Is Pick Up Weird? Of Course Not You’re Just Too SCARED To Try It

[Murphy]

On this board, like on others, I find again and again EXCUSES, EXCUSE, EXCUSES not to get involved in the Seduction Community.

My main three external life focuses are

Health,
Wealth
and Relationships

I don’t know if you guys have the same focuses. Apparently not. Apparently none of the ‘men’ out there care about improving their relationships. They don’t think that’s a priority. Their not bothered if they don’t get laid. Or if their girlfriend is fat. Which she is.

I thought this was a personal development forum!!

Lets look at some of the excuses that have been trotted out as to why pick up is bad:


1. “Those techniques only work to get one night stands. I’m deeper that that.”

Firstly. One night stands are ****ing ace. Sometime I just wanna grab some girl who looks hot and take her back to mine and **** her and never see her again. And you know what? So do you. Maybe some people do think one night stands are wrong. And I respect that. But most people don’t like them because they can’t get them so they build up an ego around that. If someone mentions how they had a fun one night stand, they look at them with disgust. It probably less painful for them to do that then to have to look at them with envy or jealousy.

Secondly. Have you studied the techniques? No. So many posts and ebooks on the community are written about maintaining a relationship. Heres one. Heres another. Oh look there's one here as well.


2. "I’m already in a loving relationship."

Think that’s going to last forever? Only if you die first. Anyway lets face it. You could do better. Especially if you studied seduction. She’s fat isn’t she? She’s a little bit rotund and its always bothered you.

And do you really know how to please your wife or girlfriend. I can tell you one thing for dam sure. I really know how to please your wife or girlfriend. So if you don't want me pleasing her down some back alley while your at 'toastmasters' you better learn.

The seduction community has lots of advice for men in relationships, especially about being a really man, masculine and feminine polarity and sex.


3. "I’m already good with women."

Really? When was the last time you got laid? How many girls have you slept with? Well? How many? Sixish? What do you mean sixISH? Oh you mean five. Well don’t be a ego chode about it. At least have the courage to admit you suck.

Anyway say you are good with women – say you’ve slept with hundreds of women. Do you not at least, could you not even CONSIDER the possibility that there’s something you could learn from someone who’s slept with THOUSANDS of women. (That’s not me by the way I’ve only slept with 18 girls.)

Or say you have slept with thousands of women. Don't you think you owe it to the world to give us newbies some advice? Either way this is no excuse.


4. "Pick Up is deceptive."

Your mum is deceptive.

Pick up is deceptive like sales is deceptive. Lol. What a load of bollocks. You give me a honest man - teach him some sales skills - and he’ll be an honest salesman. You give me a dishonest man or a wishy-washy not sure of his morals man – teach him some sales skills – and he’ll be a dishonest salesman.

Some pick up gurus do teach men to bend the truth. Mystery for example. Some teach them to outright lie. Others like Sean Messenger or Jonny Soprono are very much focused on honesty and authenticity towards women.


5. "It all about confidence and I don’t need that, I’m already confident."

Uhuh. It’s all about confidence is it?
If you’ve had a great date with a woman and then she won’t kiss you. What do you do? You try again, but she refuses again.
All the confidence in the world won’t help you here. All that’s needed is a little knowledge of women’s psychology. What’s the answer? If you’ve got any sense you’ll do a google search and find out for yourself.

You can have all the confidence in the world but if you don't understand women's psychology, you're done for.

Anyway most people who say this aren't that confident with women. They are confident. In their jobs, or in other areas of their life. But I bet their to scared to approach a random woman in a bar. I've been shot down more times than the Japanese, thats real confidence.


6. The techniques seemed focused on pick up women in bars and clubs “that’s not a natural fit for me.”

Did it ever occur to you that clubs are fun places where people go to dance and mess around? Did it ever occur to you that intelligent girls sometimes go to clubs to let loose? Also smoking hot girls that are fun to have sex with go to clubs.
And not all the theory focus on bars and clubs. Most of it is about becoming a better MAN. Clubs are just a good place to practice.


Are you ready for the FINAL EXCUSE? It’s a good one.

“I’m too ****ing scared to go out into the real world, push myself and meet women. I’d rather stay procrastinating behind a keyboard, not getting laid, but feeling good about myself because I do ‘personal development.’"

[Parthon]

I admire what you are saying Murphy, seduction is a tool not something to be scared of, but I question your motives.

