Disappointed man

[sbdiane]

I'm in a relationship with a man who can best be described as disappointed. He's a very nice man with lots of talents. Most people really like him. He's a natural leader, funny and smart. But he's not happy.

His job sucks, his house takes up all his time fixing and paying for it, he would like to take trips and get outdoors more but turns down opportunities all the time. Being outdoors is the only place I ever see him light up, smile, become his true self. That outdoors guy is who I wanted to be with.

I want to help him but I don't know what to say. I have suggested that we could scale back and live more simply, give up the house, move somewhere cheaper. I have tried to remind him that he has many talents that can be used in all kinds of industries, not just the ones he knows. Nothing cheers him up.

He worries about his health all the time. He takes a lot of prescriptions. I'm sure almost all of them would be unnecessary if he didn't work so hard at that stressful job.

I really want him to be happy, but he doesn't seem to want that for himself. I've been just trying to live my life as happily as I can, doing outdoors things without him, pursuing dreams and goals on my own. I hope some day he will join me in happiness, but without turning all codependent, I have no idea what to do. How can I help him?

[Paradox13]

Have you sat down and had a proper deep and meaningful? has he poured his heart out on the table... if not do that... dig deep for the root of his problems but sadly enough... you cannot help someone that wont help them self - or has a desire to help them self

[Call me Boges]

It is hard to help someone who doesnt want to help themselves...

edit - paradox beat me to it.

[Paradox13]

haha great minds think alike

[Lauxa]

I think you just have to focus on your own happiness and then you will see that it creates ripples of happiness around you as well. In an SR model, he would be mirroring some disappointment you have in your own life. This article of Steve's explains this perspective:

Understanding Human Relationships

Even if it's not "true", it's probably the best outlook you can take on. You have zero power to solve his disappointment, but 100% power to solve your own.

PS - Also try not to do or say anything to reinforce his disappointment. Never tell him that his job sucks or he is unhappy for example. Best not to tell others either. Words have power. If you want to make observations about him, try using the strategy of Negative affirmations and state things as "not-positive", such as "he is not happy" or "he doesn't have a fulfilling job" or "we don't get outdoors enough".

[Angela]

Originally Posted by sbdiane

I really want him to be happy, but he doesn't seem to want that for himself. I've been just trying to live my life as happily as I can, doing outdoors things without him, pursuing dreams and goals on my own. I hope some day he will join me in happiness, but without turning all codependent, I have no idea what to do. How can I help him?

Here's how you can help him: stay in your own business and stop trying to change him. Accept him exactly as he is and exactly as he isn't, and choose to either stay in the relationship with this man exactly as he is and exactly as he isn't, or let him go. Right now, with your attachment to him being other than what he is, you are generating No Freedom for him and also for yourself! Set yourself free, and choose happiness for yourself if that's what you want to do, and grant him the freedom to choose his own way of being. Then stay or leave. But quit being such a bossy boots. (that actually might cheer him up. )

It's tough, I know; but not everyone chooses happiness, and it's not our job to say they *should.* Too bad we're not in charge, huh?

[sbdiane]

I don't boss him around. Not at all. I'll say hey, there's this great thing happening this weekend. Wanna come? When he says no I say OK and then I go without him.

I think he is jealous of me. He makes a lot of little mean comments. I ignore them. I don't want him to make me be as unhappy as he is. He's been calling me a hobo lately because I don't have a job and spent the summer backpacking. Now home, I'm busy with volunteer work, a part time job, starting my own freelancing business and in the middle of the interview process for a full-time, high-paying job. I'm not a hobo.

I think his mean comments are because he feels stuck in a disappointing life and can't see a way out. I want him to be happy like he used to be, but I can't even talk to him about it. There was a time I was really depressed and he kicked me in the pants to go get help. I can't even bring myself to do the same for him.

[carenkh]

Oy - Just the title reminded me of my ex-husband! I used to call him Eeyore - he could sound exactly like him!

I knew his personality; I knew he was basically unhappy. (And it's funny, he wakes up outdoors, as well!) When we first got together, and after we'd been married a while, I realized exactly what Angela was saying - I really didn't need him to be on board with being happy, I could focus on what brought me to life. A quote I would tell myself was, "Those who are saying it can't be done shouldn't interrupt those who are doing it." I tried to see where he was mirroring for me, but wasn't really able to at that time. We were mostly happy together - but over time, I saw that I was dreaming less, reaching for less. It's one of the main reasons we separated - it was wearing me down, being married to someone like that!

A couple weekends ago, at a retreat, we did an exercise where we planned a party. We got in groups of two, and one person was to be the idea person, and the other person was to be the "yes, but" person. For every idea - "Let's have cake!" the person had to give a yes, but: "Yes, but frosting can be messy." It really shut people down! They wanted to stop giving ideas, because what was the point? Then we did it again, with the second person answering, "Yes, and": "Let's have cake!" "Yes, and everyone can help decorate it!" The energy shift was incredible.

