them romantically.

[BillyTheAdult]

Originally Posted by DoggyLady

but i'm not attracted to them romantically.

Have you ever been with a man like that. I am a bit of a mix but would definitely have more feminine energy than a lot of guys would be comfortable with. Probably enough to put some women off. I understand where you feel like the physical attraction isn't there right off so you don't ever take further. I mean I get it. I don't have women who just flip over me right off all the time (although on occasion) but I have had women I've known over long periods confess their feelings to me numerous times. I think thats how it is for men like that. You may not like them right off because maybe you cant picture them in the manly roles that turn you on, but to be honest in my experience I have cultivated those values genuinely than a macho guy. When the rubber meets the road I have more of the manly qualities than a macho type man has, I just don't make a big show of it. Plus I read an article recently where more manly dominating type men are less likely to give a woman an orgasm or a fulfilling sex life as well.

The thing is with a guy like me you have to take a chance and get to know me, it's more work and more emotional risk.

[Blore]

Maybe you should stop trying to appreciate them as men, and try to appreciate them as individual people?

[Million Dollar Man]

Well it depends on the man. If you met a man who wrote you poems and songs... then performed them for you with candles and moon light and wine... then maybe you might appreciate that.
But believe me... sometimes guys after time passes just feel it's not worth it to do all that magical stuff .. because sometimes women don't appreciate any of it..

and wow it's like impossible to find a soul mate.

[danas]

Originally Posted by DoggyLady

Interesting... so u love men cos u have a grt relationship with ur father and grandfather and uncles.

i don't have a close relationship with my dad. he is emotionally very distant. my grandfathers were both already dead when i was born.

i'm not angry at men. i feel like men are a mystery to me. i feel like i don't know them. the more manly a man is, the stranger he is to me, cos he would be talking abt investments, sports etc, which i totally don't dig. i can't relate to them.

i get along with men who ahve a lot of feminine energy. but i'm not attracted to them romantically.

Yes, maybe this has to do with my relationship with my dad. But not only.

If men are a mystery to you, then maybe its time to get to know them. You've probably heard of "Men are from Mars woman are from Venus." I think John Gray is awesome. Ive listened to many of his talks and read his books. He just talks about the differences and that helped me understand lots of things.
Its weird bc Ive always had beautiful girlfriends but always when we go out, I end up getting a lot more attention from men, even though my girl friends were often much more good looking than me. They would get pissed off and say "what is it about you!?"
So I think its a vibe I send out. Its normal for me to be randomly stopped on the street and get chatted up.
Its always been like that at 16 and still at 38, hasnt stopped to my surprise.
But its not cause Im drop dead gorgeous. Its cause Im approachable and I guess men sense my openness.

[DoggyLady]

Originally Posted by danas

Yes, maybe this has to do with my relationship with my dad. But not only.

If men are a mystery to you, then maybe its time to get to know them. You've probably heard of "Men are from Mars woman are from Venus." I think John Gray is awesome. Ive listened to many of his talks and read his books. He just talks about the differences and that helped me understand lots of things.
Its weird bc Ive always had beautiful girlfriends but always when we go out, I end up getting a lot more attention from men, even though my girl friends were often much more good looking than me. They would get pissed off and say "what is it about you!?"
So I think its a vibe I send out. Its normal for me to be randomly stopped on the street and get chatted up.
Its always been like that at 16 and still at 38, hasnt stopped to my surprise.
But its not cause Im drop dead gorgeous. Its cause Im approachable and I guess men sense my openness.

Your openness...

Hm.... I am reserved ..... People think that i'm "aloof", "stuck-up". truth is, i'm just shy and nervous about people. in social situations, i'm ok to be in there, but i won't be the one to approach people.

i need extroverted pp to make me feel at ease. or i seek out the ones who are as shy as me.

so far the guys i have dated all i meet from internet.

i have not had a guy come after me in real life yet (except during my teens when i had two).

[Swifthawk]

Originally Posted by DoggyLady

i'm not angry at men. i feel like men are a mystery to me. i feel like i don't know them. the more manly a man is, the stranger he is to me, cos he would be talking abt investments, sports etc, which i totally don't dig. i can't relate to them.

You are equating manliness with those things? That is a mistake. Who a man is has less to do with what he does and more to do with how he does them.

Sure, a lot of guys talk about those subjects, but that is because they are common topics to talk about, sort of like how people tend to talk about the weather when there is nothing else to talk about.

Have you ever seen a piece of art and thought "Why in the heck is this art? It's horrible." For some reason you don't appreciate, mostly because its outside appearance is not what you expect or think it should be.

Later, however, you realized something special about the painting. It was either painted with a very difficult technique, or it was painted by a blind man. This new info made you appreciate it that much more.

The same is true with appreciating people. You have to be willing to get to know them on a different level and see their true personality. You can't expect to be able to appreciate without any work on your end.

