Virgin

[striving4peace]

*raises hand* 29 year old virgin here.
And i'm guilty of posting a few threads while dealing with my own virginity on this forum, and troubling a few of my closest friends to help me feel better when I'm down.

I am doing much, much better now. I try zen philosophy to Katie Byrons' the work.
Usually virginity leads to some very limiting beliefs about yourself, and as someone already pointed out - those beliefs hamper your confidence and thus chances with women.

Some of the limiting beliefs i am having difficulty letting go are:
1) Only attractive, sexy, confident people have sex as teens and in thier early twenties. Hence I am not attractive sexy or confident
2) Guys who've slept around are cool, manly, held in high regard by the opposite sex. Hence I am not cool, manly or held in high regard.
3) The best sex is when your hormones are raging which is when you're a teenager to early twenties. after that sexual disfuntions occur. So I have lost out on the best sexual years of my life.

But apply katie Byrons' the work for example to any of these issues. Ask yourself:
1) Is it true?
2) Can you absolutely know that it's true?
3) How do you react when you believe that thought?
4) Who would you be without the thought?
5) If you reverse it, does it sound equally if not more true?

Just take question number 2 alone and look at those beliefs, and they melt away.

Br confident. Be happy.

[Pequod]

There's some great advice in this thread. I think that telling a women you're a virgin is no big deal, if you tell it with the right attitude.

If you tell her like it's a big secret and like there is something terribly wrong with you, she will think the same and it will bomb.

But if you you explain her that you didn't want to screw around and want to share your sexuality with someone special, you will comes across as someone who is strong and follows his own convictions.

I also like the suggestion to let her help you explore. If you can ask her that confidently, it will make a good impression too. And give both of you some fun. She is one lucky woman! .

[metamorph]

To me sex is like dancing. On the one hand it is a skill. So if you practice you will get better, and women who are merely interested in the physical aspect of sex (with no emotions attached) will prefer someone who is more experienced. However, like in dancing there are natural talents. So it is not impossible, that you will be good, because in spite of your lacking experience you simply have a feel for it (you will still get better later on).
On the other hand, having sex among lovers is also an emotional act. It is just great no matter how good you are technically. Just like that dance with the girl you had a major crush on in high-school. When you forgot about the room and about the moves. When you never danced before, but no matter how you moved your feet and body, both of you were in a different world... So, if you are truly falling in love with someone, the technical side of sex gets more and more into the background.

Another question you may want to ask yourself is why you are a virgin? Do you actually want to be intimate and have sex?

[striving4peace]

I like metamorph's analogy - nice one!

[Fullcrum]

I can't help but think some people here are rationalizing and turning to philosophy to cover up their lust for sex, when in fact the lust could be "cured" by having sex. Why cannot anyone admit they want sex, but don't know how to do it, and want help? Does anyone actually enjoy zenning away their sexual desires? I just don't understand.

I didn't take the philosophy route to cover up my urges and rationalize it away, but to support them. I wonder why more people do not do the same. Does "social conditioning" stop you?

[striving4peace]

I don't 'zen away my sexual desires'. Like I said, I use zen and things like Katie Byron's work to deal with the issues that have risen with the limiting beliefs about myself that have come up because of the virginity.

[JimOfferman]

Originally Posted by Fullcrum

Why cannot anyone admit they want sex

I do, but I don't want it at any cost.

Does "social conditioning" stop you?

Not me.

What's stopping me is not yet having met a woman where the sexual desire is mutual and equal.

I could easily pick someone up for a one night standish kind of fling, but I just don't have any desire to do so. In fact, I ended up severely disappointing a girl, who was desperate for such a fling, on the one occasion I ignored my inner resistance. I had told myself that some 'experience' would do me good, but when push came to shove everything in me refused to go on, because I deeply crave love, not lust.

No one taught me this boundary, it exists because of who I am.

