Virgin

[evevera]

I am not going to suddenly find someone attractive who is the complete opposite of what i like (which would be 90% of guys then). I also am not going to change my morals (the whole waiting thing,needing to be ready,etc.)

You have a lot of rules for how a relationship is suppose to be for you. When you have so many rules, you're only shooting yourself in the foot. You'll never get it perfectly the way you want it. True love and the "right one" only shows up when you're open and willing to let them in. Those rules are block them from coming in, that's why you're single.

You say you can't change. Bull. You don't want to change and you don't want to have a boyfriend. If you did, you would have one right now. Open yourself to love, drop these stupid rules about how they should look. Looks don't last, when you're both 70, you're going to look terrible anyway. It's whats inside the person that you should be focusing on. (LOoks also change!)

I would really like you for once to step outside your comfort zone and really open up to some guys you never would have before. Don't write them off after a date or two just because you didn't "feel it" with them physically. If their personality fits yours, keep dating them and see what develops. Attraction can develop overtime, and your one bad experience in this case is just one bad experience.

It's a numbers game as well at the end of the day. Open yourself up to as many as you can, date as many as you can and then evaluate which one you have the best connection with.

I see a lot of pretty women with ugly guys, but they're treated like gold and very happy. I also see a lot of women with hot guys and they end up being cheated on and abused to no end. Whats the point? Just so you have someone hot to show off when you walk down the street?

[JimOfferman]

Originally Posted by Rockchick26

Well how can i date any men in here,we're spread out across the whole world!

May I remind you that Rose of Cairo (from France) dated Seeker5 (from the USA). Don't think that either of them regret that...

If you really wanted to, you could probably date a bunch of the guys here, but you choose not to, because you "hate internet dating".

I agree with you 100% about needing sexual attraction,but what makes A WORLD of difference is how he handles himself in the beginning. I can't want a guy if he isn't giving me any time to want him. If someone is throwing themselves at me before i even have time to blink my eyes,i am driven away! If you want something to come to you,dont chase after it,it'll only run away! I dont want a desperate guy,and i dont want a guy who cant even take the time to get to know me first. I dont want a guy who puts sex before personality. Also i cant truly like someone (honest feelings,love,etc) if i dont know him well enough first. I have to get to know his personality first and that takes months. Only then can i truly WANT to be with him (physically too).

Yes, we get the idea.

In your world men are ugly animals that will jump on you at the first sign of interest. Men cannot possibly be interested in meaningful relationships, now can they? Boy, am I happy not to live in your world!

Here's a reality check: there are literally thousands upon thousands of men eager to meet someone who is more interested in their personalities than scoring a quick shag. When it comes down to it, we're not all that dissimilar in our desires!

[striving4peace]

Ok, i'm going to change the topic now from rockchick's specific problems back to the original topic (sorry rockchick )

On the topic of a virgin (me) marrying another virgin - I'm being told that though ideally it would be better to 'try out the goods before buying it', the nice thing is that she'll have been my best (as I wouldn't have known better) and I don't really need to know what it's like to have slept with other people. Another thing that was told to me was that I have spared myself the torture of knowing how good sex is and dying for more like some men who have been on a dry spell so far by having stayed this way.

Are these things true or are these things just being told to console me?

[Parthon]

Well, I can't say whether or not you have "missed out" on anything, because I have too.

What I do know though, is that I have a unique experience, which many men can say they haven't had. So many guys are so focussed on getting laid and chasing sex, it's refreshing not to be one of those. Considering that not trying to sleep with the first girl you meet gives you a certain level of maturity and responsibility rarely shown into today's world, you will realise you are way ahead of the pack.

After all, there are way more important things than sex.

[JSB]

I think the advice sounds good. There are two things I'd be concerned with re: waiting until marriage and marrying another virgin.

1. Are you fundamentally sexually compatible? Making a lifetime commitment to someone without knowing the answer to this is risky.

2. Ten years down the line, is one partner going to regret their lack of sexual experiences, or just feel such overwhelming curiousity, such that they cheat to "find out what it's like" or "explore their sexuality"?

Neither of these are inevitable problems, or necessarily insurmountable if they do appear, but I would suggest a high degree of honest self awareness and open communication are vital, as well as focused dedication on the part of both partners to nurturing and developing a strong positive sexual connection.