I realized after that, that my ex was a "yes, but" kinda guy! And I can now see where he's mirroring that for me - but I still don't want to be married to him!

That exercise is also in Improv Wisdom. The author of that book was attending the retreat, as well - what a gift to meet her!

[Angela]

Originally Posted by sbdiane

I don't boss him around. Not at all.

Look closer: you don't boss him around out loud, but who you are being is a bossy boots. What you are wanting is that he be other than that what he is:

I want him to be happy like he used to be, but I can't even talk to him about it.

You've noticed that he doesn't seem to want to be happy, and yet your beingness is insistence that he be happy regardless of what he wants, even if you never say anything about it. Don't you think that's a bit bossy? It's hard, as I mentioned, because you and I both know that being happy feels good, and of course we want our beloved to feel good. But the only thing that you generate by being this way is unhappiness and frustration for yourself.

I'm not saying you're doing anything wrong -- I'm just saying it's ineffective to try to make someone happy against their will. Even if he wants you to make him happy, it's just not your job; it's his. You can help him be happy, though, if that's what he wants (but it doesn't seem like that's the case here.)

I don't want him to make me be as unhappy as he is.

The reverse is true, too -- he can't make you unhappy; you must agree to it.

Listen, you're a happy and positive person; you've got a talent for being happy! This is a great opportunity, this relationship, for you to really hone that talent regardless of his actions. It might mean refusing to take the stinky sneaker of his unhappiness, as our dear friend Rose of Cairo puts it. It might mean reducing the amount of time you spend with him, or it might mean really turning up the volume of your own joy so that his gloom is insignificant by comparison. It might mean leaving him, or it might mean staying and really taking on a huge lesson for yourself in being a Happiness Generator.

I have every confidence that you'll take terrific and inspiring action here.


p.s.... you might want to take on boldly looking for your own inner truth of how you are mirroring here: try switching it around, Byron Katie style, and see what you see --

Disappointed woman.
My boyfriend is in a relationship with a woman who can best be described as disappointed. She's a very nice woman with lots of talents. Most people really like her. She's a natural leader, funny and smart. But she's not happy.

[metamorph]

I am not sure what you mean by disappointed. Is he suffering from true depression? The pondering about health problems: could there be something serious about his health that you may not know? Is he in a kind of mid-life crisis? For the latter I think the best you can do is to give him all your love and true presence. Hopefully, this will improve with time.

[SomeRandomGuy]

When I first read this I had to make sure the OP wasn't my wife :-) Ok, that isn't exactly true, because I'm not like that now. The similarities to how I was 1 year ago, though, are eerie. I was over-stressed from my job, I worked 60+ hours per week, I always was connected to work (via cell phone, Blackberry, etc). The only times I felt truly at peace was when I was hiking or camping, but I rarely did those things.

Strangely, what helped me to change was a bad situation at work. There was a change in management that immediately made me hate my job. I cut my hours back almost right away, and began focusing on other areas of my life (because with the new management I found I no longer cared about the job). I now have a new job without the stress and hours of the old one, plus I realize I want to have a life outside of work. I am much happier now than I have ever been. I make time to do the things I love, and try not to let work have a negative impact on me. I have realized that I do want a simpler life (like the one you offered to your husband). I hope to move out to the country and start scaling down my material wants/needs over the next few years.

Unfortunately, I have no idea what it might take to trigger the same sort of realization in your husband. I suspect that is very different for everyone. The scary part (at least in my situation) is that I thought I was happy. When I look back, though, I realize that I was far from it.

[Marth]

Originally Posted by sbdiane

I'm in a relationship with a man who can best be described as disappointed. He's a very nice man with lots of talents. Most people really like him. He's a natural leader, funny and smart. But he's not happy.

His job sucks, his house takes up all his time fixing and paying for it, he would like to take trips and get outdoors more but turns down opportunities all the time. Being outdoors is the only place I ever see him light up, smile, become his true self. That outdoors guy is who I wanted to be with.

I want to help him but I don't know what to say. I have suggested that we could scale back and live more simply, give up the house, move somewhere cheaper. I have tried to remind him that he has many talents that can be used in all kinds of industries, not just the ones he knows. Nothing cheers him up.

He worries about his health all the time. He takes a lot of prescriptions. I'm sure almost all of them would be unnecessary if he didn't work so hard at that stressful job.

I really want him to be happy, but he doesn't seem to want that for himself. I've been just trying to live my life as happily as I can, doing outdoors things without him, pursuing dreams and goals on my own. I hope some day he will join me in happiness, but without turning all codependent, I have no idea what to do. How can I help him?

This holds true for a majority of men, trust me. In a position they don't want, but persist through it anyways. Never growing significantly because they are stuck in this society, bound by financial needs.

"The mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation." -Henry W. Thoreau

This still holds very true today.

[sbdiane]

I'm glad you all understand.

