It Was Almost Like I Wasn't Even There. ??

[Rezzy7]

Let me start by saying I'm not sure how to adequately describe this scenario, but I'll try...

A few days ago I was in a group with 3 long-time friends, just hanging out while one friend Jim was in town for the holiday; my friend Kirk and his wife Ellie, Jim, and myself. The couple had not seen Jim in several months. So understandably, they had the usual catching up to do. I'm taking that into account in what I will describe next:

Many times it seemed as if I wasn't even there! When it happened the first time or two I noticed it, but I understand those things happen in groups sometimes.

But then it kept happening!! I would say things and no one would respond or react, even when I asked a question, like no one could hear me. After several times I became rather frustrated, and it seemed really weird that it was happening so much.

I'll try to describe specific examples...

Jim, and I arrived together at Kirk and Ellie's home. Kirk greeted us at the door, and we all sat down. Ellie entered the room moments later saying hello, and crossed past me to greet Jim with a hug, and then took a few steps away from us, still talking to him. I then stood up with my arms out, ignoring that Ellie'd just brushed by me, and gave her a hug. I didn't make anything of it, but it seemed weird...like she naturally greeted Jim that way, but only me "by request". (To my knowledge there's no reason to think her relationship with him is any different than with me.)

Later the discussion turned to Ellie's recent business trip, and she decided to show off a special ID card. Again, skipping past me, she handed her wallet to Jim, and stood in front of us while he looked. When he handed it back she just walked away. I said, "I'd like to see..." but she didn't hear me. I didn't want to interrupt, as everyone else was talking at once, so I waited for an opening. One didn't come until Ellie was already putting her wallet back in her purse, so I said, once again, a bit louder this time to ensure I was heard, "Can I see it?" As she walked back Jim said harshly, "Why didn't you say something while she was standing here?", like he was hassling me for "making her" walk all the way back.

Throughout the night I kept having to repeat myself 3 or 4 times when I had something to add to a conversation, or when I asked a question. Or, I had to wait a seemingly extra long time to get a word in. Then when I did, someone else immediately changed the topic, like I hadn't said a thing, and I didn't get to participate in the subject at all. It was really noticeable.

If I didn't know these friends well I'd think they were making an effort to exclude me...I'm not kidding, it was happening a lot more than "normal". Though I tried to ignore it at first, after a while I could not. By the end of the night I couldn't help feeling quite deflated.

So that it's known, I did everything I could to "take responsibility" in this case. It wasn't just a matter of mumbling, speaking too softly. (My voice is sometimes considered "loud", but for some reason people often don't hear me in groups well.)

Anyone experience this much and/or know of a solution?

[ZephyrusX]

That is weird. Usually if that happens with me, I am simply not speaking loud enough. Did you try asking one of your friends? Next time you find your self repeating your self 3 or 4 times, just ask what is going on.

[Rezzy7]

I decided not to mention it while there so as not to spoil everyone else's good time. I intend to ask Jim about it but haven't had a chance yet. This kind of thing happens in groups, and this isn't the first time. (Usually with acquaintances or people I've only recently met, I've written threads about it and haven't reached anything conclusive.)

[Kait]

Okay, Do you normally hang out with Kirk and his wife when Jim is out of town?

If so, this wasn't about you, This was about catching up with KirK and is wife and it was Jim's day. It sounds like to me, they see more of you so they wasnt interested in what you had to say or do, at all.

Maybe, if you want too, I would spend less time with them and just see IF their is a difference in their social skills. Or become quiet and not say much at all when you are around them. Maybe they too will notice there's something not right here...

[Spiderguy252]

Could it have been a prank of some sort?

[James81]

You have this way of taking things and blowing them out of proportion. For example, your recent thread about people here being friends with your ex on facebook. You act like the world owes you something and you seemingly get offended when you discover that the world doesn't, in fact, revolve around you.

The story you are describing here is a classic case of jealousy. Somebody else came "between" you and the friends you usually hang with, so your mind searched for a reason to make it about how they were ignoring you. What was really happening was that you just weren't used to a dynamic in which you weren't the center of attention with these friends.

Here's where it started:

When it happened the first time or two I noticed it, but I understand those things happen in groups sometimes.

But then it kept happening!!

You noticed some things that you could INTERPRET as this, without really ever confirming it. And what you did after those two times was ramp up your perception of that particular behavior to where ALL YOU NOTICED were the times when they were ignoring you.

Our minds do that sometimes. Like with the number 11:11 that people talk about around here. When you search for something to be true, you are going to find it. In this case, you were searching for every instance in which you could interpret them as ignoring you and you found it in a big way. And why wouldn't you find it? They hadn't seen your friend for a long time and were catching up with him, so OF COURSE they are going to be more focused on him than they are you. They see YOU all the time. They don't see him very much.