Originally Posted by striving4peace

Ok, i'm going to change the topic now from rockchick's specific problems back to the original topic (sorry rockchick )

On the topic of a virgin (me) marrying another virgin - I'm being told that though ideally it would be better to 'try out the goods before buying it', the nice thing is that she'll have been my best (as I wouldn't have known better) and I don't really need to know what it's like to have slept with other people. Another thing that was told to me was that I have spared myself the torture of knowing how good sex is and dying for more like some men who have been on a dry spell so far by having stayed this way.

Are these things true or are these things just being told to console me?

[striving4peace]

Ok, I think (and hope) the advice is well founded and as close to the unbiased truth as possible.

I've been thinking (and sometimes worrying) about the sexual compatibility part. There's no solid information on it available , most of what I find is sketchy. Masters and Johnsons don't even mention it. The kamasutra (the unabridged version) tells about the 3 different types of male and female anatomy each, and which is optimum - but physical / mechanical problems I've heard can be fixed or circumvented these days. They dont talk about the other things I hear in a majority about compatibility such as style, frequency, etc. But then I have a very open and trusting relationship (so far in the early stages) and I'm trying to not do what rochchick fears of most men - bring up sex too early in the picture. I want to ease the topic in and as something we need to discuss in a framework of trust, openness and communicating needs in a relationship.

The reason I doubt the advice is because I've heard a lot of people advise that it's almost a pre-requisite to sleep around at least a little and know what you're like sexually and then settling with someone who you're sexually compatible with. I haven't had the first part, and now am wondering about how i'll manage the second in my situation. The advice I've been given doesn't seem to tally with that.

[Pequod]

Originally Posted by striving4peace

Another thing that was told to me was that I have spared myself the torture of knowing how good sex is and dying for more like some men who have been on a dry spell so far by having stayed this way.

Are these things true or are these things just being told to console me?

Sex can be good or very disappointing. In my case it depends on the connection I feel with her. I have never had a ONS (one-night-stand) in which I liked the sex very much. It's basically living out your animal instincts with not much else. In a LT relationship, it can be great. I know now that I long for feelings of love and connection. Just pure lust doesn't cut it for me (although it is part of the equation).

I know both sides of the argument: I have had sexual relationships before, but also have been (voluntarily) celibate for over a year. It taught me a lot. Don't forget that as an older virgin you have a certain experience that many people lack: knowing that you can be on your own, making the best of al the freedom you have (lots of time!), knowing that you can sustain a longer period without sex. I also noted during my celibacy that I felt mentally more clear, had somewhat more energy and that I could interact much more freely with the orther sexe.

[Pequod]

Originally Posted by striving4peace

I've been thinking (and sometimes worrying) about the sexual compatibility part. There's no solid information on it available , most of what I find is sketchy.

Anatomy is not an issue. Wheather one is big- or small size etc doesn't matter, it can only mean that certain positions are more enjoyable than others. Just have fun finding it out Arousal for women is mostly mentally driven and depends also on her mood and emotional openess.

The sexual temperament of both of you and attitude toward sex is what decides compatibility.

I know of only one source wich adresses this issue, the book Constructing the Sexual Crucible by David Schnarch. It is a book for therapists, but really good and looks at a broader perspective than just sex. Schnarch describes 3 styles of lovemaking: sexual trance, partner engament and role enactment.

[striving4peace]

Thank you Pequod, I shall find this book.

It is true I have achieved a lot in life in other aspects - but I can't bring myself to solidly agree that i wouldn't have managed to do it if i was having sex all this time. there are people who achieve AND have sex in their twenties. But it is also true that I have a lot of discipline and self control and it's only gotten to this point over the last decade.
I really dont want to enjoy the benefits of my patience without sex while going through another dry spell once I'm married :P I can do without anymore dry spells henceforth, thank you very much Pequad, as a guy who has had a lot of sexual encounters, what's your honest take on the other thing that was told to me. That it's better to not know what sex with others is like, and enter into a monogamous sexual relationship that will last the rest of my life so that that one girl remains the 'best' i'll ever have?

[Pequod]

Originally Posted by striving4peace

Pequad, as a guy who has had a lot of sexual encounters

Ehhm, please don't overestimate me I am by no means a dating guru. I'm just an ordinary guy that at some point in his life decided to fix his non-existing love life and ended up in the seduction community, only to leave when he saw through the balloney. I never gave it my 100% and am glad about that too.

Originally Posted by striving4peace

what's your honest take on the other thing that was told to me. That it's better to not know what sex with others is like, and enter into a monogamous sexual relationship that will last the rest of my life so that that one girl remains the 'best' i'll ever have?