[Pequod]

Originally Posted by metamorph

To me sex is like dancing. On the one hand it is a skill. So if you practice you will get better, and women who are merely interested in the physical aspect of sex (with no emotions attached) will prefer someone who is more experienced. However, like in dancing there are natural talents. So it is not impossible, that you will be good, because in spite of your lacking experience you simply have a feel for it (you will still get better later on).
On the other hand, having sex among lovers is also an emotional act. It is just great no matter how good you are technically. Just like that dance with the girl you had a major crush on in high-school. When you forgot about the room and about the moves. When you never danced before, but no matter how you moved your feet and body, both of you were in a different world... So, if you are truly falling in love with someone, the technical side of sex gets more and more into the background.

Another question you may want to ask yourself is why you are a virgin? Do you actually want to be intimate and have sex?

Brilliant post! The comparison with dancing is spot on.

The last question is crucial: to have sex is also to surrender to the love you're feeling. For some people this is their major stumbling block, especially people that want to keep everything under control. On the other hand. I have been long periods without sex. Not because I couldn't "pull a girl" but because I only wanted to be so intimate with someone I really love.

Thanks for the insight.

[SeanOG]

Hey! Pretty cool thread. I think a pretty important distinction is your view of virginity. Most on this thread see it as a negative thing and even a sign of failure or shortcoming. I can see that view, even though I don't hold it.

My experience was completely different. I was a virgin by choice until I married at 28. I chose to marry later because there were a lot of things I wanted to achieve in my life and in my youth that would be difficult to do as a married guy. I did them all.

Secondly, I considered my virginity an asset -- kind of like the stash of cash I kept in an account to buy a ring and honeymoon with when I met the right girl. Actually, the virginity was much more emotional than that, but I did feel that it was something I owned. And it was something hard to keep. But I kept it.

When I met my wife to be and I knew that our relationship was going somewhere that I liked, I let her know that I was a virgin. I was glad to be able to tell her that because I felt I was giving her the something that I'd been saving for years. I was giving her my inexperience, naivete, passion and myself with absolutely no images in my imagination of anyone else. She was my first on our wedding night.

I have absolutely no regrets, never any doubts. I spent my virginity in the right place. Simply for your consideration!

Peace,

SeanOG

[JSB]

I was a virgin until the age of 20, and even after having sex, it took me a long time to become comfortable with it.

I was afraid of losing control of myself, afraid of true unshielded intimacy and vulnerability, and I did what I think many people do --- I retreated inward during sex and focused on my own experience. My partner's feelings were important to me, and I always tried to be a good lover, but it was in the context of my own internal experience.

Now, years later, I am comfortable with intimacy and vulnerability, with being totally exposed and connected. I still enjoy my own sensations, but so much of sex is now about shared experience and energetic flow.

So, even after you have sex, it can feel difficult or uncomfortable or even threatening, but if you are patient and kind to yourself, you can eventually find something better and more real than all the crass Hollywood bullshit and empty mechanical hook-ups. It may take awhile, but it's worth pursuing.

[Erock]

Originally Posted by white

Hi,

I'm 31 years old and virgin. I'm feeling very depressed about it. I don't think that I'll able to find a girlfriend and if I do I think she'll probobly run away when she find out about it. What do you think that I do in that case (if we have sex)? Do I tell her or do I lie something?

English is not my first language so sorry if I make mistakes.

Hey dude I've got a great idea for you. Tell girls that you thought you wanted to wait until marriage but since it hasn't happened yet you're saying screw it and just want to mess around a bit. That would sound very logical to me, and likely girls will completely believe that and have no problem with it.

Erock

[JimOfferman]

Originally Posted by Erock

Hey dude I've got a great idea for you. Tell girls that you thought you wanted to wait until marriage but since it hasn't happened yet you're saying screw it and just want to mess around a bit. That would sound very logical to me, and likely girls will completely believe that and have no problem with it.

That would be lying, which is stupid... just don't.

[cheech]

Originally Posted by Erock

Hey dude I've got a great idea for you. Tell girls that you thought you wanted to wait until marriage but since it hasn't happened yet you're saying screw it and just want to mess around a bit. That would sound very logical to me, and likely girls will completely believe that and have no problem with it.

Erock

i've got a few problems with this. first, it's not true. second, it makes you seem inconsistent and weak willed, like "well, i don't really believe in sex before marriage, but i can't wait any longer, so i'm just gonna ignore my principles cause i'm desperate to get laid". and third, it gives a certain impression as to how you view sex and relationships, which in my case (and i think probably in the OP's case) is quite different from our actual views. so overall, even if you're right that girls would believe it and have no proplem with it, it would still be totally inauthentic for me and also be quite misleading.

