Psychic Told Parents Son Was Dead

[Michelle]

There is a post this morning on Anderson Cooper's 360 Blog this morning concerning Shawn Hornbeck and his family. How awful both for parents and psychic.

CNN.com - Anderson Cooper 360° Blog

[Gordon]

Originally Posted by Michelle

There is a post this morning on Anderson Cooper's 360 Blog this morning concerning Shawn Hornbeck and his family. How awful both for parents and psychic.

CNN.com - Anderson Cooper 360° Blog

I don't understand why you would think it awful for the psychic....clearly what they said was wrong....possibly showning them as either a fake or just a misguided individual.

No sympathy from me for Sylvia and shame on the TV show clearly cashing in by trying to get ratings on someone clear distress. This is a practise that should not happen at any time.

Sure use TV to make appeals.....but for them (TV producers) to use such methods is beyond reproach in my oppinion. They clearly knew what they were doing, and Sylvia didn't!! The poor parent were in such a vulnerable state and would hang on to any kind of hope.

The story itself is amazing and I am glad it worked out so fantastically.

G

[Michelle]

Well, since I don't know the psychic myself or any of her work apart from this I hesitate to label her as a fake or a fraud. We all know people and psychics can be wrong ... that's all.

[Gordon]

Originally Posted by Michelle

Well, since I don't know the psychic myself or any of her work apart from this I hesitate to label her as a fake or a fraud. We all know people and psychics can be wrong ... that's all.

Actually I agree with you and I appreciate these things can happen. However the TV company were way out of line to put this out. It was morally wrong.

G

[Michelle]

Yep. Just did a wiki search on her. Seems she has said some very questionable things in the past as well.

Sylvia Browne - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Gordon]

Originally Posted by Michelle

Yep. Just did a wiki search on her. Seems she has said some very questionable things in the past as well.

Sylvia Browne - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Oh my goodness....that's one serious fraud. Pure guess work on her part.

I even see there stop her web site.

G

[Michelle]

Interview with James Randi on Anderson Cooper about Sylvia Browne.

YouTube - Sylvia Browne Fraud

[Gordon]

Originally Posted by Michelle

Interview with James Randi on Anderson Cooper about Sylvia Browne.

YouTube - Sylvia Browne Fraud

Yup, the dangerous taking advantage of the vulnerable yet again.

She should be arrested and put in jail, who knows if the police even followed this line of enquiry with this case. Then the Montel Williams show should be cancelled as well. Or at the very least apologise to the Hornbeck family for allowing this Sylvia Browne character on to speak to these distraught people.

G

[spirited]

It was not just Sylvia Browne, it was also James van Praagh who gave totally incorrect information. See James Randi Educational Foundation — Home Page

[spirited]

Argh, the forum does not let me change the url. Here is the correct one: James Randi's Swift - January 19, 2007

[Dharma]

Let's not forget in this discussion who is responsible for seeking out and believing such information. That would be the parents. Making them into victims does not gain them anything.

In my salty view of "you create all your experience": the parents can choose (rather unconsciously) to hear their son is dead in order to give them some space from the grieving process, so they can get on with life and get something moving. I am assuming everything in their lives was at a stand still, at least emotionally, while looking for their son.

The parents, now having created space, allowing what is to be, do have the chance to create a different experience, and now chose (unconsciously again) to find their son.

Now.... it is entirely possible that at the moment the reading was given to the parents, the son was dead. And then years later, with the help of some emotional movement and magic, the son is now alive.

(I realize I'm using the passage of time when I say "years later", but that really doesn't exist in the now. I'm just using that for reference to the news story. Is it really that far out that we can kill someone off in our reality and then bring them back in a different moment? For the parents the possibility was always there for finding their son, since his body was never found. And the only way to explain this seemingly linear track of events is to say Sylvia was wrong. Just offering another perspective to this discussion. )

[Valeria]

The biggest problem with many people who may have some legitimate psychic ability is that they let success go to their heads.

They let too much ride on knowing the answers, deluding themselves, instead of just saying they don't know or they aren't getting anything.

I'm sure Sylvia Browne is a gifted psychic. But she also puts out a lot of hogwash.

It's up to us to develop our own psychic abilities and not rely on other people. Because, in the end, they are just people, with their own flaws and foibles.

- v

[Angela]

Originally Posted by Dharma

Now.... it is entirely possible that at the moment the reading was given to the parents, the son was dead. And then years later, with the help of some emotional movement and magic, the son is now alive.

(I realize I'm using the passage of time when I say "years later", but that really doesn't exist in the now. I'm just using that for reference to the news story. Is it really that far out that we can kill someone off in our reality and then bring them back in a different moment? For the parents the possibility was always there for finding their son, since his body was never found. And the only way to explain this seemingly linear track of events is to say Sylvia was wrong. Just offering another perspective to this discussion. )

I just read that three times and I still don't understand it. Would you explain further? I had been wondering if it was possible for a well-meaning psychic to pick up on the 'deadness' of the kid -- not actual physical death, but a deadening or flattening of his vitality so that he would stay under the radar of authority. It's been suggested that the kidnapper may have threatened in tremendous detail what would be the horrible outcome if the boy was noticed. Even one of his pals said she suggested to her mom that the boy looked like the flier that had been circulated, the mom pooh-poohed her, and the girl gave up in embarassment. Maybe the boy was emotionally hibernating to save himself, he was really talented at it, and that's what psychics felt.