I think there is nothing wrong with having only one sexual partner in your life and there is nothing wrong with having many. It depends on why you coose for the one or the other.

I don't like the reason you give in the question for having only one partner. To choose for only one partner to let her be the best you ever had is imo refusing to acknowledge the reality of the situation. In fact, it could even be that the sex isn't good at all!

Another drawback of this approach is that the sex with this one partner becomes tremendously important: it is the only experience you'll ever have and you know that beforehand. That puts a lot of pressure on you, and will be an obstacle in creating a healthy sexual relationship.

Perhaps the best approach is to take it as it comes. Maybe she will be your only one, maybe not.

[striving4peace]

No, I'm not saying it's the reason the situation arises: I'm not going to have one sexual partner for life *because* that way I ensure she is the best.
The situation arises because I might be marrying the virgin i am falling in love with - and thus end up having only one monogamous relationship in my life.

the 'she'll be the best you ever had' is being told to me in answer to my query to 'wouldn't it have been optimum to have at least slept around a bit'

but i guess you are answering that with 'i think there is nothing wrong with having only one sexual partner'. And in any case, I'm willing to do anything in my power (and so is my partner from what I'm seeing so far) to have a fantastic sex life too - to make it work.

[Rockchick26]

Originally Posted by evevera

University isn't really a . (Igreat place to meet boyfriends/girlfriends. Because if you break up, you're going to have to stand seeing them around the place all the time.

That is no different than meeting people in high school or at a job,either way you have to be around them for 8 hours a day (unless you quit or drop out,whatever the case may be). But i think those places are the best places to meet people to date because you get to know them as people,and its almost inevitable that it is going to happen with somebody.

You just need to approach the ones you want to date from a NON-friend angle. Don't be the I-only-see-him-as-a-friend guy. YOu can get out of that by flirting, building sexual tension in conversations and all that other jazz.

If someone gave this advice to a guy that liked me,it would NOT work. I don't think it is so black and white. Not everyone falls in love with people who come on strong flirting up a storm right off the bat. I see that as desperate and i would think "geez does he do that with every girl he meets?!" The whole friend-trap thing,for me anyway,it doesnt matter if a guy flirts with me or not,if i am attracted to him,i will not just think of him as a friend. And flirting means so much more when it is done by somebody that i feel close to already.

Most guys don't do this. If they get creeped out and tell you to stop cos they have a boyfriend, that's fine, you won't get them anyway no matter how much you flirt with them. But that doesn't mean you have to stop, just look at it as a part of your personality. They will enjoy the attention.

Are you telling him to flirt with girls who are taken even if they tell him to stop? I read to reread this,i can't beleive thats what you meant! I think that is extremely disrespectful to the guy and his girlfriend. That sounds like a sure way to get a fist in the mouth.

[Rockchick26]

Originally Posted by evevera

You have a lot of rules for how a relationship is suppose to be for you. When you have so many rules, you're only shooting yourself in the foot. You'll never get it perfectly the way you want it. True love and the "right one" only shows up when you're open and willing to let them in. Those rules are block them from coming in, that's why you're single.

Because i have values? Because i can't help what i am attracted to? Who doesnt have those rules? I am not going to sleep with every guy i meet on the first date just to get a guy.

You say you can't change. Bull. You don't want to change and you don't want to have a boyfriend. If you did, you would have one right now.

Well i had a boyfriend for 2 years and i dated a handful of other guys without changing my values and my preferences. If it happened then it can surely happen now.

Open yourself to love, drop these stupid rules about how they should look. Looks don't last, when you're both 70, you're going to look terrible anyway. It's whats inside the person that you should be focusing on. (LOoks also change!)

I am not saying i date guys only based on how they look. You don't have to tell me that it's what inside that counts LOL Geez thats common sense. What i am saying is i have to be attracted to the guy. Obviously,i mean doesn't everyone? Otherwise we might as well walk outside and close our eyes and hold our finger out and whoever we touch first we would date them no matter what they look like! You have to have an attraction to them otherwise you won't want to be sexual with them. Are you telling me if you saw this guy that you would want to crawl in bed with him cuz he's such a nice guy?

I would really like you for once to step outside your comfort zone and really open up to some guys you never would have before. Don't write them off after a date or two just because you didn't "feel it" with them physically. If their personality fits yours, keep dating them and see what develops.

