Is Manipulation Wrong? Freaky Social Manipulation Website.

[brendannz]

OK I've just surfed upon this manipulation website. The Popular Life: How to Become Popular It's weird

Basically he doesn't offer any examples about what his product is, other than it's how to manipulate others.
and it says "how to get inside people’s heads and make them think you’re being honest with them, whether you are or not." So I really wonder if a decent person would want this benefit.. Because like, I'm a fairly honest person, and I don't think I need to trick anyone into believing I am..

Is this a joke? because like, how could I go to pay for this product from someone who's selling you how to manipulate others? it's like.. wouldn't that make me gullible to think I'm not being manipulated myself?

Is this site evil? or maybe just a product to either buy or reject,

Would be interested to hear other peoples opinions on this..

[Eros Stone]

If you want to manipulate people then you'll have no choice but to live up to the reality that you involve yourself with those who are vulnerable and impressionable to others whims being inflicted upon them.

It's negative and no real self esteem can be built upon the lack of such self worth of others. Deceitful people who use trickery do not think consciously as they are not in touch with reality.

[lemuria]

IMO

About the website: You've been manipulated. But I agree on the 'don't be yourself'.
Like Shakespeare said, the world a stage and everyone are merely players. The ability to be anyone you wished, not only 'yourself' (by yourself, I mean your physical being), is a great thing.

About manipulation: nothing wrong. Try it for yourself. Personally I like to be able to manipulate people, like Hitler *hitler_smily.png* (This is the main reason why I want to improve my speaking skill even now).

I think Steve Pavlina is manipulative. Things going like he planned. Human growth. I assume that Steve's main objective is human growth.

Learn how human react to things, learn human psychology that is relevant (what is relevant depend on your current situation), learn from others, trial and errors etc.......

Me? I just want to have fun, and I want others to have fun... but they are so... hopeless... they cling to the illusions their own mind created... to the material stuffs... and yes, they need to be manipulated.

Manipulation resources? Good place to start would be the 48 Laws of Power. And if you don't like to read loooooong essays, then go away. You're wasting your time on this planet.

And if you react with facepalm.jpg, then go. Go and follow your heart. Be warned, I like to play with people's heart (In real life).

[brendannz]

Originally Posted by lemuria

IMO

About the website: You've been manipulated. But I agree on the 'don't be yourself'.

Like Shakespeare said, the world a stage and everyone are merely players. The ability to be anyone you wished, not only 'yourself' (by yourself, I mean your physical being), is a great thing.

About manipulation: nothing wrong. Try it for yourself. Personally I like to be able to manipulate people, like Hitler *hitler_smily.png* (This is the main reason why I want to improve my speaking skill even now).


I think Steve Pavlina is manipulative. Things going like he planned. Human growth. I assume that Steve's main objective is human growth.

Learn how human react to things, learn human psychology that is relevant (what is relevant depend on your current situation), learn from others, trial and errors etc.......

Me? I just want to have fun, and I want others to have fun... but they are so... hopeless... they cling to the illusions their own mind created... to the material stuffs... and yes, they need to be manipulated.

Manipulation resources? Good place to start would be the 48 Laws of Power. And if you don't like to read loooooong essays, then go away. You're wasting your time on this planet.

And if you react with facepalm.jpg, then go. Go and follow your heart. Be warned, I like to play with people's heart (In real life).

I haven't been manipulated.. I was just a bit puzzled by the site, and not sure how anyone else could want to buy into it.. Which is why I started the thread.. Thanks for your response...

Don't just be yourself:
Another Shakespeare quote, "Above all, to thyself be true"
Yep, I suppose working on yourself, and trying to be better than what you are at the moment can be better for your self development than just being what you are.. So maybe I agree.. If it's for the pu"rpose of self development, rather than being a fake I guess "not being yourself" can be a good thing...

I think Steve Pavlina is influential rather than manipulative. I think there's a different between influence and leadership, than control and manipulation...

I think decent and honest people are more interesting than manipulative people, because they have as much need to take from others to fill an emptiness..

[Michael Chui]

Originally Posted by brendannz

I think Steve Pavlina is influential rather than manipulative. I think there's a different between influence and leadership, than control and manipulation...

I think decent and honest people are more interesting than manipulative people, because they have as much need to take from others to fill an emptiness..