2. "I’m already in a loving relationship."

Think that’s going to last forever? Only if you die first. Anyway lets face it. You could do better. Especially if you studied seduction. She’s fat isn’t she? She’s a little bit rotund and its always bothered you.

And do you really know how to please your wife or girlfriend. I can tell you one thing for dam sure. I really know how to please your wife or girlfriend. So if you don't want me pleasing her down some back alley while your at 'toastmasters' you better learn.

What the **** is this? Honestly? :P

[Scorpio]

The idea of getting better with women isn't weird, but the Seduction Community sure as hell can be:

Some Core Reasons The Seduction Community Is So Weird
Detrimental Attitudes You Can Pick Up Through The Seduction Community
Weird Dynamics That Can Occur Between Seduction Community Members

[Daffy Duck]

Originally Posted by Murphy

Sometime I just wanna grab some girl who looks hot and take her back to mine and **** her and never see her again. And you know what? So do you.

Oops. I will just stop reading there. The moment someone tells me what I want to do, I consider them to be speaking foolishness. You know better than that.

Also Murphy, it appears you're trying hard to come across as a badass with your aggressive style of writing, but you know that we all can see through that, right? It's cute and it's something I've seen a lot in the Seduction Community. That stuff only works on the naive. It is better to sound like a person who sincerely wants to help. Johnny Soporno's posts on this forum (that I've seen) are very positive. He doesn't sound like a jerk. He gives a lot of good information in his posts. I don't see him judging people or sounding like an egomaniac and pretending he will sleep with your wife. Please, that's for beginners.

Sleeping with random hot women is relatively easy. After a while, one may want to move onto other things. More challenging and potentially rewarding things.

However, I will give my opinion on the Seduction Community: There is a lot of positive things to learn from it. Although many of the ideas center around "scoring with women," (which there is nothing wrong with if it's a mutual agreement between the male and female) these same ideas are used to boost self-confidence, have fun, and achieve goals. These same ideas are found in many personal development communities.

[MidasGirl]

LMFAO..............Wow!!! I'm so glad I deal with men, not boys. I laughed till I peed my pants reading that article. I feel bad for girls in their 20's if this is what they get to deal with these days, not that boys were better 10 years ago when I was in my early 20's. Nothing changes .

[SomeRandomGuy]

The primary complaints that I see regarding the seduction community are that the teachings tend to objectify women and that "success" is often measured by how many hot women you can sleep with.

The OP briefly mentions that there is much material in the community about maintaining relationships. Notice, however, that 2 lines of the post are aimed at that aspect, while the rest of the post is focused on one night stands, implying that guys should want to do better than a fat girlfriend, that a guy sucks if he hasn't slept with more than 5 women, etc.

I believe that there are positive sides of the seduction community, and that some of the material truly is aimed at forming healthy, meaningful relationships. It seems, however, that most of what we hear about is the other side. I'm sure there are many men who want the things offered by this part of the community, and I see nothing wrong with that as long as they are honest with themselves and the women they are targeting. To claim, however, that men who don't want to be involved in the seduction community are:

Originally Posted by Murphy

“too ****ing scared to go out into the real world, push myself and meet women. I’d rather stay procrastinating behind a keyboard, not getting laid, but feeling good about myself because I do ‘personal development.’"

seems to be incredibly off base.

Personally, I believe that this line of thinking is very shallow. Judging success by how many hot women a man has slept with seem incredibly silly to me. The same goes for people who judge success by the type a car a person drives or how big their house is. Those things are superficial, and mean nothing about the person or the level of success they have attained in their life.

Originally Posted by MidasGirl

LMFAO..............Wow!!! I'm so glad I deal with men, not boys. I laughed till I peed my pants reading that article. I feel bad for girls in their 20's if this is what they get to deal with these days, not that boys were better 10 years ago when I was in my early 20's. Nothing changes .

I'm glad to see that there are women out there who don't fall for the PUA tactics, and are instead interested in building real relationships with a real person. I'm sure there are men who consider themselves a PUA who meet that description, but I suspect those are not the ones who are targeting women for one night stands and trying to prove they are successful at relationships by sleeping with lots of women.

[Daffy Duck]

I've had much success in life by simply being myself. What does that mean? Johnny spells it out nicely here: "Just Be Yourself...?!?" She says...

[Murphy]

Originally Posted by Daffy Duck

Sleeping with random hot women is relatively easy. After a while, one may want to move onto other things. More challenging and potentially rewarding things.