I HAVE done this! One guy i dated,all my friends said 'this guy is the total opposite of you,what do you see in him?' but yet i continued to date him,but the poor guy,i gave it 4 months and i still never got to the point where i wanted to fool around with him,and i ended up breaking his heart

Attraction can develop overtime, and your one bad experience in this case is just one bad experience.

What bad experience are you talking about? This isnt based off one bad experience. Or any experience really,its just a matter of what trips my trigger and what doesn't.

I see a lot of pretty women with ugly guys, but they're treated like gold and very happy. I also see a lot of women with hot guys and they end up being cheated on and abused to no end. Whats the point? Just so you have someone hot to show off when you walk down the street?

I think i am greatly misunderstood in this thread I am not saying i would pick the most gorgeous guy out there just because i could show him off. Some of the guys i have liked,my friends go "eww!! He looks like a girl!" or "what did you see in him,its about time you dumped him!" I would also not stay with a guy just because he was hot if he abused me. This is not what i am saying AT ALL.

[Rockchick26]

Originally Posted by JimOfferman

May I remind you that Rose of Cairo (from France) dated Seeker5 (from the USA). Don't think that either of them regret that...

If you really wanted to, you could probably date a bunch of the guys here, but you choose not to, because you "hate internet dating".

No i didnt know about them dating,but thats cool,if it worked for them!

And honestly,i dont think any guys in here would date me after reading enough of my posts about this But youre right,i hate internet dating,but this wouldnt be considered internet dating,this isnt a dating site. But meeting people off the internet always gives a wierd vibe,and it never feels genuine and natural to me.

Yes, we get the idea.

LOL I dont think some of the people in here do,i have had to correct some people at least once. I feel very misunderstood,probably because of my lack of being able to explain myself right the first time

In your world men are ugly animals that will jump on you at the first sign of interest. Men cannot possibly be interested in meaningful relationships, now can they? Boy, am I happy not to live in your world!

Once again,i'm misunderstood! If men in my world are ugly then why have i had any luck at all? And i didnt SAY men arent interested in meaningful relationships,i said that seems to be mostly what i find and i wanted to know if it is possibly better than what i can see.

Here's a reality check: there are literally thousands upon thousands of men eager to meet someone who is more interested in their personalities than scoring a quick shag. When it comes down to it, we're not all that dissimilar in our desires!

I believe you,it's just that my experience shows me the opposite. And for some reason something about me attracts the guys that think i'm easy,which couldnt be further from the truth. Well i'm single and i'm skinny and cute and i'm always smiling,i guess that is a pretty inviting scenario

[Rockchick26]

Sorry everyone i didnt intend to make this thread about me. I can just relate to the virginity thing (at least very close to it).

I found a really cool decision making tool that might help you if you cant decide if you should remain a virgin,not remain a virgin,get experience before marrying,etc. This will work with ANY decision.

Decision Making

[Pequod]

Originally Posted by striving4peace

No, I'm not saying it's the reason the situation arises: I'm not going to have one sexual partner for life *because* that way I ensure she is the best.
The situation arises because I might be marrying the virgin i am falling in love with - and thus end up having only one monogamous relationship in my life.

the 'she'll be the best you ever had' is being told to me in answer to my query to 'wouldn't it have been optimum to have at least slept around a bit'

but i guess you are answering that with 'i think there is nothing wrong with having only one sexual partner'. And in any case, I'm willing to do anything in my power (and so is my partner from what I'm seeing so far) to have a fantastic sex life too - to make it work.

It really does depend on yourself. If you know that you will always be curious how it would be with other women, it can be a problem. If you take things as they come and appreciate what is present, there is no need to 'sleep around a bit'.

Is that an answer to your question?

[JimOfferman]

Originally Posted by Rockchick26

And honestly,i dont think any guys in here would date me after reading enough of my posts about this

You don't know that. You're just assuming your worst fears are true and, usually, they aren't.

I believe you,it's just that my experience shows me the opposite. And for some reason something about me attracts the guys that think i'm easy,which couldnt be further from the truth. Well i'm single and i'm skinny and cute and i'm always smiling,i guess that is a pretty inviting scenario

Stop paying attention to those guys and starting paying attention to the ones that don't think you're easy. That is a decision you must make!

We tend to think of ourselves as astute observers who don't miss a thing, when in reality we only take notice of a small percentage of the impulses that our mind receives. Our brain casts away 95% of the information that our senses provide in order to make sensible decisions on the remaining 5%.

