Women of the forums. I need your female feedback.

[Angela]

Originally Posted by Alex2007

Angela, We have met 5 times.

Astra is right. Lets leave this conversation die. I have taken what I wanted from it!

“leave me alone, I don’t want to share my problem with you." I guess it's not just females!

[annalees]

I would say she is not interested, and is using the death of the uncle as an excuse, I think you should move on.

[Jamie]

I think it would make guys' lives a lot simpler, if when a lady has no romantic interest in a guy, she's just very direct with him.

I can well understand why a lot of women don't do direct though. I'm not judging you ladies. I wish I could talk to the collective consciousness of all female-kind, and I'd say ...

"Look ladies, please feel free to be indirect with whomever you wish, but with me, please, I beg you, just be direct, plain and honest. I can take it, I'm a big boy, and I'd really apprecieate knowing where I'm going wrong so I can work on that, even though, I know I'm pretty much perfect just as I am, and if you do think there's something wrong with me, then maybe you should go get an appointment at the opticians or something".



Jamie.

p.s. Only joking about the opticians! (please go directly to a psychotherapist).

[Rose of Cairo]

Originally Posted by Jamie

I think it would make guys' lives a lot simpler, if when a lady has no romantic interest in a guy, she's just very direct with him.

Ha! And what about us ladies? Do you think guys are always direct?? Don't you think it would be easier for us to have a guy being direct too?

Our life would be a lot simpler too if we had no guys promising to call, but not calling, but making a lot of excuses for that, or asking us out, but not being really interested... instead of just saying "dear lady, you're sexy and wonderful, and there is no spark on my side. Let's forget about it."

I can well understand why a lot of women don't do direct though. I'm not judging you ladies. I wish I could talk to the collective consciousness of all female-kind, and I'd say ...

"Look ladies, please feel free to be indirect with whomever you wish, but with me, please, I beg you, just be direct, plain and honest. I can take it, I'm a big boy,

Why do you want to talk to the collective consciousness of female-kind instead of the specific females you're dealing with? You're funny you, wanting women to be direct and not being direct yourself

Usually, we feel it when a guy really is a big boy and can take a clear no. Most of the time that's not the case, that's why we're afraid of hurting him.

and I'd really apprecieate knowing where I'm going wrong so I can work on that, even though, I know I'm pretty much perfect just as I am, and if you do think there's something wrong with me, then maybe you should go get an appointment at the opticians or something".

That a girl is not crazy about you doesn't mean she thinks there's anything wrong with you. There are guys who are good looking, sexy, intelligent, kind, funny, and there's nothing wrong with them. And still, I'd never want them. There are so many factors involved in romantic attraction...

I think it's a mistake to interpret a no as a "there's something wrong with you" message.

That you're doing everything right doesn't mean she'll want you either.

[Jamie]

I don't interpret a no, as meaning there's something wrong with me, I interpret it as meaning there's something wrong with the lady (bad judgement, obviously! + may need glasses and psychological help).

Actually, and seriously ...

I'm not direct myself with women, esp. if I find a woman very attractive. In my mind, I equate saying what I think or feel, in a direct way, to be the same as, a whole bunch of stuff that's not attractive. In short, for a man, being direct and honest, is (I think) a big turn-off for most women.

So there!

Jamie.

[Rose of Cairo]

Originally Posted by Jamie

I don't interpret a no, as meaning there's something wrong with me

I didn't say you interpret a no as meaning there's something wrong with you. I said it looks like you interpret a no as meaning the girl thinks there's something wrong with you. That's not necessarily the case.

I'm not direct myself with women, esp. if I find a woman very attractive. In my mind, I equate saying what I think or feel, in a direct way, to be the same as, a whole bunch of stuff that's not attractive. In short, for a man, being direct and honest, is (I think) a big turn-off for most women.

Well, I don't know about "most women". But for me, a man being direct and honest is a big turn-on. Are you sure women think how you think they think?

Or is it you who finds what you would say if you were direct unattractive? What would you say if you were direct and why is that unattractive?

So you want women to be direct while you're not direct. My guess is that this could be difficult, since I suppose that direct people are generally attracted to other direct people. Maybe I'm wrong about that though.

[Jamie]

I have to disagree with you Rose.

If I'm direct with a woman, 9 times out of 10, it's not a good thing. Usually goes something like:

me: "Whoa, you're gorgeous"

her: "<something>"

me: "But, wow, you're really gorgeous, mmmm"

her: "<something else>"

me: "I'd love to go out with you"

her: (starting to lose interest) "Oh, we'll see, yadda yadda"

me: "But babe, you're just so beautiful, and you're making my heart do little summersaults"

See ... so I'm being direct and honest, well, at least I think I am!

(actually, I've never had the above dialog with a lady, not word for word at least, but that's the general gist of it, when I tried it once).

[Jennihul]

I'm not sure we said what Alex wanted to hear...

Jennifer

[Brutha]

me: "I'd love to go out with you"

That sentence is indirect.
Direct communication would be: Would meeting at 8 o clock at thrusday be okay with you?

[Jamie]

Originally Posted by Brutha

That sentence is indirect.
Direct communication would be: Would meeting at 8 o clock at thrusday be okay with you?

When I'm a multi-millionaire, I'm going to hire you to be my dating-coach! How much do you charge?

