love=pain. Why?

[Dulma]

Love is an umbrella term for a variety of often conflicting concepts, I think. Unconditional love can't ever bring anything but positive, joyful states of being.

But if you "love" with the desire to receive emotional sustenance from someone else, if you're needing something from them, then yes, the ultimate conclusion to the relationship will inevitably be disappointment and pain. It's just not possible for your heart to be "fed" by someone else for in a continued, sustainable, and real way. *You* have to do that for yourself.

[danas]

Originally Posted by Savage

Having babies is pretty straightforward for most people, unless you're infertile.

With the babies I meant that I feel like time is running out, I would only want babies with a partner as part of a committed relationship.
So there's pressure for it to work , which maybe I wouldnt feel if I had all the time in the world..

Originally Posted by Savage

I can relate to what you're saying about depth though, but that's the benefit of deepening your relationship to life itself. If you see yourself as having just one relationship -- with life -- then it can always go deeper. It doesn't matter which particular human being you connect with. You don't have to do any special ice-breaking. Just continue where you left off with the next person in terms of what you'd like to talk about and discuss with life.

I realize that may sound very strange, but if you can get your head around it, it works beautifully.

For instance, last week I had meet-ups with several different people for the first time. With most of them I discussed subjective reality in some manner, but I didn't restart from scratch with each person. I simply continued to explore the aspects that interested me with each new person as if I was having a singular discussion with life, each time picking up where I left off. I found every conversation fascinating.

Whenever I meet someone for the first time, I tend to assume that our relationship is already at the maximum emotional intimacy and that we're already best friends. So there's no real need to deepen anything. I can simply tap into and enjoy the depth that I assume is already there.

As I mentioned in the recent "Inspired Relationships" article, I've only been using this mindset for part of this year, but it works amazingly well. Sometimes it takes people a few minutes to get used to my openness and pacing, but people seem to catch on quick, and everyone seems to like it. It creates a high-trust connection, so people tend to feel very comfortable and will quickly open up and talk about anything that's important to them. No need to go through lots of small talk.

So far I've only been doing this in conversations with one or two other people, but I hope to get used to doing it in larger groups too. I think it will just take more practice to get comfortable with it.

This even seems to work with romantic connections. Now that's a tough one for me to get used to, so I'm easing into that part slowly because my head is still spinning after a certain experience in this area.

Yes, I can totally relate to that. After I had spent intense time with this love interest, time where I had opened up a lot and let myself be vulnerable, I took a 12 hour flight across the world. On the flight my earphone jack didnt work so the stewardess came back and said: I found you 2 available seats, you can choose. Do you want an aisle seat or a window seat?...Do you want to sit next to a man or a woman?
When she saw i couldn't decide she said- "Ill decide for you, sit next to the man, he's very cute, and you never know..." and she winked.
So I sat next to the man, and sure enough we hit it off, we had loads to talk about, I showed him my work, we watched films, played games. We even agreed that we should be 100% honest with each other bc we may never meet again. At one point I fell asleep and when I woke up I was in his arms and he was stroking my head. At that point I opened my eyes and the stewardess walked by and gave me a wink.
I never saw the guy again. but it amazed me the level of intamicy we achieved on a 12 hour flight. I know that was only bc of the relationship I was having just prior.

Thank you steve, Im feeling much much better today thanks to you and everyone here. Amazing to have such support!

[danas]

Originally Posted by James81

Now, if love is pain for you, then I've got a question for you: when did love first equal pain for you? This thread isn't the first time this has showed up, is it?

I had a breakthrough time technique session with Angela today. Ive done it with her in the past, but somehow this was left over.
We discovered that my core belief isnt that love equals pain. but rather "this wont work." It was a very strong session and so many things started making sense today. Im changing "This wont work" with "This is working perfectly as it should" or something like that.
I realized how so soon in a new relationship I bring in "This wont work" and I start to panic, get emotionally confused and instincty want to cut it.
The other person feels my panic and my strong emotional confusion, and backs off and at that point I panic more and cut them out. We found the core of that one too... I wont go into it here now though, its too long.