[SeanOG]

From the book The Perks of Being a Wallflower by Steven Chbosky, "I just need to know that someone out there listens and understands and doesn't try to sleep with people even if they could have. I need to know that these people exist."

I think it's how the books starts if I remember right. And from there an underlying theme is people's dignity.

Sex isn't something you get. It's something you give.

[David21]

I'm not even sure whether anyone is even going to read this but I wanted to say something, nevertheless.

I'm 21 and I've never even kissed a girl. My life has been quite difficult so I find connecting with people my own age a real challenge and so relationships of the kind mentioned in this thread have not happened for me. I've tried but things have never developed.

Over the past eight years I have wanted one thing: companionship. I want someone to share my soul with but I haven't yet found this. It makes me sad everyday because all I want is to be really close to someone on all levels. I don't just want sex. What I want, in a way, transcends that.

I've just started university. Over the past couple of months I have been feeling a lot of emotional pain regarding this issue in my life. All I ever see is people kissing and cuddling appearing to be close, indulging in that which I want the most. It hurts so much. But don't take me wrongly, sex is not really the issue here. I just want someone to hold and to feel exceptionally close to that is more than just a friend.

It is reassuring to see that I am not the only one going through this.

[PokerEnthusiast]

Originally Posted by David21

It is reassuring to see that I am not the only one going through this.

David21, I feel exactly the same way. Everything you described about yourself and your feelings is the same for me (even down to the age ).

Everyday that I go to school I see couples that are happy together and showing their affection for each other. When I see attractive girls with their boyfriends I sometimes ask myself - "Why can't I be that guy?" or "Will I ever be with a girl like that?" or "I hope I can have those experiences while I'm still in college"

Most of the time I just blame it on "bad luck".
-Bad luck because whenever I've met a girl in one of my classes that I was attracted to I find out that she has a boyfriend. We end up just being friends and then after the semester is over I barely see her anymore.
-Bad luck because I'm never at places where I can meet new girls. None of my friends are people that go out to nightclubs so I don't have a chance to ever go to a club to meet girls. Nobody I know ever has parties where a lot of new people get together so I'm not able to meet girls at a party like that.

I know it's stupid to think this way because I know that all of this can be changed through my actions and the way I choose to live my life. It's just like in poker: It's not the about the cards that you are dealt but the way that you play them. There's nothing wrong with the cards I was dealt(my life), I just don't know how to play them the right way(I'm not doing what I should be doing to improve my social life).

And you can give me advice like:
-"Try to make new friends that are interested in the same things you are"
-"Put yourself out there more and even though you don't have friends to go with you to a club or a party; you can still go by yourself and meet people" or
-"Don't be afraid to get rejected by people. It's part of the learning process and over time you will learn that rejection is not that bad"
-"Join toastmasters"
-etc
but the problem is I already know that this is what I have to do improve my social life - I'm just too stubborn to do it and too scared to even try. I would rather believe in this illusion of bad luck that have and keep telling myself that my luck is going to change. Haha... I say things to myself like "Yeah don't worry, next semester you're gonna meet new people that are gonna be the type of friends you want and you're gonna meet a really nice girl-the one you've been waiting so long for". But this is just me waiting for things to happen for me. The truth is - it wont happen for me unless I do something about it.

[Erock]

Originally Posted by JimOfferman

That would be lying, which is stupid... just don't.

Wow way to shut down what I thought was a good idea. I wasn't trying to find this guy an authentic long term relationship, I was just trying to find him a good excuse for why he's never had sex so that it can come off smoothly when he meets women. Not to be mean at all, but there are some very negative societal assumptions about men who haven't had sex in their 20s, and most women (not those that are on these forums) will immediately assume those unless he has a good reason (which I gave him).

I understand where he's coming from and I think this sort of thing is especially taxing for men because so much of a man's ego is tied into how well he can relate to women. I didn't kiss a girl until I was 19, and I found it extremely difficult to live with at times.

