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| Social & Relationships Social skills, friends, dating, sex, seduction, monogamy, polyamory, marriage, alternative relationships, soul mates, parenting, children, family life, education |
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| | #1 (permalink) |
| Family Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: France -> Germany -> France -> Brazil
Posts: 3,430
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K and I had planned to see each other in august. We're in a long distance relationship, he lives about 1000km from where I live. About two days before he was to come visit me, unexpected things happened, preventing him from coming. Plus, his cell phone broke, we're able to send text messages to each other but being able to actually talk on the phone is a matter of chance, sometimes we're not able to reach each other at all. After a few days he explained to me that he's doing his possible to come visit me but for now he can't. ok. I was waiting. Now, after two weeks, it turns out that he definitely cannot come. Or in fact he could if he really wanted to, but only for five days, which doesn't make much sense. So I said ok, no problem, let's make another plan! and I asked him what he thinks about me coming to visit him, because I could stay there longer. He said, that would be wonderful. Then the connection broke. So I sent a text message to him, saying I would immediately jump on a train and go visit him if he agreed. He replied with a lengthy message telling me that if seeing each other didn't work out this must be for a good reason and that we should accept it. He wants to manage his stuff there and come to see me in october. He said he wants our relationship to be perfect and that's why he's being very careful. He also said he loves me and other romantic stuff, but asked me to "let us the time we need" before seeing each other. I was like So I asked him in a text message if I'm understanding him correctly that he prefers me not to come because he doesn't feel ready to meet me and needs more time? His reply was a text message full of nonsense-words, like "atmdj wpgan tjah"! Now I really don't know what to do! I tried to call him in order to ask him directly wtf this means, I hate talking about important things over text messages. But it was impossible to reach him. What would you do? Try to call him tomorrow? Do nothing at all? Write a text message asking what it means? Interpret his answer as "yes I prefer you not to come but I'm afraid to tell you frankly" and reply "ok, I let you more time"? I really don't understand. Why is he sad about us not seeing each other if in fact he doesn't want us to see each other? Why doesn't he just tell me? (and why doesn't he want to see me I don't think jumping on a train is going against the Universe's will! Some thoughts? I'm really lost and confused! This guy is so complicated! |
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| | #2 (permalink) |
| Senior Member Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 619
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Very strange. Can it be that he faked that his phone was broken and now he fakes it again with these nonsense words? For me it looks like he doesn't want to meet you (the world's a place we will never fully understand If I were you I'd call him. Ask him what you wanted to ask him with your text message. Say to him that you don't accept the cheap excuse with the universe. |
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| | #3 (permalink) |
| Banned Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 22,520
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Yes, it sounds to me like he is telling you he needs some time and space for something, and he's not ready to tell you what it is. Maybe he doesn't even know. In any case, unless you want to be in continuous pursuit, I recommend allowing him the space he's claiming here. In the meanwhile, are you quite sure you see eye-to-eye on how exclusive and committed this relationship is? |
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| | #4 (permalink) |
| Family Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: France -> Germany -> France -> Brazil
Posts: 3,430
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Yeah, I think you are both right, it's pretty obvious that he doesn't want to see me and needs some more time and space. That's ok, I'm just irritated that he didn't tell me right away! I hate guessing and translating what someone means without saying it. Why can't he just tell me what is. I'd say "ok, I let you time" and not even ask for an explanation. Now I'm asking for an explanation because all this has grown so complicated and mysterious! Of course I was sad and disappointed, after all we're freshly in a relationship and have never even kissed each other, and haven't seen each other in one entire year... Seeing him is the first thing I'd want to do. But I applied a few methods to my bad feelings (reclaiming power, present moment awareness) and now I'm perfectly fine with him not coming. So it's not like I'd throw a tantrum at him if he told me the truth. I don't see the point in making plans to see each other and then sneaking out like this. I'd also have preferred to know the truth because I unnecessarily spent two weeks waiting for him while he unnecessarily was looking for excuses! Argh, what a waste. I was so excited to know he could arrive at any time that I wasn't able to concentrate on my own things, and it probably did cost him a lot of energy too. But ok, it's pointless to regret what happened. I'll just give him the time and space he needs and practice surrendering. It is, absolutely. 200%, I'm sure about that. |
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| | #5 (permalink) |
| Family Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 1,800
