Can May/December relationships work?

[munish]

A very good article by Mira Kirshenbaum on May/December relationships .

She says -

[ I never want to rain on anyone's love parade. But the divorce rate is high enough as it is. And the statistics are that the more different people are, the greater their risk of getting a divorce.]

It is very clear that she is doubtful, that such relationships work in the long run.

Can May/December relati... - Blogs - Revolution Health

[ivorytickler]

As someone who has been in a may-december relationship for 29 years, I'd say this article is right on target. By the time we were married 10 years, he'd figured out "get 'um young and train 'um right" wasn't going to work and I was sick of being "taught". Honestly, if he hadn't had his lifestyle tied to my income, I don't think we would have made it to year 15.

We have, since, managed to work through our issues but, every now and again, he starts "teaching" me again and we get right back on the treadmill.

Respect, or more accurately, lack of respect for the younger partner is an issue. So is the fact the adoration a young girl has for her older man early on fading away. By the time I was 30, I wanted a true partner. He still wanted that girl who looked up to him.

It's been a rough ride. While I"m in this relationship for the long haul, I wouldn't do it over. There are just too many problems due to the age gap. And some of them, we're just starting to see with him entering his senior years and me still rooted in middle adulthood. I feel like I sold my youth and got gyped in the deal but it's the deal I made.

Honestly, I wouldn't recommend a may-december relationship involving a very young woman. Women need to get to their late 20's to know who they are and who they want to be and catching one young doesn't mean she'll take to your teaching. Anytime you enter a relationship intent on changing your partner or counting on your partner never growing up, you're in trouble.

If the woman is, at least, 25, I don't see it as nearly the risk.

[PianoManGidley]

Not a bad article, but one little thing that irked me:

The greater the differences of any kind between two people, the harder is it to have things in common.

It's just a "duh" phrase, really--like saying "the less light there is, the darker it is!"

What's more, not ALL May/December relationships are a young woman with an older man. There have been older woman/younger man relationships, as well as May/December relationships in the gay and lesbian community.

[ivorytickler]

This article doesn't deny the existence of other types, it simply speaks to one type. Younger woman/older man and the pitfalls. Which I know well because I've lived them.

[JimOfferman]

You could probably write an article like this about any kind of relationship.

Relationships work or fail because of the people in the relationship - not because of some random statistic.

[Jennihul]

It works every now and then. But the same thing can be said about most marriages, unfortunately.

Jennifer

[ivorytickler]

From my experience and what I"ve read, the dynamics of an older man attracted to a, relatively, immature woman are pretty consistent. He's either immature himself, which explains his attraction to an immature woman, which becomes a problem when she matures or he's looking for some sweet young thing to adore him he can mold which becomes a problem when she matures. I really do think this article pegs it if it's a case where the woman is very young.

Whenever you enter into a relationship where one or both parties are immature, you're probably going to have problems when they start to mature. If you're both immature because you're both young, maybe you'll mature together but if one is immature because of age and the other just immature, watch out.

[The David]

My mom's birthday is May 1. She claims to have dated an enormous amount of guys. Which guy has she been with for almost 28 years? You guessed it. His birthday is April 29.

I know that's not what the article is about, but it's a powerful metaphor. lol

[jaamkie]

*sigh* I tend to attract older guys, who somehow think I'm charming and young and cute yet oddly proper/mature, intelligent and "wise"... to an extent I prefer to date somewhat older guys, because I've gone through life a bit quicker than others and am at the same place in life/maturity as guys a few years older. But I've had several much-older guys want to date me, or at least take me out and flirt with me even if they realize we're both better off with people closer to our ages- and I've always felt the weirdness of a guy wanting someone much younger, felt the inequity in the interaction and been uncomfortable with the idea of being in a relationship with them. Often the guy expects to pay for everything and go out to nice places, and I feel a bit like a paid pet and like I have to act especially nice and interested-in-them and joyful and mature to repay their largess; often they compliment my looks in a very "courtly" fashion that somehow just makes me uncomfortable and in the back of my mind wonder what they would think when I got older; they have many more experiences and great conversation which can be enlightening but a bit intimidating- I feel like a student talking to a teacher and have trouble disagreeing very forcefully with any of their opinions; and also physically I just don't feel attracted, so if I were to go out with them I would feel a bit like Anna Nicole Smith or something, trading sex for other types of attention and gifts.

