Lack of Intimacy

[spookie149]

Hey everyone! New to these forums! Hope to be around for a while! I have been reading a bit and was impressed by the advice given. Hope some thoughts can be shared with me on my situation.

My boyfriend and I have been dating for about 7 or 8 months now. We met on a student exchange in Jan. We met while we were dating other people (also met on exchange) and became good friends. Both of our respective relationships fizzled out and we started dating. For the rest of our time overseas, we spent every waking moment (and much of the time, even our time sleeping) together.

We came back to our respective cities here in Canada after the semester ended. I flew out to visit him for 2 weeks in the summer and we went on a road trip for a month across the country in August. He is in Europe now for another exchange until Christmas Eve, at which point he flies to me for the holidays.

Our relationship has been great. When we are together it's perfect. He is the ying to my yang and vice versa. However, I feel like we are stuck in the early stages of our relationship. He is not very emotionally intimate with me. He avoids talking about feelings and the past like the plague. Someone asked me how well I knew him, and I said about a 3 or a 4 out of 10. I want him to open up and confide in me but he won't. When we talk, I share a lot about what I'm thinking/feeling and he wants to listen and provide advice (which is great and I value it.) However, he talks to me about things you would a friend (ie, job application stuff, traveling, news, or wants to know about me). He is introverted, whereas I am extroverted. That being said, the talking between us is usually split 50/50.

The most feelings I get from him is when he sends me the odd text message that says "I miss you...a tad." Or "I miss your smelly feet." It's like he dangles his feet in the pool of emotions then jumps right back out! They're so rare I crave them, though they're obviously not the most romantic words in the world. It seems that we're months or even years away from saying I love you.

I see him not opening up to me as way of not being emotionally committed in our relationship. Is it fear of rejection? Past relationship issues? I've tried to get to the bottom of it, but I read a book that digging will make men feel more pressure and retreat further. He told me previously that he wasn't sure if he has ever been in love, though he dated his first gf for 3 years in high school (and told me he broke up with her) and his second for a year in university. When I tried digging last week, he finally let it slip that his first gf "really ****ed him up" then he had to go right away and would not elaborate. I didn't push it because I figured he didn't want me to.

I should add we're both in our early 20's and graduating this spring. With out him opening up to me, I have started feeling reluctant to open up with him myself. We are both in the process of looking for jobs after graduation, but he doesn't like talking about the future. Since we live in different cities, obviously we need to coordinate it if we plan to be together in the spring. This has been the source of many arguments the last 2 weeks (instigated by me). He says we both need to apply to wherever it is we want to and we'll make those big moving decisions later when we're actually offered jobs. This dancing around is making me sick!

From the amount of time we talk with one another (usually daily for at least an hour or more on Skype) and the manner in which he looks after me I know he cares about me. He has told me nobody understands him like I do. I care about him and want to be there for him but he's not letting me in! I think he is afraid of rejection. One would avoid talking about the future with a bf/gf if you didn't see yourself with that person. However, we're doing long-distance. If you don't see yourself with that person in the future, why would you bother doing a long-distance relationship? The immediate gratification from sex is not provided, so clearly what we have is more than that.

One more thing- he is Asian and I am Caucasian. Could there be a cultural difference relative to intimacy? This is the first time for both of us dating someone outside our race.

Can anyone provide me with advice or another perspective I'm not seeing? Thanks so much!

[WordKeeper]

He has told me nobody understands him like I do. I care about him and want to be there for him but he's not letting me in!

I think you answer is contained in these two sentences. Nobody understands him better than you, but do YOU understand him? How could you when he doesn't really open up to you? THAT says a lot to me.

He's not letting you in!!! Is that really the kind of relationship you want?

Let me tell you from experience - it does not get better than the early months - it can get stronger and more solid but it doesn't get better. If you are not sharing intimately now - just wait until you get into the mundane....

This is the question I have for you to ask yourself, "Why am I afraid of letting him go?" Are you afraid there won't be another? Are you afraid of being alone? Did you have a timeline in mind and time is running out?

He does not sound right - even to you - why is it you won't let him go and find the one who connects on an intimate level? Can you be honest with yourself?

