When demons, or satanic forces, attack?

[Jamie]

I want to share with you, something that happened to me a long time ago, and to elicit your opinions and suggestions on the matter.

About 18 years ago, when I was around the age of 22, I smoked quite a bit of cannabis, too much really. Looking back now, from where I am today, I wish I had never touched the stuff (I am very anti-drugs now). At the time, I was of course, young and naive!

Obviously, smoking a sufficient quantity of this stuff will have quite an effect on you, psychologically, as well as in other ways. It opens you up; to a lot of things that are 'out there', that perhaps you are not ready, old or wise enough, to deal with.

I believe that's certainly the case with me.

I started to imagine things, and it got worse ... much worse.

Imagination ...

This is hard, to find the right words here, so please bear with me. In some ways, I believe that our entire being, and the real world (physical reality) is itself a construct of a most primal (and hidden) aspect of our being, a point where we touch 'god' if you like, where we are 'god'.

Not that I'm into any religious malarkey you understand. I just use the word 'god' to describe well, words fail me again! Anyway, I am trying to say that the physical world sprouts forth from consciousness, and is itself consciousness manifest. I'm sure that's not a new concept round these parts.

So the kind of 'imagine things', that I refer to earlier, it's not the same kind of 'imagine things', you do when you're stuck in work on a dreary Monday morning, wishing you were on some sunny beach somewhere, with some gorgeous lady by your side (please god!).

No. It is a much more fundamental way of 'imagine things', that affects the fabric, and very nature of reality itself, and even pulling things to you. This is not a good thing, if you're not strong or wise enough to deal with it.

Anyway, this kind of culminated with me being away from home, alone, in a cheap hotel room, for 2 or 3 days, being attacked, tormented, like having a massive jack-hammer drill; go directly, in a most profound way, through the very centre of my being, my awareness itself.

To this day, I still believe, it was a malignant dis-corporate being, demon, devil, whatever, such labels don't mean much to me. That it wasn't some fancy of my imagination. That it was something very real. It terrified me, and that is putting it very mildly.

I'm quite happy talking about it now, and I feel I've come a long way since, and am a much stronger and more capable person, more balanced and relaxed and spiritually whole.

Obviously, apart from the no girl-friend issues (you'd have to check my other threads to see what I mean).

To anyone reading this, I would say, be very careful with psychotropic drug use, esp. if you have a propensity to 'open up'.

Has anyone heard the song 'Riki Tiki Tavi', it's by Donovan. I have a most excellent version where he also cautions against drug use. I believe stating that it will f**k up your third eye ...

Also, the song talks about how we can't rely on government, schools, religion etc, to save us. As my experience taught me, no-one came to my aid, no-one. For the most part, I thing we humans are quite fragile beings, which is all the more reason to treat one another with kindness and love.

Just wanted to get it all the out, thanks for reading, x

[Mato Kinze]

I think I completely understand and agree with your assessment of what I have been taught to call "The Great Mystery" - all that exists (and doesn't exist) in this realm and all others. I had trouble defining for myself what my beliefs actually were for some time. I did a lot of comparative religion studies in college and none seemed to fit what I felt was Truth. They all had some Truth in them, but nothing seemed to fit completely.

So, I took bits and pieces from all and basically followed my own Spiritual Path. Eventually, I did find others who were a part of a very ancient religion that did fit, and I've been a dedicated follower ever since. This new commitment has helped me to come to terms with what I've believed to be Truth since I was a child by putting a framework around it and giving me words to tie it together.

Some may argue that words that describe spiritual experiences are only labels and labels are inherantly limiting. They would argue - and have - that the experience is what is most important, not what you call it. They may be right, but for me, having the labels has helped me to put my arms around things and help me solidify my beliefs.

I don't know which would be better for you, only you can determine that, but if you think it would help you, I'd be happy to share some of my "labels" with you.

All that being said, I do have some thoughts about your experience and how that changed you.

Sometimes the things we perceive as bad are actually the things that are sent to help us.

Change does not happen readily or easily for most people. We live in Fear. Fear of death, Fear of life, Fear of discomfort... Our whole lives are built around not being uncomfortable. Many times, most times actually, change is uncomfortable. It is also necessary if we are to grow both physically and Spiritually.

I can't say that what you experienced wasn't some form of malignant spiritual entity; it may have been. But I'd like to offer for your consideration the possibility that it was in actuality, an Angel or Spirit Guide giving you the Spiritual equivalent of a swift "Kick in the ass" to get your head right and quit abusing yourself and others.