[Eric Revelin]

I would think the key aspect in any relationship is self-knowledge. A young girl willing to be taught, or who's caught up in her adoration of the older male, is likely ignorant of the workings of her heart and mind and what she really wants. Similarly, an older man who finds a girl like that attractive is likely insecure and craves reverence to compensate for it.

Relationships are bound to fail when they aren't based on an earnest desire for companionship. You've got people who want another person to provide something they feel is lacking in themselves, you've got people who want sex, you've got people who feel pressured (whether by society or family) to get married... Considering that, "duh!' statements as pointed out above aren't so obvious since common sense is forgotten when insanity is the norm.

True love isn't bound by age but true love is more than a passing fancy and a tingling between the legs. The head cannot dominate matters of the heart but it can't be left out of the process either. Logical thinking, self knowledge, and strong feelings are all necessary to make a relationship work. Shortsightedness combined with infatuation and/or insecurity is likely responsible for the high divorce rates we're seeing nowadays.

[OlivettiUnderwood]

I don’t believe they will work, no matter the couple. I'm referring to an age disparity more than 10 years. The more years apart they are, the fewer things they have in common. The less a couple has in common, the more likely they will part. A person in the youthful spring of their life will almost always feel instructed by the more experienced partner. It's human nature and the younger person, if they don't grow to resent always being the student, they will outgrow the teacher and the older person will be left alone. In defense of the older - - man, he has a woman who admires and looks up to him. His sweet young girlfriend thinks she's found the guy who finally treats her well and seems to respect her mind and vitality. The younger woman thinks she's found the father for her children - - - even if the older guy has told her he doesn't want more kids. You see, in almost any woman's mind, if she meets a man who will treat her well and provides her with things she needs, she thinks anything is possible, including changing her beau's mind about fathering and parenting. I read an adage not long ago which said, "Women fall in love, thinking they'll change and men fall in love, hoping they won't." Oh, I know why we younger women like maturity, stability and the communicative qualities of older men, the young guys have what appear to be terminal cases of arrested development and that's because no one. not even they demand more out of themselves. I know the tendency is to over generalize, but very few people have the courage to be a man or a woman of true conviction. Setting goals and working toward them is the stuff of growing romance, working through the difficult times and learning to tolerate each other's peccadilloes. If there has to be a may December relationship, make it between an older woman and younger man or of same sex couples past child rearing years - -then it could work. I hate to say it, even in this day and age, but there are those older guys who think getting a younger one and making her into what he wants -still exist. That is servitude and no one’s should be subject to that kind of “grooming.” In conclusion, the older guy younger woman has a creep factor where the other May December relationships seem to be an adventure, at least for a time. They will usually fail because of the inequities of chronological and emotional age.

[rei]

Olivetti, why did you say it could work with a same sex couple that is past child-rearing years? i'm curious about the thinking behind adding the "past child rearing years" part, if you care to elaborate.

welcome to the forums, by the way

[Gene]

May December romances and marriages do work for some people. I believe they work as well as marriages where the partners are closer in age.

I am 63 and my wife is 28. We have been together for 7 years. Age is just a number. If two people are compatible the relationship can flourish and if they are not the relationship is problematic.

Some relationships exist for a finite period of time, others seem to transcend the passage of time. Age difference does not automatically doom the couple.

[MyEyeIsOpen]

My wife is 18 years older than I am, we've been together more than 7 years, and our relationship gets better every year. I think the important thing is communication and commonality.

The assumption that an age gap automatically means you have less in common (other than your age) is wrong in my case.

[billionairekid]

Originally Posted by Gene

May December romances and marriages do work for some people. I believe they work as well as marriages where the partners are closer in age.

I am 63 and my wife is 28. We have been together for 7 years. Age is just a number. If two people are compatible the relationship can flourish and if they are not the relationship is problematic.

Some relationships exist for a finite period of time, others seem to transcend the passage of time. Age difference does not automatically doom the couple.

Gene you dog, you! LOL

[Michael Chui]

Originally Posted by OlivettiUnderwood

The more years apart they are, the fewer things they have in common. The less a couple has in common, the more likely they will part.