Here is the real truth for men: Unless you are very fortunate you will NEVER be given girls. Girls will never fall into your lap. Don't believe any of the hype that somehow you will meet the girl of your dreams without doing anything. The very MAX you will be given is a girl giving you subtle signals that she likes you. That's it. No gimmies. No freebies. You have to go after the girls you want and conquer your fears.


Erock

[Rockchick26]

Originally Posted by PokerEnthusiast

David21, I feel exactly the same way. Everything you described about yourself and your feelings is the same for me (even down to the age ).

Everyday that I go to school I see couples that are happy together and showing their affection for each other. When I see attractive girls with their boyfriends I sometimes ask myself - "Why can't I be that guy?" or "Will I ever be with a girl like that?" or "I hope I can have those experiences while I'm still in college"

Most of the time I just blame it on "bad luck".
-Bad luck because whenever I've met a girl in one of my classes that I was attracted to I find out that she has a boyfriend. We end up just being friends and then after the semester is over I barely see her anymore.
-Bad luck because I'm never at places where I can meet new girls. None of my friends are people that go out to nightclubs so I don't have a chance to ever go to a club to meet girls. Nobody I know ever has parties where a lot of new people get together so I'm not able to meet girls at a party like that.

I know it's stupid to think this way because I know that all of this can be changed through my actions and the way I choose to live my life. It's just like in poker: It's not the about the cards that you are dealt but the way that you play them. There's nothing wrong with the cards I was dealt(my life), I just don't know how to play them the right way(I'm not doing what I should be doing to improve my social life).

And you can give me advice like:
-"Try to make new friends that are interested in the same things you are"
-"Put yourself out there more and even though you don't have friends to go with you to a club or a party; you can still go by yourself and meet people" or
-"Don't be afraid to get rejected by people. It's part of the learning process and over time you will learn that rejection is not that bad"
-"Join toastmasters"
-etc
but the problem is I already know that this is what I have to do improve my social life - I'm just too stubborn to do it and too scared to even try. I would rather believe in this illusion of bad luck that have and keep telling myself that my luck is going to change. Haha... I say things to myself like "Yeah don't worry, next semester you're gonna meet new people that are gonna be the type of friends you want and you're gonna meet a really nice girl-the one you've been waiting so long for". But this is just me waiting for things to happen for me. The truth is - it wont happen for me unless I do something about it.

This entire post could have been written by me! Not that its a good thing there are so many of us with this problem,but its reassuring in a way because we know we're not alone. I have the same thoughts,that i KNOW what to do,but i just can't get myself to do them,so i know the blame all lands on me. I also have thoughts like "its very possible some guy will just start talking to me in public and i wont have to work for it" so i would rather let it happen naturally than force it to happen by forcing myself to do something i wouldnt normally do to make it happen. And besides,don't things come to you easier and faster if you don't force it? The way i see it,i'm just trying to enjoy my life and let love happen when its naturally supposed to,i dont want to scare it away by chasing after it!

It's also kinda like this: would you rather do backbreaking physical labor for 12 hours a day,or would you rather sit back on your computer and earn the same amount of money in 2 hours? The choice is obvious.

I bet you also feel like why do we have to do this when it "just happens" for other people. It just isn't fair that some of us have to work harder and go out of our way to get something that just falls into other people's laps. So we don't want to give in to that.

[PokerEnthusiast]

Yeah I hear what ur saying Rockerchick!

There are so many of us with this problem. We all know what we need to do to make it better yet all we do is complain about it.

I liked your backbreaking labour analogy. I also kinda think of the whole thing this way: Its like we all have an addiction of some sort - like alcoholics do. The alcoholic knows he has a drinking problem. He sees so many people around him that are living happily because they don't have this problem. And he knows that if he just stops drinking, he could be just like all these other people. It sounds SO EASY!!! but in reality it can seem like the hardest thing in the world to do because there is something inside of you that does not want to let you change.

You know what really pisses me off. I am like 99% sure that over the next week if I were to approach 10 different girls at my school and start talking to them, I would be able to get a phone number and/or date from AT LEAST one of them. I really believe this! So why don't I do it? - Because I make excuses not to, so I don't have to feel nervous about it.