OK. How many hot women have you slept with then?

[TonyToneTone]

Edit.

[garentee]

Originally Posted by Murphy

OK. How many hot women have you slept with then?

Why does the number matter?

[Happybird]

It makes me chucke that Murphy seems to think that a man needs an excuse NOT to get involved in the seduction community.

See, I think that its actually the other way around: you should have a good reason for yourself to work on your "seduction skills". The main reason for most people who start studying seduction is that, well, they suck at it. That sure is true for me, heh.

Perhaps you should read this article about how the seduction community can make you weird, Murphy. The following parts may be of special interest to you:

• Trying to proselytize and convert your friends
• Being an unsolicited advice and opinion giver
• Being too against mainstream society
• Feeling arrogant and superior just for being in the 'Community'
• Buying too much into the self-hype that the Community is some movement
• Being too into the idea of the Community being secret and underground
• Trading one set of misguided ideas about women for another
• Chasing after and glorifying a lifestyle you don't even know you want

I'd say as far as the seduction "expert" that wrote this article is concerned, you classify as WEIRD.

[Savage]

I agree that the seduction community has some good people in it, and studying some PUA material can help people make progress on their personal growth. It's definitely not all bad. Often the marketing messages are worse than the material behind them.

Johnny Soporno and Zan Perrion are examples of the light side of the seduction community. I've hung out with both of them and consider them friends. Their style isn't about racking up bedpost notches and treating women like objects. They have a lot of respect for women, and the women they're with seem quite happy about it. Their focus is on being authentic in expressing one's sexuality and not hiding the fact that we're all sexual beings. They're both very intelligent people as well. I had one conversation with Johnny that lasted nearly 8 hours straight.

It's hard to make blanket statements about the seduction community as a whole because it has so many different facets. Everyone's experience with it is unique. Some men enjoy awesome transformations -- building the courage to be authentic and comfortable in their own skin. Other men devolve into social robots or become very weird and manipulative.

The authentic guys are really awesome. I've spent many, many hours talking to such people face-to-face. IMO the creepy social robots tend to be found more often among the perpetual students. All of the teachers I've met in this community have seemed very authentic to me, although I haven't met that many of them yet -- about 8 so far.

[Daffy Duck]

Originally Posted by Murphy

OK. How many hot women have you slept with then?

LOL. That's something I hear teenagers ask each other and won't give you the satisfaction of an answer. You missed my points, I see.

Besides, if my number is higher than yours, you will say I'm lying. If my number is lower, then you will whip out your e-Penis on me.

You're in the Seduction community, bud. You know how easy and natural it can be. Anything I can do without trying is easy. I can't fly a plane without trying, but I have had multiple women come onto me for sex without any effort on my part. So to me, flying a plane is harder than sleeping with women, and that's why I say picking up women is relatively easy. To be fair, flying a plane isn't that hard either once you know how.

I also have a friend who you would refer to as a "natural" who does it extremely successfully without even trying. He doesn't even intend to. Girls just love him although he has a hard time finding a "good one" suitable for a long-term relationship.

You know what's hard? Try creating a blog more popular than Steve Pavlina's. Try making more money than Bill Gates. That is hard. That takes some serious effort. That gives you "braggin' rights." Sleeping with 10 or 20 women is hardly anything worth bragging about, at least to me.

People like Tynan and Soporno are successful PUAs and they don't act like asses (that I've witnessed). When you come on here and talk **** to everyone, you don't sound successful... you sound like you're trying. That's one of my points, bud. This is feedback for you. Ignore it if you wish.

[LifeFirst]

I've picked up women before, and I've never gotten rejected. EVER. But I got bored with it, because it's meaningless to me. So I do something else now. So what can you do about it, huh? What exactly can you do about it?

[Murphy]

Originally Posted by Daffy Duck

LOL. That's something I hear teenagers ask each other and won't give you the satisfaction of an answer.

Mate the satisfaction comes from you not answering, like I knew you wouldn't.

That sounds harsh. I hoped you would answer, but I suspected you wouldn't

Originally Posted by Daffy Duck

Sleeping with random hot women is relatively easy. After a while, one may want to move onto other things. More challenging and potentially rewarding things.

Uhuh. If you slept with lots of hot women you can say that. If you haven't you can't.

My point is this. Sleeping with attractive women is not easy for most people. Thus most people deride it as a goal that isn't worth attaining. Steve does the same thing.