Jamie.

[Joely]

Originally Posted by Jamie

I have to disagree with you Rose.

If I'm direct with a woman, 9 times out of 10, it's not a good thing. Usually goes something like:

me: "Whoa, you're gorgeous"

her: "<something>"

me: "But, wow, you're really gorgeous, mmmm"

her: "<something else>"

me: "I'd love to go out with you"

her: (starting to lose interest) "Oh, we'll see, yadda yadda"

me: "But babe, you're just so beautiful, and you're making my heart do little summersaults"

See ... so I'm being direct and honest, well, at least I think I am!

(actually, I've never had the above dialog with a lady, not word for word at least, but that's the general gist of it, when I tried it once).

Hi Jamie,

Speaking as a woman who's been on the receiving end of a conversation like this a few times, it's not that it's direct, it's that it can make you a little uncomfortable - the woman feels like she's being put on the spot and that she's expected to give you a shot just because you find her attractive. There's a difference between being direct and gushing. If I was going to suggest anything, once you've said "you're gorgeous" once, you don't need to say it again. I've even been on dates where the only conversation I got out of the guy was "wow, you're amazing."

D'you know what? That's so boring! I know I'm amazing , I don't need the guy to tell me all the time! If you're going to go the Full On Compliment route, then pick out something specific about the person, like their eyes for example or the way they've done their hair. Basically, your opener at the moment doesn't give any inroads for conversation on anything else and you come off as though you're desperate and think that by excessive compliments you can win her over.

Sorry, I just derailed this thread into dating advice! I do know though, when I open conversation with a guy, and I want to compliment him on how he looks, I don't stand there and keep telling him he's gorgeous. I'll comment on his hair or his eyes (I have a big thing for eyes) and then talk about something else. Show an interest in them as people, not just as physical objects.

And personally, I've never liked the use of "babe" unless we're actually dating, but that's just my personal opinion and might be due to my feminist bent!

J x

[Jamie]

Oh god Joely, it's fine, and I think the thead has been well and truely derailed and changed direction from it's original course!

You're right of course, what you're saying, and I am gushing (just a tiny bit), I know, and it's probably not nice to be on the recieving end. The thing is, when I am talking to someone I find mega-attractive, the sense of attraction I feel, will affect my whole being, in a powerful way, and it's a tad distracting. My mind has this thing where it wants to shut down, stop thinking, and just bask my being in the wonderful feelings flowing through my body (nothing dirty you understand). I guess what I'm trying to say, is being in the company of an attractive lady, inhibits my capacity to hold inteligent conversation. Maybe be a lack of self control issue, on my part. I know it's not very swave.

Jamie.

EDIT: I should also point out, that the above samlpe dialog, is somewhat eggsagerated ..

[Little Deb]

I am female, and this may be an usual stance on your problem. A lot of women in my circle, anyway, seem to think that its OK to be smart-aleckey and justify it as being "tough" "sophisticated" or "for their own good" when they are only being jerks. There is a severe lack of manners in today's culture, and you are better off finding a more considerate and gueninely mature lady.
Ps. You are probably not a councilor or therepist anyway, so be careful how you relate to any new friends.

[missing]

Originally Posted by Little Deb

I am female, and this may be an usual stance on your problem. A lot of women in my circle, anyway, seem to think that its OK to be smart-aleckey and justify it as being "tough" "sophisticated" or "for their own good" when they are only being jerks. There is a severe lack of manners in today's culture, and you are better off finding a more considerate and gueninely mature lady.
Ps. You are probably not a councilor or therepist anyway, so be careful how you relate to any new friends.

I think you may have a point. I'll add something a bit different but somewhat related. I'm not female but in my experience there are women who have issues appearing "weak" in front of certain men. They can cry and be very emotional with their girlfriends, and even some of their guy friends (those they've written off as romantic partners). But if there is a gray area, as it seems their is with Alex's situation, they will close up emotionally. Why is this? Who knows. I had an experience with a girl like this. At one point she told me I reminded her of her father and that gave me an "aha" moment (she had serious issues with him). But that's just one situation. If you are a guy and women consistently close themselves off to you emotionally, there are probably two things going on;

1.) you are sending off vibes (maybe sexual) that are confusing or threatening to her and she doesn't know how to respond. Thus she closes herself off as a defense mechanism.

2.) you are attracted to women with "issues". Try to find some women who are more "together" and point #1 will be less of a problem. It's not easy since there are a lot of women out their with issues. Plenty are sane however, and you have to ask yourself why you aren't going after them instead of the nut jobs. In Alex's case it was probably something to do with his personality, which I think has been covered earlier in this thread aka he was a "nice guy" who wants to "help" the girl with problems. Pretty common scenario.

[SonoranBob]

Alex,

I'm not a woman but there is a factor at work here that you're not taking into account, and that is grief. I suspect it has more to do with grief and loss than with gender.

If she was close to this relative and badly shaken, it isn't something she's going to trust a person with whom she has had two casual dates and barely knows. Her whole life will be on hold for awhile and the best thing you can do is honor her request. What is there to decode about "leave me alone"?

People can be a bit crazy when grieving. Give her space. Let her know you'd like her to contact you if and when she wishes to. Then leave. her. alone.

--Bob