How to find a love partner?

[songwriter]

I only miss one topic in Steve's blog.
How to find a love partner? .
I've never had success in that, I haven't even get to have a date, and I'm 29.
Now I seem to have a chance with a women I've just known... If I only have a date I'll celebrate it like if she wants to marry or so... Oh, my, it's so hard for me...

[Henry]

I don't think there's an algorithm for finding a "love partner."

There is a pick-up artist site that might be of interest to you:

The Attraction Chronicles

There's also a book called "The Game" which was pretty good.

[Wulfen]

Hello there,

I think that your question has a difficult answer, because you are asking the wrong question.

Your question should be:

How can I become an attractive person, so that potential partners are attracted to me?

You need to become more attractive, and that you can achieve with personal development and seduction material. Yossarian's post in the Pick-Up thread sums it up perfectly: 1) become a more attractive person, and 2) learn to convey it quickly.

If you want to learn material, apart from "The Game", these other books are very good:

The Venusian Arts Handbook by Mystery
Double Your Dating by David DeAngelo

However there are also many free resources that you might want to check before spending your hard-earned cash, in case you end up not liking the "seduction" approach to relationships. A good free place to start is this one:

New visitors to Fast Seduction 101, follow this helpful guide

Rock Hard, Ride Free,

Wulfen

[songwriter]

Originally Posted by Henry

I don't think there's an algorithm for finding a "love partner."

There is a pick-up artist site that might be of interest to you:

The Attraction Chronicles

There's also a book called "The Game" which was pretty good.

No, I already have tried all that things with no results, or should I say "bad results".

[songwriter]

Originally Posted by Wulfen

Hello there,

I think that your question has a difficult answer, because you are asking the wrong question.

Your question should be:

How can I become an attractive person, so that potential partners are attracted to me?

You need to become more attractive, and that you can achieve with personal development and seduction material. Yossarian's post in the Pick-Up thread sums it up perfectly: 1) become a more attractive person, and 2) learn to convey it quickly.

If you want to learn material, apart from "The Game", these other books are very good:

The Venusian Arts Handbook by Mystery
Double Your Dating by David DeAngelo

However there are also many free resources that you might want to check before spending your hard-earned cash, in case you end up not liking the "seduction" approach to relationships. A good free place to start is this one:

New visitors to Fast Seduction 101, follow this helpful guide

Rock Hard, Ride Free,

Wulfen

mmm... I don't think it's not because I'm not attractive... women use to have a good time with me, they use to laugh with me... and I already have the "attractive traits" (well, I'm not rich :-P :-)).
Notice that I said "women". Because when I ask a single woman to go out with me, or try to have a little more deep conversation, etc... they don't.

I'm a kind of strange example, the usual methods don't work with me... that's why I expect something by Steve. I discovered his site while searching for "social skills" at yahoo. And then I saw the rest :-D.

I mean women even tell me I'm very attractive, even silly online tests say that... but don't want to have nothing personal with me. Enough to drive a man crazy...

[Wulfen]

Originally Posted by songwriter

No, I already have tried all that things with no results, or should I say "bad results".

Well, I can say from experience that these things work. If they didn't work for you, that means you either misunderstood them, or didn't put all the effort required. Can you elaborate on why they didn't work for you?

BTW I'm from Spain too. You can add me to msn messenger (it's on my profile) and we can have a talk.

Rock Hard, Ride Free,

Wulfen

[songwriter]

Originally Posted by Wulfen

Well, I can say from experience that these things work. If they didn't work for you, that means you either misunderstood them, or didn't put all the effort required. Can you elaborate on why they didn't work for you?

BTW I'm from Spain too. You can add me to msn messenger (it's on my profile) and we can have a talk.

Rock Hard, Ride Free,

Wulfen

No, I don't want to have a talk. Because everytime I talk about it nobody believes me. Except my friends, because they can see it. I've talked online with women and they don't believe me either.
Probably if I tell that girl I've never had a date she probably won't believe me either... They think I'm a ladies man or so... maybe that scares them and I've never had a date!.

