Trying to attract a richer woman?

[Kean]

How do you usually relate to people who come from an entirely different social background.

By "social" I mean everything from economic, cultural and ideological.

Do you have closer relationships (including friendship and love) with people who are different from you?

What do you think about dating across economic differences, e.g. poor man dating rich woman? Do you think it is challenging, or that it shouldn't be, that it is impossible, that the effort isn't worth it?

What are your attitudes, in general, towards deeper relationships with those who are different?

One reason I am asking this is that most people (mainly in the self-help industry) say that in order for deeper relationships to work, there should be some elements of social background in common, whether it be religion, nationality/ethnicity but most importantly wealth.
The second reason I am asking this is that in my whole life I have only had deeper relationships with people who were much richer than me since I grew up as a "poor kid with a scholarship in rich schools and elite universities", I was the only one with a different skin color, so I somehow feel the need to bridge these different people regardless of the differences.
(Anyone else had similar experiences to mine?)

I'd like to hear everyones' opinion.

[Brutha]

It certainly easier when there is a shared background, but that doesn't mean that it's impossible to overcome gaps.
There are a lot of things that are possible if you are commited.

[ssandra]

I think it is more important to have similar attitude than similar backgrounds. Of course, having similar backgroudns usually leads to similar attitude (especially about money...)

[MidasGirl]

I think it depends on you and what works for you actually. For some people (like me) being with someone of a different background in whatever way, is an adventure in itself . For others, being in their comfort zone is what works for them.

Do you have closer relationships (including friendship and love) with people who are different from you?

Yes very much so. Bear in mind that every relationship type has its own unique consequences. If certainty is high on your needs list, you're probably best sticking with your kind.

[pyrogen]

A lot of what they're talking about, is common cultural background, not how much money you presently have.

I relate to this very well. I was raised with a lot of "wealthy" privileges and values, without being wealthy - parents would send me to ballet lessons if it meant we were eating boiled beans every day of the week. There were intellectual conversations around the dinner table every night, and my dad worked for a school so that I could go to a private school. My parents both played instruments, so they taught me about music *themselves*, and expected me to join the school orchestra. It wasn't acceptable for me not to play an instrument.

The thing is, when I'm around most people who are in the same socioeconomic place I'm in (I work doing home health care while putting myself through school, at age 35 - I didn't manage to go to college right after high school - and I'm interested in *academia*, not something "practical") they are usually very focused on lower-order Maslow needs. We don't tend to have very much intellectually, socially or spiritually in common.

I have much more in common with people who are in a higher income bracket, most of the time.

Likewise, people who are "nouveau riche" (new money) or who have worked hard to become the first middle class member of their family, often find they have very little in common with other more established members of their social class.

There is so much more to social class than just money. Otherwise, academics and the like, who actually make very little money, would be considered the same class as plumbers - who often make quite a bit more.

[aelle]

pyrogen, once again what you say resonates deeply with me. I come from what I think sociologists call the X class. Both my parents were intellectual, college graduates, my mother came from a wealthy family. But they made the choice to go for low income but meaningful careers - working for social welfare, in non profits rather than private companies, stay at home parent, etc. And indeed I spent a lot of my younger years feeling like I didn't belong. We didn't have the money for me to have common hobbies with middle class kids, but couldn't find much common ground with working class kids.

I ended up piecing together my own network of friends with other outliers, mostly people who've had too bizarre experiences in life to fit the classical class/income system. Funnily enough, no matter how diverse the backgrounds, we often end up with similar attitudes: well read in social matters, science and fiction, environmentalists, internationalists, curious about the world, with an entrepreneurial spirit and political leftist leanings. Great mix .

To address the original question, I too think that common experiences and attitudes in life count more than income - but then again the former make up a large part of what social class is. If you don't have these common references, however, you will be forced to address some daily issues through lots of honest communication, which is always a great habit for couples to take.

[pyrogen]

Aelle, that's very interesting. I'll google, I want to learn more about the "x" class.

I've had this frustration... when I get involved with people who are *culturally* in sync with me... often they have a lot of expectations and assumptions of privilege. Many of their political views, even, will come out of these assumptions.