| Impossible? Yours were the only two phones in the vicinity? You might text him your cell number, and ask him to borrow a phone to call you. If it's an issue of the cost, in most places you can buy a calling card cheaply, or work something out - especially for something that's important to you. (*cough, cough*) I think many people aren't used to bold, decisive people, desiring honest communication - they really believe they *have* to play these games! I'm so grateful you're living a different example. I broke off an engagement with someone years ago, because he kept lying to me about silly stuff. |
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| | #6 (permalink) | |
| Family Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: France -> Germany -> France -> Brazil
Posts: 3,430
| I meant that I called him several times but the call couldn't reach his cell phone. I don't know if his phone was off, or broken. His cell phone is the only way I have to reach him. He has no conventional phone and no computer at home, I don't even know where he lives exactly. Of course if he really wanted to, he would be able to reach me. He has several cell phone and conventional phone numbers of mine, my email address and my mail address. He could borrow a phone or go to a cybercafe or whatever. Obviously, it's not that important to him. Quote:
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| | #7 (permalink) |
| Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Kansas
Posts: 54
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Hey Rose, I agree with the other posters. He is not being up front with you. I absolutely cannot stand that! I do better knowing the truth, where I stand than trying to read between the lines. What would it hurt for him to tell you that he is getting "whatever.?" It could very well be that he is seeing someone else as well and is not wanting you to know so he can have his cake and eat it too. There is a really good chance, that if he was honest with you, that you would not want to see him anymore. If he is seeing someone else, then he made the decision to stick around where he was instead of coming to see you. So, I don't understand his reasoning behind not being honest and upfront with you unless he really does want to date you too, but just chose to do something else during the time he was supposed to come see you. It really seems that the fact that he is pulling all of this, he really could be hiding something. So, you have a good attitude about it. If you give him the time and space that he needs, it will work out the way it is supposed to work out. |
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| | #8 (permalink) |
| Family Member Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,203
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Sounds to me like you need to have a talk with him about creating a drama-free relationship. Also, you may want to talk with yourself about not creating drama for yourself |
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| | #9 (permalink) |
| Family Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: France -> Germany -> France -> Brazil
Posts: 3,430
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I know he's not seeing anybody else. When we decided to start a relationship, he said there would be no others for him anymore, ever. And I 100% trust him on this. He's quite traditional and a man of principles. For him, cheating equates losing one's honor, and honor is very important to him. He's also very much in love with me, and very focused on me. Before August he used to call me a lot. We're very close. He often tells me what a wonderful and perfect woman of his life I am and how much he loves me, and he's planning on leaving his country and coming to live with me in fall. I totally cannot imagine him seeing someone else. But yeah, he's not being upfront with me now. I too hate that! I don't think he's intentionally hiding things from me though, I suppose it's more that he doesn't want to hurt me and he's afraid of telling me honestly that there is no space for me in his life right now. Maybe he's having some fears about us meeting. After all, this relationship is a real BIG thing for both of us, we both think we're meant to spend this life together. I can understand it if he doesn't feel "ready" to jump yet. I can also understand his wish that everything in his life might be cleared and neat before we meet, that would look like him a lot. Or maybe something external happened that he needs his energy to deal with now, I don't know. It's none of my business to find out why exactly he made this decision. It's his decision and I trust him that it's the best he could make. I'm still confused about his complicated communication style and mixed signals though. I hate getting contradictory messages and having to read between the lines. |
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| | #10 (permalink) | ||||
| Family Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: France -> Germany -> France -> Brazil
Posts: 3,430
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You're also right that I'm being in reaction mode instead of genuinely responding, and that's not good. My genuine response was to call him and ask what he means, but I couldn't reach him, so I began wondering like crazy what all this is about. My questions about what to do are because I'm confused and feeling insecure. I don't know how to deal with someone who sends me such mixed messages and doesn't clearly say what he thinks. Do I react to what he says with his words, or do I react to what he says between the lines? That's my real question. Quote:
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I don't see how I could hurt him if I ask him to be clear. (and even if I do, that's his problem, not mine. He's responsible for his feelings.) Quote:
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| | #11 (permalink) |
| Banned Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 22,520
| Rose, may I suggest asking him, too, if there is anything you are being that leaves him feeling not safe about being straight with you? His answer might surprise you. It's easier to encourage 100% responsibility in others if you're being it in a really bold way yourself. (you know, I'm sure, that I'm not talking about being "at fault" or to blame -- just looking at who you're being that things are occurring in your life the way you are.)