That's all it is. It's about us not wanting to feel nervous or out of our comfort zone. And those feelings overpower our desire to socialize and meet new people.

(btw, I think we kinda hijacked this thread and changed the topic. lol sorry OP)

[funchy]

As a woman, I really don't understand why any man would be ashamed to admit he's a virgin. I have a lot more respect for a 30 yr old virgin than a 20 yr old man-slut who's had dozens of conquests. I think it's really sweet, and I'd go out of my way to earn his respect than some player.

Here is a thing some people don't understand: having sex does not teach you to be better at satisfying the other partner. Some of the best lovers are those who were more selective about who they shared it with and who want to make each encounter mean something.

And in some ways, it's better to be with a virgin, if you plan to have more than a one night stand. They're not as likely to be hung up on preconceived notions or emotional baggage from past bad experiences.

Never be ashamed about being selective. Never apologize to anyone. If the woman can't deal with this information, she was never worth your time in the first place.

[JimOfferman]

Originally Posted by Erock

Wow way to shut down what I thought was a good idea.

Well, it was a pretty poor idea. You're basically telling him to make up a lie he doesn't believe in just so he can get some sex. I can all but guarantee you that the lie will make life not easier but more difficult for him.

I was just trying to find him a good excuse for why he's never had sex so that it can come off smoothly when he meets women.

He doesn't need such an excuse! You're not weird if you haven't had sex yet at 20 or 30, in fact, you're not even a minority.

Not to be mean at all, but there are some very negative societal assumptions about men who haven't had sex in their 20s, and most women (not those that are on these forums) will immediately assume those unless he has a good reason (which I gave him).

How do you know? Have you interviewed "most" women? All 3 billion of them? No, you're just making assumptions here. You're mindlessly repeating what "everybody else" is saying as if it were truth, just because "everybody else" is saying it.

Snap out of it!

I understand where he's coming from and I think this sort of thing is especially taxing for men because so much of a man's ego is tied into how well he can relate to women. I didn't kiss a girl until I was 19, and I found it extremely difficult to live with at times.

Making up excuses for yourself doesn't make it easier to relate to women (or men, for that matter), it just makes it harder. Being honest and genuine, on the other hand, works pretty darn well.

If I were to stroll over to a nice lady in a bar and tell her "hiya, honey, I would just love to have sex with you!" I would have a much bigger chance of taking her home than when I'd make the excuse of "listen dear, I'm still a virgin because I wanted to remain so until I was married, but now I'm desperate so, please, do me!" Here's the reason why: the first line shows my interest in her, while the second is basically me telling her that I need her to get my fix. If that doesn't earn me a kick in the groin, I don't know what will...

Here is the real truth for men: Unless you are very fortunate you will NEVER be given girls. Girls will never fall into your lap. Don't believe any of the hype that somehow you will meet the girl of your dreams without doing anything.

No argument there. Well, maybe just that I don't believe there is a hype that says you'll get girls without doing anything (at least not on this forum).

However, I really don't think that lying is part of a good strategy for how you get the girl of your dreams. Heck, I don't think that lying is a good strategy for anything in life.

Be honest, be you.

[Pequod]

Originally Posted by funchy

Here is a thing some people don't understand: having sex does not teach you to be better at satisfying the other partner. Some of the best lovers are those who were more selective about who they shared it with and who want to make each encounter mean something.

Good to point this out! The right attitude (in combination with some knowledge) is much more important than a ton of experience. A teacher about sexuality for man I know always says:"Being a masterful lover is not about experience, it is about knowledge and beliefs"

Originally Posted by funchy

Never be ashamed about being selective. Never apologize to anyone. If the woman can't deal with this information, she was never worth your time in the first place.

Amen. Be proud of who you are.

[David21]

Originally Posted by Rockchick26

This entire post could have been written by me! Not that its a good thing there are so many of us with this problem,but its reassuring in a way because we know we're not alone. I have the same thoughts,that i KNOW what to do,but i just can't get myself to do them,so i know the blame all lands on me. I also have thoughts like "its very possible some guy will just start talking to me in public and i wont have to work for it" so i would rather let it happen naturally than force it to happen by forcing myself to do something i wouldnt normally do to make it happen. And besides,don't things come to you easier and faster if you don't force it? The way i see it,i'm just trying to enjoy my life and let love happen when its naturally supposed to,i dont want to scare it away by chasing after it!