[eskimo]

Well spookie, I grew up with a culturally Asian orientation and I can tell you that the way I was conditioned was to focus more on developing and exercising my intelligence and less on understanding and expressing my emotions. The expression of emotions is suppressed (perhaps as a sign of weakness) especially among men and a young guy who grew up with that conditioning is not going to feel comfortable opening up and making himself vulnerable, especially to a woman of another background who's constantly yearning for him to open up even more.

Like the other poster mentioned, you're going to have to decide whether this guy will be able to ultimately give you what you need - he may not be ready for the level of emotional intimacy that you are.

In any case, you may want to seek the counsel of some biculturally sensitive women who are well-versed in the Asian culture who can help you sort out some of these issues and questions with greater depth.

Hope this helps. Take care of yourself.

[sepiagal]

Having sex too early in the relationship can make the emotional intimacy harder. Getting naked with a stranger can make people less likely to open up emotionally.

Its only been 7 or 8 months. It takes time for intimacy and trust to develop. I think you have unrealistic expectations. You need to take it slow; get to know each other more. Focus on getting to know each other more and less on knowing how he feels about his past, etc.

You might be pushing him away being so touchy-feely with him. Most times in a relationship you can get something NOT by being direct. Asking him to share about his feelings might make him more guarded.

Try to enjoy just spending time together and not having a deeply intimate relationship. Forcing the intimacy thing, sharing and talking about emotions too often may turn him off. He is a guy so don't expect him to act like your BFF.

If you really want a guy who is more touchy-feely then you may be with the wrong person. But too much intimacy too early on can also be a bad thing. Trust doesn't happen overnight; it builds over time. So does intimacy.

One simple thing you might try when you are together is to kiss with (both of) your eyes open. Closing your eyes takes you of the experience of who you are with. Also making love and acheiving orgasm with your eyes open is another simple way of increasing intimacy. But having an orgasm is one of the most vulnerable experiences you can share with someone. So having sex too early in the relationship can inhibit the intimacy. But if you wait until you have an emotional bond then you can enjoy sex with a deeper intimacy by being more present in the experience by actually looking at each other during the best part (also most intimate and vulnerable part). This isn't easy to do though. You should wait to do the open eyes during sex. But try kissing with your eyes open.

[WordKeeper]

I agree with Sepiagal that sexual intimacy before an emotional intimacy can work against a strong relationship but I disagree with the rest. 7 or 8 months is a significant period for any relationship to develop intimately. And kissing with eyes open is merely distracting. Closed eyes allows heightening the other sensations - small, tactile, etc.

[spookie149]

Ya we started the sexual pretty early on. But we started as friends for a few months first?

Been talking to some friends and they also think 7-8 months intimacy should start happening more. However, they also think I shouldn't pressure him. So how to encourage more intimacy?

[crescive]

I don't agree with anything sepiagal says, except maybe the kissing and having sex with open eyes thing which can be nice, but I think you can do that whenever you feel comfortable, there doesn't need to be a specific timeline. Also, there is no evidence that sex too early on will jeopardize the intimacy of the relationship. This is definitely a sexist myth that I've heard way too many times before. You really need to judge the character of the person you're with and try to understand him as an individual before you assume that he will be that stereotype of the guy who does not want intimacy because they already have had sex with you. That is just absurd. Sex is always better with intimacy and even guys agree with that. What guy does not want better, more uninhibited, wild, loving sex?

Anyways, I think what you should do is speak outright about the lack of closeness you feel with him in regards to knowing him deeper than just his day-to-day. It will be difficult, I once dated a guy who was pretty emotional detached and reserved about his feelings but I managed to break through with him after enough talks and breaking up with him many times due to his lack of showing he cared. You should just say exactly what you said, that you feel a lack of closeness to him because he never shows that he cares or speak affectionately with you. It's not true that guys will pull away if you do that unless he really just didn't like you all that much and that is the reason why he's being unresponsive. However, from what it seems to me, it seems like he does like you a lot but just has hangups and is definitely afraid of rejection. I think with this knowledge you should be confident in approaching this issue with him. Ask him why he isn't letting you in on his feelings and what you can do to make him feel more comfortable with it. He could be afraid of pushing you away and that's why he is reserved about his feelings because they are actually very strong. You should let him know that you value him and his thoughts and feelings and that you think a relationship is best when both people are very honest about their emotions and are open to sharing all their thoughts and feelings.