How is this relevant? Your thought process is the filter. The stuff - good or bad - that occupies your mind is filtered out for you, presenting you with a reality that is comfortably familiar, but far from complete.

It's why one person sees just a row of parked cars along the street and the other notices that the make and model she drives is present five times in three different colors. Your mind brings cars of the make and model you own to the forefront to help you find where yours is parked after that long shopping session.

Likewise, your mind brings to the forefront the things that you want to avoid, to help you avoid them. Unfortunately, it can also get so caught up in the avoiding that it starts missing the things it really desires... which is something, I think, you're quite familiar with.

Shift your focus!

[Pequod]

Rockchick

People can be divided in two groups: matchers and mismatchers. Matchers have the impuls to see what is the same, mismatchers have the impuls to see what is different.

You are an example of the perfect mismatcher. Whatever someone will say to you, you'll always find the little detail that isn't correct,that is different. If I'm attracted to you, you will be repulsed by me. If I'm repulsed by you, you will be attracted to me. You will always think about what is NOT possible instead of what is possible. And when it comes to dating, you will always expect to find hurdles, problems and impossibilities.

I'll tell you, as long as you keep creating these demons in your mind, you will keep meeting them in your reality.

The only way out of this is to consciously change the way you think.

Of course you won't take this advise because true to form, you will disagree with me

[striving4peace]

Originally Posted by Pequod

It really does depend on yourself. If you know that you will always be curious how it would be with other women, it can be a problem. If you take things as they come and appreciate what is present, there is no need to 'sleep around a bit'.

Is that an answer to your question?

Yes, It does, thanks.
As usually the most important thing - It is ultimately my perception that decides.

I was browsing a site and the trailer for "he's just not that into you" started playing on it's own and it's like the universe sent me a message, one of the lines by Ben Affleck (i think) was 'the moment a guy marries, he thinks of all the women he could sleep with who he's going to be giving up"

So it wasn't just me - all guys, no matter how many girls they sleep with will have the same conundrum. Probably even harder for them?

[JSB]

Originally Posted by JimOfferman

...
We tend to think of ourselves as astute observers who don't miss a thing, when in reality we only take notice of a small percentage of the impulses that our mind receives. Our brain casts away 95% of the information that our senses provide in order to make sensible decisions on the remaining 5%.

How is this relevant? Your thought process is the filter. The stuff - good or bad - that occupies your mind is filtered out for you, presenting you with a reality that is comfortably familiar, but far from complete.
...

Bingo!

Rockchick, I suggest you print a copy of Jim's post and carry it around with you. Every time you have a few moments free, take it out and read it. (I'm not being snarky or sarcastic; I think the post was right on the money!)

[Parthon]

What I'm wondering is why does Rockchick always argue for what she doesn't want?

If you want to change some aspect of your life, the only way to do that is to go and discover exactly how to change it. Asking for advice is great, but it's a case of taking it, analysing it and using what resonates with you, or even more so, that which scares you.

If you have a reason why not to every example, then you are just creating reasons to stay still. That won't get you anywhere. You'll end up stuck even considering how much you've read and how much advie you've been given. It's simply because you've "reason"ed it all away and "excuse"d so much of it. It's fine if you like what you've got, but why argue for what you don't want.

You say that All the guys you know are shallow and are primarily interested in sex, and will argue that proof until the cows come home, but WHY? If you want to find guys that are not that, you have to release your view that most guys are like that. Otherwise you are just prooving yourself right.

As for music, some were self taught, but a majority had lessons of some kind. Even the ones that were self taught learnt the "rules" of music, but they did it by discover, not by being taught. Playing by ear is just the start of being a musician, being able to create new music from scratch requires you to know how music works. Even those that were never taught, just seemed to be naturals and can create music on their own follow the rules, they just don't know it. And breaking the rules? That's about using the rules in unique and different ways to create something new and different.

You don't have to follow the rules at all for romance, but they are still in play. You might discover someone you have been friends with and fall in love with each other after knowing them for years, yet the rules of social attraction and compatibility are still at work, you've just managed to use them without knowing.

[Rockchick26]

Originally Posted by JimOfferman

Stop paying attention to those guys and starting paying attention to the ones that don't think you're easy. That is a decision you must make!

Well i already do this. I even posted in here about one guy who was trying to get with me and i ignored him as much as i could without being a bitch. And the guys that dont think i'm easy,well,those are the ones that are never interested in me. So i feel like i have no choice with what i can focus on.