Originally Posted by ssandra

Danas,

As an alternative approach to your dating, a bit more on a logical level:

Do you have a list of "must have" values in your future mate?

If so, instead of falling for someone, dating them, finding out you are compatible/incompatible why not mix it up?

Why not date someone, find out if they are compatible within 2 or 3 dates and move on, or move forward?

You'll still have a chance that things don't work out of course... but at least you'll know at date nr. 1 that he doesn't want kids, before you get emotionally involved with all the feelings and heartache that follows that.

The thing is I havent been "dating" but rather inviting love into my life and when it comes they fit all my list to the T. Spiritual, artistic, honest, curious, wants kids.. etc.. and its too strong for me to back off. It feels so new and good to open up my heart, so i do.

Anyway- now Ive just joined OKcupid and I will start dating.

[danas]

Originally Posted by ginkgo

Maybe you should use love to help others. Mobedience.

Maybe you should re-think your strategy in life since it is not working!

Im totally with you that much fulfillment comes from spreading love. I do not think thats my problem though. I spread a lot of love around and I get a ton of love back. In general I feel very loved. i give and what I give I get 10 time more back.
Still, I would like to experience a relationship with a man in a fairly conservative manner. i.e monogamous.
I do not think I need to become Mother Teresa for that to happen though.

Originally Posted by brendannz

Maybe do nothing for now, and just do something when you're ready to, when you know the time's right..

Its funny, today I feel like I already know what to do. Flow. keep going. date. enjoy. next!
A lot thanks to this thread, and my session with Angela today.
Thanks.

Originally Posted by The Cloud

If love isn't your primary consideration, then maybe that's where your problems are coming from. Love doesn't exist a week from now or a year from now; it's an experience, which can only be had when all experiences are had; in the present. The future is the time when expectations and requirements exist, which have nothing to do with love.

Loving long term monogamous relationship. That is my goal. When it lasts only a month. again and again, against my will, I need to look deeper and see why that is.

[garentee]

patience. seems simple but patience usually means staring fear down and knowing that you will not go without....to gain patience you need to be patient// that is what I have learned and I hope patience comes your way....G

[C33]

This is very positive Danas! It looks like you're already attracting a lot of love in the form of the kindness of strangers ( cute guy on the plane ).

You seem to be able to start up magical conversations/encounters.

One day that conversation will last longer than one month.

whenever I meet someone for the first time, I tend to assume that our relationship is already at the maximum emotional intimacy and that we're already best friends. So there's no real need to deepen anything. I can simply tap into and enjoy the depth that I assume is already there.

Thank you Steve! This totally works! It does take time not to revert to being socially "proper". We are all connected, anyway. Social conditioning make us lose that connection, and recreate artificial connection based on inauthenticity, and disconnecting from the soul and spirit.

When you look at babies, it's wonderful how they assume that everyone is their best friend! And it's working quite well for them!

Ride on that wave of possibility that love is there already. Meeting someone special will just be one form of love manifesting.

As far as the biological clock, I think you should relax a bit, and not make your biological clock decide of your love life.

A lot of women make disastrous choices in partners based on that procreative need.

It would probably help if you could already envision the child, and all the possibilities of love attached to having a child, instead of "acquiring" a father. In a way, find the father that goes with the baby, not the baby that goes with the father.

In "working" in manifesting a child, you are also, concurrently working on manifesting the father of that child.

[The Cloud]

Originally Posted by danas

Loving long term monogamous relationship. That is my goal. When it lasts only a month. again and again, against my will, I need to look deeper and see why that is.

If you're not enjoying the love you have in the now, there's no way you can expect to enjoy it in the nows to come. If you're not enjoying your love, it's not going to conspire to make you happy. I think your preoccupation with the "long term monogamous" part of your goal is interfering with the "loving" part of it, and in my experience interference of that sort results in failure and disappointment.

I think of that failure as a gift, myself, because it always reminds me that "loving" is the only necessary adjective to a relationship. Getting what you want wouldn't change that you're more concerned with the future than you are with your present experience, which would add a sour note to even the most perfect relationship.