Trust me, you should definitely bring it up. I've been there and you will need to persist, it might get better after a good talk and then another incident will come along and they will act nonchalant again and you will have to have another talk with him but do it, he will appreciate how much you take charge and that you won't accept anything less than the best and it will make him work harder to be in a relationship with you. If after all that pushing he still doesn't open up it could be that the strong feelings just aren't there or that his hangups are too deep to resolve right away so you will have to make the judgement call on continuing to try or to leave him. Good luck, I hope everything works out well!

[sepiagal]

There's an expression - Men give love to get sex and women give sex to get love.

Men want physical closeness and women want emotional closeness.

He's got what he wants but you don't have what you want.

If you want to believe that asking a man to love you is all you have to do then good luck.

You had sex with him before he even opened up to you. Think about the next BF and maybe not having sex until he volunteers those three little words. (Don't tell him that you will only sleep with him after he expresses his love for you. Just tell him you don't think you know each other well enough to have sex.) Then you'll both be happy in the relationship. And you won't ever doubt his love and respect for you.

Or, you can continue to feel frustrated in your relationships.

If you want him to love you and show it you have to show him that you love and respect yourself first.

Easy sex for a guy means its easy to blow off the tough stuff - the intimacy. Make a guy work for something and he will value it by showing his appreciation for it.

[spookie149]

I think the sex before intimacy is very dependent on the guy. I don't doubt that our relationship has more to it than the sex. After all-we're apart for 3 or 4 months at a time. I understand your point however.

I spoke with him again today. He wanted to go sleep and think about it for a while. However, when we spoke later he talked to me about everything that ran through his head. I think he's trying. I guess I just need to be patient.

[estudiant9]

Originally Posted by spookie149

He is not very emotionally intimate with me. He avoids talking about feelings and the past like the plague. Someone asked me how well I knew him, and I said about a 3 or a 4 out of 10. I want him to open up and confide in me but he won't. When we talk, I share a lot about what I'm thinking/feeling and he wants to listen and provide advice (which is great and I value it.) However, he talks to me about things you would a friend (ie, job application stuff, traveling, news, or wants to know about me). He is introverted, whereas I am extroverted. That being said, the talking between us is usually split 50/50.

The most feelings I get from him is when he sends me the odd text message that says "I miss you...a tad." Or "I miss your smelly feet." It's like he dangles his feet in the pool of emotions then jumps right back out! They're so rare I crave them, though they're obviously not the most romantic words in the world. It seems that we're months or even years away from saying I love you.

I see him not opening up to me as way of not being emotionally committed in our relationship. Is it fear of rejection? Past relationship issues? I've tried to get to the bottom of it, but I read a book that digging will make men feel more pressure and retreat further. He told me previously that he wasn't sure if he has ever been in love, though he dated his first gf for 3 years in high school (and told me he broke up with her) and his second for a year in university. When I tried digging last week, he finally let it slip that his first gf "really ****ed him up" then he had to go right away and would not elaborate. I didn't push it because I figured he didn't want me to.

I should add we're both in our early 20's and graduating this spring. Without him opening up to me, I have started feeling reluctant to open up with him myself.

From the amount of time we talk with one another (usually daily for at least an hour or more on Skype) and the manner in which he looks after me I know he cares about me. He has told me nobody understands him like I do. I care about him and want to be there for him but he's not letting me in!

One more thing- he is Asian and I am Caucasian. Could there be a cultural difference relative to intimacy?

I think this thread has been dead for a while, but why not, I'll bump it.

Not to generalize, but I am an introverted Asian-American male in his early 20's who has been romantically involved with a Caucasian woman before, so perhaps I can provide a perspective that semi-simulates this gentleman's.