In fact it is a goal worth attaining. And not just for hot girls or for hot sex but also for HIGH QUALITY GIRLS.

Once you have attained it, by all means move on to better things. I will once I have. But if you haven't then you should be aiming for that goal.

[Daffy Duck]

Originally Posted by Murphy

Uhuh. If you slept with lots of hot women you can say that.

Exactly, mate. You're starting to catch on.

Since this magical number is so special to you, why don't you tell us how many you have slept with?

hoped you would answer, but I suspected you wouldn't.

You suspected correctly. I try not to answer silly questions. I'm glad you noticed this already. I wonder if you will answer your own silly question?

My point is this. Sleeping with attractive women is not easy for most people. Thus most people deride it as a goal that isn't worth attaining. Steve does the same thing.

What is your point? If Steve wanted to sleep with a bunch of women, I bet he would be more successful at it than you and I combined.

But if you haven't then you should be aiming for that goal.

You're assuming that every male has the goal of sleeping with a lot of hot women. This is a false assumption and is easily verified to be false. A continued belief in something that has proven to be nonfactual is called Delusion...

I can just imagine a basketball player coming up to me and saying, "You should be aiming to be as good as Michael Jordan." Ummm... why? I like basketball but I don't care that much about it.

[Johnny Soporno]

Originally Posted by Daffy Duck

It is better to sound like a person who sincerely wants to help. Johnny Soporno's posts on this forum (that I've seen) are very positive. He doesn't sound like a jerk. He gives a lot of good information in his posts. I don't see him judging people or sounding like an egomaniac and pretending he will sleep with your wife.

Thanks for that

I've just posted a new thread, How 'Rating Women' destroys 'Inner Game' which I hope everyone will take the time to read & absorb!

Johnny Soporno
Worthy Playboy

[jaamkie]

All I have to say is that, as a woman, I'm totally turned-off by this post. What I find weird about pick-up discussions (and I don't know much about "the seduction community" outside of this board), is that if the men in person sounded like some of them do here, I'd be totally unattracted and probably sleep with their "nice guy" sidekick friend instead.

[Change42008]

"It's hard to make blanket statements about the seduction community as a whole because it has so many different facets. Everyone's experience with it is unique. Some men enjoy awesome transformations -- building the courage to be authentic and comfortable in their own skin. Other men devolve into social robots or become very weird and manipulative."

The problem im finding is that everyone seems to know that through the seduction community you can turn into a weirdo......well how do you turn back to being NORMAL again??? How do you unlearn all the NLP and marketing techniques used to brainwash customers?? How can you turn into a normal social person again, and unlearn the conditioning which is found in the seduction community? Its all well and good saying oh this medicine causes some people to grow into healthier people, and causes others to get cancer - but what about doing something to restore back those lives to the people the seduction community has damaged??? Are you supposed to use NLP to get back to your old ways? Do you practice dettachment from Buddhism? What if the seduction community is using hypnotic language to create unconscious fears via its material? How do you unbrainwash yourself? Does anyone have answers to these questions?

[Johnny Soporno]

Originally Posted by Change42008

The problem im finding is that everyone seems to know that through the seduction community you can turn into a weirdo......well how do you turn back to being NORMAL again???
How do you unlearn all the NLP and marketing techniques used to brainwash customers?? How can you turn into a normal social person again, and unlearn the conditioning which is found in the seduction community?

Urban Dictionary: Recovering Pick Up Artist

Originally Posted by Change42008

It's all well and good saying oh this medicine causes some people to grow into healthier people, and causes others to get cancer - but what about doing something to restore back those lives to the people the seduction community has damaged??? Are you supposed to use NLP to get back to your old ways? Do you practice dettachment from Buddhism? What if the seduction community is using hypnotic language to create unconscious fears via its material? How do you unbrainwash yourself? Does anyone have answers to these questions?

As a matter of fact, YES, we do!

www.RecoveringPUAs.com

Johnny Soporno
Worthy Playboy & "rPUA Sponsor"

[Rose of Cairo]

Originally Posted by jaamkie

All I have to say is that, as a woman, I'm totally turned-off by this post. What I find weird about pick-up discussions (and I don't know much about "the seduction community" outside of this board), is that if the men in person sounded like some of them do here, I'd be totally unattracted and probably sleep with their "nice guy" sidekick friend instead.