[Wulfen]

Yeah, I can see it now.

Your problem is that you are a pessimistic. You focus on your shortcomings, instead of seeing each problem as a challenge and as an opportunity to learn.

Girls are not attracted to negative persons. In fact, noone is.

You need to learn to see the good things in life, and to see the problems as opportunities to grow.

The bad news is that negativity will hold you back a lot. The good news is that it can be turned around. I did it, and so can you

Rock Hard, Ride Free,

Wulfen

P.S.: as a last word, there is no "magic pill" for success with women. Regardless of what anyone tells you, it's hard work. Unless you become a millionaire overnight, there's no other way. But is doable. Many many people have already done it. There's no reason you can't, and if you believe that, it's a limiting belief and you have to get rid of it.

[JJP]

You say you've never been on a date, so let's start there. What have you done in the past when you've met a woman you are interested in dating? Break it down into pieces for us so we can see what you need to work on.

[songwriter]

Originally Posted by Wulfen

Yeah, I can see it now.

Your problem is that you are a pessimistic. You focus on your shortcomings, instead of seeing each problem as a challenge and as an opportunity to learn.

Girls are not attractive to negative persons. In fact, noone is.

You need to learn to see the good things in life, and to see the problems as opportunities to grow.

The bad news is that negativity will hold you back a lot. The good news is that it can be turned around. I did it, and so can you

Wulfen

P.S.: as a last word, there is no "magic pill" for success with women. Regardless of what anyone tells you, it's hard work. Unless you become a millionaire overnight, there's no other way. But is doable. Many many people have already done it. There's no reason you can't, and if you believe that, it's a limiting belief and you have to get rid of it.

Well, tell me of someone that has never been kissed being 29 and that's optimistic about love relationships. Yeah, this is not an answer but that's what happens to me. I use to be positive about other things, fortunately.

[Wulfen]

You are in a vicious circle man!

You feel bad for not having any success, then that makes you negative, which makes you have even less success! The more you think about it, the more it will hold you back.

Age is never a problem! One of the pick-up gurus at Real Social Dynamics, called Twentysix, lost his virginity at... drumroll... 26! And he's a Pick-Up Guru now! He's been with his share of girls and is now teaching others to to the same. If he can, so can you!

Now we could get more to the heart of the problem if you could pinpoint some specifics of what are you currently doing and why it doesn't work for you.

[Patrick]

Please know that you are not alone in this. A good friend of mine is 30, almost 31 years old and has never had a girlfriend nor kissed a girl. Despite the fact that he has good looks, is succesful and intelligent. Another friend of mine is in exactly the same situation, although he is rather small and not really attractive. At least, that's what he thinks he is and thus he is.

They both lack the right attitude towards women. Is there any right attitude to all women? Well, I guess not. But as Wulfer wrote before, women are attracted to positive talk. Negativity turns them away. When you see a depressed girl, you feel sad for her. You don't want to marry her for just being sad. Or do you? If so, you might be really frustrated and that is not a good thing. You'll radiate that and this will also turn off women.

I myself learned some things about getting girls:
- Be positive
- Be a good listener
- Radiate positivity
- Be charming
- Be yourself, be yourself, be yourself!

You'll succeed. It might take time, but you will. Have confidence. Radiate that.

[Wulfen]

Patrick, I agree with almost the whole content of your post, except this little thing:

Is there any right attitude to all women? Well, I guess not.

Yes it is, just some quick notes:

- be positive, not negative.
- be proactive, not reactive or passive.
- be ambitious, not compliant.
- be entertaining, not boring.
- be a leader, not a follower.
- be mysterious, not predictable.
- be a challenge, not a chaser.
- be sexual, not asexual.

