Any girl PUAs?

[JE Gonzalez]

I was just curious to see if women ever used methods natural or learned, to attract other men.

Do any girls out there ever ask for a guy's number? Do any girls out there seduce a guy into bed? What is life like as a Girl PUA?

[fitx3]

What exactly is a PUA? I know it's a pick up artist but would you mind going into a little more detail?

[carnelian heart]

With a truly realized mind, there is no pick-up, only the connection.

Just be yourself and try to be with someone who knows who they are. It is a lot more awesome when love is real and not just a pick-up game.

That being said, being with a real woman is AMAZING. Yes, we ask for numbers, kiss first, and have awesome orgasms (please: if you had one, she should too.)

Question answered?

[allirowe23]

Originally Posted by carnelian heart

That being said, being with a real woman is AMAZING. Yes, we ask for numbers, kiss first, and have awesome orgasms (please: if you had one, she should too.)

The truth of that statement goes beyond my truthometer haha.

Most women do take charge at least occasionally. I personally like doing it because I'm a pretty confident person and being confident enough to ask a guy out tends to distinguish you from everyone else.

[Brien]

For the most part, there are no female "pick-up artists". Why do you think there aren't?

Don't strain yourself.

[TonyToneTone]

Originally Posted by carnelian heart

With a truly realized mind, there is no pick-up, only the connection.

Just be yourself and try to be with someone who knows who they are. It is a lot more awesome when love is real and not just a pick-up game.

That being said, being with a real woman is AMAZING. Yes, we ask for numbers, kiss first, and have awesome orgasms (please: if you had one, she should too.)

Question answered?

I love REAL women. It's so nice, so smooth. Everything just flows.

And yes, there are Hot Alpha Female: Why I Love Pick Up Artists

[lasti]

Originally Posted by TonyToneTone

I love REAL women. It's so nice, so smooth. Everything just flows.

And yes, there are Hot Alpha Female: Why I Love Pick Up Artists

What's the difference between a woman and a "REAL" woman?

[TonyToneTone]

Originally Posted by lasti

What's the difference between a woman and a "REAL" woman?

A real woman knows what she wants and gets it.

Just like a real man should do the same.

[funchy]

Depends how you define PUA. I am admittedly becoming less fond of the term the more I see of it.

The "PUA" stuff I see is all about how to manipulate women to get a notch in a bedpost. I suppose there are women out there who also use men? It's all a big act, and none of it is real.

I'd rather be with shy or nerdy and real than an "artist" any day.

That being said, being with a real woman is AMAZING. Yes, we ask for numbers, kiss first, and have awesome orgasms (please: if you had one, she should too.)

Thanks, carnelian heart, for your great post!!!

I also don't see what is so hard about asking someone for a number (male or female). It's just a phone number -- you're not proposing marriage. The worst he/she can say is "no".

Love the orgasm comment! I can't believe there are so many times people have sex where the woman doesn't get to climax?! I think a guy would die if the woman stopped halfway through sex, announced she was done, and suddenly fell asleep.

Maybe instead of promoting PUA acting, we can talk about real ways people can have these AMAZING experiences with other people. Here is one site I found interesting. His latest video is on making connections with another person via sex and relationships:
Sex With Devon » Blog Archive » Sex With Devon #21 - Accessing Connection

[JE Gonzalez]

I think the PUA acting you talk about is what Mystery promotes. Most of PUA, is simply about approaching girls in a relaxed and joyful manner. Funchy, PUA artists *are* real. Their behavior can be learned or it comes naturally. And believe me a nerd will get boring after awhile. Plus its not just bout numbers, it is about creating attraction, which is independent of looks, money or lifestyle. The "acting" you speak of is simply training wheels for becoming more adept. Moreover if there is anything that Pick-Up really encourages, is personal development on all fronts.

[Rose of Cairo]

Originally Posted by JE Gonzalez

Do any girls out there ever ask for a guy's number? Do any girls out there seduce a guy into bed? What is life like as a Girl PUA?

