Girlfriend with very low self esteem

[Riggs]

My girlfriend and I have been together for just over 3 years now and, although I'm crazy about her, I've hit my breaking point with her self esteem issues and I really need some help. Although I love her and don't want to leave her, it's getting very close to that point.

For our first 2 years I tried talking "up" every time she put herself down. This was a constant battle, but I loved her and figured that with enough positive reinforcement she'd eventually begin to see the good in herself. Being far away from her dad should have helped as well, as he was the biggest contributor to her LSE.

After 2 years or so, I started to tire of the nonstop building and began to just ignore the self bashing. The past 4 months or so however, it's hit a point where my blood begins to boil every time and I just try to get away so I don't have to listen to it and don't start yelling at her.

We (had) a very solid relationship so I hate to give up on it, but counseling is the only thing left to try. The problem is that she's never expressed any interest in it, and if I broach the subject, it will start a whole string of "I'm stupid, horrible, worthless, everyone hates me's..." etc.

What really throws me is I've always believed in the "You can't love someone if you don't love yourself" school of thought, yet I don't doubt her love at all. Until recently anyways...
Now I can't help but wonder if it's nothing more than her learned nature (she's a "pleaser" as so many LSE people are) fooling me.

Help...

[lifetimelearner]

Originally Posted by Riggs

My girlfriend and I have been together for just over 3 years now and, although I'm crazy about her, I've hit my breaking point with her self esteem issues and I really need some help. Although I love her and don't want to leave her, it's getting very close to that point.

For our first 2 years I tried talking "up" every time she put herself down. This was a constant battle, but I loved her and figured that with enough positive reinforcement she'd eventually begin to see the good in herself. Being far away from her dad should have helped as well, as he was the biggest contributor to her LSE.

After 2 years or so, I started to tire of the nonstop building and began to just ignore the self bashing. The past 4 months or so however, it's hit a point where my blood begins to boil every time and I just try to get away so I don't have to listen to it and don't start yelling at her.

We (had) a very solid relationship so I hate to give up on it, but counseling is the only thing left to try. The problem is that she's never expressed any interest in it, and if I broach the subject, it will start a whole string of "I'm stupid, horrible, worthless, everyone hates me's..." etc.

What really throws me is I've always believed in the "You can't love someone if you don't love yourself" school of thought, yet I don't doubt her love at all. Until recently anyways...
Now I can't help but wonder if it's nothing more than her learned nature (she's a "pleaser" as so many LSE people are) fooling me.

Help...

I don't know why LSE and people pleaser go hand in hand with me

I don't believe I was born like this -with LSE

it developed through my life
through my thoughts of never being good enough
for my mom and dad

later when a guy would break up with me
I would say
whats wrong with me ?
everything apparently would be my answer
or they would not break up with me

when you are told enough times or had it beaten into you
you tend to believe it


I believe she does love you

I believe that just because you are down on yourself doesn't mean you cannot love

I love my children
and would die for them

but I still feel bad about myself


I hope you get it all figured out

[Alexjstrandberg]

She's a people pleaser, great use that to get her to start doing things to improve her self esteem.

First step is get her to acknowledge her LSE. If she can't see it at this point, she might never. After she admits to what is going on ask her if she wants to do something about it.

If she doesn't want to improve her self esteem it's best to cut the relationship short-it's already starting to affect your life.

If she does get her to agree a couple of times. For example 'do you want to improve your self esteem?' 'yes' 'do you?' "yes" "are you sure?" A lot of people just respond yes without really thinking about the question. Asking her three times helps sure up her answer.

From there, teach her how to have high self esteem. There are tons of articles on this and here's another one "How to Love Yourself"

Two things will be key for her: 1. standing up for herself and 2. getting out of her head

The standing up for herself will be difficult because of her father but she will eventually get the hang of it. it's impossible to have high self esteem and be a human punching bag.