[Rockchick26]

Originally Posted by Pequod

Rockchick

People can be divided in two groups: matchers and mismatchers. Matchers have the impuls to see what is the same, mismatchers have the impuls to see what is different.

You are an example of the perfect mismatcher. Whatever someone will say to you, you'll always find the little detail that isn't correct,that is different. If I'm attracted to you, you will be repulsed by me. If I'm repulsed by you, you will be attracted to me. You will always think about what is NOT possible instead of what is possible. And when it comes to dating, you will always expect to find hurdles, problems and impossibilities.

I'll tell you, as long as you keep creating these demons in your mind, you will keep meeting them in your reality.

The only way out of this is to consciously change the way you think.

Of course you won't take this advise because true to form, you will disagree with me

I think what it is is that i just have this need to discuss things. And if every post was "yeah i agree." then where would we be? I mean,isnt the point of having a message board to discuss and debate things? If we all agreed on everything,there would be no reason to post. But you are right,i do tend to find the opposite of whatever somebody is saying and defend that position. Very rarely does someone say something and i can totally relate and feel the same way. But usually i really truly feel that i am just so different from everyone else that its just natural that i won't agree with most of them. I also have this need to explain myself and defend myself when disagreeing with others. I guess all those things combined are not good

And one thing i have to add: I am not repulsed by every guy that likes me...how do you think i ever dated anyone then? LOL I obviously dont push guys away just because they like me. If i like them too,i give them a chance. I'm just so picky,that rarely happens.

[JimOfferman]

Originally Posted by Rockchick26

So i feel like i have no choice with what i can focus on.

I know you do. I'm trying to explain to you that your world is not going to change until you realize that this feeling is off base. Only when you stop obsessing about everything you don't want (that includes guys you like but who aren't interested in you), are you going to find what you do want.

[Rockchick26]

Originally Posted by Parthon

What I'm wondering is why does Rockchick always argue for what she doesn't want?

LOL Well,read my last post where i talked about how its just in my nature to debate things. Thats what we're all here for,anyway,we can't all possibly see everything the same way. And of course when somebody asks me a question or directs something to me,i have to respond. But i dont see it as im arguing for things i dont want...i see it as i'm explaining myself and defending myself,and explaining why everyone's suggestions havent worked for me. In other words,it isnt that i dont know what i need to do,but i have to explain why they dont work for me personally in my situation.

If you want to change some aspect of your life, the only way to do that is to go and discover exactly how to change it. Asking for advice is great, but it's a case of taking it, analysing it and using what resonates with you, or even more so, that which scares you.

yes,i know,i am probably really frustrating to deal with because of that. Not much resonates with me though. I keep thinking there is some solution out there that just clicks with me,something that i could easily do. But everyone says changing isnt easy,and personal development can take YEARS,even decades...and i've only been at it for about 3 years so i'm still a newbie. If it was that easy,these types of sites wouldn't even exist because everyone would have already figured out how to change.

If you have a reason why not to every example, then you are just creating reasons to stay still. That won't get you anywhere. You'll end up stuck even considering how much you've read and how much advie you've been given. It's simply because you've "reason"ed it all away and "excuse"d so much of it. It's fine if you like what you've got, but why argue for what you don't want.

Like i said,i dont feel like i'm arguing for what i dont want,i feel like i'm arguing because the solutions don't work for me and i have to explain that. Not every solution is going to work for everyone,and i'm picky with everything so this is no exception. And i don't feel like i am "creating reasons to stay still",even though deep down that has to be it,but to me it just feels more like i would be going against the grain to change them,i'd be swimming upstream,and i want a solution that,like you said,resonates with me,and fits me.

You say that All the guys you know are shallow and are primarily interested in sex, and will argue that proof until the cows come home, but WHY?

The same reason you would argue with someone til the cows come home if they said the sky was green when you can see that it's blue. If somebody would just once reply with "yeah it's hard to find guys who arent just into one night stands" then i would finally feel like somebody else is living on the same planet I am. I just want people to know what i see,and that is why i have these problems. It's not just this topic,its any topic that people disagree with me on. Of course youre going to argue if you disagree.

If you want to find guys that are not that, you have to release your view that most guys are like that. Otherwise you are just prooving yourself right.

