Gunman at Pa. health club was bitter over women

[munish]

Gunman at Pa. health club was bitter over women - Yahoo! News

[Daffy Duck]

He was a pretty decent looking guy, so appearance wasn't the problem.

His neighbor gave us a hint:

A neighbor, Connie Fontanesi, said Sodini was so anti-social that "we really didn't learn anything personal about him."

It was his personality. His thoughts. Such a shame.

The older I get, the more I see how much creative power we have. The more I see just how easy it is. We have the power to create our work, our health, our relationships. The biggest obstacle to living a life full of joyful loving authentic relationships are the negative thoughts in our heads. The thoughts that say, "Oh, everyone fights a lot. Oh, my spouse will never find me attractive. Oh, I can't be honest about this. Oh, I can't let them know how I feel. Oh, relationships are tricky and complicated." Blah blah blah. We've heard them all. Many people believe these thoughts. They'll even strongly identity with and defend them as "the TRUTH!"

Our minds create so many excuses to fail. The human race needs more excuses to succeed!

[Dreamline]

There is nothing more dangerous than a broken human, out of warranty.

Jennifer

[MidasGirl]

Guns don't kill people. People kill people.

[James81]

Originally Posted by MidasGirl

Guns don't kill people. People kill people.

Yup, the anti-gun people LOVE stories like this don't they?

[ssandra]

Originally Posted by James81

Yup, the anti-gun people LOVE stories like this don't they?

I think the anti-gun people would be very very happy if these type of stories didn´t happen. Probably they wouldn´t even be anti-gun people if these type of stories didn´t happen...

[James81]

Originally Posted by ssandra

I think the anti-gun people would be very very happy if these type of stories didn´t happen. Probably they wouldn´t even be anti-gun people if these type of stories didn´t happen...

I know, I was being a bit facetious.

I just find it interesting that people tend to blame the guns in these situations.

[MidasGirl]

I'm not anti-gun. I'm anti-idiots-with-guns.

[danas]

His anger and frustration- thats what kept the women away from him
and it grew more and more over the years
I think anger and frustration is what stops anyone from finding love.
Forgiving is the key.
he couldn't forgive all the women whom rejected him. Without forgiveness the door to love is blocked. and so it was an endless loop for him
so sad

[Dreamline]

Sorry, but this is not about the guns.

Jennifer

[seeker5]

Originally Posted by Dreamline

Sorry, but this is not about the guns.

Agreed. I've heard nothing in this thread that was against ownership of guns. If you want a debate on guns, go to the World forum, don't start one here in the Social & Relationship forum.

About the op, it's very sad what happened to this guy, that he felt he had to go out like this. I've known other guys who've spent many years without being able to date women, it's sad.

[Andrew Brunelle]

It seems like all this guy wanted was a woman, but his own beliefs blocked him from getting one, so he took his loneliness out on people he didn't even know and caused terrible consequences. It's too bad others didn't stop him before it was too late. His webpage should have been a red flag.

[seeker5]

Originally Posted by Andrew Brunelle

It's too bad others didn't stop him before it was too late. His webpage should have been a red flag.

Yeah. It's also too bad we don't have a good, well developed system to also help guys like this.

[James81]

Originally Posted by seeker5

Yeah. It's also too bad we don't have a good, well developed system to also help guys like this.

We do.

But what most people don't seem to realize is that they have to help themselves (i.e. want help).

I mean, there are so many ways to get help in this country anymore that it's insane.

[Dreamline]

Can you imagine the phone call?

"Yeah, police? Well, my neighbor is really quiet and keeps mostly to himself. Yeah. He just bought a freezer. I'm really worried we are all in danger."

Unless they submit themselves for help, you can never really tell who is normal and who is damaged. Some of the most seemingly damaged people in the world, or those that should be, turn out to be the most amazing humans. And the most normal seeming, monsters.

I just don't know how it would be logistically possible without tossing out human, civic and societal rights, wholesale.

Jennifer

[MidasGirl]

Originally Posted by seeker5

Yeah. It's also too bad we don't have a good, well developed system to also help guys like this.

I see this as a pretty common phenomenon, where people feel they have a right to be pissed at everyone else for what's going wrong in their lives. Taking responsibility would be a good place to start. Apparently this guy did attend one of those dating seminars. Maybe working on himself, rather than his dating skills or lack thereof, might have yielded better results?

[spirit4711]

Originally Posted by MidasGirl

I'm not anti-gun. I'm anti-idiots-with-guns.

Dogbert, the smart dog in the Dilbert comic, once said: 'Everyone can have guns. But I should be the only one with bullets'. Wise words indeed...

Back on topic, a totally sad event. A thoroughly frustrated guy, and dead and wounded women.

[freddy]

I wonder if these people attract this to happen to them? I mean with all the LOA talk on the forum. At what point is it LOA. VS being at the wrong place, at the wrong time kick in.
And I wonder if before this tragedy, was there anyone reading his blog pages at all?

[seeker5]

Originally Posted by James81

We do.

But what most people don't seem to realize is that they have to help themselves (i.e. want help).

I mean, there are so many ways to get help in this country anymore that it's insane.

Yeah, there is some help. But not a good systematic help like there is with Alchoholics, and Drug addicts. Not that those systems have problem, plenty of people fall through the cracks there. However, in comparison, I don't think there's a good system yet for people like that guy and his dating life. There is still too much of a stigma associated with guys not being able to date, and so much of the material to help them date is contradictory and mostly worthless.

[JSB]

I pity this poor, misguided, frustrated, suffering man, but my pity can go only so far --- he was in such despair that he took his own life, but he chose to make others suffer as well, and the murders he committed have not only killed his victims, but inflicted terrible pain upon their loved ones.

Suicide is awful enough, but a rampage like this is unforgivable.

[Andrew Brunelle]

We can all learn something from this tragedy. This man had rage inside of him and was bitter towards what he perceived as the cause of his loneliness. I don't know the man, but I'm sure very few did. He could have gotten help, but help doesn't work for everyone. Some people can be in counseling and therapy for years and still never get where it is they want to be.

It would be one thing if he had just ended his own life. It would not have made the papers or the national news and he would have faded away without harming others, except for those who cared about him. I just feel bad that he had to take more lives and cause so much more suffering just because he was suffering. But it's over now and we can learn from this. We can recognize parts of him in ourselves and in those we care for and prevent something like this from happening again.

[spirit4711]

Originally Posted by Andrew Brunelle

...We can recognize parts of him in ourselves and in those we care for and prevent something like this from happening again.

True words... The hardest part for me is to really see this...

[missing]

Originally Posted by Andrew Brunelle

We can all learn something from this tragedy. This man had rage inside of him and was bitter towards what he perceived as the cause of his loneliness. I don't know the man, but I'm sure very few did. He could have gotten help, but help doesn't work for everyone. Some people can be in counseling and therapy for years and still never get where it is they want to be.

It would be one thing if he had just ended his own life. It would not have made the papers or the national news and he would have faded away without harming others, except for those who cared about him. I just feel bad that he had to take more lives and cause so much more suffering just because he was suffering. But it's over now and we can learn from this. We can recognize parts of him in ourselves and in those we care for and prevent something like this from happening again.

Good post. This was a real wake up call to me as I can certainly see a lot of myself in this guy and it's scary, though I'm not a violent person. I do have violent fantasies, but I keep them that way - fantasies, and I don't see that changing. All the same, this incident depressed me worse than any news story I can remember. But it may also help move me to action to improve my situation. I'm afraid if I do nothing I will get as desperate as this guy, sans the murderous rampage, of course.