It's also kinda like this: would you rather do backbreaking physical labor for 12 hours a day,or would you rather sit back on your computer and earn the same amount of money in 2 hours? The choice is obvious.

I bet you also feel like why do we have to do this when it "just happens" for other people. It just isn't fair that some of us have to work harder and go out of our way to get something that just falls into other people's laps. So we don't want to give in to that.

Pokerenthusiast, Rockchick - I felt a weight lift from me when I read your posts. For so long now I've just been waiting, convincing myself that 'it will just happen' and it never has. However, I am a spiritual person so I do believe that things happen for a reason. And I do believe that I am meant to be with someone, even if that does sound too sentimental and soppy!

I am slowly changing my life so maybe changes such as those I have dreamed about all these years will in turn follow. For example, last night I went to a friends party - the first real party I have been to in years! All my previous friends were not the sort to host parties, anyway, it was amazing! Unfortunately I didn't find 'the one' and instead I had to put up with the fact that my friend got intimate and close to someone and I didn't but it felt good anyway. Perhaps this is the type of thing I need to be doing to meet the one I'm meant to be with? Trouble is, I always thought I'd meet my soulmate in a library or something.

I agree with you rockchick, you shouldn't pursue love with everything you have but at the same time you do need to create the circumstances in your life that would allow your dreams entry, if you know what I mean?

Seeing other people together, showing their affection for one another leaves a burning emptiness in my core, but I just try and hold on to the dream that that will be me one day. Day by day, I am trying to open myself up to the possibility that I may meet a partner and it certainly helps to know that I am not the only one in the world feeling this. I'm sure things will be great eventually!

[white]

I feel something like david21 and pokerenthusiast. I see couples all the time and I'm wondering if I'm gonna be like them. When I see hot girls/women on the streets I'm so depressed I can't have them (or I think I can't have them).
I dig my hole by neglecting my problem - that is not find a girlfriend(s) years ago. which I'm going to have to now, but it will probably not be easy.
I think I got this problem because I have social anxiety (phobia), low self confidence, I'm introvert... and so on. I couldn't attract girls and just gave up.
The thing is if the potential girlfriend asks me about my past relationships and stuff I'll say "I'm virgin".. I think it will be just too weird, because I'm 30, and then she'll probably tell all her girlfriends and I'll feel like an idiot.
I mean what if I get to know women and let's say she's 38 and she tells me she's virgin. I don't know what would I think of that.. that she's probably messed up in her head. (like I am )

[JimOfferman]

Originally Posted by white

The thing is if the potential girlfriend asks me about my past relationships and stuff I'll say "I'm virgin".. I think it will be just too weird, because I'm 30, and then she'll probably tell all her girlfriends and I'll feel like an idiot.

You may think that, but it's not true.

Why do I know? Because I've had the conversation a whole bunch of times.

[Rockchick26]

Originally Posted by David21

Pokerenthusiast, Rockchick - I felt a weight lift from me when I read your posts. For so long now I've just been waiting, convincing myself that 'it will just happen' and it never has. However, I am a spiritual person so I do believe that things happen for a reason. And I do believe that I am meant to be with someone, even if that does sound too sentimental and soppy!

Well that made me smile! I'm glad you got a good reaction out of reading my posts,from what i understand that doesn't happen too often LOL

I am slowly changing my life so maybe changes such as those I have dreamed about all these years will in turn follow. For example, last night I went to a friends party - the first real party I have been to in years! All my previous friends were not the sort to host parties, anyway, it was amazing! Unfortunately I didn't find 'the one' and instead I had to put up with the fact that my friend got intimate and close to someone and I didn't but it felt good anyway. Perhaps this is the type of thing I need to be doing to meet the one I'm meant to be with? Trouble is, I always thought I'd meet my soulmate in a library or something.