Well,it isnt that i NEVER meet guys who aren't pigs,but theyre already taken or not interested in me. I know decent guys exist but i'm just saying the majority of the ones that come up to me are not the kind of guys i want. And i honestly dont see how i am attracting them since i am nothing like them. Whatever happened to like attracts like? I should be attracting friendly,patient,moralistic guys who love to talk about music.
And its a little hard to release your view of something and tell yourself its the complete opposite...would you be able to talk yourself into believing the sky was really green even though you don't see it as being green?

[Rockchick26]

Originally Posted by JimOfferman

I know you do. I'm trying to explain to you that your world is not going to change until you realize that this feeling is off base. Only when you stop obsessing about everything you don't want (that includes guys you like but who aren't interested in you), are you going to find what you do want.

I don't feel like i'm obsessing though. Just because a lot of my posts deal with that issue doesn't mean i am sitting around every minute i'm awake worried sick that i'll never find a boyfriend. While i am posting in here,i am also listening to music,chatting with a friend about music,and learning more about Site Build It so i can build my own website about music. Before I came online i was with a friend and her kids at a monster truck show having a good old time. Before that i was playing piano. I didn't even think about my lack of a boyfriend until i just typed the words right now.

And i used to be really bad with wanting a boyfriend,i used to be depressed over it quite often,but that's when i DID finally get a boyfriend. So if it only happens when you aren't worried about it,how did i get one then?

[Parthon]

Firstly: Don't respond to what I'm about to say. Read it all, twice or three times, then think about it, and respond to it as a whole, instead of line by line. Tell me what insights you see, if any, or what benefits you get, if any. Write from your heart, and not from your mind. Be with the information, and se what your self inside is whispering to you. Don't reply. Don't respond. Discover, and express.

But you are arguing for what you don't want. It might not be your desire, but it's definately your results. I understand where you are coming from, wanting to be devils advocate, and argue for the underdog. Being contrary because it's a good way to get both sides of the story. Knowing what you know and knowing that you are right. Being smart enough to know all the answers, and being wise enough to know how the world really works.

It's all well and good, but it doesn't give you what you want. Right now, it feels like this contraryness is a fundamental core of who you are, but it's not. It's a personality trait that you bring into existence when you want to use it. It doesn't seem that way, because it's so real for you. This iwon't be making any sense at all either, unless you have already experienced it.

I'm not sure what else to say right now though. Myself and 20 other people have said everything there is to say on the subject, but that's okay, because you already know the answers. Here's an answer for you:

People give up, and get tired. They get tired of fighting against you, and they get tired of proving themselves. They get tired of being wrong, and they definately get tired of being not-listening-to. You push people away, because you are always right and know everything. Other people are stupid and wrong. If you say something is true, then it is true. People just can't relate to you on a close level. There's so many hoops and walls to push through, it's so very tiring, and it never stops. Noone can get close to you right now, because there is no you to get close to. If anyone ever tries, you give them the walls, the reasons and the rightness.

As an aside: How is your relationship with your family? Is it everything you could dream of, or are there difficulties relating to them. Are you 100% open, happy, loving and compassionate with each other, or are there blocks and barriers, things unsaid. Is it just your romantic relationships that are suffering, or is it your friendships and family relationships that are suffering too?

By the way, I have seen the sky in green, blue, grey, white, black, red, purple, orange, silver and yellow. If someone said it was green, I would look first, then correct them second, and sometimes I wouldn't even correct them. After all, learning is all in the experience. I really don't know anything of my own. What colour is your sky now?

[Pequod]

Originally Posted by Rockchick26

if every post was "yeah i agree." then where would we be?

if every post was "yeah, but" then where would we be?

(Couldn't resist that one )

Originally Posted by Rockchick26

But you are right,i do tend to find the opposite of whatever somebody is saying and defend that position. Very rarely does someone say something and i can totally relate and feel the same way.

That is what makes it hard to find a relationship, because a relationship asks for connection. You are habitually focussed on what is not the same, i.e. disconnection.

Originally Posted by Rockchick26

But usually i really truly feel that i am just so different from everyone else that its just natural that i won't agree with most of them.

It's an habit that you probably have since you were very little. So off course it feels natural, as you've been doing it for so long!

Originally Posted by Rockchick26

I also have this need to explain myself and defend myself when disagreeing with others.

This could be a sign of low confidence. On that note, if I may give you one tip for improving your confidence: you adress yourself always with a lower case "i". It's better to use capital "I". It may seem a detail, but I've noticed the way one adresses him/herself is almost always related to his/her level of self-confidence.