Also about the qualities you mention:

I myself learned some things about getting girls:
- Be positive
- Be a good listener
- Radiate positivity
- Be charming
- Be yourself, be yourself, be yourself!

The first ones are OK, but... beware of "be yourself" advice. If the current "yourself" has inherent unnatractive qualities, being yourself will not get you very far. I think what you mean here is "be congruent, and do not fake things in order to get a girl", which is good advice, but if people interpret "be yourself" as "you are ok as you are", it's not that good because your current "yourself" might be unattractive to girls, so you might need to improve yourself. I hope that makes sense

[songwriter]

Originally Posted by JJP

You say you've never been on a date, so let's start there. What have you done in the past when you've met a woman you are interested in dating? Break it down into pieces for us so we can see what you need to work on.

Originally Posted by JJP

You say you've never been on a date, so let's start there. What have you done in the past when you've met a woman you are interested in dating? Break it down into pieces for us so we can see what you need to work on.

wel... I've done everything. Included doing nothing... I've tried marriage bureaus, discos, bars, webs... I've tried all the different kind of approaches you can imagine, even the weirdest ones... I've tried to "try nothing", so "be myself", etc.

For instance in a marriage bureau I talked with two women. It was a flash date game. We had a great time together. (It was two woman for every man tables). There was a game of messages we should write and then the messages should be read loud by the hostress of the game or sent private to one person.
They made the hostress said loud they loved how natural I was talking about the situation of flirting at discos.
I sent one girl a message asking what does she does on weekends? "So many things..." etc. She gave me her phone number... But when I asked to go out someday, maybe tomorrow or next week, the two alone or with friends... she said... that... we'll continue to see each other in the marriage bureau :-/.
And kind of ignored me during the rest of the night. I sent her two more messages but she doesn't have replied...

That's the usual process. Things may go right sometimes until I ask them out.

Now I've known another girl in a course. We have a great time together, we laugh... she's single (I think). I asked her out... "this weekend at the cinema" or so... she told me she couldn't this weekend because of she has arranged a meeting with friends but maybe yes some other weekend. (She might not be much interested in me if she prefers to go out with friends...)
"And what if I leave the course because I find a job and we'll never see each other again?" (We both are unemployed, but some months ago I wasn't unemployed and I had no success anyway... well, this is the only girl I've tried to date that knows that I'm unemployed anyway...).
Then, to my surprise she said... "If you find a job, you can come here (to the course) sometimes to see me and to see if we can go out some weekend"

I think then she's interested, single or so...?
Well, that's the further I've get with a woman.
At least I have a maybe. But I don't have nothing really.

She asked me for my number and I asked her for hers. Instead of doing that thing of coming to the course... because maybe I'll be working in those hours.

And that's all by the moment. Well, If I'm an optimist... on Thursday I will ask the girl if she's free the weekend and she would say yes, etc.
If I'm an pessimist, she will never be free in weekends and all I will have is a phone number of someone that's not really interested in me... like the first girl for instance.

I think all this is very detailed, though some details of the dialogues can be misunderstood by the Spanish-English translation.

[JJP]

Sorry, I replied before I read your post up there.

[Mr. Punch]

Please, if you haven't had any positive experience at your age with seduction and sexual relationships, it will not come easy to you. I am tall and handsome and have had some experience with women since my teens but I have never felt comfortable around them and have placed an excessive amount of value on their reactions to me.

After the break up with my longterm girlfriend over a year ago and a couple of very unfortunate affairs, I decided to do something about it and turned to the PUA community. A good place to start is The Game by Neil Strauss, just to get a feel for the mindset and different approaches amongst men who are good with women.

From there you can start searching for the approach that may fit you, your personality and problems. There isn't any quick universal method, you have to practice and study (but mostly get in field experience!) for things to start happening. You are a hard case, obviously, but as you don't have your looks against you but only your inner game, it shouldn't be that tough.

