Getting tired of waiting to be proposed to..... any advice?

[carnelian heart]

Well, I know I have an expectation and that is the problem: I have been waiting forever for my boyfriend of five years to propose to me and it is not happening. Every time my birthday comes around, or a holiday like Xmas or New Years, I am really excited about the possibility but he is so not excited about it. Even when marriage is mentioned, he fizzles out and draws away. He knows I wanted to get married when we first started going out and we even talked about it recently when he saw I was depressed about my younger sister getting married.

I've gotten past the phase where I would be !!!!!so surprised!!!! if he proposed, and past the comfortably excited phase as well. Now I feel like we're just plodding along, watching family and friends get married all around us, watching it happen in the movies, and staying on the same level as we were for years.

Even though he is a great lover and we really understand and listen to each other, I kind of feel like he is really taking advantage of our situation by being lazy about this. "Why buy the cow" comes to mind.

So I'm trying to let go of the expectation because I know that is the source of pain. I'm trying to go deep into my hobbies and friends to keep my mind from it, but the months keep slipping by and this has been an issue for a while. Do I bring it up and sour a possible surprise? (Is this a masochistic question?)

I know it will be much better if he comes up with this idea to propose by himself, but how do I live with things until that happens? Any advice? (Please?)

[Angela]

How strong is your desire to get married? Is it stronger than your desire to be with this guy? Or about the same, neck and neck? Why do you want to be married (in general)? Why do you want to be married to this fellow in particular?

If you were married to Mr. Fizzle, what would you have that you don't have now?

[carnelian heart]

Originally Posted by Angela

How strong is your desire to get married? Is it stronger than your desire to be with this guy? Or about the same, neck and neck? Why do you want to be married (in general)? Why do you want to be married to this fellow in particular?

If you were married to Mr. Fizzle, what would you have that you don't have now?

I have a really strong desire to get married, and it is neck and neck to the guy.

I want to be married because it is such a deep, romantic, spiritual commitment and it is the next level, and it means security to me, and it is the "grand gesture" I have been looking for.

This guy is really sweet and really understands me (except for this one big thing, I guess.)

I think our relationship is missing the grand gesture, from my thoughts on the Mr. Fizzle question. Like "I would cross a continent for you" instead of "I will watch TV with you," which is what I have right now.

[Erin Pavlina]

Does he know you want to get married? Why don't you propose to him?

But otherwise, here is my advice...

Tell him what you want. Ask him if he wants the same thing. If he does not, your choice is to stay in the relationship the way it is or leave. It is your choice. If you choose to stay, don't blame him for being the way he is. If you leave, don't blame him for being the way he is. Your happiness is your responsibility.

You need more communication with this guy.

[RT Wolf]

Talk to him about him and ask him what his thoughts are. You seem so caught up with your own expectations that you've ignored that he's in this relationship too (other than the offhand comment about buying hte cow, which is insulting to both of you to begin with). Let him talk about his feelings openly. If he has concerns, don't get defensive, allow him to voice them and talk to him about them.

Well, you're already expecting to get married...so what's the surprise that'd be ruined? When he'll do it? Then, once you've got it all sorted out, tell him to surprise you about when he'll ask you. If I could privately tell him something, I'd tell him to wait at least two-three months until you're not expecting it so much anymore.

Or, just surprise him by asking him to marry you! I bet that'd be a surprise to both of you!

Good luck!

Edit: Basically what Erin said. Great minds think alike?

[ellie]

Do you know why he doesn't want to get married? Has he discussed his reasons?

I personally don't get the whole marriage thing and how that would make someone feel more secure.

Personally I would feel more secure, knowing I was in a committed relationship and that I felt secure enough not to require a piece of paper and some vows. That seems like more of a real commitment to me.

[Angela]

Carnelian Heart, are you willing to look a little deeper? If you had the Grand Gesture, then what would you really have? (What quality or condition lies at the heart of your desire, is what I'm getting at.)

[bluemoon]

I feel like "grand gestures" are overrated. Let's say he does it, y'all get married, blah blah blah. Then what? You still have the same relationship, with the same person, forever. I feel like this should be obvious, but things aren't like they are in the movies.

Personally, I think weddings are overrated as well. Ooh, I get to go thousands of dollars into debt for one day, a fancy dress, and some hackneyed ceremony to wake up to the same person I already know I love and am committed to? I'll take a down payment on a house any day. But this is about you, and so if this really is a big deal, talk to him about it or propose yourself. Just know what you're getting into.

[Daffy Duck]

Carnelian, the best thing you can probably do is talk to him about it, or propose yourself. It's as simple as that, I believe. Angela seems to be encouraging you to question why you are feeling the way you feel, which is always a good thing to do. In other words, she wants you to be conscious. A lot of people on this forum are kind of against a conventional marriage, but if it's a conscious (not dictated by the big bad "society") decision, then they should have nothing to worry about.