Mitaque Oyasin,
Mato Kinze

[Jamie]

Thank you for your replay Mato.

On the issue of labels, to use or not to use. I think there are good points and bad points to be made for each case. Perhaps it may help guide us, early on, like a finger pointing at the moon, perhaps there is a danger that we become trasnfixed on the finger (the words), and forget the moon (what it is that the words attempt to describe). Always though, I think it is for the individual to choose for themselves, what is appropriate for them.

I wasn't trying to make a big point about this in my post though, just highlighting that it was a real thing, and had an energy about it, and that I didn't really know what to call it. Maybe it's not so important.

On reflection, it may have well done me favours, and I can say that I have improved my lot in life, certainly in terms of who I am, a better person I feel to be.

On these theme, I can see how other (more mundane) things in life have happened to me, that have been something of a kick up the bum, and that it's only when we experience a lot of pain, and discomfort, that we are most motivated to do, or to change something.

It's quite refreshing too, for me, because it kinda makes the universe look like a less hostile and terrifying place.

Thank you once again.

[Pegasus]

A local radio station used to have a psychic from California on every once in a while. The psychic, Gary Spivey, has a specialty of clearing out dark energy. He claims that there is a demon associated with each drug. That makes me wonder, how can the demons differentiate between illegal/harmful drugs and prescription drugs?

[Billy]

Its the resonance or frequency that the drug induces that causes energies that are associated with that resonance to come forth and make themselves a nusance. What the problem is, is that we as human beings seem to attribute demonic forces with malice and hate towards us and nothing else. Its simply not true that they torment us for the hell of it although like humanity there are some that possibly do so, they are just ar..holes. There is a specific need involved in demonic possesion. In other planes of existence there are other rules from the slightly different to the extreme, and by that I mean time and space issues as well as cultural. Entities that visit our earth plane do not want us to know of their existence let alone their purpose in manifesting here, and that is because of what we can give them, if we knew the enemy then we could form options of resisting it, but as it stands most of us don't even know that there is an enemy which suits these beings to a T. Some entities who are of a low order need an energy form that human beings give off in great quantities when under stress or for want of a better term spiritual turmoil. Others who are more alien but of a higher order than the previous use our descision making processes{ ie memories} to make great descisions for themselves, giving them opportunities in thought proscess that they could never imagine otherwise. So when we take drugs to escape we may be escaping our own world but we will be entering theirs which for many people is dangerous. I have spoken with many of these entities and to tell youi the truth from my perspective they are not truly evil they just have a function in the universe to fullfill that is not congruent with ours, just as we take from nature so do they we just don't like to think of ourselves as prey, but we can be. They will manipulate our thought processes to get what they want, and most people would never be able to distinguish between their own and those implanted . Pretty clever of them yes? Sorry to be so dry but its the only way to pack all the info in.

[Jamie]

Be as dry as you like Billy, and please free free (anyone) to contribute to this thread, on the general topic of drugs opening us up to these kind of things.

I half expected people, to think along the lines of "he imagined it all - on drugs - what do you expect", but what you and others have said here, is in line with my own thinking. I know it wasn't imagined. That whole period of my life was like having my house burn down, seems really bad at the time, but I am a lot wiser stronger for it now. Quite a few really strange things happened around that time in my life ...

One time I felt the presense of a lesser, more earth bound entity (it was non physical but it had more 'solid' energy, it felt closer to our physical plane of reality). I remember at one point, shortly after I became aware of it, it shot out of me, and went in to my dog. My dog was going mad well before this, he could tell something was wrong, but as soon as it came out of me and went in to my dog, he lept off the ground and spun round, maybe like twice! As if he was having a stroke (sadly, he did have a stroke for real, later in life).

Another time, I remeber looking at a clock, and an instant before I did this, I KNEW it would be exaclty 12:00:00 to the second, and it was. I remeber this kind of thing happened a bit. I may have been sitting on a bus, and I would just know there was someone on the pavement outside, who was 'awake', and I look, and see some rasta guy or someone looking at me in a knowing way. This also happened to me in India, while I was in a taxi, but the guy was like 100 meters away, so I imagine he was very energetically strong to make the connection at that distance.

I also had exprerience of seeing people who I had a strong feeling were 'awake', but involved with some kind of secret organization, perhaps with the purpose of the mutual benefit of it's members (and sod the rest of us), like a global elite of people controlling the world. Sounds far fetched, and I can't say how true this is, just that it was my distinct feeling at the time. The guy was dressed simular to the agents, in The Matrix, also, the film 'They Live' reflects this same theme.