The pick up line approach must be combined with some solid inner game work: What is your attitude about women and more importantly your attitude to yourself concerning women. And find one or several men who are good with women, talk to them, study them in field. Go to stylelife.com or Mystery's boards to find men who have the same problems as you do and have overcome them. Get a mentor.

It has been a tough but highly rewarding experience for me to learn the PUA mindset and methods.

[songwriter]

About the be "positive", charming, entertaining...

Women use to laugh with me! :-) Much more than men for instance... Almost all of my jokes/comments are welcomed with laughter. I'm not a constant joker thought.
So I think that's not the problem. Well that's what I'm thinking... I may be wrong... If I knew the truth for sure I wouldn't be wondering about it...

Just don't try too hard to help me, because no-one have had good results. Those usual solutions, mind-settings, etc don't work for me... that's why the original meaning of the post. I miss Steve writing about it.

[Wulfen]

Hey, and I thought your problem was going to be very hard!

Man, you are already on the right track! You are at this moment suffering from a very common problem, and it's that your phone numbers are not solid, and that's why you get phone flakes.

It's very simple: the girls from which you get the phone numbers (i.e., your number closes, or #-closes), are not that attracted to you. Perhaps they are mildly attracted when you ask for the numbers, but not so much when you call them so they phone flake (in spanish: te dan planton telefonico, colega).

So, what can you do to get rid of this problem? You need to get solid phone numbers. And a solid #-close is when the girl is very attracted to you. And you can get the girl very attracted to you by working on attraction. So you must work on improving the attraction that you create in girls.

If you've read Mystery Method you know that you create attraction by being a challenge, demonstrating higher value and teasing (push/pull and all that). So focus on this on the beginning of interactions with girls, and do not ask for the phone, instead watch for IOIs (Indicators of Interest), like she asking stuff about you, or laughing at your teasing. If you are not getting IOIs, then you are not doing it right, so focus on trying different things until you get IOIs. When you have several IOIs, then you can proceed in the interaction, and compliment her, ask for the number and so on, but not before.

So the summary: focus on creating attraction. Watch for IOIs. Do not do anything else until you can create attraction. If what you do doesn't create attraction, change what you do. A wingman can come in handy to spot IOIs that you might miss.

I hope this help. Try it and report back.

[songwriter]

Originally Posted by Mr. Punch

Please, if you haven't had any positive experience at your age with seduction and sexual relationships, it will not come easy to you. I am tall and handsome and have had some experience with women since my teens but I have never felt comfortable around them and have placed an excessive amount of value on their reactions to me.

Mine is not the same usual problem, is different... Those mindsets don't work at all for me.

Gottogonow.

[songwriter]

Originally Posted by Wulfen

Hey, and I thought your problem was going to be very hard!

Man, you are already on the right track! You are at this moment suffering from a very common problem, and it's that your phone numbers are not solid, and that's why you get phone flakes.

It's very simple: the girls from which you get the phone numbers (i.e., your number closes, or #-closes), are not that attracted to you. Perhaps they are mildly attracted when you ask for the numbers, but not so much when you call them so they phone flake (in spanish: te dan planton telefonico, colega).

So, what can you do to get rid of this problem? You need to get solid phone numbers. And a solid #-close is when the girl is very attracted to you. And you can get the girl very attracted to you by working on attraction. So you must work on improving the attraction that you create in girls.

If you've read Mystery Method you know that you create attraction by being a challenge, demonstrating higher value and teasing (push/pull and all that). So focus on this on the beginning of interactions with girls, and do not ask for the phone, instead watch for IOIs (Indicators of Interest), like she asking stuff about you, or laughing at your teasing. If you are not getting IOIs, then you are not doing it right, so focus on trying different things until you get IOIs. When you have several IOIs, then you can proceed in the interaction, and compliment her, ask for the number and so on, but not before.

So the summary: focus on create attraction. Watch for IOIs. Do not do anything else until you can create attraction. If what you do doesn't create attraction, change what you do. A wingman can come in handy to spot IOIs that you might miss.