WOW...we are so alike! I have always dreamed i'd meet my soulmate in a place like that too,i dont usually think of it happening in a bar or at a party. But yet,i,like you,once in a while do something that and i usually end up feeling kinda crappy afterwards. Tonight i went to the bar with a friend who was meeting another friend there,and usually when i'm with those girls,i get ignored. So i wasnt looking forward to it and i almost had her drop me off at home,but i thought 'no i should go,you never know what will happen!' Well it was the most boring night EVER. I wont go into details but it just sucked and i had her bring me home before wasting my entire night there. Of course,i sat home by myself the rest of the night,but i gave it a shot and it didnt work out so i cut my losses.

I agree with you rockchick, you shouldn't pursue love with everything you have but at the same time you do need to create the circumstances in your life that would allow your dreams entry, if you know what I mean?

Yes,thats why i gave the bar a chance tonight. But it rarely pays off.

[Rockchick26]

Originally Posted by white

I mean what if I get to know women and let's say she's 38 and she tells me she's virgin. I don't know what would I think of that.. that she's probably messed up in her head. (like I am )

This sparked a thought process in my head. It actually goes much deeper than the virgin thing but i can't change the thread direction here so i'll post seperately about it. But basically its about that last sentence you said; You would think a girl who is a virgin is messed up in the head...yet you are too,so,youre kinda rejecting her for being the same thing you are,that you hate. So you can ONLY hook up with girls who arent virgins,but then they wont hook up with you cuz you ARE one! Its like a catch 22,a conundrum,a vicious cycle that you cant get out of.

[David21]

Well that made me smile! I'm glad you got a good reaction out of reading my posts,from what i understand that doesn't happen too often LOL

You should have more confidence in yourself, Rockchick but, having said that, I realize it is easier said than done.

WOW...we are so alike! I have always dreamed i'd meet my soulmate in a place like that too,i dont usually think of it happening in a bar or at a party.

I'd always hoped it would be reflective of their nature i.e. if I find them in a library or some other quiet place they are more likely to be quiet in nature, kind and not into multiple partners. It's the worst stereotype and absolutely isn't true but I can't help sometimes associating people at clubs. pubs and parties as those how would be unfamiliar with commitment.

but i thought 'no i should go,you never know what will happen!'

I've had this kind of optimism for years! 'It might happen', I say 'you never know'. I just cling on to hope. But I guess there is some truth in it - it really could happen anywhere. I went to a party the other night myself. My friend met someone but I didn't. It felt awful but I still held on to hope. What else could i do? I wouldn't force anything to happen because that's not what I want but at the same time I have to open situations in my life that will give me a chance.

Yes,thats why i gave the bar a chance tonight. But it rarely pays off.

It rarely pays off for me either. Somehow, though and for some reason I just keep on going with the idea that tomorrow is another day. But that's the thing with me, I have had opportunities in my life but I always held back because in my heart I felt that it wasn't right. My friend tells me I should take more of these opportunities but I just can't. I don't want to share these moments with just any one. I need it to be the right person - surely that is not wrong?

[Rockchick26]

Originally Posted by David21

You should have more confidence in yourself, Rockchick but, having said that, I realize it is easier said than done.

Well,to me,confidence is something i can easily have regarding something that i get good results with. but if i don't get good results,then i know there is no reason for confidence. For example,i have confidence to sing karaoke (even when sober!) cuz i love music and i love to sing and most of the time i do a good job,i've only really sucked at it twice,but 2 times out of 30 or 40 is very good! So therefore i do have confidence in that. As well as my job,i always do a wonderful job and i know i'm a better worker and better at my job than most of the other people who do it,so i have boatloads of confidence there.

But i dont have confidence when it comes to dating because i have never once gotten to date a guy that i liked,it was always the guy coming after me and i felt forced to date them. I never got the guys i wanted,i had to settle for the guys that liked me. And i lack confidence in my communication skills because it is a FACT that i suck at talking and 99% of the time i embarrass myself and i hate the way i talk yet its so hard to change (impossible,so far).

So yeah i have no problem with confidence,if its something i am good at and something i get good results from.

I'd always hoped it would be reflective of their nature i.e. if I find them in a library or some other quiet place they are more likely to be quiet in nature, kind and not into multiple partners. It's the worst stereotype and absolutely isn't true but I can't help sometimes associating people at clubs. pubs and parties as those how would be unfamiliar with commitment.