[Valeria]

Originally Posted by Angela

I had been wondering if it was possible for a well-meaning psychic to pick up on the 'deadness' of the kid -- not actual physical death, but a deadening or flattening of his vitality so that he would stay under the radar of authority.

Ya know, i don't think so...the psychics would have felt his fear or his distance. On the other hand, we all make mistakes...and death is actually the worst thing to have to "pronounce" or talk about...it's so emotionally charged. And then the psychic is in the spotlight, in front of the camera, with a microphone shoved in his or her face.

- v

[Gordon]

Originally Posted by Valeria

Ya know, i don't think so...the psychics would have felt his fear or his distance. On the other hand, we all make mistakes...and death is actually the worst thing to have to "pronounce" or talk about...it's so emotionally charged. And then the psychic is in the spotlight, in front of the camera, with a microphone shoved in his or her face.

- v

And still my point, this should never have been shown on a show like Montel Williams...(We don't get it here in the UK....but I have seen it),...as everyone has lost out here.

G

[Valeria]

Originally Posted by Gordon

And still my point, this should never have been shown on a show like Montel Williams...(We don't get it here in the UK....but I have seen it),...as everyone has lost out here.

G

Well, i do agree with you there. Actually, that kind of thing shouldn't be on television anyway...grief as spectacle? tragedy as entertainment? now there is a place for public grief and tragedy...that's when its purpose is to lead others to catharsis...when it's healing to them...or to move others to action...in other words, when its purpose is to transform one's inner or outer world...but this tv stuff is not.

then again, i haven't watched television at all in about a month...visits to friends notwithstanding...and when i do watch television, it isn't to watch Montel Williams...i have an issue with how some of these shows cater to the lowest common denominator.

-v

[Angela]

Did y'all know that Ms. Browne was convicted in 1992 of felony grand theft and fraud? That doesn't prove she's a psychic fraud (although there is plenty of evidence that she's a scammer) but it does show what she's capable of.

[Erin Pavlina]

Before we burn Sylvia at the stake, I feel I should jump in with a question.

How many people who have received readings from Sylvia been interviewed? Do we only hear about the people who got a bad reading or do we also hear from the people who she helped? What if, and I don't know, but what if she has helped 10,000 people and only 100 of them got a bad reading?

As far as her committing a crime... was it related to being psychic? If not, I wouldn't use that as evidence that she is a fraud. If it was a conviction for fraud related to her psychic abilities, then I would want to know more.

As far as Sylvia Browne in general... I don't know what to think of her, honestly. I find her to be abrasive and rude and snarky, and a little condescending. But I don't know if that means she is not really psychic. I don't have a love and light feeling around her, but I do feel like she has good intentions.

So before we light her up and set her on fire, let's make sure we've got the full story, not just the ones that her detractors are spreading.

[Angela]

Originally Posted by Erin Pavlina

As far as her committing a crime... was it related to being psychic? If not, I wouldn't use that as evidence that she is a fraud. If it was a conviction for fraud related to her psychic abilities, then I would want to know more.

Apparently she told potential investors that she had "a strong feeling" about profit potential. That sounds like using her qualifications as a psychic for gain, to me. I'll look for that link and post it so you can read it so you can judge for yourself.

A quick search on her turned up so many complaints about her that I was overwhelmed. I didn't read any further than her telling a woman that her little granddaughter had been sold into slavery in Japan (the daughter's body was found buried in Texas; apparently she had been killed within a day or so of being snatched.) That one alone told me all I needed to know.

[Gordon]

Originally Posted by Erin Pavlina

Before we burn Sylvia at the stake, I feel I should jump in with a question.

How many people who have received readings from Sylvia been interviewed? Do we only hear about the people who got a bad reading or do we also hear from the people who she helped? What if, and I don't know, but what if she has helped 10,000 people and only 100 of them got a bad reading?

As far as her committing a crime... was it related to being psychic? If not, I wouldn't use that as evidence that she is a fraud. If it was a conviction for fraud related to her psychic abilities, then I would want to know more.

As far as Sylvia Browne in general... I don't know what to think of her, honestly. I find her to be abrasive and rude and snarky, and a little condescending. But I don't know if that means she is not really psychic. I don't have a love and light feeling around her, but I do feel like she has good intentions.

So before we light her up and set her on fire, let's make sure we've got the full story, not just the ones that her detractors are spreading.

Okay Erin, I hear what you are saying, but do you think that this sort of thing should have been shown on television. I personally think that is should not have been shown.

G

[Erin Pavlina]

Definitely not shown on television. No way.

it would be like if the police said, "There's a 90% chance this kid is dead just based on statistics in cases like this." That would be inappropriate too.

Or a doctor who tells a patient, "I estimate you've got 90 days to live, maximum. Put your affairs in order." Sometimes doctors are wrong even when they are sure they are right.

The bottom line as I see it is if I were the parents and I went to Sylvia and she told me that, I would have sought the advice and opinions of other psychics or the police or a detective or whatever. I hope they didn't just stop looking for the kid and close the case based on her prediction alone.