I hope this help. Try it and report back.

Man, I already see indicators of attractions just being myself, etc. Women use to be attracted to me but not interested in going out with me. They laugh with me, etc.
Stop trying so hard to help me or I will feel guiltly. :-)

Leave it to fate, Steve, God or whatever...

[placebo]

My change in relations with women happened when i figured it out that if you flirt with 10 women in one night, nine of them reject you and only one likes you, your succes ratio isn't 1/10 = 10%. IT IS 1/10=100%. Try thinking this way, it helped me a lot.

[Scott]

Originally Posted by placebo

My change in relations with women happened when i figured it out that if you flirt with 10 women in one night, nine of them reject you and only one likes you, your succes ratio isn't 1/10 = 10%. IT IS 1/10=100%. Try thinking this way, it helped me a lot.

Perfectly stated, placebo. After all, you're only going to date one woman at a time, right? (If you're the "player" type, I don't think this is the right forum for you.)

songwriter, I think part of your problem is what Wulfen said; these women are giving you numbers out of kindness, not necessarily out of interest. My two cents:

-When you call a woman after receiving her number, wait at least one full day but no more than three.
-If you're going to ask her out for the weekend, do it by Wednesday. Many women already have their plans set by Thursday (at least in the U.S., but your culture may be different).
-Study up not necessarily on how to impress women, but how to read body language so you know when women are impressed by you. It's easy to simply do the right things, but knowing that she's going to say yes before you ask her out will save you a lot of stress.

[songwriter]

Men, the answers I have are disgusting for me...
I already told you I know about body language, I know when I attract a woman, but she says no anyway.
As for the tricks of saying "something", calling "a particular day", I find them disgusting... if a relationship has to be like that, I'm better all alone.

Alone forever.

[Daniel Terhorst]

Originally Posted by songwriter

As for the tricks of saying "something", calling "a particular day", I find them disgusting... if a relationship has to be like that, I'm better all alone.

I can't stand that kind of thing, either. It's too unnatural. Now, I'm definitely not one to give advice on this matter (!), so ignore me if you wish, but...



If I wanted a long-lasting relationship with someone,

I'd focus on being their friend first.

Not because I want to go out with them,

but because I want to be their friend most of all.



I would be rather turned off if someone I barely knew approached me only looking for a love partner.

What are you looking for? Why?

Originally Posted by Richard Bach

"If your happiness depends on what somebody else does, I guess you do have a problem."

-- Daniel Terhorst

[Scott]

Originally Posted by songwriter

Men, the answers I have are disgusting for me...
I already told you I know about body language, I know when I attract a woman, but she says no anyway.
As for the tricks of saying "something", calling "a particular day", I find them disgusting... if a relationship has to be like that, I'm better all alone.

Alone forever.

songwriter, you're giving us mixed signals. Your thread is titled, "How to find a love partner?" but everything you've said up to this point suggests that what you're looking for is a dating partner. There's a difference. If you want someone to date, I can guarantee you that almost every bit of advice suggested to you will be of assistance, provided that you properly use it. Will it be natural? Probably not - but let's face it... Dating is not natural.

If, on the other hand, you're looking for true love, my suggestion would be completely counterintuitive: Stop. In my (possibly not so humble) opinion, you shouldn't have to go looking for true love - it will find you. And yes, it will feel completely natural and "right". If it doesn't, then it isn't. Get my drift?

In either case, I really do think you're trying too hard. No, I've never met you, and I don't know every thought that runs through your head or the heads of the women you meet, but I can tell you from personal experience that I've been much happier when I have simply focused on my life and not made dating or love a goal of mine. And you know what? I feel like women are more drawn to me than they ever were when I was "girl crazy".

Be thoughtful and be optimistic. You will not be alone forever. I guarantee it.

[Wulfen]

Originally Posted by Daniel Terhorst

If I wanted a long-lasting relationship with someone,

I'd focus on being their friend first.