Originally Posted by Rockchick26

And one thing i have to add: I am not repulsed by every guy that likes me...how do you think i ever dated anyone then? LOL

I know this is not always the case, I just put it black and white for the sake of argument. But I remember a recent thread in which you stated that you perceive guys that like you as "lower status" and thus not interesting, and guys that don't like you back as "higher status" and therefore there is never a satisfying relationship possible. Doesn't that mechanism fit in my describtion?

[JimOfferman]

Originally Posted by Rockchick26

I don't feel like i'm obsessing though. Just because a lot of my posts deal with that issue doesn't mean i am sitting around every minute i'm awake worried sick that i'll never find a boyfriend. While i am posting in here,i am also listening to music,chatting with a friend about music,and learning more about Site Build It so i can build my own website about music. Before I came online i was with a friend and her kids at a monster truck show having a good old time. Before that i was playing piano. I didn't even think about my lack of a boyfriend until i just typed the words right now.

Yes, you're a wonderfully well rounded person. There's no need to defend yourself like this all the time. I already know you're a good person and I'm not trying to fight you...

I'm trying to help!

And i used to be really bad with wanting a boyfriend,i used to be depressed over it quite often,but that's when i DID finally get a boyfriend. So if it only happens when you aren't worried about it,how did i get one then?

Life is not an exact science, dear. It's not as easy as 1 + 1 = 3!

It's also not about who can prove who wrong. There is no right or wrong here. Nothing you say will ever prove to me that the world is like you see it, because I see it differently. Likewise, I cannot prove with my words to you just how differently the world is to me. Neither of us is ever going to see the world as the other does... all we can do here is learn from each other's perspective.

I can tell you endlessly that looking at things differently will bring you new insights and experiences, but the telling that is all I can do. You have to do the looking all by yourself (if you choose to).

[Rockchick26]

Originally Posted by Parthon

Firstly: Don't respond to what I'm about to say. Read it all, twice or three times, then think about it, and respond to it as a whole, instead of line by line. Tell me what insights you see, if any, or what benefits you get, if any. Write from your heart, and not from your mind. Be with the information, and se what your self inside is whispering to you. Don't reply. Don't respond. Discover, and express.

But you are arguing for what you don't want. It might not be your desire, but it's definately your results. I understand where you are coming from, wanting to be devils advocate, and argue for the underdog. Being contrary because it's a good way to get both sides of the story. Knowing what you know and knowing that you are right. Being smart enough to know all the answers, and being wise enough to know how the world really works.

It's all well and good, but it doesn't give you what you want. Right now, it feels like this contraryness is a fundamental core of who you are, but it's not. It's a personality trait that you bring into existence when you want to use it. It doesn't seem that way, because it's so real for you. This iwon't be making any sense at all either, unless you have already experienced it.

I'm not sure what else to say right now though. Myself and 20 other people have said everything there is to say on the subject, but that's okay, because you already know the answers. Here's an answer for you:

People give up, and get tired. They get tired of fighting against you, and they get tired of proving themselves. They get tired of being wrong, and they definately get tired of being not-listening-to. You push people away, because you are always right and know everything. Other people are stupid and wrong. If you say something is true, then it is true. People just can't relate to you on a close level. There's so many hoops and walls to push through, it's so very tiring, and it never stops. Noone can get close to you right now, because there is no you to get close to. If anyone ever tries, you give them the walls, the reasons and the rightness.

Alright,i did as you said and i didnt reply to this right away,and i reread it 3 times. Just as the sky can change colors,so can people. Meaning,sure i may seem like i'm fighting everyone and constantly putting up walls and barriers,but i am not like this all the time with everyone in every situation. It appears that way in here because this is a discussion forum,and thats what people do,they discuss/argue/debate,whatever. I am not like this in other posts where i am offering advice to someone. I am only like this when the posts are about me specifically,and i have to explain myself. I don't even speak like this,in real life. In real life,i am very passive,very much a follower,and i rarely talk at all. If somebody that knew me in real life read my posts on here,they would be shocked.

As an aside: How is your relationship with your family? Is it everything you could dream of, or are there difficulties relating to them. Are you 100% open, happy, loving and compassionate with each other, or are there blocks and barriers, things unsaid. Is it just your romantic relationships that are suffering, or is it your friendships and family relationships that are suffering too?

You have probably seen my posts in here regarding my relationship with my dad,but that's the only problematic relationship i have. I have a wonderful relationship with my mom,brother,my dad's girlfriend,the few close friends i have...but the problems with my dad,the rest of my family also has with him,so it isn't just me.