Of course I ask for phone numbers, ask guys out or seduce them into bed. I mean, not all the time. But it happens. However, I would never call myself a PUA! There's a big difference between being a PUA and simply expressing what I want.

Originally Posted by funchy

Love the orgasm comment! I can't believe there are so many times people have sex where the woman doesn't get to climax?! I think a guy would die if the woman stopped halfway through sex, announced she was done, and suddenly fell asleep.

I absolutely agree. It's AMAZING how many girls and women I talked to who said to me that they rarely (or even never!) have an orgasm when they have sex with a man, or that in order to have one, they have to make sure it happens themselves because the guy doesn't seem to care or to know how it works.

IMO learning this would be much more important than to learn how to pick up.

[Jonathan Browne]

Female pick up artistry would involve being able to distinguish quality men from terrible choices.

[carnelian heart]

JE, what if the best PUAs were just being themselves?

And since they truly believed they were sexy, what if their confidence made them a true PUA?

I think that is the real question and answer -- how to be a real PUA (loving yourself and being genuine at all costs) instead of being a phoney PUA (pretending to be confident.)

People can smell phoneyness a mile away and it is not sexy.

So just be yourself. Just be yourself.

[Lauxa]

I thought female "PUA" were generally termed "sl*ts".

[TonyToneTone]

Originally Posted by Lauxa

I thought female "PUA" were generally termed "sl*ts".

Only to insecure people. Go out there and get what you want ladies!

[Corey]

Originally Posted by TonyToneTone

A real woman knows what she wants and gets it.

Just like a real man should do the same.

Maybe because we dont want to piss people off...

[Michael Chui]

Originally Posted by Lauxa

I thought female "PUA" were generally termed "sl*ts".

That's "studette".

[Lauxa]

Originally Posted by Michael Chui

That's "studette".

LOL

[Grandiouse]

It's not socially acceptable for girls to go out there and make an effort to "pick-up" guys. However, they do give guys a lot of signals and will lead them on if they are interested. But as far as approaching guys and picking them up, I've seen that most guys are turned off by it.

[TonyToneTone]

No way. I love it! Rock on studettes!

[pyrogen]

My theory is that RulesGirls (google it) are the female counterpart of PUAs. I think that The Rules and PUA are exactly the same thing!

You may need to google RulesGirls because The Rules has become kind of passe; the book is about 15 years old now. I see exactly the same techniques talked about more among PUAs these days.

One might say, but RulesGirls are trying to marry Alpha Males, and PUAs are trying to get laid. But the commonality is both are seeking power with the opposite sex. Power is defined differently to each gender. Men have a scarcity mindset about sex; women have a scarcity mindset about getting men to commit.

If you look at The Rules and other similar philosophies (books such as Why Men Love Bitches and Stop Getting Dumped) they are very similar to PUA theories with only a few differences (who initiates is the chief difference). But The Rules is probably the closest.

The thing is, sex has a different currency with women than with men. The real object for both is social status IMHO. Getting laid a lot doesn't advance a woman's social status. So, a female "player" who follows exactly the same principles (with only a few minor differences) may have a different goal (marriage vs quantity of sex partners). Sex is so available to women that women don't have a scarcity mindset about it.

I also think that PUA is valuable to *women* because men need to stop having a scarcity mindset about sex before they can start being good relationship partners. Many "Average Frustrated Chumps" settle for one woman because their market value is low and they have a scarcity mindset about attention, affection, love and sex.

They end up in relationships because they perceive it as the only way to get laid. Then they often end up cheating on the partner or leaving the relationship. AFCs make poor partners. Much of The Rules is about weeding out AFCs (known in the Rules subculture as "moonpies" for some god unknown reason) more than weeding out PUAs.

Likewise, RGs set out to stop having a scarcity mindset about LTRs.