Originally Posted by ellie

I personally don't get the whole marriage thing and how that would make someone feel more secure.

A marriage certificate definitely means little "security," as evidenced by the divorce rate. Still, there are plenty of good reasons to get married.

I personally don't get the whole fish as a pet thing. They're boring as hell. Still, I'm sure there are many good reasons, although I don't want a fish.

Bluemoon, weddings don't have to be expensive. Besides, it's a memorable event. A time to bring friends and family together to celebrate. Why do we have New Year parties? It's just another day, after all! Well, we do it for fun and memory, among other things.

[pyrogen]

I disagree that just because you've been living together for six years, means you will have the same relationship after the wedding.

Marriage is not the same relationship that "living together" is. Marriage killed my perfectly functional "living together" relationship. Marriage is a ritual of extreme social power, one of the most powerful we have. We don't know what it will do until we do it! It's always a leap of faith! Once married, people will treat the both of you differently than they ever have. Your lives will change.

This is a LOA-themed community so I'll suggest something LOA oriented.

Manifest marriage. See yourself married after the fact (that is, the marriage, not the wedding), fully embody it in your mind, the sights, the sounds, the smells. How will you feel as a married woman. Feel the ring on your finger, et cetera.

If you want to be married, see yourself as married and live in that reality. "Step into" being in a happy, fulfilling marriage of the characteristics you want. He will either step up, or you'll meet someone else (and fairly quickly - seen it time and time again) who WILL. You will thoroughly impress upon your subconscious your desire, and you will start acting (very naturally) in a different way that will bring about the goal you have. You will find the resources inside to do what you need to do.

And finally, maybe you haven't seen him do the equivalent of crossing the continent to be with you, because he hasn't had to.

[bluemoon]

Daffy: Fair enough, and I've gotten the "well, why not! You celebrate Christmas and you're not a Christian" sort of argument before. I guess I'm just tired of it because right now there's a lot of girls I know getting married, and flaunting their rings/weddings/whatnot. I feel like so many girls get into it for the princess and fairy tale aspect, and don't think about the whole what happens afterward aspect enough.

And granted, I'm not married or proposed to yet (we're happily living together and fornicating), so maybe I'll get a different notion if that happens. But when he and I talk about it, it's usually that we'll just elope and have a nice party later with plenty of (booze soaked) memories for family and friends with no ridiculous rituals. We're both in school and working, so I actually get a lot more hot and bothered at the thought of being debt free and in our very own house. Eff the diamond, give me a walk in closet and a tub with jets.

Like I said before though (in so many words): to each their own. And when my good friends get engaged, I will be more than happy to go to their weddings and congratulate them sincerely.

[Daffy Duck]

Bluemoon: I hear ya. I'd rather have a nice down payment for a house than a $5,000 ring and $20,000 wedding too. Actually, if a girl wanted such a big diamond, I might have to reconsider her. Fortunately, all the girls I've ever been with have placed their value elsewhere.

The girl I'm currently living and fornicating with shares my desire for a relatively simple wedding, if/when we come to that point.

I'm making a mental note about the tub with jets idea. I love those things...

[brandongilbert]

id say if you want something/want something to happen, then just be up front and let all parties know. this will be a lot better than sitting around waiting for it to happen.

[bluemoon]

Originally Posted by Daffy Duck

I'm making a mental note about the tub with jets idea. I love those things...

I know, right? My parents are in their 50's and just moved into their first house with one. I am so getting one before I'm 30

[pyrogen]

Originally Posted by bluemoon

Daffy: Fair enough, and I've gotten the "well, why not! You celebrate Christmas and you're not a Christian" sort of argument before. I guess I'm just tired of it because right now there's a lot of girls I know getting married, and flaunting their rings/weddings/whatnot. I feel like so many girls get into it for the princess and fairy tale aspect, and don't think about the whole what happens afterward aspect enough.

You're smart to think of the "what comes next".

My wedding got hoodwinked into being the Fairy Princess Nightmare, because the moment I announced my engagement my mom invited about 200 people, and there were lots of demands from both sides of the family. The fact that we couldn't draw lines between us and the families, is part of how we ended up divorced a year later.

Next time? Vegas, baby.
I think a Vegas wedding sounds incredibly romantic and fun, IMHO. Anyone who sincerely wants to attend can and should, then we part and do our own stuff.

My other fantasy is a Hawaii beach elopement, in flipflops.

[aussieNickuss]

Marriage is a pretty big jump to make for a guy....maybe he's just too scared to make a commitment.

Why wait for him? You're just as qualified to pop the question you know!

BTW, if he says no, instantly you'll know if he's interested in marriage or not. Then you can get on with the rest of your life (with or without him) so you don't waste any more years waiting and waiting.