The difference isn't in the technique, but in intent and worth. Honesty is as much a technique as lying. It can be used to drive people away or to bring them in.

Augustus Caesar was incredibly controlling and manipulative. He is also arguably the single most influential leader in all Western civilization. It helps that he sort of founded it, I guess.

[Chris Cade]

I haven't looked at the website, but food for thought... where's the line between manipulation and persuasion?

Understanding manipulation and persuasion can be very helpful, even in altruistic contexts. At the very base, it's about effective communication.

The questionable element is not whether or not it's useful to understand various communication techniques, but rather whether it's moral/ethical/acceptable to use that information exclusively for personal gain.

We're persuading (and quite likely manipulating) people every day whether we want to believe that or not... even whether we're consciously aware of it or not.

[LordSappington]

You can tell a lot from looking at the physical layout of a website. Look at the following websites selling a wide number of products:

The Popular Life: How to Become Popular
Pickup Women Online - Online Dating & Pick up Resources
Build Muscle Bodybuilding Muscle Building Gain Weight Hardgainer (warning: pop ups)
Easy Money Online - Make Money Fast - TheRichKids

Notice anything familiar? The unusually large font. The random highlighting of words. The testimonials. The links to BUY NOW.

All of these websites also have several other things in common:

What they sell is complete and utter crap.

[Eric Roosevelt]

"I have a degree and you're unpopular, therefore you must let me manipulate you into buying my book! The only way to escape your sad existence is to PAY ME MONEY."

I love this guy.

Comedic relief ftw?

[brendannz]

Originally Posted by Eric Roosevelt

"I have a degree and you're unpopular, therefore you must let me manipulate you into buying my book! The only way to escape your sad existence is to PAY ME MONEY."

I love this guy.

Comedic relief ftw?

Exactly!

It's almost like me saying "if you give me 50 bucks, I'll teach you how to con people into giving you money" I didn't look at how much it costed though.

I was pretty amazed when I saw this site, but it's actually given me a lot of good food for thought about persuasion, manipulation, and influence on this thread.. So that's good.

[Eric Roosevelt]

Originally Posted by brendannz

Exactly!

It's almost like me saying "if you give me 50 bucks, I'll teach you how to con people into giving you money" I didn't look at how much it costed though.

I was pretty amazed when I saw this site, but it's actually given me a lot of good food for thought about persuasion, manipulation, and influence on this thread.. So that's good.

It gave you food for thought? I'm not sure manipulation is a good thing. But each to their own, I guess. I don't want to dissuade anyone from reading the book. People with good ideas often come across as arrogant or annoying, so you should never dismiss anyone on those ground alone.

Go ahead an buy it. It's probably quite interesting.

Most people do have something in their social lives which they feel insecure about, which is why these type of books sell like wildfire. He's using the foremost technique of manipulation, which is to press the giant red buttons in your head. Usually I'd like to read it, but due to the layout of the website I'm guessing that the content is mainly poor quality, maybe with a few random insights. You'll just have to make a decision if that's worth either your time or your money. My guess is that you can find the exact same information for free somewhere else, if you're interested.

[brendannz]

Originally Posted by Eric Roosevelt

It gave you food for thought? I'm not sure manipulation is a good thing. But each to their own, I guess. I don't want to dissuade anyone from reading the book. People with good ideas often come across as arrogant or annoying, so you should never dismiss anyone on those ground alone.

Go ahead an buy it. It's probably quite interesting.

Most people do have something in their lives which they feel insecure about, which is why these type of books sell like wildfire. He's using the foremost technique of manipulation, which is to press the giant red buttons in people's heads. Usually I would like to read things like this, but due to the layout of the website I'm guessing that the content is mainly poor quality with a few good insights here and there.

Hey Eric,

No, I meant the posts on this forum about it were good food for thought. This guy won't say anything about who he is, so I wouldn't consider spending money on his book.

I'm sure there's plenty of other good books out there about persuasion..

[dice]

AHha that looks like a complete joke to me.