I stated in another post that RGs and PUAs are natural enemies. But it may be RGs that PUAs ultimately end up long-terming with. It seems like The Rules' enemy is more AFCs than it is PUAs, and The Rules is about teaching women not to be "Average Frustrated Chicks".

[Xanafax]

A PUA is someone who uses facilitators to structure and project their natural qualities so as to get a girl attracted.

It's not about being fake, or lying or being sleazy, its like saying you need to learn the proper way to play tennis, like good form, power, technique, and then someone saying its immoral to play tennis like that because your not being genuine.

Well let me say this, I am BAD with girls, so who are you (anyone who opposes PUA) to tell me I shouldn't use it?

I don't want to hurt girls, I want sex, relationships, better times when I am out partying.

What's wrong with that?

[Elenny]

JE Gonzalez mentioned that nerds get boring after a while. In my experience, guys with all the one-liners and the fake confidence run out of things to say pretty quickly also. Ask them something that was not in the $50 e-book they read and they become brain dead.

Personally I think the entire culture of PUAs is a scheme. Some say that the books and the expensive conferences have helped their self-esteem and their personal development, but they are still going by the script, and you can't reach your full potential in life with a script.

Can it get you a one-night stand? Yes.

Can it get you a girlfriend or long-term relationship? Yes.

But life and true love go much deeper than Mr. Mystery or Mr. Tynan's latest technique. The only way you will ever find your true match is by being yourself, and there are no e-books or conferences about how to be YOU, because only YOU know that!

And by the way, women don't need to be PUAs. If it were just about sex and quickies, most women could get most men they wanted without much effort or "special seduction training for just $49.99".

[pyrogen]

I think that AFCs actually have hurt the most women.

Here is what's wrong with AFCs:

* How many of us are sick of guys who want to be our "friends" then turn around and act passive-aggressive and pissy because they really had another agenda. We'd rather be approached, and have the option of saying NO to an honest approach. If you're going to approach us, approach. If you want to just be friends, just be friends. Don't confuse us. [And the fact that most "friends" actually want play, messes with us when we meet a guy we like who DOES want to just be friends.]

* What about those bitter guys such as over at nomarriage.com, intellectualwhores.com, et cetera. AFC losers.

* We're sick of guys who don't know how to behave on a date.

* We're sick of guys who have hidden agendas. If you're going to approach for sex, don't pretend you want a relationship when you don't.
PUA isn't about pretending you want a relationship.

* we're sick of being "settled for". Every person wants to be "the one" to their partner, and deserves it.

* We're sick of guys getting with us who didn't get all their "fun" out of their system before settling down.

[jaamkie]

I wouldn't call myself a PUA, but probably do agree that some of their teachings help whether male or female: putting yourself out there in situations to find someone, having fun with life and trying to pay more attention to the immediate experience, open friendly body language and looks that can draw people to you vs shut them out, trying to find the right spot between attraction and neediness, and generally the certainty that you can attract the right person, and that when you do, it won't be a huge struggle to keep them- so if one guy doesn't call, you can move on, looking forward to finding the right guy.

[edith]

Originally Posted by Xanafax

A PUA is someone who uses facilitators to structure and project their natural qualities so as to get a girl attracted.

I thought it was that "he chased her until she caught him."

[Jasonv]

Originally Posted by Xanafax

It's not about being fake, or lying or being sleazy, its like saying you need to learn the proper way to play tennis, like good form, power, technique, and then someone saying its immoral to play tennis like that because your not being genuine.

Well put!!!

I know a couple girl PUA's that pick up men and women. Good times, uh.

People have a lot of bad things to say about pick up but few of them speak from direct experience.

The truth is, there is a good side and a bad side to pick up. Once Steve Pavlina starts blogging about the good side a lot of people will change their tune.

[missing]

Originally Posted by pyrogen

I think that AFCs actually have hurt the most women.

Here is what's wrong with AFCs:

* How many of us are sick of guys who want to be our "friends" then turn around and act passive-aggressive and pissy because they really had another agenda. We'd rather be approached, and have the option of saying NO to an honest approach. If you're going to approach us, approach. If you want to just be friends, just be friends. Don't confuse us. [And the fact that most "friends" actually want play, messes with us when we meet a guy we like who DOES want to just be friends.]