If you know how to stand up for yourself when people treat you not so nice it should be easy to teach her. Have her sit down and think about all the times she should have stood up for herself but didn't, then start doing it.

You can practice with her at home as well. Tell her randomly that you are going to give her a tough time and give her an opportunity to stand up for herself. Don't make it too exaggerated so she knows when it's coming.

One day freak out over something that isn't a big deal. If she forgets to take the trash out or whatever start yelling at her. If after a minute she doesn't recognize what's going on stop and tell her what you were doing. Then give her some pointers as to what she could do to stand up for herself.

If you do this a couple of times she will start to build up some confidence in herself that she can not take other people's crap.

[RT Wolf]

If you're committed to saving/improving her, you can pick up some books on dealing iwth low self-esteem, even if she doesn't acknowledge the issue, you can perhaps help her by acquiring greater knowledge. You can also consult a therapist yourself and ask how they suggest handling someone who's resistant to the idea of therapy, or just tips on dealing with her LSE. CEBT is the most effective therapy for this sorta thing, last I heard. You can read about it here:
Cognitive behavioral therapy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

You can pick up some books on this sorta thing. That said, you want to be careful about imposing too much on her, people with LSE usually feel a sense of helplessness, so you might wanna try to help her gain some greater control over her life.

You may also want to consider something my gf of 2 years and I committed to: we are not going to stick together because we've been together for a long time or because we've had fun times in the past. The relationship has to be good now for us to stick to it. It's basically zero-based thinking: would you enter into this relatoinship if you were given the choice to today knowing everything you know now? If not, then get out. This isn't easy, its emotionally difficult, but its not complicated. You just might not be compatible anymore and its time to move on.

[Bud921]

Riggs,

I truly feel you buddy. I am in the same situation. I have since given up on improving her, and been trying to improve myself. Believe it or not that has helped me tremendously. Maybe your not as confident as you think. Work on yourself, and watch her follow. If it doesn't work out, it wasnt meant to be. Since you love her, just be there for her. I wish you best of luck man.

[elainevdw]

I was like that when I first started dating my bf. He tried reinforcing me but I'd just argue with him about what an awful person I was. Then one day he actually agreed with me. "Yeah, you're right, you really are just a lazy, talentless hack." I was like, WHAT?! It really hurt. I cried for hours. He said to me, "That is exactly how I feel every time you say things like that about yourself. Cut it out!"

For the most part it worked. But the ugly monster still rears its head. Especially when we argue.

I think in some cases of low self esteem, it's because you honestly believe you have control over your life. Or maybe you're a perfectionist. So if you make a mistake, or your life sucks, or whatnot, then it's your fault. If circumstances dictate that there's really nothing you could have done about it, then instead of saying, "Oh well, I'm in a pickle about this -- guess I'll rough it out" -- you think to yourself, "If I was X, Y, Z, I wouldn't be in this pickle! I'm an inherently flawed human being."

Other times it's easier to blame yourself than confront someone else.

Seriously, with the Law of Attraction and everything else -- if something in your life isn't going right, it's really all your fault. For not having the attitude if nothing else.

[Riggs]

If you know how to stand up for yourself when people treat you not so nice it should be easy to teach her. Have her sit down and think about all the times she should have stood up for herself but didn't, then start doing it.

You can practice with her at home as well. Tell her randomly that you are going to give her a tough time and give her an opportunity to stand up for herself. Don't make it too exaggerated so she knows when it's coming.

One day freak out over something that isn't a big deal. If she forgets to take the trash out or whatever start yelling at her. If after a minute she doesn't recognize what's going on stop and tell her what you were doing. Then give her some pointers as to what she could do to stand up for herself.

Now that is a great idea. I hadn't thought of trying it that way before. I've tried talking it through, reverse psych, taking her out and pointing out other peoples mistakes, over exaggerating mine, and so on. Your idea however, sounds like a painless way to go about it. Thank you Alex. Thanks to the rest of you who replied also.

