Fight Club

[pigsonthewing6]

I love the movie fight club.

It's very symbolic and interesting.

But there is just one thing that troubles me.

In one scene, the narator looks at a picture of a calvin klein model and asks Tyler if that is what a man looks like. Then Tyler laughs and says

"self improvement is masturbation"

what is meant by this?

[Shamou]

Maybe this could help... from here...

"If you derive the meaning of the word masturbation from its Latin roots, it actually translates to self-pollution. So, what Ed Norton's character is saying is self-improvement is self-pollution.

My logical half wants to disagree with that, but my spiritual half says, "sure, in order to improve the self, one must first pollute the self." We cannot have improvement if we don't have a flaw to improve. We cannot see light unless we also see dark."

.

[JohnPlace]

In Tyler Durden's mindset, self-improvement makes one feel good temporarily (like masturbation), but provides no lasting fulfillment. Argue with Tyler if you like -- just try not to get punched in the face while you're doing it.

Whether or not this is intended to be an indictment of self-improvement in general or just the way most people treat self-improvement is something we'd have to take up with Tyler.

Clearly, Tyler believes that people should look inward for enlightenment and chase their dreams (remember the scene where he threatens to kill the guy if he doesn't go get his dream job?), so it's not as though Tyler Durden believes in standing still and stagnating.

Tyler would advocate the tough road to enlightenment over the latest self-improvement pop novel. I believe his motto might be: Self-improvement through pain and deprivation (which, incidentally, is at the opposite end of the spectrum from the fleeting pleasure and indulgence of masturbation and the temporary feel-good benefits of many self-improvement activities).

Remember, we're talking about an extreme individual who's idea of real self-improvement involves chemical burns and blowing up one's own house. But even if we ignore the character's insanity, it's pretty clear that his lesson is a good one: real enlightenment comes from hard work, introspection, and devotion to something higher than material wealth.

[Asmoday]

That and self-improvement implies lack of perfection, a deficiency.

Tyler's whole philosophy, while nihilistic, does call us to rapidly shake off illusions, pre-fabricated notions, and most of all -- things marketing has brainwashed us to believe.

The entire idea is to love yourself now, without delusion about both self and reality, then evolve into something greater.

An evolution built on a foundation of a lie, just becomes another lie, so to speak.

On a deeper level, it's masturbation in the sense of not really being what you want. Generally speaking, you whack it when you really want sex. Likewise, you self-improve to get people to love you, when really, you should just go for the love...or, free yourself from the lies that make you dependent on others in the first place.

I dunno, some thoughts.

[Max Power]

Originally Posted by pigsonthewing6

I love the movie fight club.

It's very symbolic and interesting.

But there is just one thing that troubles me.

In one scene, the narator looks at a picture of a calvin klein model and asks Tyler if that is what a man looks like. Then Tyler laughs and says

"self improvement is masturbation"

what is meant by this?

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WARNING-POSSIBLE MOVIE SPOILERS BELOW
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How ironic that the whole point of the main character inventing a split personality is actually self loathing and in fact he is wanting to self improve to the point of inventing someone who can be all the things he can't bring himself to be.

This is what consciousness is doing with every one of it's created versions of itself, no wonder the whole concept of one consciousness is nuts I like it!

Max

[172]

Originally Posted by Asmoday

That and self-improvement implies lack of perfection, a deficiency.

Tyler's whole philosophy, while nihilistic, does call us to rapidly shake off illusions, pre-fabricated notions, and most of all -- things marketing has brainwashed us to believe.

The entire idea is to love yourself now, without delusion about both self and reality, then evolve into something greater.

An evolution built on a foundation of a lie, just becomes another lie, so to speak.

On a deeper level, it's masturbation in the sense of not really being what you want. Generally speaking, you whack it when you really want sex. Likewise, you self-improve to get people to love you, when really, you should just go for the love...or, free yourself from the lies that make you dependent on others in the first place.

I dunno, some thoughts.

LOVE this!

[Shamou]

Originally Posted by JohnPlace

real enlightenment comes from hard work, introspection, and devotion to something higher than material wealth.

Once again John, my hat goes off to you... you, along with Angela are my two favorite posters here... I just love the way that you guys think and write...

Keep up the good work...

.

[JohnPlace]

Originally Posted by Shamou

Once again John, my hat goes off to you... you, along with Angela are my two favorite posters here... I just love the way that you guys think and write...

Keep up the good work...

.

Thank you so much, Shamou. The feeling is mutual.

[JohnPlace]

Originally Posted by Asmoday

That and self-improvement implies lack of perfection, a deficiency.

Tyler's whole philosophy, while nihilistic, does call us to rapidly shake off illusions, pre-fabricated notions, and most of all -- things marketing has brainwashed us to believe.

The entire idea is to love yourself now, without delusion about both self and reality, then evolve into something greater.

I agree with your assessment, Asmoday. In fact, my original post said something very similar, but I deleted it because I feared my post was growing too big to read.

Good work.