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| | #12 (permalink) | |
| Family Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: France -> Germany -> France -> Brazil
Posts: 3,430
| Quote:
I can also imagine it's not easy for him because we have slightly different approaches on the phone. He likes to chit-chat about his day, my day, other topics, laugh together, share feelings and be in love. I like that too, but I usually use the phone call more to check the situation concretely and make plans to see each other. I kinda have nothing else in my mind but to relentlessly pursue the goal of seeing him eventually. So maybe he feels pressured in some way. And I know he thinks it's his "fault" that it took us five years to get together. I can imagine that he might feel bad about telling me that I'll have to wait six weeks more | |
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| | #13 (permalink) | |
| Family Member Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,203
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Heh heh, sorry for the faulty assumptions. For some reason I have difficulty correctly interpreting your intentions from your words. Anyways, this was kind of what I was getting at. Quote:
Of course, often people say things between the lines because they are afraid of acknowledging them, so they hope that the other person will spare them the effort of accepting responsibility for their words by guessing them. I don't know that this is the case, but it may be. Ironically, it sounds to me as if you communicate more like a conventional male, and your boyfriend communicates more like a conventional female. I'm not much of a female-oriented communicator, so I can give no advice about how to interpret his actions. I don't know what you could do aside from asking him what you want to ask him once you can get in communication with him. | |
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| | #14 (permalink) | |
| Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 764
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If so, I am now officially too old to comprehend modern life. People dating pixels. If not, never mind. | |
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| | #15 (permalink) | |
| Family Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: France -> Germany -> France -> Brazil
Posts: 3,430
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No, we have met in person, but not since we're in a relationship! Yeah it's a bit complicated. We met almost five years ago and fell madly in love with each other. We dated for about half a year, but nothing ever happened, not even a kiss. Then for some reason we did not see each other anymore (too complicated to explain that here). For several years we had almost no contact, alternating between finding and losing each other again. A few months ago, we started communicating via email and phone. We realized that we're still in love with each other and decided to go for a relationship. It's a long-distance relationship because I live in another country now. Since our decision to go for the relationship, I haven't seen him. Last time I saw him was one year ago, by accident on the street, for about five minutes ( That's why I never kissed my boyfriend | |
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| | #16 (permalink) |
| Banned Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 22,520
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You know what occurs to me? Maybe he has put on some weight or has some other appearance issue that embarrasses him and that he wants some time to deal with before you meet. ...and pardon me for this incredibly impertinent question, but are you remaining celibate during this No-See Zone? |
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| | #17 (permalink) | |
| Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 764
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I fear there are people who date pixels...some of them end up buried in the basement of a fellow wearing a clown suit... | |
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| | #18 (permalink) | ||
| Family Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: France -> Germany -> France -> Brazil
Posts: 3,430
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I have put on some weight. When we met I was a smoker and over 20lbs lighter than now. But that's not an issue. Quote:
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| | #20 (permalink) |
| Family Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: France -> Germany -> France -> Brazil
Posts: 3,430
| You know, even if I wanted to, I wouldn't be able to have sex with someone else now. It's just not possible anymore. (and I don't want to anyway) But my impatience is not only because of that. I'm way too attached to the outcome of seeing him at last. Since we stopped seeing each other four years ago, every time he showed up in my life I so wanted to see him. Nothing more, just spend some time with him. And every time we almost saw each other... something happened and whoop, no K again. I think he's here to teach me detachment! |
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| | #21 (permalink) |
| Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 658