[Rezzy7]

Originally Posted by danas

Without one person to share my life with I do not see the point anymore.

I get this feeling a lot, too, so I can relate. It's really interesting you're doing well in other areas, but having dissatisfaction in this one. Again, I can relate! I have no suggestion except reiterating what you already know, release the thought that love=pain, and let go of worry about your bio-clock, the same thing happening over and over, and all that. For me I found The Sedona Method works well. Good luck, you seem to be close to working it out.

Originally Posted by Savage

I can relate to what you're saying about depth though, but that's the benefit of deepening your relationship to life itself. If you see yourself as having just one relationship -- with life -- then it can always go deeper. It doesn't matter which particular human being you connect with. You don't have to do any special ice-breaking. Just continue where you left off with the next person in terms of what you'd like to talk about and discuss with life.

I realize that may sound very strange, but if you can get your head around it, it works beautifully.

For instance, last week I had meet-ups with several different people for the first time. With most of them I discussed subjective reality in some manner, but I didn't restart from scratch with each person. I simply continued to explore the aspects that interested me with each new person as if I was having a singular discussion with life, each time picking up where I left off. I found every conversation fascinating.

Whenever I meet someone for the first time, I tend to assume that our relationship is already at the maximum emotional intimacy and that we're already best friends. So there's no real need to deepen anything. I can simply tap into and enjoy the depth that I assume is already there.

Very interesting post and perspective, Sav thanks. I like it. For years I have approached each new person with the attitude we are already friends, though that has had limited effectiveness. This is something that can take some getting used to, but it feels right for me, somehow.

[danas]

Originally Posted by garentee

patience. seems simple but patience usually means staring fear down and knowing that you will not go without....to gain patience you need to be patient// that is what I have learned and I hope patience comes your way....G

Very true. Thanks.

Originally Posted by C33

This is very positive Danas! It looks like you're already attracting a lot of love in the form of the kindness of strangers ( cute guy on the plane ).

You seem to be able to start up magical conversations/encounters.

One day that conversation will last longer than one month..

Yes!

Originally Posted by C33

It would probably help if you could already envision the child, and all the possibilities of love attached to having a child, instead of "acquiring" a father. In a way, find the father that goes with the baby, not the baby that goes with the father.

In "working" in manifesting a child, you are also, concurrently working on manifesting the father of that child.

I like this. Quite a few of my friends are having fatherless babies now, or babies with men who they arent in love with but both share the desire for a baby. For me this is not an option. Ive had enough men wanting to have babies with me. But I didnt love them enough. So I cant do that even if I wanted to. For me the relationship comes first. But when I finally do meet a man I see myself spending my life with, it hurts when it doesnt work out...
But yes, Ill start envisioning a baby.

Originally Posted by The Cloud

If you're not enjoying the love you have in the now, there's no way you can expect to enjoy it in the nows to come. If you're not enjoying your love, it's not going to conspire to make you happy. I think your preoccupation with the "long term monogamous" part of your goal is interfering with the "loving" part of it, and in my experience interference of that sort results in failure and disappointment.

I think of that failure as a gift, myself, because it always reminds me that "loving" is the only necessary adjective to a relationship. Getting what you want wouldn't change that you're more concerned with the future than you are with your present experience, which would add a sour note to even the most perfect relationship.

Im not so sure this is accurate. i love all the way. love doesnt stop. I keep thinking that I love this man, and I would do anything for him regardless if he is with me or not. Simply bc I love his soul. The problem is desiring something other than what is.
Although the pain still comes in waves, today I realized that its all perfect the way it is. I actually see how the loss is his. but I let go of desiring the man who isnt with me. I just realized that its such a useless, negative desire to have. It puts me in a place of constant lack.

[spacecadetglow]

I think you're just falling for the wrong men. How soon are you physically intimate with these fellas, danas? Sex too early on can make things reeeeally confusing. It releases chemicals in your brain that make you wanting more of that person, without the requisite emotional/spiritual intimacy. I don't know anything about your connections of course, but this has been the pattern with me and maybe it resonates for you.