Some other really really strange things happened; and I am very much of the opinion that one needs to be a man of power to process such things, rather than to be blown here and there like a leave in the wind. If a person is a man of power, then I can apprecieate venturing in to such realms may have some value. It's certainly a serious matter, I feel, and is the reason I would always caution against drug use. The term 'man of power' is from the Casteneda books I think, I'm sure it applies to the ladies too.

As an aside, the song Riki Tiki Tavi (mongoose is gone), by Donovan, in the version I have, there's some good points made. Riki Tiki Tavi is a mongoose who kills snakes (in the Jungle Book), in the song, he's gone, and won't be coming around for to kill your snakes no more ...

Snakes, being, the government, the school, religion, in general the establishment (which I believe is established with the purpose of keeping those in power, just where they are, it's the power structures that control the world economies etc). So we have to kill our own snakes. Also, I feel this is true, very much so, in other realms. You certainly can't go relying on Jesus or the Tooth Fairy or such like; not that I don't believe in Angelic beings, just that, for me, I found that I was on my own.

Hope I don't sound nuts!!

Jamie.

[Jamie]

Originally Posted by Billy

... we just don't like to think of ourselves as prey, but we can be. They will manipulate our thought processes to get what they want, and most people would never be able to distinguish between their own and those implanted.

Have you read any David Icke? I haven't myself, but I recall seeing one of his books where he mentions demonic beings attaching themselves to us, maybe feeding of us. I'm sure Casteneda mentions this too.

[Billy]

Originally Posted by Jamie

Have you read any David Icke? I haven't myself, but I recall seeing one of his books where he mentions demonic beings attaching themselves to us, maybe feeding of us. I'm sure Casteneda mentions this too.

Yes I have read some of Icke's stuff but none of casteneda and some of it rings true about reptillians of a lower order infiltrating the earth plane but the entities that I have conversed with are more snakey looking than lizard, Vipers I call some of them but the term reptile still applies, about ruling the world or controlling it i'm not privy to any knowledge and wouldnt expect to be as they for the most part have a general contempt for us and treat us with either amusement or outright aggression but they do have a sense of humor strangely enough. A psychic doesnt have to approach these beings to know them as almost certainly they will come to them. They are fascinated and attracted to those of us that have the subtle perceptions. But sadly they do feed off of us and more so the vulnerable and weak. You know what it is to be awake jamie I'm interested to know how do you percieve the world in general and others who are not?

[Jamie]

Originally Posted by Billy

I'm interested to know how do you percieve the world in general and others who are not?

Hi Billy,

The world? do you mean, planet earth? human society? the entire physical plane? Am I in the world, or is the world in me? In terms of planet earth, it does seem to be in a bit of a mess. Humanity is out of control, out of balance, and headed for calamity (perhaps as a result of our cleverness, out-witting mother nature).

As someone with a background in Taoism, I see the world and all things in it, as the Tao taking shape. Like a sphere, like an invisible sun, with fingers of light or energy reaching out in all directions, people are like the finger tips, looking out. Though on the surface of it, we all seem to be seperate, we are all connected to the one. Easy to say such things, I know, and words really have little meaning, it's the knowing, the direct knowing and self-realisation that counts.

I'm hardly awake, I forget all the time! I try to live for the mother, but I am so incredible small, smaller that I can know, and the Great Mystery, sometimes, it feels bigger than the biggest thing and smaller than the smallest, it is everything, and at the same time, it is nothing. It is a force that pervades all living things (god, I sound like yoda, lol). It is part and parcel of all things under heaven, an intelligence that is non-seperate from, and contained within the very fabric of the universe. To give it a name is ludicrous. But we still try (then we fight over who has the right name, it's sheer madness). As I say, I feel most affinity for Taoism, and in the very first line of the Tao Te Ching ... "The name that can be named, is not the eternal name". Taoism, as a tradition, points at the Tao, it doesn't hold any copyright!!

There is a saying I think, that any religion or belief system is only a finger pointing at the moon ... but perhaps the very finger that points at the moon, also, is the moon.

I was watching a Wayne Dyer video, someone posted a link on here. Someone asked Mother Teresa, what she felt or saw on her day to day helping the poor in India. She says she sees Jesus Christ in the multitude of pain enduring forms (people). It's like that same energy, awareness, that is in one person, is in us all. Until we become more and more aware of that, and more people live for and serve that energy awareness, the world will be troubled. We need more Mother Teresas' ... but each day, maybe more and more people are waking up ....