I feel for you that you felt slighted, but this is yet another case of you taking something and blowing it out of proportion.

[Angela]

Rezzy, when someone has been out of town or out of touch for awhile, it's normal ettiquette for the hostess to go straight for the prodigal person, to make a beeline for him, focusing on welcoming him with no peripheral acknowledgements. That's just what happens at parties; it doesn't mean anything about you.

It sounds like that happened and you made it mean something (like what James was saying, above, that things "like this" happen in groups, and "like this" means "it means something's wrong here"), and with this filter in place, things like that kept occurring. It was perfectly IN proportion with how you created the world as occurring by thinking thoughts that had you filter for "there's something wrong here."

When you find yourself focusing in that way, you can shift how the evening goes by choosing thoughts that have you feeling a little better. In this case, I would look for another interpretation for that root cause event, to look for alternate meanings than the one you made about it.

I would also look from a higher perspective, now that you're out of it: what do you make it mean in your life when people don't hear you the way you'd like to be heard? Especially, what do you make it mean about you that they don't hear you? Then examine that belief to see if and how it has been running you at a deeply unconscious level.

[Rezzy7]

Thanks for the comments.

Turns out Jim was not in a mood to have a conversation with me when I spoke to him next. Hmm.

Originally Posted by Kait

Okay, Do you normally hang out with Kirk and his wife when Jim is out of town?

If so, this wasn't about you, This was about catching up with KirK and is wife and it was Jim's day. It sounds like to me, they see more of you so they wasnt interested in what you had to say or do, at all.

I spend time with Jim but rarely see Ellie because our schedules don't match. Since Kirk lives in another city, of course I realize they haven't seen him for some time. So that fact was on my mind while this was going on as a possible explanation. It's about Jim, sure, I get that. However, that didn't and doesn't seem like a complete explanation. I have known this to happen, even where I was the person who someone was glad to see, but the host(s) never ignored anyone else who was present. I never noticed anyone else having to say something several times just to be heard at all (and I do my best to watch and listen to everyone as much as possible).

I'm beginning to think this is impossible to properly describe to anyone who wasn't there.

Originally Posted by Spiderguy252

Could it have been a prank of some sort?

No, but that might be preferable.

[elucidate]

When that happens to me, I usually check if I'm speaking up enough. That's been an issue with me in the past...although with other people I've had the opposite issue, and they are ultra sensitive and think I speak too loudly?

It can get confusing, but it might be the same case with you?

For what it's worth, I think james is totally off the ball. I haven't noticed you acting in the way he describes, you were just grieving in that other thread, and couldn't understand why people would be friends with someone who was rude to you.

I can think of certain posts that james has made where thoughts have been expressed that gave the impression that james thinks the world revolves around him though, so there might be some projection at work there?

I've had the experience you describe, and it's really unnerving when it happens...like you are invisible. It's easy to draw conclusions when your insecurities start to kick in. I never did find out why they treated me this way?

One day I asked if they could hear me, and one person said that I speak very softly...which I never realized as I don't think I do. It honestly sounds to me like I am speaking up when I talk...but apparently, some people don't hear me...or I don't speak in a way that is fast or interesting enough for them*shrug* I had to teach myself to project my voice better, which got me better results.

I don't get that with other people I know though, so it's hard to tell whether it's them, or me?

Were you treated this way as a kid by either of your parents?

[Rezzy7]

Originally Posted by James81

You have this way of taking things and blowing them out of proportion. For example, your recent thread about people here being friends with your ex on facebook. You act like the world owes you something and you seemingly get offended when you discover that the world doesn't, in fact, revolve around you.

I think you have me pegged...as someone else. Please tell me how you conclude these things about me? That other thread has nothing to do with anyone owing me anything, and the only thing blown out of proportion was some people's extremely harsh overreaction to what to me was just a simple question. I digress. I don't think the world revolves around me at all, it very much doesn't. Not even on my birthday.

The story you are describing here is a classic case of jealousy. Somebody else came "between" you and the friends you usually hang with, so your mind searched for a reason to make it about how they were ignoring you.

Close, but out of sequence. I admit feeling left out, and maybe a bit jealous now that you brought it up, but only after the things I noticed. If not for that, I would not have felt jealous at all because, as I tried to impart in the OP, I knew they hadn't seen each other for a while, so it is perfectly normal for them to focus on Kirk. But not so much I'm practically invisible.

What was really happening was that you just weren't used to a dynamic in which you weren't the center of attention with these friends.