I can't bring myself to believe that someone was being serious when they made that site...its too outrageous. just some guy who skimmed a few self-help buisness books and had nothing better to do with his time. ( I unconciously assumed this is a he...hmmmmmm )

I guess I don't believe in 'evil' people at all...just regular people with bad ideas.


for me to laugh at

[Eric Roosevelt]

The best way to be persuasive is probably just to work on all your weak spots until you become so good at them that everyone wants to be like you, and do what you say. You might get inspiration from certain books... including this one. Why the hell not? I sort of like people with that level of directness.

But in end, no book is going to teach you the fundamentals, which can only be taught by experience. You'll just have to start testing your way to success, and failing lots of times. That's the way it's always worked, and always will. Which is sad in a way, but it also makes it all a lot more interesting.

[Eric Roosevelt]

Sorry, I couldn't resist doing this. I want to just have a small look at the core assumptions of this website, if you don't mind, just as a sort of preliminary book review. The core assumptions are

1) Most of you are miserable people. Are you having doubts about that? No, believe me. You're miserable.

2) You want to be more obnoxious and "popular", right? Absolutely.

3) The answer is in this book. You want to give up your cash right now so you can become more obnoxious and popular.

4) Just like me. Look at me! Hey, hey, hey look at me! And look there, it's PayPal!

Well, what do you know? It's PayPal! Awsome, it's like so convenient! This guy like totally spoke to me, and then the solution is like right there on the same page. How awsome is THAT! I can tell this guy really wants the best for me and my life. And there's like nothing at all suspicious about this, either. Nothing at all. No siree Bob. Just buy the book, and everything will work out just fine. In fact, your life will be so easy you won't even have to eat, drink or put in any hard work ever again. Now pay this money or be doomed.

*ehum* sorry, I just felt like doing that. I'm sure the book is great, by the way.

[Scorpio]

The book itself is probably your typical over priced, disappointing e-book:

• 60 pages of text, with huge font
• Lots of typos
• And most importantly, the advice is totally recycled and unoriginal and is often the kind of stuff you can find for free elsewhere (in this case, probably NLP and mirroring type advice)

Most of these info marketers put fifty times more effort into writing their sales copy and marketing their product, then making a good product in the first place. They often get someone else to write their book for them.

In this case he's trying to push insecurity buttons, and tap into your desire for a magic, quick, effortless solution. He's is also being so over the top obnoxious that it will hopefully pique your curiosity.

[brendannz]

Originally Posted by Eric Roosevelt

Sorry, I couldn't resist doing this. I want to just have a small look at the core assumptions of this website, if you don't mind, just as a sort of preliminary book review. The core assumptions are

1) Most of you are miserable people. Are you having doubts about that? No, believe me. You're miserable.

2) You want to be more obnoxious and "popular", right? Absolutely.

3) The answer is in this book. You want to give up your cash right now so you can become more obnoxious and popular.

4) Just like me. Look at me! Hey, hey, hey look at me! And look there, it's PayPal!

Well, what do you know? It's PayPal! Awsome, it's like so convenient! This guy like totally spoke to me, and then the solution is like right there on the same page. How awsome is THAT! I can tell this guy really wants the best for me and my life. And there's like nothing at all suspicious about this, either. Nothing at all. No siree Bob. Just buy the book, and everything will work out just fine. In fact, your life will be so easy you won't even have to eat, drink or put in any hard work ever again. Now pay this money or be doomed.

*ehum* sorry, I just felt like doing that. I'm sure the book is great, by the way.

Yeah, or a more simplistic overview.

1/ I am really cool
2/ You are a total loser
3/ In order to become really cool like me, you have to pay all your money for my book on PayPal

[brendannz]

Originally Posted by dice

AHha that looks like a complete joke to me.

I can't bring myself to believe that someone was being serious when they made that site...its too outrageous. just some guy who skimmed a few self-help buisness books and had nothing better to do with his time. ( I unconciously assumed this is a he...hmmmmmm )

I guess I don't believe in 'evil' people at all...just regular people with bad ideas.


for me to laugh at

Yep.. Well I'm guessing hes making good money from this book.. I've already given him free advertising, but luckily noone here seems to have caught onto it.

I think you're very sexist, its probably a woman writing this book.. lol...

[Chris Cade]

If I were to buy a digital product on persuasion, this is the one I'd get:

Power of Persuasion | Conversational Hypnosis | Mind Control Techniques | Mind Control Tricks | Subliminal Persuasion