To stand up for oneself or to roll with it

[Patriciatta]

Hi, I'm new to the forum,

Much of my attention toward personal growth is geared toward taking the higher ground but expressing my needs and wants (even identifying them has been tough for me). In my opinion, I've been the "grace under pressure" sort of person who rolls with it, avoids conflict, and generally has other people's interests in mind.

However, it is with my ex-husband and his wife that I find this most difficult. It is as if they wish I did not exist, and this makes it challenging since we have three kids ages 16, 14, and 12 to raise (joint custody). I suspect it is from my ex's wife's insecurity that things are harder than they should be. I have been very supportive of their marriage since day one three years ago. I'm very supportive to my kids, encouraging them to show respect and appreciation toward her, although she is an authoritarian parent and living under her roof been very challenging to them (another subject).

Where the snags occur is anything in which we both have to be present for the kids. She will do the footwork to be sure we are not seated near each other at an event for example. They used to call common friends to be sure we wouldn't be also invited events, but our friends got tired of that, and it seems to be mostly history.

My ex does not look me in the eye or say hello, though I wave and say hi when appropriate. We divorced 6 years ago, and it came from me - so I suspect he is still bitter. I remarried last year to a great guy who is no threat whatsoever to their father. My concern is that there will only be more events in the future (graduations, weddings, etc.) that I will potentially miss out on in full or in part because I would rather not have our kids put in an awkward position.

An example is my daughter will be attending an art program for a month this summer. Though I paid for the entire residential program ($$), spent a month suggesting ideas to my daughter and researching ideas for her personal growth (that was the requirement), he helped her do the application while I was out of town with another kid.

In person, I was grateful to him, and even thanked him for his technology genius getting her portfolio online. I meant it. No eye contact of course. I let him know I'd like to buy her ticket home, so she and I could have an extra day to visit friends, and asked him what his plans were - would that work? He said he'd get back to me.

He just let me know the two of them would be there for the final expo and would be flying her home with them. My fear is being the outsider (does that even make sense - she is my daughter!) and having to be a wall flower for the expo, so it's not awkward for my daughter. Again. How do I get myself in this position? Is there a way to stand up for myself without causing conflict and making things worse?

I'm feeling very immature about even writing this, but I'd like to find a way to grow as a person so I don't spend days ruminating about how to handle so we all get what we want, without the expense of my kids.

Any suggestions welcome. Thanks.

[ns123]

Why don't you ask your daughter what she prefers? If she wants to stay a day longer with you to visit, or fly home immediately with her dad?

Normally, when you have joint custody, whoever has the child at the time will say. For example, if you have her that week, you get to say. If he does... he gets to say. So if it's his week, he gets to say, and you gotta grin and bear it. But if it's your week, I dunno why you have to ask his permission - you get to say if she will fly home with you or with him, cuz it's YOUR week.

[Patriciatta]

I wanted to thank you for responding to my post - probably just one of those "stick with the facts" bits of advice was what I needed. Just so happened that her father's week included the final exhibition, so he'll just attend with his wife, and I'll go earlier (she's there for a month). My daughter's preference was to have me there, but I need to respect the system that is in place. Thanks again.

[TonyToneTone]

Edited because I like Dot's approach.

[Dot]

Hey Patriciatta, it seems obvious that your ex doesn't want any involvement with you. So why are you making "common events" into a battle ground for everyone involved?

Where the snags occur is anything in which we both have to be present for the kids.

Then eliminate them entirely. There is nothing in the world that both you and your ex have to be present at simultaneously "for the kids." Nothing. And if there's an event you want to go to - just go. And leave your ex out of it. Focus on your kids.

My ex does not look me in the eye or say hello, though I wave and say hi when appropriate.

Ah, this is total, um, game playing on your part. Your ex owes you nothing. Leave him alone. This seems to be more about you messing with your ex than about your kids. More about you creating battle grounds.

Are you ready to drop it? Are you ready to let everyone get on with their lives?

Create more events. Create your own parties and ceremonies that include you and your children. The beauty in this is that everyone gets what they want. And, in fact, your kids get much, much more.

You obviously created more space by divorcing your ex. So, now create even more space/s.

[Dot]

I suspect it is from my ex's wife's insecurity that things are harder than they should be.

Wow, you've made yourself and your new hubby as out to be the "good" people, and your ex and his wife out to be the bad people.

You might examine that it is precisely from YOUR insecurity that things are harder than they should be.

Maybe you could make a list of all the great qualities of your ex and his wife, and all the messed-up stuff about your and your new hubby. Because that would expose the mote in your own eye. The crap inside you. And after you remove it you'll suddenly have the bigger space that you and everyone else wants - especially your kids. : )

[Patriciatta]

Wow good info - gulp - actually really good - the fact that I want to throw up probably means something hits home.

I guess my little fantasy where we all get along is just completely unrealistic. And I thought being nice in front of the kids was what we were supposed to do "for the kids" to be respectful and supportive.

But game playing, huh? Must be my shadow side I don't see - but thank you for pointing that out. I will give it some serious thought.

It's just too bad because I know how ex's can get along - I have a great relationship with my current husband's wife, many family events coordinated together etc.

I am ready to drop it - geez maybe I have been holding on to something - can't place it - something there - seeking harmony, redemption? I'm being very candid. I was bullied for years, and I still want "approval." something like that...ridiculous I know.

I am ready to move on with our lives - whatever that means I need to face.

Thank you!!

[Patriciatta]

Originally Posted by Dot

[i]

You might examine that it is precisely from YOUR insecurity that things are harder than they should be.

Good one -

Will try to decifer - check - all insecurities are present. Should spare you the details I suppose...that's a good point.

[shasah]

Patriciatta, I totally disagree with Dot. I am in a similar position although my kids are older. There are situations that you will both want to be present. Your kids only achieve certain accomplishments once. You have to be there for your kids and minimizing awkardness is a good goal. Minimizing it for your ex and his wife are not important in my eyes, but doing so for your kids is of utmost importance. They need both of their parents.

I keep minimal contact with my ex and have not yet met his girlfriend, but when an event requires both of us to attend, we do so. An award at school or a graduation or a marriage need to be celebrated with both parents. Be the bigger person, don't talk bad about the ex or the wife to your kids, keep your chin up and be proud of who you are but don't invite confrontation.

It's all about your kids, not you, not him. They need you and should not be put into the middle. I hope you are able to succeed in this very important endeavor.

Last but not least, none of us knows your particular situation and you need to keep positive. Don't start beating yourself up because of something written here. None of us is perfect, but I highly doubt that you are the one totaly at fault either. As they say, it takes two....

Good luck!!!

[Patriciatta]

Ugh I forgot to log in before I wrote my response! It evaporated - after an hour of writing.

Oh well, newbie!

I wanted to thank you Shasah, for your post.

Also it was helpful to take Dot's suggestion and reverse the perspective to see my insecurities that I am projecting on my ex and his wife. I am hoping to grow through the awareness of this - and I did make my list.

Though somehow Dot's post did seem like a slap in the face. I'm now wondering if I'm self-righteous underneath this sweet exterior, or I wouldn't have had a response like that that I think I am "good" and they are "bad." I always thought they felt that way about me! Ah ha? Another projection?

I do take the higher ground in my actions and speech, just trying to work on the guts.

Not every event needs me, but the big ones do require that I am at least there as a wallflower. That's all the kids need. I think that is a fair resolution.

This has been helpful - thank you!