Understanding probability fail.

[MyEyeIsOpen]

Originally Posted by Michael Chui

Understanding probability fail.

Why is that a fail?

[James81]

Any relationship that you can imagine can work.

You are not asking the right question. The right question is: am I willing to do what it takes to make the relationship I am in work?

To me, though, relationships shouldn't involve a great amount of work. If it feels like "work" then you are probably with someone or in a situation where you simply aren't compatible. Relationships take MAINTENANCE. People who sit around and force things to work simply because they pounded in a certain amount of time with a person are just wasting precious life.

[Gene]

Originally Posted by MyEyeIsOpen

Why is that a fail?

I echo your statement, "Why is that fail." I've personally know a large number of people in relationships which include those in relationships with ten, twenty, thirty and even a few with more years of age difference. My conclusion from personal observations are that these marriages/relationships are at least as stable as marriages between couples of similar ages.

To the OP, on what source do you base your assertion that such relationships are destined to fail? Is it just your opinion or do you have data? Do you yourself have personal observations of a significant number of May December Relationships?

It is an interesting and useful topic. There is some considerable reaction among the general populace ranging from "Wow, Really" to "OH, yucky that's obscene." and "pervert."

I would suggest it is a personal choice among consenting adults. Why are so many partnerships that are out of the middle of norm all right when this particular choice viewed with such ambivalence while other choices are accepted?

In my own relationship you will not discover my wife a submissive student. If you call my wife submissive I suggest you be prepared to listen to her reaction. She is a strong woman. Sometimes I am the leader and sometimes she is the leader. Most decisions are decided by discussion and mutual agreement.

[Michael Chui]

Originally Posted by MyEyeIsOpen

Why is that a fail?

Saying something is "more likely" not to work is absolutely meaningless when considering any single case. But the person I responded to used this "more likely" claim as the basis for their "it will never work, no matter the couple".

Simply put, even if the chances are 99% that it would never work, there is no basis for claiming that the couple in question does not fall into the remaining 1%.

That's a basic misapplication of probability.

[Snorkledorf]

With a 24-year difference in age between my parents, I'd be vying for the title of biggest hypocrite in the world if I ever thought of it as creepy or wrong or anything like that. I generally try to avoid negating the legitimacy of my own existence...

Can it work? If you make it work. If both people do what's needed to remain compatible with the other over the years. In that sense it's the same as any other marriage.

The difficulty I'd guess would be in finding someone who's compatible with you even though you've lived significantly different lives. I look at is as similar to people from different cultures marrying, where each has significantly differing assumptions/opinions about "what life is like." If both partners are aware enough to actively look at their lives and relationship as works in progress, then it's perfectly reasonable to be optimistic.

But if one or the other partner isn't, then the problem doesn't exactly lie in their ages, does it?

[Brutha]

Simply put, even if the chances are 99% that it would never work, there is no basis for claiming that the couple in question does not fall into the remaining 1%.

It could fall in the remaining 1%. Some hypothetical teapots do go from being broken to being whole.
It however still makes sense to use past data to make predictions that a particular broken teapot won't restore itself.

[Michael Chui]

Originally Posted by Brutha

It could fall in the remaining 1%. Some hypothetical teapots do go from being broken to being whole.
It however still makes sense to use past data to make predictions that a particular broken teapot won't restore itself.

False analogy.

[Brutha]

False analogy.

Where's the structural difference in the arguments (besides the point that the probability is less)?

[Michael Chui]

Originally Posted by Brutha

Where's the structural difference in the arguments (besides the point that the probability is less)?

Analogies aren't about structure. They're about making comparisons between two related things. A false analogy is a comparison between two unrelated things.

In other words, entropy and relationships are not (so easily) related.