Not because I want to go out with them,

but because I want to be their friend most of all.

Daniel, of course you are entitled to your opinion and the view of the subject, but the practical problem with this kind of reasoning is that, for several reasons concerning the psychology of women, it's way harder to become the lover of a girl that considers you a friend, that to start as her lover in the first place.

A million men who have heard the line "but I love you as a friend" can give proof of this.

Besides, who says that approaching someone with love interest in mind is a bad thing? It's only bad if you're being sneaky about it, but it would surprise you how many girls respond positively to directly being upfront on expressing romantic interest on them. Girls need love, like we do.

[Daniel Terhorst]

Originally Posted by Wulfen

it's way harder to become the lover of a girl that considers you a friend, that to start as her lover in the first place.

I guess it really comes down to what you really want. Do you want a lover? Or someone you can spend a fulfilling life with?

The two are not mutually exclusive, but I do think one is more important than the other.


It has been said that the secret to success is doing more of what works, and less of what doesn't. Regardless of what the correct approach actually is (as I cautioned, I'm not the best one to consult on that matter), one thing is obvious: the current approach is clearly not working. I don't think more of the same is going to yield better results...

I can't offer much, but I think it might be a lens worth at least a look through.

-- Daniel Terhorst

[Lychee]

Originally Posted by Scott

songwriter, you're giving us mixed signals. Your thread is titled, "How to find a love partner?" but everything you've said up to this point suggests that what you're looking for is a dating partner. There's a difference. If you want someone to date, I can guarantee you that almost every bit of advice suggested to you will be of assistance, provided that you properly use it. Will it be natural? Probably not - but let's face it... Dating is not natural.

Scott,

You said dating is not natural and I am inclined to agree with you, but would you mind expanding on what you mean by "not natural"?

We have to be the person we want to attract. I guess the easiest and most effective way is the obvious. It's hard not to get discouraged, but we can't lose our faith or patience.

[zpivat]

Originally Posted by Lychee

Scott,

You said dating is not natural and I am inclined to agree with you, but would you mind expanding on what you mean by "not natural"?

We have to be the person we want to attract. I guess the easiest and most effective way is the obvious. It's hard not to get discouraged, but we can't lose our faith or patience.

I'm pretty sure what Scott means by "dating is not natural" is that when we're dating someone, we have a tendency to show our best selves (i.e: not necessarily our natural/real selves), in order to keep the other party pleased. Then after a few years, or even marriage, finally one's true colours show up...............

[Dating Specialist]

Hello guys

May I jump in from a woman's point of view?

Yes, it sure is different to look for a dating partner vs a love parter. While the former suggest more of fun and companionship, the latter has more deeper implications of a long-term relationship, possibily going towards marriage.

Whatever the pickup artists teach, it is basically about a "game" where the man will go all out to get their target's interest. They are very useful to get a woman's attention and interest. But, a note of caution here is: a woman who's looking for serious relationship don't like games.

Songwriter, I feel that joking about your success in how you flirt in a disco is pure entertaining, but they are also telling the ladies that you may be too much of a fun-looking guy!

I'm not sure, but it sounds like you are driving yourself into a "desperate" corner from the way you have described your situation and your mindset. Women trust our instints very much. We can smell a man whos's trying-too-hard from a mile away. It's not a tough guess to know that we're generally reluctant to accept such a date cos we'll be suspecting is there an underlying agenda or, is there something wrong with the guy?

To play safe, we'd rather reject it. Well, security is a basic need for human, esp for women in terms of love.

In any case, whether is it for date or love partner, sincerity is the key. When we can sense that, we're pretty willing to go for at least one shot, because someone who is sincere is good to be a friend even if it doesn't turn out to be otherwise.

Wulfen, I love your positive mindset and beliefs. That's why I blogged a whole series on Love Beliefs on my blog.

Hope what I said helps!