Actually I'm often in someone else's shadow, and that doesn't bother me. Being ignored or unheard is not enjoyable, and I do not like it any more than anyone else does.

I don't desire to be the center of attention, I just would like some acknowledgement of my presence. If all I did was sit there quietly and not participate that would be different. I sometimes have something valuable to say, and I want to share that with the group just as they are doing. If there's something wrong with that, I apologize, I thought that was normal.

You noticed some things that you could INTERPRET as this, without really ever confirming it. And what you did after those two times was ramp up your perception of that particular behavior to where ALL YOU NOTICED were the times when they were ignoring you.

I know full well how things can be interpreted to fit one's beliefs. Trust me, I did not overlook that notion while I was there, and I did my best to consider any explanations I could think of. I don't think I was just noticing it because I was searching for it. I mean, I was on alert, but it was happening too much for it not to stand out.

They see YOU all the time.

No, I never said that, and if I implied it, I'm sorry I wasn't laser precise.

I see Kirk sometimes, his wife rarely, and I see Jim rarely, which is slightly more frequently than Kirk or Ellie do. That's all. Besides, I said earlier I am taking all that into account, meaning, I understand they will be more excited to see Jim than me. That doesn't fully explain all that occurred. If I thought it could be explained by just that I wouldn't have started this thread.

I feel for you that you felt slighted, but this is yet another case of you taking something and blowing it out of proportion.

I'm just trying to understand what happened. I'm not trying to argue about it or make it a bigger deal than it is. I wonder if you had been there if you'd really think I'm blowing it out of proportion or if it really was at the level I'm saying. Or if you'd have a different tune if this kind of thing also happened to you plenty of times, I mean, to this degree.

[Curious cat]

It may or may not be a case of jealousy, only rezzy would be able to answer that.

I get how insecurities can contribute to blowing things out of proportion, but i also like to trust in one's intuition or insincts. Sometimes we get tiny hints from people in subleties, which on the surface seems like nothing, but sometimes it can be a window into what's really going on underneath.

What peeps have said here make sense, but you won't know for sure if it applies to your specific situation, so I don't think anyone here can offer a real answer for you Rezzy. it'd be best to talk directly to your friends about it.

[Rezzy7]

Originally Posted by Angela

Rezzy, when someone has been out of town or out of touch for awhile, it's normal ettiquette for the hostess to go straight for the prodigal person, to make a beeline for him, focusing on welcoming him with no peripheral acknowledgements.

Thank you, that makes sense, and I have tried to allow for that in my evaluation of what happened. Even then it seems excessive.

I'm also doing my best to have another perspective than the "filtered" version you talked about. I understand that can be problematic. I think that's also what James81 was describing. I can't say I was totally unaffected by "filtration," but I know I'm not just blindly letting the filter dictate my perception.

Some examples for anyone that wants to read 'em:
I can understand Ellie beelining to Jim first, but it was odd that she stepped away without hugging me, too, since we always greet each other with hugs. It's reasonable that she would show Jim her work ID, but a bit weird that she didn't also show it to me, AND strange no one apparently heard me when I asked to see it while she was turning to walk away.

It was normal for Ellie to take Jim's plate and food wrappers when he was done, but weird she didn't take mine, with me sitting right there. I think it's common in small groups to occasionally have to repeat a statement when someone talks over you. It's unusual, in my experience, to have to repeat myself more than once, and for it to be necessary so many times in one evening!

When you find yourself focusing in that way, you can shift how the evening goes by choosing thoughts that have you feeling a little better.

Yes. Thanks for the reminder.

I do my best to do that when I can. I kept trying to ignore it, and focus on having a good time. Other times I tried to "silver lining" it, pondering, "What might the message be in this?" But then "it" would happen again, and I couldn't just forget about it. Over time I wasn't able to think of another perspective that could account fo those kinds of things happening again and again.

I would also look from a higher perspective, now that you're out of it: what do you make it mean in your life when people don't hear you the way you'd like to be heard? Especially, what do you make it mean about you that they don't hear you?

Thanks, this is helpful. I think it has to do with my value to other people, generally, and being appreciated. I'll continue to ponder it.

Originally Posted by elucidate

When that happens to me, I usually check if I'm speaking up enough.

It can get confusing, but it might be the same case with you?

Yes! Confusing! I know I was loud enough to be heard the 2nd time, because any louder would have been shouting level, and it wasn't a noisy environment. Plus, the level I started with was heard other times. Really, it was weird.

I can think of certain posts that james has made where thoughts have been expressed that gave the impression that james thinks the world revolves around him though, so there might be some projection at work there?