Same here. I'm totally turned off by PUAs and their mindset and their posts, here, on other websites and in real life.

I also don't understand how they can be good with women, when most women I know are turned off by them. Maybe they're only good as long as they hide how they really think.

[MidasGirl]

Originally Posted by Rose of Cairo

Same here. I'm totally turned off by PUAs and their mindset and their posts, here, on other websites and in real life.

I also don't understand how they can be good with women, when most women I know are turned off by them. Maybe they're only good as long as they hide how they really think.

I think the sleazy and manipulative ones (eg OP) are good with the low self esteem girls. As you and I know, those girls are all over the place, especially in their late teens to mid-20's. I know, I was one of them once. So, sleeping with some hot girl who still behaves like a high school queen bee might make these guys feel they are really scoring.........and then wonder why everyone else thinks they are weird.

I just don't see how a confident woman be impressed with such seeming idiots.

[lemuria]

what the **** is this ****** talking **** about?! d'oh!
If you believe human interactions can be reduced to some ******* formulas, be my ******* guest, ******!
**** with a girl that I will not see again... ****! Sound too shallow, I got better plans for my future.
****ed with thousand of women... That's right! Enjoy your 'aids'.


what seem so strange is why only men pick up girls? why don't we have women pick up men? I don't know about you, but I never heard any story about a girl who uses the cube on a man. Nor have I heard the line "If I weren't a lesbian, you'd so be mine!"
But I've read story of girls seducing men and make them miserable. Perfect example would be Salome who broke Nietzche's heart. (poor guy)


When it come to 'pick up', I prefer to follow David Wygant advices. You can go to his website or go to youtube to watch some of his videos... really ******* great.


P.S. Why the **** do we create words that later on will be censored on almost every occasion?

[Johnny Soporno]

Originally Posted by Murphy

How many hot women have you slept with then?

Mr Murphy, you're out of your depth here.

Originally Posted by Murphy

So many posts and ebooks on the community are written about maintaining a relationship. Heres one. Heres another. Oh look there's one here as well.

While I do appreciate your linking to one of my posts in defense of 'The Community', and while I do my best to serve up my best-reasoned and most rational arguments, I can't avoid continually and adamantly insisting that I am NOT a 'pick up artist', and I don't support the efforts of those who consider themselves as such.

Please read and consider what I've said in this thread: A 'Pick Up Artist' is ultimately a 'Con Artist' in the arena of the sexual predator

Johnny Soporno
"The Man Who Didn't Count"

[Angela]

Originally Posted by Rose of Cairo

Same here. I'm totally turned off by PUAs and their mindset and their posts, here, on other websites and in real life.

I find them sort of endearing.

(edited, because everything originally after the period sounded kind of insulting. Sorry.)

It seems like there are a couple of different approaches, as some people have pointed out. There are the men who honor women, like Johnny -- but I don't think he identifies as a PUA, do you, Johnny? -- and some of the guys around the forums here who are interested in authentic relationships and use some of the tools they find in PUA material, without the slimey bits. And then there are... well, the Others. The ones who approach you with manipulative techniques like "negs" -- can you BELIEVE grown-up men still do that?!? -- the stunted men who think of sex as something you *get from* a woman. The first group is likely to get some o' this, but the second, not a chance.

[Angela]

Originally Posted by Murphy

So if you don't want me pleasing her down some back alley while your at 'toastmasters' you better learn.

The back alley at Toastmasters would be a really good place to meet great lovers! Well, okay, actually going in to the meeting might be even better.

[Angela]

Ah, Johnny, you answered my question while I was typing.

[Rose of Cairo]

Originally Posted by Angela

I find them sort of endearing.

Yes, you, Sorceress, because you stand way above all this.

I have issues with them. I'm allergic to PUAs, I can't stand them. I don't know why. That's something I need to look at some time, just not now, I have other priorities now.

[Angela]

You know, I find there's a sort of general, generation-wide thing going on of the men I'm coming across in their late teens/early twenties, and I love it. Not all guys, of course, but it seems to me like a LOT of them. They are sweet and sexy and direct and intelligent in the way they communicate with women. It's so much fun to talk with men like this -- men who see connection as something you generate with others, rather than a means to getting something out of them. No PUA techniques. It's a fun time to be a woman, around men like these.

[Xanafax]

Hey Murphy!

I love your post!


Keep up the good work man, don't listen to the nay sayers, your right, they're just scared!