I suggest doing some work on your intuition. You probably know right away that they aren't right for you, that they're emotionally unavailable or "just not that into you." People show you who they are all the time, but perhaps you choose to ignore that because you get addicted to those happy chemicals flooding your brain.

You mentioned that as soon as you start showing them who you are and become more open, they run away. Well, so be it. That means they are not right for you. You seem to blame yourself though. Keep being yourself, and I suggest you open up even MORE, and get MORE direct with these guys. It helps you to get clear on what you want.

Don't accept anything less than wonderful. Perhaps because you've been dating the wrong guys for long and always experience pain, you think that is the love is. It's not. Love is not pain. Keep your standards high and be discerning.

Hope this helps!

[The Cloud]

Originally Posted by danas

Im not so sure this is accurate. i love all the way. love doesnt stop. I keep thinking that I love this man, and I would do anything for him regardless if he is with me or not. Simply bc I love his soul. The problem is desiring something other than what is.
Although the pain still comes in waves, today I realized that its all perfect the way it is. I actually see how the loss is his. but I let go of desiring the man who isnt with me. I just realized that its such a useless, negative desire to have. It puts me in a place of constant lack.

I don't mind being wrong, as long as you're happy. You seem to have gotten what I was trying to say, though, even if you didn't get it because of me. As long as you don't desire things that put you in a position of emotional poverty, you can focus on the positive things you have to give and the positive people that you have to receive them.

[danas]

Originally Posted by spacecadetglow

I think you're just falling for the wrong men. How soon are you physically intimate with these fellas, danas? Sex too early on can make things reeeeally confusing. It releases chemicals in your brain that make you wanting more of that person, without the requisite emotional/spiritual intimacy. I don't know anything about your connections of course, but this has been the pattern with me and maybe it resonates for you.

I suggest doing some work on your intuition. You probably know right away that they aren't right for you, that they're emotionally unavailable or "just not that into you." People show you who they are all the time, but perhaps you choose to ignore that because you get addicted to those happy chemicals flooding your brain.

You mentioned that as soon as you start showing them who you are and become more open, they run away. Well, so be it. That means they are not right for you. You seem to blame yourself though. Keep being yourself, and I suggest you open up even MORE, and get MORE direct with these guys. It helps you to get clear on what you want.

Don't accept anything less than wonderful. Perhaps because you've been dating the wrong guys for long and always experience pain, you think that is the love is. It's not. Love is not pain. Keep your standards high and be discerning.

Hope this helps!

Thanks you but believe it or not there was no sex! Only long hugs. and even that after many long days together.
Like he described it: First we connected through the mind- we loved eachothers creative work, then we connected through the voice- we had endless things to talk about, and finally we connected through the heart.
He himself said that this is a soul connection because it wasnt just lust...
Thats his description. My intuition told me very strongly after only 3 days that this is my soulmate. I believe we have more than one though.
Last time I connected so deeply with a guy was back in 1994. and that was after many months together.

But- he is married. I couldnt help not falling for him. We spent day and night together, away from our normal lives (and his wife) and as much as I tried it was inevitable. for both of us. Now hes back home, and thats all it was. A love story. A beautiful one. but not one that ends happily ever after together...
The 2 guys before I waited a while before any sex. Longer than they ever did I suspect. Interestingly enough straight after I left the picture, they connected with someone new and now are in long term monogamous relationships.
So these guys are perfectly capable. Its not them... It me.

I have a strong belief in my art and finances that things will work. I take really crazy risks sometimes but I have a deep knowing that it will work. And it ALWAYS does.
Although, I think, until know, I had the exact opposite belief about relationships. I had a deep knowing that it won't work.
And so it was... But all thats changing know! It will work. It is working and it must work.
thanks to some work with Angela and all the wonderful people here.

[danas]

Originally Posted by The Cloud

I don't mind being wrong, as long as you're happy. You seem to have gotten what I was trying to say, though, even if you didn't get it because of me. As long as you don't desire things that put you in a position of emotional poverty, you can focus on the positive things you have to give and the positive people that you have to receive them.

Yup
Im learning every day. Every moment