I just did not grow up with that kind of privilege. Where this can play out in nightmarish fashion is when you're planning a wedding... thinking about my relationship with my ex husband. His family was very resentful that my family didn't have any money and couldn't afford a wedding. But they expected a big wedding nonetheless. And it came out of my ex husband's savings. To please his family. And he resented ME for that. He also was very pro-public-schooling and totally dug in about this. I'm not, because of having grown up in "bad" areas that had "bad" schools. The idea that you can actually get an education from a public school, surprises and amazes me. Another thing we often got into arguments about, had to do with his anti-military leanings. Um, practically my whole family is either 1) a veteran 2) married to a veteran or active duty person or 3) on active duty?

He and I had every academic/intellectual thing in common, but we were opposed on practically every issue that would constitute a hill either of us would die on.

And I tend to be just a little more conservative than a lot of the "educated/academic" type of people.

After him, I vowed to get with someone who would "get it" next time... so I got with someone from a working class background, who was just as poor as me. Oh, that was candied hell on a stick. He felt like I wasted my time with all the stuff I'm into. All of our time was spent focused on lower-heirarchy needs. It became worse after we moved into a fixer-upper house... his first home was a great point of pride for him, but to me, it was something time consuming that would be taken away from developing the mind. We had totally different ideas about what we wanted to share with a family and as a relationship, because of different class backgrounds. Totally different love languages.

I turned away from an academic focus while with him, to become strictly vocationally oriented and grounded, and I TRIED to be more working class, and I was totally miserable... I feel like I totally lost myself with him. Life was supposed to revolve around work, and it was acceptable to hate work, because after all, most Americans hate their jobs, right? And there's something wrong with me if I expect to actually get pleasure out of my day to day life?

This will probably give any TV watchers a laugh - I finally broke up with him after the episode of CSI where Grissom left the team to go be with Sara in the jungles of Costa Rica. I literally broke down in tears after that, because that's closer to what I have always envisioned of love... not working two jobs, spending all of free time fixing a house, and an endless parade of BBQs with exactly the same friends, every weekend, the rest of my life. My ex would probably see me as horribly selfish, but I also see it as a good thing that I left him to free him up for someone who shares his vision of life.

My most recent relationship attempt after him - screwing this up feels like such a loss to me (he was almost too good of a fit on paper - I got a little too excited about him and scared him off) - was with someone who had an advanced degree and heavily academically inclined but worked his way through school, by working in a factory. This really seemed like the perfect mix for me. That's really the kind of blend I need in a partner... I need them to be very higher-Maslow-needs oriented (focused on learning and on personal development), but they have to know how the other half lives.

One reason I wouldn't get with a culturally poor person (as opposed to someone educated but in a low paid field) is because poor people *think* like poor people, and this colors *everything*. They don't envision the future beyond that pension plan. Everything is extremely day to day. They think things can never be better, and they think very small, and they won't emotionally support you if you have bigger ideas, because they want to drag everyone down to their level of misery. The way I was raised - was to believe that as long as you keep learning, anything is possible. My parents didn't stay poor - they just succeeded later in life. They still had to have the vision to do this. They never told me anything was impossible. If I announced (at 35, with health issues) that I wanted to be an astronaut, they would tell me, "Go for it! I'm proud of you!" while thinking, well, ok, as a sick 35 year old, she might not become an astronaut, but she'll probably end up a space scientist working for NASA out of all that hard work.

My parents were/are "shoot for the stars, you might land on the moon". Whereas a lot of working class people tend to be very, "Stay on Earth, it's secure here, it's scary and risky up there". They aren't personally acquainted with anyone who does anything but some "practical", "safe" job, so to them, it doesn't exist.

A lot of immigrant families tend to be this way, too... can't tell you how many of my Asian friends really wanted to be anthropologists or artists or such, but the family pressure to be in a "safe" field is impossible to overcome. In this way, those "safe" fields of medicine, engineering and management, can be like a better-paid version of the working class.

Which is ridiculous, because in any recession, there are few "safe" fields. Plenty of those people in "safe" professions are getting laid off, while the risk takers are laughing.