I do believe he is depressed. When I met him he was on medication but switched to another one because of sexual side-effects. I don't think the one he switched to ever really worked. And now he takes so many meds he's got to be compromised some way. Maybe he just can't see that it isn't working.

Yes, he's just like Eyore. It's like "how was your day?" I say great. He just sighs with his head hanging and his shoulders drooping.

Oh well. I guess I'll just keep working away at my own life. I don't know how much more I can take. I was hoping not to take the full-time job if possible, so I could work on my freelancing, but I'm thinking now I might need a way out soon, a back-up plan. Although, I think I might be ready to move to a new town if that happened. I've lived where I am all my life.

[Angela]

What would make you deliriously happy, sbdiane, that wouldn't require any action from him, I mean. What would be present in your own life, regardless of anyone else's, that would really light you up and have you leaping out of bed to greet the day?

[sbdiane]

Deliriously happy? Long distance backpacking. That is what I did this summer. It was life transforming. I want to go back and finish the trail and do other trails and live that lifestyle forever. It was a dream I had for 33 years and I finally went out there and did it for 3 months and it was like finally being who I was meant to be.

But I can't do it all the time because it is seasonal and obviously doesn't earn any money. So the next best thing is to carve out some kind of life that makes long distance backpacking possible. It is not really clear to me whether it would be better to work for myself so I had more control over my time, or to commodotize my full-time career. Work for a few years, save lots of money, quit, hike, go back and work etc. I'm hoping freelancing will be the way because I've really had it with cubicle life and freelancing kind of feels like a new trail in life to follow. It gets me excited. But cubicle life is calling because I have skills in demand and the siren song of earning and saving a ton of money for more backpacking is aluring.

Perhaps the problem we have is that work is pretty much all he does anymore even though they treat him horribly at his job and he hates it. Work is the center of his life. He is working right now at 8:30 on a Tuesday night. He manages people in India and China and so he's on the phone with them now. Sometimes he's on the phone at 6 AM.

But with my long distance adventure, work has a lesser place in my life. It doesn't seem as important to me now. My time means more to me. Real life was on the trail. I was rich in time. More happened each day on the trail than happens in a month in regular life. I want to go back. I don't feel finished with it yet.

If I lived alone I would want to live a much more scaled down life than the one we have. A total voluntary simplicity kind of life rather than this keeping up with the Joneses middle class life. I don't want to own a car. I don't want to own a flat screen TV. I don't want anything anymore. Just my backpack and a few more things for the house. He asked me, if I won the lottery what would I buy. I said nothing. Anyway, if I moved to be on my own I would feel much better with a solid income, even though it would be soul-crushing. At least I could pay the rent. So far I can't on my freelance career.

Thing is, I think he prefers life to be soul-crushing. As much as he complains about me when I'm in some job making me unhappy, he actually seems to hate it more when I'm happy. It's like we both have to live with our spirits broken for him to be happy. The happiest was when we worked at the same company and could complain about the same idiotic Dilbert things.

Oh well. Sorry to dump all my problems. At least you know a little bit more about me.

[Angela]

Originally Posted by sbdiane

Thing is, I think he prefers life to be soul-crushing. As much as he complains about me when I'm in some job making me unhappy, he actually seems to hate it more when I'm happy. It's like we both have to live with our spirits broken for him to be happy. ..... At least you know a little bit more about me.

When you read this back, are you learning a little bit more about you?

You want you both to be happy, and he wants you both to be unhappy. What are you in this relationship to learn?

By the way, why aren't you a trail guide or something like that, earning money doing what you love?

[sbdiane]

I am a trail guide. It does not pay money. It's a volunteer thing. I don't like it much. You would think that if someone enjoys hiking that they would enjoy leading hikes, but it's really like trying to equate someone who enjoys solitude and nature with someone who loves babysitting. The better choice is actually writing. I enjoy writing about my adventures and am working on a book about it which I will sell from my web site about hiking.

Relationships morph over time, I guess. Our relationship did not start like this. I feel like we've both been waiting for several years now for something to change. I don't want to leave, I don't want to make ultimatums and he does not want advice or anything like that. So I wait and try to be supportive of any ideas he has. He's only got a year and a half before he can retire if he wants. Maybe something will happen then. It's just awful to watch the stock market drop and his savings disappear and see him get more and more disappointed. So he probably won't retire in a year and a half.

[Angela]

So here you are, in this relationship in which you want to be happy but he hates it when you're happy; he wants you to share in his broken spirit soul-crushed disappointment and you'd rather love your life.

What are you in this relationship to learn? What are you willing to learn? sbdiane, why are you in this relationship? (not rhetorical questions, by the way -- I can see where they might sound that way.)

[sbdiane]

I don't know what or why other than because I love him and he's my family. Perhaps more will be revealed to me. I have known him for 10 years. I was alone for 5 years before I met him and now I feel kind of alone again.

I just hope he finds a way out of his funk before it kills him.

[Angela]

Well, you're not alone. We're with you.