[jaamkie]

Just a question, but I'm curious if part of your attraction is the low self esteem, or rather, the fact that she will accept your judgements opinions ideas without challenging them? Relationships generate all of these patterns of thought and behavior that we don't realize are leading to the very issues we're complaining about. The very fact that you're here discussing and diagnosing your gf's issues... how would you feel if she were on a message board diagnosing and plotting actions to change you? I think the best place to start is usually with yourself, not with someone else's imperfections- find a way to live happily accepting her as she is, or else break up with her, because you're doing her no favors to stay while criticising her for low self esteem.

[Riggs]

Just a question, but I'm curious if part of your attraction is the low self esteem, or rather, the fact that she will accept your judgements opinions ideas without challenging them? Relationships generate all of these patterns of thought and behavior that we don't realize are leading to the very issues we're complaining about. The very fact that you're here discussing and diagnosing your gf's issues... how would you feel if she were on a message board diagnosing and plotting actions to change you? I think the best place to start is usually with yourself, not with someone else's imperfections- find a way to live happily accepting her as she is, or else break up with her, because you're doing her no favors to stay while criticising her for low self esteem.

No, I'm sorry but you're way off base in my opinion.

First off, I love being challenged. How can you grow if you're not challenged?

Second, if she were "plotting" as you put it, to help me change something I didn't like about myself, then I'd be very happy. That's the difference between people with confidence and those without. Those who are comfortable with themselves can take criticism, acknowledge it, and change it. Those without use the cop-out "you shouldn't try to change someone..blah blah".

I agree 100% that if a person likes something about themselves then nobody has any right to try to change it. If they hate that aspect of themselves however, and you don't try to help them, then you don't truly care about them. "You should accept and love this part of me that I can't even stand myself" is a cop-out for weak and lazy people. Sadly, it's the new battle-cry of America.

She is well aware of her LSE and she hates it. She doesn't enjoy beating herself up emotionally. She doesn't like coming home from work crying because of some people walking all over her. She doesn't like that the smallest criticism will force her to cry. She watches me handle adversity or criticism or stand up for my beliefs and says "I wish I could do that".

As for working on myself, I've done, and continue to, do that already. When I was 20 I realized that I didn't like my self image so I made a conscious effort to change my perceptions. By 23 I was a whole different person. By 25 I was quite happy with myself. Now at 31 I am extremely comfortable with every aspect of me. This isn't to say I don't have flaws, I have plenty, but life sure is great when you learn to accept your flaws. Plus, a lot of your "flaws' can actually be quite endearing to people. For instance, my gf is also fairly klutzy and I love it. It makes me laugh and I find it cute (well it's not so cute when she spills hot coffee on ME, but the rest of the time it is).

[FrogNettle]

Originally Posted by Alexjstrandberg

You can practice with her at home as well. Tell her randomly that you are going to give her a tough time and give her an opportunity to stand up for herself. Don't make it too exaggerated so she knows when it's coming.

One day freak out over something that isn't a big deal. If she forgets to take the trash out or whatever start yelling at her. If after a minute she doesn't recognize what's going on stop and tell her what you were doing. Then give her some pointers as to what she could do to stand up for herself.

If you do this a couple of times she will start to build up some confidence in herself that she can not take other people's crap.

LOL I love this idea

[RT Wolf]

jaamkie, I've thought about it for a while and I've come to the conclusion similar to how medical practitioners do: informed consent. Riggs claims to have consent from his gf to help her with this issue. So, he's here getting advice to help her change herself. Is just the way I see it. If my gf was on a board askin for help for somin we've both decided is a good idea to improve, I'd wonder why I didn't do it myself!

There are a number of good books on self-esteem, like the Six Pillars of Self-Esteem. Good luck, Riggs!