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saying is one thing, doing is quite another. I'm not singling anyone out specifically here. I just wanted to throw this out. I've encountered many many people who say they want an honest, open, relationship. They say they value honesty and integrity. In business, they say they want to build a company based on team work, working together towards a common goal, to help others, blah blah blah. They say all the right things that everyone recognizes as good. Then I get to know them. (not romantically) And it's a totally opposite picture. Some people say they value integrity and honesty, but do not live like they posses that quality. Words are one thing. Action is another. Balls to bones, I've encountered very few people who really are what they say they are (or what they say they value). This is not to say they are duplicitious. They are not actively trying to lie to me. Most of the time, they don't even realize they are dishonest or are a coward. The power of denial and self delusion is great - and often times they don't even know they are doing it. So just because a person says he values honesty and integrity, he may not in actuality. The words don't translate to action. He may say he wants open honest communication, but his actions may illustrate otherwise. How do you have open honest communication if you can only text message him and only have his cell phone number? He has no other phone? He has no computer - but can't go to an internet cafe maybe, once a week to chat with you? Or even once a month? This does not make him a bad person, we all deny and lie to ourselves at some point in our lives. We've all been there. (I've been there!) People compromise their values all the time. I know I used to! And to some extent, I still do. And courage to be honest is a very rare commodity. My advice to you Rose, is really think and reflect on whether this relationship has been what you want. Reflect the ACTIONS, not the words. Forget everything he's told you, has his behavior towards you reflected what you want in a relationship? |
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| | #22 (permalink) | ||
| Family Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: France -> Germany -> France -> Brazil
Posts: 3,430
| No, no, Cloud, they're not faulty. You're right that asking how to deal with him to make the relationship work is not being genuine of me. It'd be better not to think about how to react and just do what is natural for me, and if it works, it works, and if it doesn't work, it doesn't work. What you're saying reminds me Steve's post about reaction vs. response. I'm being in reaction mode, thinking about how to best react, instead of responding intuitively. That's being manipulative indeed, even though I mean well... I so want this relationship to work Quote:
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I asked what this text message with nonsense-words meant though. He said he was swearing and cursing because he couldn't reach me on the phone! lol He also said he thinks the odds are against us now, and that he has a bad gut feeling about us meeting this month. Those events preventing him from coming are a sign that we should not meet yet. His intuition tells him so, even though he very much wants to see me. He's really sad about it. I admire that he trusts his intuition so much, even against his own feelings | ||
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| | #23 (permalink) | ||||
| Family Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: France -> Germany -> France -> Brazil
Posts: 3,430
| Quote:
Plus, it's not his fault we can only text message for now, he tries to call me, and used to call me a lot in the past too. Quote:
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Of course there was no seeing each other action, this does not reflect what I want | ||||
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| | #24 (permalink) |
| Family Member Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 2,756
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When it is about asking, there is nothing like asking directly from the source. If there are no lies, then you may get a traight answer. If there are lies, compare facts and words and believe in facts. I see it simple, but it is just me. Your reality could be more complex than that. |
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| | #26 (permalink) |
| Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: UK
Posts: 66
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Hmm. A voice on the phone, the thoughts at the other end of the email, the words that come back from instant messaging. This is but a projection of a person. I'm far more forthright with my opinions when I write on the internet. Email allows me to express my thoughts with more precision than speaking. Instant messaging I can be easily misunderstood. The phone gives a better medium of communication. But it is still a voice, that is only on the phone during that relatively short period of time. It is a phone date. However, you don't see the body language of the person whilst you are talking, you don't see them thinking, or not during silences. Even with knowing the person before you started communicating at this level of intimacy, your idea of them is very different from that reality. Having spent two months working away from home, one month after starting to see someone... I don't know that it can really work. I can relate to how badly you want to meet this person. But you are missing out on so so so much of the communication, the presence... you do NOT know this man. It is so much easier to be someone else remotely. To be rude about someone who is the other side of the world. This idea of "say it to their face"... I work in a multinational company. Meeting both sets of people on either side of a professional relationship, they both blamed each other for project failures. Yet they would certainly NOT say that to each other. They would happily argue and shout on the phone at each other... but not in person. Your intuition about people in non-face to face situations is severely restricted. |
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| | #28 (permalink) |
| Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 175