They say "Like attracts like" and also "Opposites attract." They are both so true. I think that virtually all social interactions we crave and find satisfying are either with people who reflect back to us what we have inside us, or with those who in some way complement us, fill us in where we're weak and act in ways that are somehow mysterious and even incomprehensible to us.

In the context of romantic relationships, I'd say extroverts are those who seek to figure others out and want to make everything crystal clear. Introverts, on the other hand, want to be figured out, made clear. They like to throw out puzzles with the understanding that someone out there hopefully has the brains to solve them. And when they find that someone, who tends to be an extrovert, they are thrilled, and throw out even more puzzles! Ironic, and even frustrating, but isn't that what allows us to be the yin to oppose your yang, and create the powerful sexual tension that we all crave in a relationship?

The truth is, if you feel that this guy probably loves you, you're probably right. Based on my experience and observations, the most common way an introverted guy loses a girl is by forcing the emotional disclosure - he sees that his loved one constantly seeks to emotionally connect with the part of himself that he's not comfortable with quite yet, so he tries his best and tells her things that he never found necessary to process emotionally. In the process his shame, guilt, and resentment that he's never come to terms with, come out and latch on to you (inadvertently of course), and, faced with this little monster of his dark side that comes out nowhere, you get upset and disappointed, and pull away. I wonder if, when he talked about how one of his ex's f'ed him up, this isn't exactly the type of thing he was mentioning. So yes, it is very much a fear of rejection if this is the case.

Obviously this is hard for you because you feel like you're not getting as much out of this guy as you're investing in him, when you deserve more. You're very patient and wise not to press on the issue too much, though. Ironically, the more you choose to be honest and open with him regardless of how he chooses to reciprocate, the more likely it is that he will realize that he has nothing to fear by opening himself up to you, because you're leading by example in showing that emotional intimacy is the most natural thing in the world between two people. Perhaps you might have to accept that, at least in the arena of emotional connection, you will, for the foreseeable future, have to be the one to initiate and lead.

I look back on my previous encounters with extroverted women who would continually express interest and seek to connect with me when I found it so frightening to reciprocate and continually pulled away, despite the fact that I also found them attractive. But I let the rope get too tight until finally they couldn't pull on it anymore, and finally let it go slack. I was an idiot to let that happen and I really try not to do that these days. My point is that, guys like us don't hang onto relationships casually, we're so fascinated by the potential that's there, and letting it all out in the span of a few months or even a few years would be such a mistake and a deal breaker.

So, hold on and try to take it easy! You're doing what you can, and if he doesn't give you what you deserve no matter how patient you are, it's his loss, and you'd be right to seek your happiness in someone else. Just give him some time to realize that, to the degree that you're willing.

[spookie149]

Thank you estudiant9!! Your insight was extremely helpful and reassuring.

About 3 weeks ago he was doing his emotional distancing cycle. That is, coming in, wanting to talk to me all the time, then pulling away and closing back up. He had a habit of prioritizing everything else and taking me for granted. I told him I wanted more, again, like I had been saying routinely for a month. He told me he wasn't sure if he wanted to change. He liked the way things were. Why can't we just keep things the way they are? I said I fell in love with him a few months ago, but at this rate I fear he's never going to be totally honest with me, let alone tell me he loves me. I told him that it wasn't good enough for me, and said it was over. He was shocked, and ask me to give him another chance. We talked for another few hours on the phone and I really let him know once and for all how this was making me feel. In the end, I relented and we stayed together.

I am pleased to say things are much better. He's opening up to me more. He told me over the summer that he used to like a friend of his before we met. He had not spoken to her since she started dating her ex again. As well, he hasn't spoken to his ex-gf since the last time they bumped into one another. Last week he told me out of the blue he sent them both messages on facebook to see how they were doing. I asked one or two questions, but let him lead the conversation before he went to bed. I asked him if he had been avoiding talking to them because he was worried about developing feelings for them again. He told me yes. He had to go right away after. I felt great! I think it was his way of telling me he has starting seeing me very seriously and he no longer has those fears. Then Thurs, he told me over the phone, "I just want you to know....how much... I like you." I was smiling the whole weekend! I still haven't said I love you. I'd really like him to say it first.