[jaamkie]

I guess I was responding to the tone, and to the complaint that his "blood begins to boil every time"- I don't think in that frame of mind he'd be much help, and that the anger itself is a bigger issue than his girlfriend's flaws. At least, someone getting upset with me when I'm already upset with myself tends to only make the situation about our relationship instead of about working on the original issue.

Maybe relationship styles are different though- I vastly prefer a relationship where I'm accepted and loved as I am, and supported in my own desires to improve myself, rather than judged and required to attain higher standards. My boyfriend and I are very similar- very independent, spontaneous, curious- and each of us taking responsibility for our own lives, and not trying to judge or control the other, is what makes the relationship so wonderful and freeing instead of stifling. I'm currently losing weight, and my boyfriend's wonderful contribution is a lot of considerate listening and refraining from interfering or judging or cheering for any particular outcome. Similarly, I'm vegan for ethical reasons, and, while of course I talk about it sometimes out of personal interest, I've never pushed it on him or asked him about it- but from what I've noticed him buying and eating, and from his occasional comments, he's gone vegan as well.

[DerekH]

Originally Posted by Riggs

My girlfriend and I have been together for just over 3 years now and, although I'm crazy about her, I've hit my breaking point with her self esteem issues and I really need some help. Although I love her and don't want to leave her, it's getting very close to that point.

For our first 2 years I tried talking "up" every time she put herself down. This was a constant battle, but I loved her and figured that with enough positive reinforcement she'd eventually begin to see the good in herself. Being far away from her dad should have helped as well, as he was the biggest contributor to her LSE.

After 2 years or so, I started to tire of the nonstop building and began to just ignore the self bashing. The past 4 months or so however, it's hit a point where my blood begins to boil every time and I just try to get away so I don't have to listen to it and don't start yelling at her.

We (had) a very solid relationship so I hate to give up on it, but counseling is the only thing left to try. The problem is that she's never expressed any interest in it, and if I broach the subject, it will start a whole string of "I'm stupid, horrible, worthless, everyone hates me's..." etc.

What really throws me is I've always believed in the "You can't love someone if you don't love yourself" school of thought, yet I don't doubt her love at all. Until recently anyways...
Now I can't help but wonder if it's nothing more than her learned nature (she's a "pleaser" as so many LSE people are) fooling me.

Help...

Recently, I just broke up with my GF of just about a year. She has some LSE problems as well. It was more about her weight though.

It would get me mad as well when she would talk about it and such. I just wanted to shake some sense in her. I tried helping in many different ways but it has ultimately failed.

I've realized a few things. People either want help or not. She may verbalize that she wants help but she is just crying for love. Action will dictate true motives.

Look within. You are compromising your own standards with this relationship. It is obviously not a 'good' relationship since you feel the need to seek help.

It maybe time to move on.

[angies]

This is a very complicated issues that affect many relationships. And her problem could have rooted back in her childhood and how she was nurtured in her adolescent years. I don't think you can help her by being critical or judgemental or angry. I agree with jaamkie that you must first accept and love her for who she is, then and only then that you can help her to improve her LSE. If not the best thing you can do for her is to leave and let her grow by herself. It may hurt her in the short term but will help her to grow better. When you have LSE, the last thing you need is someone who think that you are flaws and need improving.

I was like a door mat for many years in my previous relationship with a guy who always never think i was good enough and always need improving. It took me many years to build my SE with my now partner who constantly show me love and support regardless of who i am. That is the only environment where one can truly grow.

[RT Wolf]

That is a good technique. The therapist who wrote What Happy People Know talked abotu that. I don't remember what that therapeutic technique is called anymore. He has a very nice story in there about an anorexic or bulemic girl who was brought in. He didn't focus on her eating disorder but instead asked her about what she loved. One of these was her dog, and he brought the dog in for her. After a few days, he asked her if she would ever consider witholding food for the dog? She said no, horrified and then understood what she was doin to herself. Nice story, dunno how applicable it it.