[jridgway]

I think you answered your own question? No emotionally available dad and two dead grandfather's. There is nothing like a family with an active patriarch, or in the case of a grandfather one remembered. He is the rock of the family the pillar on which all stands when he is worthy of that place. In my case it was my mother's father. I remember 20 years ago I fount a audio cassette tape at my mother's house and turned it on and out came my grandfather talking, one of his famous stories. Apparently someone got a brain storm and decided to record him. The tears were rolling down my mother's face, why? Because that was her daddy he had two years before. When you love someone you love everything about them their rough voice, their laugh, their stories over and over and over. You love the way they kid you, hand you money for the candy truck and tell you don't tell your mother. In my case I loved it when he would tell mom, I don't take orders from you, if I want to give the kids something I will lol. What's missing DoggyLady is what for you history? The reason a good man is important. My grandmother walked on water around him and she never wanted, even at 75 he flirted with her and told her to give him a kiss. Even at 75 he would hand her 300 or 400 bucks and she'd say why no reason get yourself something. He was the example, I wish I could transfer that to you.

[bodi]

Stereotypes are the grist of ignorance....

Anything that fits in a box belongs there...

How many 'men' do you know, besides what you may see on the evil, idiot, brainwashing box? .00000000001 % of the entire male population of the planet?

[reekah]

Originally Posted by DoggyLady

I can't appreciate men as men.

i can't appreciate maleness.

but i'm not lesbian. i'm straight woman. I have male friends. I have had boyfriends.

just that i can't "gush" about men being men.

really, what's so great about men?

tell me.

I need to learn to appreciate men on a different level. this probably explains why i have difficulty in attracting relationships into my life.

If you detest us, why should we respect you? Perhaps you are projecting this dislike of our gender, which men subconsciously sense?

[reekah]

Also, if I met a woman who claimed to detest all men, I'd probably laugh and mentally list her a nutcase or somebody to be shunned. It wouldn't bother me one iota.

[BillyTheAdult]

Originally Posted by reekah

Also, if I met a woman who claimed to detest all men, I'd probably laugh and mentally list her a nutcase or somebody to be shunned. It wouldn't bother me one iota.

I'm having trouble believing that. Nor do I remember the OP claiming to detest all men, just that she doesn't appreciate us for who we are and is not quite sure why. Personally I don't feel that many women do appreciate men though many would never admit to it. I think there is a lot of unreasonable expectations placed on men in this society (among myriad other gender relation problems) that leads to much unhappiness on both sides of the fence.

[reekah]

Originally Posted by BillyTheAdult

I'm having trouble believing that. Nor do I remember the OP claiming to detest all men, just that she doesn't appreciate us for who we are and is not quite sure why. Personally I don't feel that many women do appreciate men though many would never admit to it. I think there is a lot of unreasonable expectations placed on men in this society (among myriad other gender relation problems) that leads to much unhappiness on both sides of the fence.

It still doesn't bother me. I would still just dismiss her as a loser.

[Acting Like Godot]

Originally Posted by DoggyLady

.

so far the guys i have dated all i meet from internet.

i have not had a guy come after me in real life yet (except during my teens when i had two).

In this day and age, the Internet should be considered a part of real life.

[Acting Like Godot]

Originally Posted by DoggyLady

the more manly a man is, the stranger he is to me, cos he would be talking abt investments, sports etc, which i totally don't dig. i can't relate to them.

I work in an investment bank and I talk about investments every day. If talking about investments makes a man manly, I must be a real stud.

Then again, all my female colleagues must be very manly too. Because they talk about investments every day too.

[Albalida]

Originally Posted by DoggyLady

i feel like men are a mystery to me. i feel like i don't know them. the more manly a man is, the stranger he is to me, cos he would be talking abt investments, sports etc, which i totally don't dig. i can't relate to them.

In that, I read that your very definition of a man, is a collection of shallow stereotypes. Of course the real individual is going to be a mystery.

Men who have problems with managing money, who like shopping, and have artistic rather than athletic inclinations, are just as real as men who keep stock portfolios and follow sports. They all have their own sense of humor, or tragedy, things that excite them, and make them feel insecure, histories, families, likes and dislikes. All individual. These are traits of real men because these are traits of real people.

The impression I get from you, is more of an unwillingness to recognize the humanity of half the world's population, rather than an inability to do so. Your stereotypes are self-constructed limits, and if you really want a relationship then I think it's time to break them down.

[nistacular]

Originally Posted by albalida

men who have problems with managing money, who like shopping, and have artistic rather than athletic inclinations, are just as real as men who keep stock portfolios and follow sports. They all have their own sense of humor, or tragedy, things that excite them, and make them feel insecure, histories, families, likes and dislikes. All individual. These are traits of real men because these are traits of real people.

+1

[bodi]

Originally Posted by Albalida

In that, I read that your very definition of a man, is a collection of shallow stereotypes. Of course the real individual is going to be a mystery.

Men who have problems with managing money, who like shopping, and have artistic rather than athletic inclinations, are just as real as men who keep stock portfolios and follow sports. They all have their own sense of humor, or tragedy, things that excite them, and make them feel insecure, histories, families, likes and dislikes. All individual. These are traits of real men because these are traits of real people.

The impression I get from you, is more of an unwillingness to recognize the humanity of half the world's population, rather than an inability to do so. Your stereotypes are self-constructed limits, and if you really want a relationship then I think it's time to break them down.

Amen...

[DoggyLady]

Originally Posted by reekah

If you detest us, why should we respect you? Perhaps you are projecting this dislike of our gender, which men subconsciously sense?

i never said that i detest men.

i said that men are a mystery to me. i said that i don't understand men.

i can't relate to men.

i'm not sure what i'm supposed to do with men. when men flirt with me, or show me attention, i feel shy and uncomfortable. i don't know how i am supposed to react.