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Now this is a synchronicity Perhaps this will make a lenghty post, so beware! Right now at this moment I was calling my boyfriend with whom I am in a distance relationship with (across all Europe), and he was not picking up phone again! Shoo all voicemails. And right after that I come accross this post. My story has some connection points with yours, so I felt like it is a good idea to share this. First about our relationship: we met on World of Warcraft first, we have met twice in real life, and we share very beautiful love. For months when we could not see each other, we would talk on Skype, play World of Warcraft together, send each other pictures and musics and thingies and spend hours together like this. I know and contact some of his friends and his family as well to some extent. The chemistry between us is genuine, but unfortunately we are not able to live together yet due to real life circumstances. But we both are working towards solving them and expect to be together very soon. I had the most disturbing experience last week regarding our relationship that taught me a lot. Let me tell you about it. He went to a vacation for a week with his family, during this time he would call me almost every day. Then, when he came back, there was suddenly silence. No skype. No calls. Nothing. After two days of waiting I seriously freaked out. I felt just as you probably feel right now: helpless, desperate and scared, because I feared intensely that our relationship is suddenly coming to an end and I can do nothing about it, because I am miles and miles away! I cried, I called him dozens of times, I sent various text messages and such. In my mind I practically lived through how it would be if our relationship would really be over. The pain was genuine.. and overwhelming. The next day he called and apologised. He said that he has finally started doing serious work on his thesis which is currently essential for him to finish his education and get a decent job in his profession. He said that due to his personality (he absolutely can't multitask) he can't allow any other thoughts to interfere with that, otherwise he will never finish it, and he can't really afford that. So our chances to make any contact during this time (and after a recent setback that will be 6 more weeks when I expected to see him in what would be a week from now) will be pretty slim. Thing is, he had mentioned it before that he will start this work after he returns from holidays, but I never expected it to be that serious. So I had no clue what was coming. But most important is what I learned from this experience when I shed the light of (slightly late :P ) consciousness on it: 1. I have to own my power I understood that I had put a lot responsibility of my wellbeing on his shoulders. In a way I was living through him, and my experience with feeling miserable just because of a slight chance that he might be gone from my life proved that. So I figured I should take power back and generate my love and wellbeing myself instead of expecting him to be the generator. 2. I have to live here and now. All my life recently was just a means to get to the moment when I live with him as we had originally planned. A lot of mindless, unexperienced hours that I could use so much more usefully to fill my life with joy instead of being frustrated and in waiting. 3. I have the power to choose my own emotions. Angela has posted this uncountable times, and it is so true. It was my choice (unconscious, but a choice) to create the dramatic picture in my head and imagine all the dire consequences. When I calmed down and started to think lighter thoughts, my mood immediately improved. Why did I not start with thinking them in the first place? 4. I have to form more positive beliefs about me and relationships. My emotional drama was basically a result of me acting out a belief "People I am deeply in love with, leave me, because I don't deserve a LLTMBR." So I should work on changing these. 5. Our relationship will end one day one way or another. Tomorrow or 50 years from now, another love or death - there is not much difference. Our current moment is all we have, and there is no use of worrying about the end. When it comes, all I can do is to be thankful for the beautiful moments that we shared and understand that life still has a lot of amazing surprises in store for me, even if they are not connected with that particular person anymore. 6. I have to set him free. By craving him I had made him my prisoner. By wanting him I keep him apart from me. That is an universal rule about all things, including relationships. In practice this means that instead on being focused on some day in future when we will be together or on my craving for him, now I have chosen to focus on the current day and it's tasks. My boyfriend needs space, so I am giving it to him by focusing on myself, my work and what delights me as much as I can. If I can't reach him on phone, I accept that I can't reach him now and that is it. No mental pictures of various "why's". I fully accept a chance that our relationship might end any moment. I fully accept that right now I am where I am, and that is apart from him and fully into my life, so I should experience this and bring joy and love in this experience. This in no way restricts me being loving for him, because I still can send all the love of my heart to him whenever I feel like it. But it sure eliminates the pain factor and makes me much happier right now. The amazing part about this is that in the possible case if he lies about his intentions or plans, or reasons, it has no effect on me. Because no matter what, I am living my own life. Sure, there are practical consequences if anything I have worked towards in practical sense turns out to be not needed anymore because the status of our relationship has changed, but if I have done it while remaining aligned with myself (i.e. not "sacrificing" anything for the greater good of "us"), then I can still remain grounded and acknowledge that these things are common and that not all plans come to life and thats it. The pain really comes into picture only when you start living some other life instead of your own, and is a good marker for that and should be perceived as such. I hope that this helps. Last edited by mncz; 08-20-2008 at 09:10 PM. |
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| | #30 (permalink) | |
| Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 10
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MNCZ thank you for sharing. | |
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