That I couldn't say. Well, we sometimes can recognize our own characteristics in someone else, or initially think that we do.

I've had the experience you describe, and it's really unnerving when it happens...like you are invisible. It's easy to draw conclusions when your insecurities start to kick in. I never did find out why they treated me this way?

Is that a question? Anyway, yes, it's unsettling. It's not good for self esteem or confidence if it happens somewhat often. Especially when you're doing everything you know, your absolute best to contribute to a conversation, treat everyone well, be friendly, etc.

Were you treated this way as a kid by either of your parents?

Ignored you mean? No.

[elucidate]

Originally Posted by Rezzy7

Yes! Confusing! I know I was loud enough to be heard the 2nd time, because any louder would have been shouting level, and it wasn't a noisy environment. Plus, the level I started with was heard other times. Really, it was weird.

Really, I think I do understand exactly what you mean, and I have had it occur for me at times, with work colleagues and people I've lived with and just friends in social situations, and it's really baffling. There were no environmental factors either, and I'm sure I was speaking at a pitch that could easily be heard. It was like I was in a different dimension to them all together and they couldn't see or here me...it was, like your title said...as though I wasn't even there.

I've had this happen a lot in my life.

[elucidate]

Originally Posted by Rezzy7

Is that a question? Anyway, yes, it's unsettling. It's not good for self esteem or confidence if it happens somewhat often. Especially when you're doing everything you know, your absolute best to contribute to a conversation, treat everyone well, be friendly, etc.

No, it wasn't a question. I put the question mark there because I couldn't figure out why it was happening, and never did. Granted, it was not the best use of question marks and I can see how it caused confusion,

Ignored you mean? No.

Ok. I asked because I was ignored, for rather long periods of time, by my mother growing up and I have wondered in the past whether these things occurring for me were partly as a result of that?

[Curious cat]

Maybe they were so deeply enthralled and stimulated by the multi-person conversation that it soaked up all their brain power, so by the time you chimed in, they were already over-stimulated and couldn't take in new information in that instant. Or they did hear you, but quickly forgot about it because again, brain was full and it slipped their mind?

Like when multi-tasking, sometimes you just forget things and get distracted.

[insanezenmistress]

Sometimes simple vounerability is usefull. If you are feeling slighted or paranoid about the same, try simple, comedic honesty.

She passes the picture to Jim and does not hear you ask......."hey (person i can be frank with), i am feeling like the hunchback of notre dame here, can I please see the picture too."

Are you are group of friends, do you share humor and happyness and sadness and comfort? Is it rude to be yourself with these people? If it is.. well then that opens up an whole new set of paranoias.

If , maybe you didnt feel like confessing your snubbedness to your closest friend in company, you could just have an extra wine, tell them your toasty and sit in quiet observation of the humans around you. Take time to appreciate their friendship on it's own merits excluding yourself.

But then i am the recluse and socal interactions are difficult for me, but with friends i keep it real, always.

jessy

[Rezzy7]

Originally Posted by elucidate

No, it wasn't a question. I put the question mark there because I couldn't figure out why it was happening,

Oh, like my questions marks in the title. Just making sure so I could respond if it was.

Ok. I asked because I was ignored, for rather long periods of time, by my mother

For me not by a parent, but other people, perhaps. Since high school I've been often passed over, disregarded, ignored, beyond what I would reasonably think is normal. When I used to be quiet that made sense. But as an adult I have wanted to participate more, and it's frustrating putting out the effort to be social and still having this response from others.

It's a weird thing. Often in groups at restaurants my order was the one that never arrived. In fact a similar thing happened on this night. We picked up some takeout, and my order was not put in the bags. Luckily, the counter person caught up with us at the car! I'm thankful it we hadn't driven away, and it makes me wonder, WTF?!

Originally Posted by Curious cat

Maybe they were so deeply enthralled and stimulated by the multi-person conversation that it soaked up all their brain power

That is an interesting angle I hadn't considered. It would be even more plausible had there been alcohol involved. I can't say for sure. Thanks.

Originally Posted by insanezenmistress

She passes the picture to Jim and does not hear you ask......."hey (person i can be frank with), i am feeling like the hunchback of notre dame here, can I please see the picture too."

When I decided not to mention it had tried to think of a way to make it into a joke, but nothing came to mind. Your idea would have worked.

Are you are group of friends, do you share humor and happyness and sadness and comfort? Is it rude to be yourself with these people? If it is.. well then that opens up an whole new set of paranoias.

We mostly share a lot of humor, so your idea to joke about it while pointing it out could have been useful. I chose instead to try to talk about it after the fact, but haven't had an opportunity since.