* What about those bitter guys such as over at nomarriage.com, intellectualwhores.com, et cetera. AFC losers.

* We're sick of guys who don't know how to behave on a date.

* We're sick of guys who have hidden agendas. If you're going to approach for sex, don't pretend you want a relationship when you don't.
PUA isn't about pretending you want a relationship.

* we're sick of being "settled for". Every person wants to be "the one" to their partner, and deserves it.

* We're sick of guys getting with us who didn't get all their "fun" out of their system before settling down.

hmm, reading this makes me wanna give up on American women altogether and go the much maligned overseas route. You oughta thank me cause I'd never be able to measure up to all these "rules". I'm probably guilty of all this stuff at one point or another (I even enjoy both those websites you mentioned!). Not cause I'm trying to be manipulative or lame, but it's hard to get out of habits that are socially ingrained from an early age. If you don't get the "right" habits early on, you face a near olympian effort to acquire them later; at which point the rewards for your work is simply not worth it. The disdainful tone in this post certainly does not encourage me to want to improve. It implies I'd get very little understanding and support for where I'm coming from.

Call me an idealist but something like dating doesn't seem like it should be so confusing, or have so many rules. You shouldn't need an equivalent bachelor's degree just to get your foot in the door. The fact that you do trips me off that something is wrong with today's dating paradigm. One thing reading PUA has taught me is that the work necessary to sleep with women these days simply isn't worth it, particularly when you consider the risk (std's, pregnancy, etc). I'm not against PUA's, but to me it seems there are so many better, lower risk, more rewarding places to place your life's valuable energy. Since I'd probably just end up "hurting" women for the reasons listed above, I'd rather not burden them with my presence.

[Xanafax]

Here is my take on it so far:

Women who have no idea what a PUA is, are against them.

Men who have no idea what a PUA is, are against them.

Men who are PUA know full well that you can be moral - in fact more moral - than the average guy.

PUA teaches you that women have certain things they are attracted to. They want men who do certain things.

It also teaches you that it is important to be honest with a women, lying is - in the upper-class of MPUA's - strictly a no-no, you see they don't need it.

PUA's aren't people who are bad with women and just use cheesy pick up lines and things to get women to sleep with them, they are men who originally where bad or where lacking in skill, and have trained and practised to a point where they can pick any girl they want out of a crowd and make her happy. Show her a good time. Be either a good one night stand, or a good friend, or even a good relationship partner.

They aren't horrible, greasy guys who want to use you, some are, but that's not the general rule, it's the exception. PUA's are real people, with real feelings, who mastered the art of attraction and seduction.

As a final word, to all those people who say "Just be yourself" have you ever really thought about how ridiculous that statement really is? It makes little or no sense, what does be yourself mean?

If I know how to use the skills of a Natural MPUA, is that not being myself?

Just something for you to think about.

[Sanity Panda]

Originally Posted by Xanafax

As a final word, to all those people who say "Just be yourself" have you ever really thought about how ridiculous that statement really is? It makes little or no sense, what does be yourself mean?

If I know how to use the skills of a Natural MPUA, is that not being myself?

It means to do what feels natural to you.

I'm not a fond of the idea of PUA, but that's more because I dislike the whole idea of something as important as relationships being described as a game. Yet I'm hypocritical because I do use techniques in my interaction, just not consciously.

There's a side of culture which I really dislike in PUA communities.
- The manipulative community where their primary concern is their hedonism without care for other factors.
- Approaching and flirting with others when they are unofficially commited to another person. It's open game.
- Treating another person as an object/goal/task. Dehumanising.

Otherwise I agree there's some PUA that practice just highlighting their positives, reducing the negatives or changing their environment to a more friendly environment.

Actively creating an environment in your favour can be seen as sleezy though.