[OlivettiUnderwood]

Gentlemen:
Your responses are, predictable. First and most obvious is Gene, I'll wager you're financially well off or that your wife is of foreign desent. Of course you're infatuated by her youth and beauty. She is enamored by her perception of your status. Without more information, it's difficult to tell, but such a significant age disparity is very telling. Although there may be some genuine affection you have for her and she may sincerely be in awe of all your billions. the dynamic isn't only clear, it is the quintessential definition of an old wealthy immature guy with a super young “arm charm” young girl/woman. Who in god’s name are you kidding? You say your wife is a strong woman - - - she may very well be, and she probably is smart too. Smart enough to marry an old rich guy so she won't have to work after you're dead and gone. What could you possibly have in common? Music? no. Mutual understanding and love of the American Transcendentalist movement? No. Shared generational overlapping histories that add wisdom, depth and mutual understanding and humor to the thought processes and emotions with each other? No. Colloquialisms and idiomatic expressions that evolve within a generation that add the existential texture and grit of that season in time? No. When a couple has more in common with each other, the likelihood of them staying together increases. The converse is also true and with the added chasm of 35 years the overlapping of commonality held together by your money. That's what keeps her with you. I'm certain there are other dynamics that influence your "union" but it is stunningly clear.

As for EyeIsOpen, I say, good for you. Older women not only are better in bed, they're much more savvy about their wants and needs and know how to go about getting them on their own. She likely has no expectation of you supporting her financially and if there are children, they're probably adults, or nearly so. Money and children are oft the problems that plague couples. It is not only a rare person who can integrate child rearing, but an even more unique couple who can maintain parenting perspective and priorities and still have time to deal with each other, ex's, work demands and STILL have time and energy to "work" on the complexities inherit in a large age disparity in a primary relationship.

While I'm at it here, I might add it is interesting that the responses since I last wrote are mostly from men. I know this to be a sexist comment to boot, but perhaps the reason for it is because you men are online blogging how good your relationships are with your significantly older or younger partner (the woman) because she's taking care of the real relationship maintenance issues - - - like cooking, cleaning, bill paying - - or even taking classes or visiting friends or an aging parent or grandparent. How about them apples?

[OlivettiUnderwood]

We're not dealing with probability here, Nothing mathematical or even logical. Fifty percent of marriages fail, that, if you need a baseline for this obtuse application of probability, is a statistical fact. The rest, especially when dealing with humans, an anthropological application of data still obfuscates what's going on in this discussion - - and probably between men and women. You have embarked on a quantifiable discussion about probability and to what end? Is it not more relevant to discuss qualitative issues associated with human beings and their attraction to each other - - and why?

[Michael Chui]

Originally Posted by OlivettiUnderwood

We're not dealing with probability here, Nothing mathematical or even logical. Fifty percent of marriages fail, that, if you need a baseline for this obtuse application of probability, is a statistical fact. The rest, especially when dealing with humans, an anthropological application of data still obfuscates what's going on in this discussion - - and probably between men and women. You have embarked on a quantifiable discussion about probability and to what end? Is it not more relevant to discuss qualitative issues associated with human beings and their attraction to each other - - and why?

Yes. Why have you done so? Why are you using useless words like "more likely", "almost always", and "likelihood" when they have no meaning? Why are you submitting to the "tendency to over generalize"? I didn't bring up probability: you did. The fact that you didn't even realize it is your own problem.

[OlivettiUnderwood]

Thanks REI - Glad to be here. I said "past the child rearing age" because older people (generally speaking) have lived several years longer than those typically bearing and raising children. That task and responsibility and priviledge deserves our very best efforts and (in my opinion) shouldn't have the added burden of a parenting couple working through their own differences in addition to raising the kids. Through adversity however, we humans sometimes are able to raise the bar and do remarkable things. Children are, indeed, remarkable people and should not have to bear the burden of adults working out their own "stuff" while parenting. Part of what Eric Revelin (sp) said in self knowledge certainly involves the wisdom and clarity of mind to recognize differences weigh all the factors and act in a way that expresses and reinforces real and agape love. Romantic love, as we all know is the most selfish love. Children deserve our best and most generous and care filled love.

[rei]

but you said something about a same-sex couple past child-rearing age, as if it would not work if they are not past child-rearing age.

sounded to me like it was more about the same-sex relationship and children than a general idea of not working through issues while you're parenting, since you mentioned the same-sex aspect of it originally.

but now you are applying it to all couples with issues (not sure that leaves anyone who would be able to raise children), and not just a same-sex couple past child-rearing age as one of two cases where a May/December relationship would work, in your opinion. that is confusing me, are you changing what you said?