I understand,and i feel the same way! And every time i go in a bar,i'm reminded of this,and within 10 minutes i want to go home. At least if you meet someone in a library or something,you arent expected to go home together after closing time LOL

I've had this kind of optimism for years! 'It might happen', I say 'you never know'. I just cling on to hope. But I guess there is some truth in it - it really could happen anywhere. I went to a party the other night myself. My friend met someone but I didn't. It felt awful but I still held on to hope. What else could i do? I wouldn't force anything to happen because that's not what I want but at the same time I have to open situations in my life that will give me a chance.

Yep,me too! And i cant help but feel like for other people this works but for me it doesn't. I know i'm just too picky with guys though,i always want the ones that i want and not the ones that end up wanting me (the ones lower on the ladder...if you are familiar with the Ladder Theory,from my other posts)

It rarely pays off for me either. Somehow, though and for some reason I just keep on going with the idea that tomorrow is another day.

I have this same undying hope,and you'd think that would be good for something but apparently hope is not a major factor in finding love LOL

But that's the thing with me, I have had opportunities in my life but I always held back because in my heart I felt that it wasn't right. My friend tells me I should take more of these opportunities but I just can't. I don't want to share these moments with just any one. I need it to be the right person - surely that is not wrong?

No its not wrong,i'm the same way. I've had many opportunities too,in fact just today i got 2 messages on Myspace from 2 guys saying i was a "babe". Now i could date them but my first reaction is "ugh,a babe!? why dont guys ever think with their BRAINS for once,its the first message and theyre already commenting on my looks!" I mean,i'm attracted to hot guys too but i would NEVER call them "gorgeous" or "babe" or "sexy" right off the bat!

[David21]

Well,to me,confidence is something i can easily have regarding something that i get good results with. but if i don't get good results,then i know there is no reason for confidence. For example,i have confidence to sing karaoke (even when sober!) cuz i love music and i love to sing and most of the time i do a good job,i've only really sucked at it twice,but 2 times out of 30 or 40 is very good! So therefore i do have confidence in that. As well as my job,i always do a wonderful job and i know i'm a better worker and better at my job than most of the other people who do it,so i have boatloads of confidence there.

Well, I can certainly see your point. I think a person estimates their own self-worth by how others treat them, speak with them and value them and if this is not something you have had much of then your confidence will be at rock bottom. I know mine is!

But i dont have confidence when it comes to dating because i have never once gotten to date a guy that i liked,it was always the guy coming after me and i felt forced to date them. I never got the guys i wanted,i had to settle for the guys that liked me. And i lack confidence in my communication skills because it is a FACT that i suck at talking and 99% of the time i embarrass myself and i hate the way i talk yet its so hard to change (impossible,so far).

I kinda know how you feel in this respect because I too lack the ability to verbally communicate with skill, or at least, not at first anyway. I always stammer and mix my words up in my sentences - its really annoying because people interpret it wrongly. Once a person gets to know me I find that I start to open up and talk well. Admittedly, I do still have this stammer occasionally but it is nothing like what it is when I first talk to someone.

Yep,me too! And i cant help but feel like for other people this works but for me it doesn't. I know i'm just too picky with guys though,i always want the ones that i want and not the ones that end up wanting me (the ones lower on the ladder...if you are familiar with the Ladder Theory,from my other posts)

Is it that you are too picky or that you know who is right for you? I've wondered whether I am too picky but then I realize that I just know what is right for me and what is not. Perhaps you're the same?

I've had many opportunities too,in fact just today i got 2 messages on Myspace from 2 guys saying i was a "babe". Now i could date them but my first reaction is "ugh,a babe!? why dont guys ever think with their BRAINS for once,its the first message and theyre already commenting on my looks!" I mean,i'm attracted to hot guys too but i would NEVER call them "gorgeous" or "babe" or "sexy" right off the bat!

Yeah, I wouldn't do that personally, but don't take that kind of thing too seriously because you're liable to get hurt. Try and meet people who don't refer to you as 'babe' upon first seeing you - it's more likely an indication of how much respect they will have for you.