[ellie]

Originally Posted by aussieNickuss

Marriage is a pretty big jump to make for a guy....maybe he's just too scared to make a commitment.

Why wait for him? You're just as qualified to pop the question you know!

BTW, if he says no, instantly you'll know if he's interested in marriage or not. Then you can get on with the rest of your life (with or without him) so you don't waste any more years waiting and waiting.

Even if she pops the questions and he says "yes", I would still be wary. I mean if he hasn't done it yet, there must be an underlying reason.

I know that this has happened to a couple I know and well it ended in divorce. The worst thing is to force/persuade your partner into marriage and also have delusions that everything will be so much better when your married.

[Holistic Star]

I've got a story that might help shed light on the LOA aspect of it.

I really, really wanted to get married to my bf. I had this thing about being married by the time I was 29! don't know why, I had set this arbitrary deadline and was getting anxious. Lots of friends were getting engaged too.

By the time I was 28 I had a house with bf, but he told me he didn't see the point in getting married. In his mind buying a house together or having children was a much bigger commitment to each other. He thought it was too expensive and as we are both the children of divorced parents we are both aware of its instability. In addition his cousin was getting married the following year, and he particularly didn't want to overshadow his cousin's wedding.

We argued, lots. I would bring it up 'jokingly' but there was always an undercurrent.

After one particularly big row I sat and thought about what I really wanted. If I had to choose between being with him and not being married, or not being with him - I realised I wanted to be with him regardless. I became totally at peace with the idea of never getting married, I completely accepted it as something that might never happen to me. I didn't tell my bf what I thought because by making that decision it had become a non-issue for me. We didn't discuss or argue about it from that date.

Four months later he proposed and we got married seven months later! (four months after my 30th birthday)

The thing is, you can't trick the LOA. You can't say 'oh I accept I might never get married' but do it to attempt to trick it into happening just won't work! You have to really, truly be totally at peace with the idea it might never happen. When you are so attached to the outcome, you can't let go and trust it will happen. I didn't know I was using the LOA in my thinking. I just knew what I wanted was a loving, happy relationship and that's what I focused on and got.

[pyrogen]

Originally Posted by Holistic Star

By the time I was 28 I had a house with bf, but he told me he didn't see the point in getting married. In his mind buying a house together or having children was a much bigger commitment to each other.

Asking if she wants to stay with him anyway if they weren't married, is great advice.

Interestingly, I had about the same deadline... I just had "friends with benefits", dates and platonic friends then when I hit 30 the alarm went off in my head. "OH NOES!! TIME TO SETTLE DOWN!".

The problem for some people is that him/her dragging their feet on getting married, can become a values clash, rather than simply "are we going to be together with marriage or without marriage?".

For example, I know I could be happy with "love" without it being "love and marriage" as long as we weren't having children, making major investments together etc.

That said, having divorced someone who did "the grand gesture" and ONLY did grand gestures, there's something to be said for having a peaceful and happy life.

I was with my partner a very short time before he proposed. Only a year dating, six months living together. In retrospect I wish we'd waited, because the crap that came u p during the wedding planning (that ultimately is why I left) would've come up eventually without us having to go through the trouble of a divorce.

We had so much pressure from both sides to get married, and he was constantly teasing me about marriage. "You need a husband!" or, "Maybe one day if I propose I'll do it *here*", without actually proposing. It drove me insane! He would drop all kinds of hints then refuse to actually have an adult conversation about marriage.

In retrospect I think he was trying to "feel out" if I was going to say yes before proposing. To him, it had to be this big fat deal, and to me, it was something that had to be rationally and sanely discussed between two adults. This was a major values clash and it turned out to be very significant and pretty much how we ended up divorcing, too.

[funchy]

Why keep waiting?? Escaping from this by keeping busy does not make the problem go away. Will you be content if you spend another 5 yrs with this man to find out he'll never give you that level of commitment? Will you look back and regret you wasted so many years waiting for someone who just didn't want to ever marry?

Sit him down and ask him his thoughts. You can't wait in a holding pattern forever. If you want to marry and he's happy being with you, WHY NOT? Five years is plenty of time for him to decide if you're long-term material. If you really want him to appreciate you, you may have to be prepared to leave for him to really understand he truly needs you in his life.

Or plan B is you propose to him.

Or plan C is grow old waiting for him to get to that level of commitment.... but if you wait long enough, you may be eligible for common-law marriage, depending on your state's law. But deep down you may always resent it.



I don't think there's anything wrong with marriage, if that's what you want. Don't apologize to anyone for wanting to cement this relationship. Marriage also has legal & tax benefits. And you've earned it by being a good mate for 5 years, so why shouldn't you be happy?