I'm sorry to hijack the thread. This just illustrates (I feel) several of the things that can come up when you get with someone who is from too different of a socioeconomic background.

To make a long story short: a poor person from "old money" has more in common with a rich person from "old money" than the same poor person has in common with another poor person who is from a poor background.

Class is a lot more than simply money, it's a whole set of attitudes, wishes, goals, and expectations - it's a worldview. For many people who come from generations of poverty, or from a working class background, vision and hope is beat out of them from day one and they simply may have too much to overcome to begin to be positive-thinking people.

[Kean]

Thanks for all your posts!

pyrogen, you didn't hijack the thread, you actually addressed exactly what I was speaking about! Thanks

I come from a pretty unusual family: working class immigrants but very international. They had several (non-managerial) jobs in the travel trade / hospitality. My parents have an attitude very similar to what you mentioned: "Keep your feet on the ground, since it's safe, and consider yourself lucky for having all those scholarships, etc."
However, the fact that I traveled so much and lived in different countries throughout my life made me learn new languages and become more curious about the world and the people around me. It is this curiosity that in the end motivated me to work hard at school, pursue university studies and get good grades, scholarships, etc. rather than follow the "safety goal" my parents always set.

Typical situation in my family...
I tell my parents:"Wow, the oral exam of Organizational Psychology was so interesting! They asked about one of my favorite topics!", father replies:"Do you think you'll get an A?"

My motivation was further fostered by my friends. My best friend since 10+ years is from a family that is radically different from my social class. His father is a CEO and his mother a chief editor of the nations' main weekly magazine.
Perhaps (perhaps!) being wealthy allows rich and well-educated kids not to worry too much about the lower needs and thereby focus on things that will help them get a better income anyway. If it weren't for my best friend, I would have never been interested in classical music, drama/musical acting, and everything related to culture which my parents would call a total waste of time.

He took me to high class orchestra concerts and operas for free and made me acquainted with a lifestyle I probably would have never learned about.

Most of my peers from my own social class (e.g. other immigrants) are not at university, already working in jobs similar to their parents, and have fun only on saturday when they go out to nightclubs - if I start a conversation about composition, sociology/psychology or science they would get bored and call me "TOO PHILOSOPHICAL" or "TOO INTELLECTUAL" (also my parents call me like this).

However, what I am realizing now is that IF I want to continue the lifestyle I was allowed to live thanks to my scholarships and "high cultural" friends, I cannot become a psychology professor or a researcher.
A typical classical music concert ticket is sometimes 10 times more than a nightclub ticket, and add the elegant clothes you have to buy in order to mingle with the people after a theater, high class restaurants and - perhaps most importantly - women with a high taste of fashion.

I have developed a good taste for fashion throughout my lucky years, but if I merely pursued an academic job, I wouldn't be able to afford what I wish.

This is a reason why I am aiming at a job/career that would allow me to find intrinsic motivation in the job and to earn enough money so I can afford high class activities.

What I am unsure about is whether it would be right or wrong to make such a decision only for the sake of getting "richer women".
After all, I could also try being more flexible with working class women... what do you think?

[ssandra]

Originally Posted by Kean

A typical classical music concert ticket is sometimes 10 times more than a nightclub ticket, and add the elegant clothes you have to buy in order to mingle with the people after a theater, high class restaurants and - perhaps most importantly - women with a high taste of fashion.
...
This is a reason why I am aiming at a job/career that would allow me to find intrinsic motivation in the job and to earn enough money so I can afford high class activities.
....
What I am unsure about is whether it would be right or wrong to make such a decision only for the sake of getting "richer women".
After all, I could also try being more flexible with working class women... what do you think?

It doesn´t sound like you want it just to get richer women... it sounds more like you want it to live a certain lifestyle.

I think there is nothing wrong with working in order to aford a lifestyle that fits you, that you would enjoy.

I would seriously just lighten up on the richer/working woman attitude.. Some day you will meet somebody and you will have chemistry and there will be stuff to talk about and you will fall in love. This can happen with anybody!

Of course, if you are mainly hanging out with richer people, it is more likely that she is rich as well... or she can be the waiter in your favorite restaurant.