Jamie.

[mncz]

This is a very interesting thread.
May I ask you something, Billy?

What would be the signs if someone is having a demon feeding off his energy for a prolonged period of time (years)? Is it possible at all?

The situation why I am asking this is as follows:
I had a boyfriend, our relationship is discussed in another thread. He comes from a good family, there is nothing inherently wrong with his life.. but he is depressed and suicidal. He actually tried to commit suicide by hanging himself about 10 years before and after that he has been living with depression all the time.

He finally entered therapy 2 moths ago but it does not seem to help him. We have had a few very interesting conversations where he confesses that he feels as if like he is creating his reality all the time, or, more precisely, that there is another being creating his reality through him and he is forced to observe it, since his physical self is unable to change anything that is happening. Sometimes when I was with him, I felt really drained from energy too, as if something dark soaked it all up. I had a lot of love to give, so for a while it was not a problem. But eventually I got "infected" with his depression too, I could feel it creeping up to me. Due to his behaviour I thought that he is feeding off my energy due to himself being an energetic vampire of sorts, but perhaps there is something else at work? Who or how I can determine that with any credibility?

[Billy]

Originally Posted by Jamie

. Until we become more and more aware of that, and more people live for and serve that energy awareness, the world will be troubled. We need more Mother Teresas' ... but each day, maybe more and more people are waking up ....

Jamie.

A positive world view, I like your style.

[Billy]

Originally Posted by mncz

. Due to his behaviour I thought that he is feeding off my energy due to himself being an energetic vampire of sorts, but perhaps there is something else at work? Who or how I can determine that with any credibility?

Short of doing a direct reading on him it is not easy to determine if he is being influenced but there are some signs that can be of help. Demonic energies create and take energy from us by first infiltrating us when we are weak or traumatised{or for karmic reasons} and undermining our self confidence by manipulating our self talk. It is a hard pill to swallow for some but without a doubt when they gain a hold on a person they start to work on their mind by getting feedback and countering that persons own self image. So if you were hypothetically infected for lack of a better word you would expect your own mind to be the battle ground. This would play itself out in self sabotaging behaviour that had no precedence in the persons life previously but had somehow gained momentum and as that person gave in to it these entities would strengthen their hold. Also the persons luck will be effected in a big way, nothing will seem to work for them at all no matter what they do, because as an entities energy becomes congruent with our own we start to give off those same negative vibrations and the person becomes unpleasant to be around and drains others energetically and emotionally and we seek ways to avoid them. Also sometimes they will say or do things that those close to them would never have anticipated, and this is an advanced form of possesion where almost total parody has been achieved with the person attacked. I could go on but basically what they are doing is causing a person to suffer mentally, emotionally and sometimes physically in order for them to experience anguish, and the energy that we give off in this state is exactly what they want. If he has experienced suddenly in his life a lot of mental conflict and or trauma that has become extremely difficult to work around then it is highly possible that he has become a target of external negative forces, especially in these times when we look upon these things as just so much bs it is so easy to become a victim and never even know it. Hope it helps you.

[m18pak]

Originally Posted by mncz

This is a very interesting thread.
May I ask you something, Billy?

What would be the signs if someone is having a demon feeding off his energy for a prolonged period of time (years)? Is it possible at all?

The situation why I am asking this is as follows:
I had a boyfriend, our relationship is discussed in another thread. He comes from a good family, there is nothing inherently wrong with his life.. but he is depressed and suicidal. He actually tried to commit suicide by hanging himself about 10 years before and after that he has been living with depression all the time.

He finally entered therapy 2 moths ago but it does not seem to help him. We have had a few very interesting conversations where he confesses that he feels as if like he is creating his reality all the time, or, more precisely, that there is another being creating his reality through him and he is forced to observe it, since his physical self is unable to change anything that is happening. Sometimes when I was with him, I felt really drained from energy too, as if something dark soaked it all up. I had a lot of love to give, so for a while it was not a problem. But eventually I got "infected" with his depression too, I could feel it creeping up to me. Due to his behaviour I thought that he is feeding off my energy due to himself being an energetic vampire of sorts, but perhaps there is something else at work? Who or how I can determine that with any credibility?

The only way that you can make a judgement in situations like this is to use your intuition. There is no amount of intellectual analysis that'll make the situation any clearer.

I suggest that you look at this page:
Real Jesus, Establishing spiritual protection

[Billy]

I looked at it, what am I supposed to be seeing?