[bluemoon]

Funchy- a nitpicky point- In the US, common law marriage these days may only be contracted in DC and 11 states. States are rapidly phasing it out by statute or case law and frown upon it in general. It's a misconception that you can simply 'become common law married' after living together 7 years or whatnot. Even in states that recognize it, there still must be a general holding out of being married, along with an understanding between the couple. Otherwise the bf and my other roommate would be halfway to being common law married to the two of us (a whole other polyamorous can of worms we've never explored)

But I think the real issue here is that the OP sees marriage as signifying some kind of commitment unattainable by unmarried people. Or something like that.

(this message not intended to be legal advice of any sort, just fyi)

[alan7388]

I have been waiting forever for my boyfriend of five years to propose to me

So propose to him. Pardon me if I say "Duhh"?

Seriously -- if you're afraid he'll say No, you need to face up to your fear. If he has privately decided he won't marry you, you're better off finding this out now than going on pretending.

The decision will then be yours: Stay with the present situation, or start looking for someone who better suits your needs. The clock ticks.

[shy talk]

DUMP HIM!

He has no intention of marrying you.

(Shy Talk - Master of the Bleedin' Obvious)

[Magicinthenight]

If marriage really is that important to you and you've told him this, then maybe it's time to think about what both of you want.

Where do you want to be in 5 years time? Ask him where he sees himself in 5 years. Explain to him why marriage is important to you. Ask him to explain as to why he's opposed to the idea.

And take a while to think why the "grand gesture" is so important to you. Because grand gesture isn't the thing that glues people together or what gives them security: open and honest communication does that a lot better.

[jaamkie]

To the people on here saying marriage is an obsolete foolish concept:

Watching my parents' marriage over time, I think they've both learned and grown immensely from the commitment to take responsibility and keep grappling with their issues, instead of blaming the other person and running away from discomfort. I think they've also each learned to appreciate a side of life that they would've formerly dismissed, to respect and admire their different strengths, to embrace and learn to love another set of parents and siblings, families each with their own unique texture and dysfunctions.

I think a marriage is about enlarging your family, regardless of if you further expand it by having children. I think it can serve as an avenue for self-discovery similar to relating to other family members, if you take it to be a lifelong commitment- family is always there, to support you as well as to frustrate and mystify. Unlike friendships that come and go, romantic relationships that come and go, you can't walk away from family when they are difficult and imperfect and exhausting, when they challenge your beliefs and values, when they disappoint your expectations or don't conform to your plan for their improvement, when they lose their job or end up dying in a hospital. I think a marriage in the traditional life-long sense is another opportunity for that (scary, life altering) level of commitment to relating to another human.

Of course, perhaps I have an old-fashioned view of family as well as of marriage. I've met many people who are glad to live far from their parents and siblings, who don't keep in touch or feel responsible for a relationship with them, who have closed themselves off from the people fate has given them to relate to. Today, mainstream American culture at least, is very individualistic and expects each of us to pursue our own happiness based on our impulses each moment- relating to others only when we're in the mood and think we'll gain something from it. Yet I think, and science has shown time and again, that we're not always capable of rational self-interest, often taking short-term ease over long-term gain. I think the cultural values of family and community help to counter our tendencies to walk away too soon, when we still have something to learn and gain from relationships with others.

I want to get married because I want that experience of commitment and growth, I want to make a decision with someone- to keep on relating to each other, living together, learning from each other, deepening our relationship, even when it would seem easier to quit and go searching for someone "better", or to close off when it's scary to be so open.

I sympathize with the OP wanting to get married, if this is what she's looking for, because I agree with everyone else here- you can't force someone into marriage if they don't want it. In my case, my boyfriend shares this view of marriage, and expects to marry before living together. He also grew up in a non-Western country where these values are the norm, and can appreciate both sides- how family/marriage can also stifle and cause dishonesty, like religion, if it is done superficially rather than focusing on genuine relationship and concern for one another.

[carnelian heart]

Hi, I'm the Original Poster of this thread. I wanted to update everyone.

After waiting for him to propose for so long, I decided I did not want to wait any more, so I brought it up in conversation. I said I wanted to be engaged, and would he think about it? And he got a big grin on his face and said, "Yes, well, I've just been having a hard time thinking about a ring because you said you don't really like diamonds."

... and so, we went out shopping, and he bought me a ring today, which was just the kind of grand gesture I have been desiring.

We don't have a date, but I'm not in a hurry for that. We can plan it in a relaxed manner, since we will just have a reception for the public, and that shouldn't be too much trouble since we have friends in the music, flowers, and catering biz. We're truly very happy.

Thanks to everyone who posted and offered advice. You really helped me with those emotions, and I appreciate it.

[RT Wolf]

Congratz! Glad we could help!

[pyrogen]

OMG! Yay!!!!!!!!!
(jumping up and down for you!!!)

[jaamkie]

Congratulations!!!!!!!! I hope your marriage grows deeper and stronger each year

[Yellow]

Congratulations, carnelian heart!!