To OP, you can try out a technique for a while, then try another and see what gets the best results. I would also suggest consulting with therapists. Good Luck

[Jay Pavlina]

I have been in the same position as you twice. The first was a relationship of a year and a half. I couldn't handle it anymore and had to end it. The 2nd was a relationship of 2 and a half years. That one ended for different reasons, but I'm still glad it ended because I spent so much energy trying to cheer up my girlfriend. Both times, I felt much lighter and had a greater sense of freedom once I got over the breakup.

I learned that if you love someone, you must accept every part of them. If they have a low self-esteem, that is who they are. The more you try to change them, the more you're resisting who they are. If you accept, she might change on her own... but don't count on it. Just love her.

I suggest that you either accept her for who she is and let it be, or accept that you are unhappy and cannot continue the relationship in its present state. It's all about acceptance. I feel you, and I wish you the best.

[Martyn13]

I'd just like to reiterate and agree with what some others are saying.

There are two main issues here -
One is your girlfriend's lack of self esteem, but the other issue is your unhappiness with the way she is.

Regardless of whether (you think) she wishes to change, for the relationship to work in the long term, you must first accept her the way she is.

It is not easy over the internet, as I can't be sure of the situation, but I'll make the points, just in case they help.

With girls, you have to read between the lines - In other words, you cannot judge her on what she says only - It's always possible that she says she wants to improve, only to please you, but really, she might deep down just really want you to love her as she is, and be strong for her.

In my opinion, your attitude to the low self esteem, is more relevant (than her perceived wish to improve).

In my opinion, you have two 'positive' options.

You need to have the courage to completely accept and love All of her.

The way many relationships go, is that one partner says everything is 'almost' perfect, except for one little thing - It's always the same.
That little thing expands in importance over time, until the relationship breaks down.

You cannot find happiness by changing anything outside of yourself - You Must accept the present, before moving on.

If you cannot do this, then in my opinion, the relationship will flounder and die in time.

On the other hand, it takes a lot of courage to accept something that you have previously not accepted - but if you manage to grow to be able to accomplish this, then the rewards are amazing - but first you must be open.

I have to be honest, but one of your replies seemed to indicate closed mindedness and rigid beliefs - Of course, it's difficult knowing for certain over the internet, but that is the impression I got.

So in my opinion, to make this relationship succeed, you must become Open, and see her as a 'Whole', rather than a collection of qualities, some of which need changing.

I would say that it starts from the 'first person' rather than changing others

Hope what I say doesn't make you too stressed, but it is from my understanding and experiences over the years - Sometimes, the lessons of life can be hard, and telling someone else about them can sometimes seem hard also, especially over the internet!

[ellie]

Hey I just wanted to say good on you guys for trying to stick it out! You all sound like a lovely bunch

That said, I could imagine that it would be very hard and you can only take so much.

To Riggs the original poster, I thought what you wrote explained it all quite clearly. Could you not give her a letter similar to what you wrote above? If I got a letter similar to what you outlined above, I would take a good hard look at myself and try and see what steps I could take to improve the situation.

I too have lse, to a certain extent, but I don't carry on to others and I do try and take action. It's one thing to have LSE, but if you don't notice how it is effecting others then it becomes more about being selfish and continuing a bad pattern.

[funchy]

First off, bless you for sticking it out. The fact you've been so dedicated to her should be all the proof in the world of your love for her. It's so sad she refuses to see it.

I see this as HER problem. You're not saying unkind things to her, so all the negativity is coming from inside. She needs to start taking responsibility for her own happiness & confidence. She could read self-help books. She could invest her her appearance, career, or goals to give her things to be proud of. She could work through this with a therapist.

You cannot make her change if she is not ready to. Some people spent their entire life hating themselves and always seeking approval from those around them.

The best you can do is be supportive of her efforts to get help... and love her for who she is (which includes the annoying self criticism). Or you can decide this isn't making you happy and move on.

Best of luck to you.